Baylor defeats Kansas, 55-7

  • 11 a.m., Oct. 2, 2010
  • Floyd Casey Stadium, Waco, TX

Sunday, October 3, 2010

Em-Bear-rassing: Jayhawks routed, taunted in Waco

Kansas players, including Steven Johnson (52), Chris Harris (16), Prinz Kande (4), Lubbock Smith (1) and Corrigan Powell (10) wait out the final possession of the Jayhawks' 55-7 loss to Baylor Saturday, Oct. 2, 2010 at Floyd Casey Stadium in Waco.

Kansas players, including Steven Johnson (52), Chris Harris (16), Prinz Kande (4), Lubbock Smith (1) and Corrigan Powell (10) wait out the final possession of the Jayhawks' 55-7 loss to Baylor Saturday, Oct. 2, 2010 at Floyd Casey Stadium in Waco.



Baylor defeats KU, 55-7

Baylor dismantled Kansas, 55-7, Saturday, October 2, 2010 in Waco, Texas.

— If it were a high school game, it would’ve been one of those in which the coaches agreed at halftime to play the final two quarters with a running clock.

That fact was not lost on the Baylor fans, who, near the end of Saturday’s 55-7 beating of Kansas University, chanted “Kansas high school” at the Jayhawks on the sideline.

Harsh? Maybe. Accurate? It was Saturday.

“Yeah, I heard ’em,” said KU sophomore receiver D.J. Beshears, who finished with 137 total yards. “Man. I just come out here to play and win games. I don’t really pay attention to it.”

Of all the wild and brutal things that unfolded during Saturday’s game, what spoke loudest were Baylor’s offensive totals. During four long quarters on a sunny Saturday in central Texas, the Bears racked up 678 yards of total offense — 434 passing and 244 rushing — marking the fifth-most by a Kansas opponent in school history and the most since Auburn gained 680 yards in 1988.

In the first half alone, Baylor scored touchdowns on drives of 90, 94 and 97 yards — one of them a one-play pitch-and-catch from Robert Griffin III to Josh Gordon. By the time he went to the sideline midway through the fourth quarter, Griffin had tallied 434 total yards and three touchdowns — both career highs — on 26-of-36 passing. The stat that best sums up just how effective Griffin was on Saturday? He was 10 yards shy of his career high in passing yards … by halftime.

“He executed their offense,” KU coach Turner Gill said of Griffin. “He did what he was supposed to do. He kept moving the chains, made the big plays when they had to (have) them, made the throws he had to make, ran the ball when he had to, kept their offense in rhythm and kept us out of rhythm.”

And he did it all day.

Even when it looked as if Baylor was content to run out the clock on the first half and take a 24-7 lead into halftime, Griffin and the Bears moved into scoring position, and Aaron Jones drilled a 50-yard field goal as time expired.

That scoring drive was kept alive by an eight-yard run on third-and-seven by sophomore halfback Jarred Salubi. Salubi first was hit after three yards, encountered a trio of KU tacklers after five, yet still found the fight to power forward for three more yards and the first down.

Yep, it was almost as if the Bears couldn’t help but score.

That the Kansas defense played passively for most of the afternoon only helped Baylor’s march into history. The 678 yards surpassed a BU school record. The 55 points were Baylor’s most ever in a Big 12 game. And the 48-point margin of victory also was a Big 12-best for the Bears.

“We were always a step too slow on a lot of things on offense and defense,” Gill said. “You gotta get lined up right so you can get yourself in the right position. And then when you are lined up right, you gotta make a play. We just weren’t quite in sync, and they were.”

While the Bears effortlessly moved up and down the field, the Jayhawks struggled. KU quarterback Jordan Webb faced constant pressure and, even when he did have time to throw, was off target or trying to force things.

“This was probably the one game he didn’t quite play as well as far as some reads and some different things, but there were some other people who didn’t play well, either, too,” Gill said.

Added Webb: “There were times I just got out of the system a little bit and tried to do too much. I’m a competitor, and it’s hard sometimes, but I just gotta stay within the system and take what they give us.”

When Webb was able to move the Jayhawks down the field — like he was on the seven-play, 70-yard drive that ended with a TD pass to Daymond Patterson and kept KU close at 17-7 — the offense often had trouble finishing its drives.

Webb threw two interceptions — one was returned for a touchdown and came just 12 seconds after a previous Baylor TD made it 41-7 — and KU fumbled twice, one coming from Webb.

“There’s no way you’re going to be able to stay in the ballgame, playing like that and turning the ball over,” Patterson said.

It wasn’t just the highly visible mistakes that cost the Jayhawks in this one. Several false-start penalties killed their offensive flow. A couple of holding calls backed them into third-and-long situations, and a frustration personal foul from Jake Laptad and missed field goal by Jacob Branstetter added to the misery. KU even suffered a false start by Bradley Dedeaux on the game’s final play, a meaningless snap with 24 seconds remaining in which all KU had to do was snap the ball and end the game.

On the flip side, back-to-back holding calls on Baylor during a third-quarter scoring drive still resulted in first downs for the Bears.

“I just think they played better than we did, and we got outcoached,” Gill said. “I’m disappointed. It obviously wasn’t a very good job by us as a coaching staff, and Baylor played an outstanding football game. We just couldn’t ever get anything going.”

Senior safety Olaitan Oguntodu, who finished with a career-high 10 tackles, went one step farther than disappointing.

“Overall, it was an embarrassing game,” he said. “Just embarrassing all the way around.”


CatsEatBirds 9 years, 4 months ago

“I just think they played better than we did, and we got outcoached,” Gill said. “I’m disappointed. It obviously wasn’t a very good job by us as a coaching staff, and Baylor played an outstanding football game. We just couldn’t ever get anything going.”

There's at least the coach standing up and taking responsibility. Gotta do better than that in conference.

At least the north represented with Colorado over Georgia and ISU big in the end over TTech. This Baylor fiasco should not have happened.

escaped_labrat 9 years, 4 months ago

The scary thing is that this coaching staff has umpteen years of coaching experience except for the head honcho. I am stumped, personally. Does anyone else think that the drastic change in style has caused some kind of a system shock to the players that were so used to the disciplinarian style that to suddenly give them the love treatment is the culprit? Hmmm.. perhaps KU needs to find the in-between approach....discipline mixed with compassion.

Randy Bombardier 9 years, 4 months ago

Yes, I do think the change in system is going to take a year or two to get rolling. When Wariner was not retained as OC that was my biggest concern about the change in regime. We have been able to score the last four or five years and that was nice to see. I still think it was a bad more not to retain him. Of course Wariner is having the same experience at ND now. After Gill was here a couple of years then would be the time to gradually introduce his system. But, that is my opinion.

Dan Pawlowski 9 years, 4 months ago

A couple years? New coaches tend to get only 3 or 4 years to prove themselves. Not introducing his system until then would be a big mistake. Introducing it as soon as possible for the younger players is the right move.

Dan Pawlowski 9 years, 4 months ago

Hmm, first year here for Gill with Mangino's players. Yea I would say it will take a few years.

Carolyn Troupe 9 years, 4 months ago

That occurred to me, too. Thse kids were used to giving their all to avoid getting yelled at, and now are not as scared of failure because it's not the end of the world. I could be more analytical.

Robert Berger 9 years, 4 months ago

In 25yrs of following KU FB/BB I have seen the highest of the high and the lowest of the low...but I cant ever remember seeing a "KS high school" team play like this. All of you can talk about Gil's style versus MM but the bottom line is to represent yourself/school in a postitive manner but I'm lost for words to describe the pitiful performance Gil put out on the field on Sat. That game probably set KU recruiting back 5yrs in the state of TX...12hrs later and I'm still p-o'd....thanks Turner, hows that swear jar work'n for ya !!!!!

yates33333 9 years, 4 months ago

I have watched them over 50 years, and I must agree with the lowest of the low comment. It was BAD! Real BAD!

Randy Bombardier 9 years, 4 months ago

I do not agree. check the first year win totals in KU history. It is about what you should expect. Baylor is good this year. There is a lot of hype about Griffin, for good reason. The south div looks like it will be anybody but texas or ou. OSU, AM, or Baylor will most likely win it.

CatsEatBirds 9 years, 4 months ago

Not sure of your logic. OU looks strong and until someone knocks them off their perch you've got to consider them the frontrunner.

Mike Nicco 9 years, 4 months ago

Lowest of the lows. How about the 1-9-1 1987 team. We only beat a I-AA team, tied the worst program in the country (Toilet Bowl - KSU), and lost at home to OU 77-10 on national tv. Wasn't that the game where Keith Jackson asked why are we even here?

Bear86 9 years, 4 months ago

EBH - I remember that game & time period of KU football when Valesente was coach. It was lower than our current state of affairs. On another note I live in the South Bay (Campbell). The KU/Cal BB game should be a good game. Rock Chalk!

mtdewjunkie 9 years, 4 months ago

if you have been watching for 25 years you have seen worse.

Kyle Crenshaw 9 years, 4 months ago

yeah against kstate and nebraska...but baylor!?!? not so much

mtdewjunkie 9 years, 4 months ago

baylor is good this year... how about this loss 41-13...san diego st. at home.

Eric Williams 9 years, 4 months ago

Mangino went 4-22 against the Big 12 South. Only beat Baylor twice.

Gill is 0-1 against the South.

Give him 21 more losses before you pass judgement.

ZDKC 9 years, 4 months ago

Quit trying to compare Mangino to Gill.
1) Gill is getting paid more than Mangino 2) Our athletics dept operating budget is double what it used to be during the Mangino days.

If anything this makes Gill look like more of an idiot.

Eric Williams 9 years, 4 months ago

The reason I keep bringing up Mangino, is b/c people keep implying it would be different right now with him.

Reesing vs. Webb = Reesing Meier vs. Wilson = Meier Briscoe vs. Patterson = Briscoe Sharp vs. Sims = Push (although I think Sims will end up being better).

Most Hawk fans are expecting more with less, which isn't fair to Gill.

He's getting paid more to recruit and build up a team. He's also starting with guys that didn't even see the field during Mangino's time.

rolo2383 9 years, 4 months ago

Lew doesn't work for KU anymore and Bernie has better things to do than travel to football games. Should she travel to all away KU sporting events or just football?

Quit acting like my 8 year old nephew.

caribhawk 9 years, 4 months ago

Yea, they need a mercy rule in football for this type of whooping, and don't insult high school teams by comparing them to KU. 5 games into the season and they are still disorganized, have no fire, and hard to figure out what type of team they are. If the TG experiment lasts 5 years, KU will be so far behind K-State and Mizzou in recruiting & performance it will take a huge overhaul to turn this around. Meantime, I can see the fans in the stands dwindling to pre-Mangino years. How many times have we seen KU line up on 4th and short yardage (after a wasted timeout of course) and run it straight up the gut after not being able to run it up the gut up to that point of the game? KU is predictable and has no coaching "edge" - - the coaches are a liability at this point because they give this team no chance to make a play. Is Ron Prince available?

tdub 9 years, 4 months ago

Considering Lew retired a couple weeks ago... I'm going with no.

Teri Jester 9 years, 4 months ago

that chant is like the "overrated" chant...basically the baylor students dont think they are good enough to beat a college team so it follows this team must be a high school team...not bright!

rockemchalkemrobots 9 years, 4 months ago

Agree with regard to the overrated chant, but Baylor has beat college teams this year. That includes Buffalo, and they did not spank them as bad as they did us. Does that mean that Gill left them in good shape, or that they upgraded their coaching when he left? Pick the answer that makes you feel better.

mtdewjunkie 9 years, 4 months ago

still waiting for your answer on who is coming to replace gill if you fire him now...

Justin Daniel 9 years, 4 months ago

Lou Hotlz, Herm Edwards, heck Bobby Knight would be better than this. In all seriousness, I agree it would be difficult to replace a coach at this point in the season. However, Les Miles may be free at the end of the year. He would at least bring a strong defensive presence, something we have not had since Bill Young left.

rockemchalkemrobots 9 years, 4 months ago

Considering the game of coaching musical chairs ended for this season, all the good options are going to be taken. Mid-season is not a good time to conduct a search and KU is currently looking for an AD. It would have to be an interim (not that I'm even advocating firing him now), probably Long or Torbush, with an all out search. For reasons set forth in other posts re: finances and the fallout from the coaching community in not giving a coach at least three years, he will not be terminated anytime soon. But to answer the question asked about who is available, without regard to the likelihood that it would occur, I would offer the following after thinking for about 5 minutes on it: Tommy Bowden, Mike Leach, Jim Mora, Jr. The most intriguing name on the list is Leach. He might jump at the chance to play Tech every year. Unfortunately, the witch-hunt conducted last year prohits this as hypocritical. Before the MM debate starts up anew, let me add that I thought he should have been fired for losing 7 games in a row in a season where a mid-level bowl was a realistic expectation, not for his disciplinary style, which was OK with the administration as long as there were exciting games on the field.

steamboat 9 years, 4 months ago

I would like to see Knight throw a chair to the other sidelines. Yep KU should have emptied the bank account to keep young. Gill HAS GOT TO shed the nice guy image and show some toughness. Also.. He will never succeed in the Big 12 with 2-3 star players. I don't know if KU can afford to honor Gill's contract. The Baylor game is evidence we are going backwards.

KU_FanSince75 9 years, 4 months ago

After seeing both Iowa State (against Texas Tech) and Colorado (against Georgia), and then, watching us on TV with Baylor, I am thoroughly convinced it will be a long and humbling season. Unless the Jayhawks turn it around quickly, I just don't see us winning very many games. I was still holding out hope that maybe, just maybe, we could pull some games out of the big black magic hat, but heck, we are not even competitive against a team like Baylor. Now, comes K-State-----if this is a blow out come October 14th-----look out-----I am not saying win the game (that would be nice if it happens), be competitive! The two games that any KU football coach is really watched is the K-State and Missery games. K-State is up to bat. I don't know if I want to even watch the game past halftime if the Wild Kitties are up 55-7. I am trying to stay positive here but it is very difficult.

Justin Daniel 9 years, 4 months ago

This just proves why Kansas was not in the consideration for the PAC 16, SEC, or Big 10. No matter how great our basketball program is, football will keep us out of the the major conferences when they are formed, which is where we should be. Kansas can be a competitive at least in conferences like CUSA, MWC, or the WAC. We will never win a conference championship in football with the format of the new Big 12.

Dan Pawlowski 9 years, 4 months ago

Never? It is not like its a law of nature. (against laws of physics). Quite acting like a sportscaster.

Gregg Webster 9 years, 4 months ago

Jeez! This was bad - I thought we came here today to play a FOOTBALL game gentlemen. Did you all have something else in mind? Some BBQ Brisket maybe, OH, that's right, that's what you served up nice and tender for the bears. Are you boys actually on scholarship? Getting paid to play?

I remember the teams of the 60's with Sayers, Riggins and Douglas. But this, this was the Kansas of the 70's, 80's and most of the 90's. This could set our program back so far we'll need an archaeologist for a coach and a geologist to study the campus' predominant building materials in order to get a grip.

PS: I'll take it all back if Baylor wins the BCS Championship game. (yeah right).

John Brown 9 years, 4 months ago

Obviously, firing of MM and hiring of Gill was a political move by LP. I can't blame Gill for this mess. Gill was a .500 coach before KU. He acheived mediocre results in a less than mediocre football conference. LP hires him into the B-12. I'm sorry, but we still have Texas, OU, MU, KSU, OSU... yet to play. If Baylor makes a High School team out of us then the best is yet to come. If you ask, 'How did we get to this point?' then LP needs some credit.

Kusportsshould Notrequirethis 9 years, 4 months ago

while I agree our schedule will not get easier, I'm pretty sure we don't play either OU or Texas this year...Unless we see them in the Big 12 championship game...Ha Ha!

Nick Cole 9 years, 4 months ago

I think "Kansas High School" is an upgrade from how they played yesterday. Should have been more like "Kansas Elementary" based on what I saw. Sixth graders play with more passion and competitiveness than our boys did this weekend. Embarrassing doesn't even begin to describe it.

Gill better find a better way to get these "players" to get their heads out of their @$$es and have some friggin' pride in their craft. I am surprised at how bad a game this was all around from players to coaches and even the water boy. Way to go everyone, you just successfully took The University of Kansas and made it a CUSA school.

I hope the players and coaches read this. I have had faith in our football program every week until now. Good job KUFB, all of that is now gone.

Hey Gill, if we can't run the ball up the middle, quit doing it. If we are successfully passing it, don't all of a sudden start to run it up the middle when we get inside the 20. This is the kind of stuff that kills drives. And maybe we need to have open tryouts for a kicker like Leach and TTech did a couple years back? Just saying...

KWufan 9 years, 4 months ago

umm, did we watch the same game? Down 17 -7 and having pinned Baylor at their own 6 yd line in the second quarter we were in the game. Boom, big play happens, okay. But we came back down and had a chance to get back to 24-14 at the half and fumbled at their 10 yrd line I believe. Come on, your really going to say they had a lack of effort up to that point? The second half when Baylor goes touchdown, interception return for touchdown just after that, yes our balloon got popped and the effort sagged. That happens to every team that gets destroyed like that. Give them a little credit for at least having the opportunity to get back within 10 points at the half, given the bad start to the game we had. Fumbles happen, they kill drives and momentum, then it snowballs, simple as that.

KWufan 9 years, 4 months ago

One more thing, your criticism of the play calling. If they are having problems with the pass, the run usually opens up, every coach in America would have run the ball inside the 20 with the other team trying to tighten up the pass defense. That's why these guys are coaches and you are a Monday morning quaterback. Just saying...

Nick Cole 9 years, 4 months ago

Yes, I am criticizing the play calling. We hadn't run the ball successfully up the middle all game. On the drive where our passing game was in sync, we completely abandoned it once we got close. It's smart to try the run, but when you do and it doesn't work, you probably shouldn't try another run up the middle again on the very next play. I may be no coach but I could tell the run was not working and the passing game was what got us down the field. Run the hurry-up and keep the defense on their heels. And everything you said in your first response to me simply proved my point. Fumbles, interceptions, poor decision making by the players and coaches. All of these thing are a result of a lack of preparation and effort. If you think you can argue that, you sir are a moron (sorry). We had these chances to get "back into" the game. Well guess what KWufan, we should't have to talk about us needing to get back into the game. It was a road game and our Big XII opener. Both of those factors should lead to focusing on the task at hand and being fired up to earn your scholarship and paycheck. This team knows they can play well yet we still came out with no fire and totally out of sync.

We pin then inside the 10 multiple times and they still score on us (pathetic). We get in scoring position and fumble the ball (pathetic). We had two guys covering 3 receivers all day long, no adjustment at halftime (pathetic).

So KWufan, thank you for pointing out all of things about this game that prove me right. Just saying...

Dan Harris 9 years, 4 months ago

Wow! I didn't see, ummmm we should ,no well we could, no how about we , um wow! unbeievable, why dont we no that would never, ok I know , Holy sheep dip! nevermind I give up!

Kevin Studer 9 years, 4 months ago

It would be one thing if the players were simply not talented or athletic. These losses are due to poor execution and lack of leadership. I'm not saying fire Gill, because that may be an overreaction so early in his tenure. But this is definitely cause for alarm. He will need to show serious improvement in simple execution of a game plan and simple stuff we should take for granted (like getting lined up properly, and players at least having an idea of what they are supposed to be doing on a given play) in order to justify bringing him or anyone else on this staff back next year.

TwistedFish31 9 years, 4 months ago

You're an mu inbred, you have that going for you!

Dan Pawlowski 9 years, 4 months ago

I notice you didn't dispute the inbred part.

jayhawkinATL 9 years, 4 months ago

I think it's time for Coach Gill to start using the F-BOMB!!!!!

jayhawkinATL 9 years, 4 months ago

Hopefully, the taunts from Baylor fans will light a fire under our collective A$$ES!!!

steamboat 9 years, 4 months ago

Even though last year was a downer, KU FB was making progress. MM was one of only a couple KU coaches with a winning record. His kids played hard with talent or not. Yesterday was proof that KU FB has taken a step backwards. I'm not saying fire Gill.....we all know they won't BUT if TG wants to compete in theBig 12 he better step it up. 2-3 star athletes won't get it done in the Big 12. Take away cell phones and girl-friends? LMAO these kids ain't junior high. Treat 'em like men and hope for the best!! Yesterday was pathetic and it can only get better I hope but KU and the school can't afford too many beatdowns like Baylor gave us.

KWufan 9 years, 4 months ago

Only thing I don't agree with in your statement is 2 and 3 star athletes. Most of those guys are MM players, not TG.

hawksince51 9 years, 4 months ago

While it was fine to question the hiring of Gill, it is certainly premature to talk about firing him in his first year. I have 60 season of fading memories and believe that nearly every KU football coach had disappointing first seasons. This is simply because their predecessors were nearly always fired after they left the program in poor shape. MM was no exception; we were 1-7 in the conference last year and lost our 3 best players. I have no prediction on whether Gill will have a long tenure at KU but he should be given at least 3 years to show what he can do with his recruits and system.

Sparko 9 years, 4 months ago

Utterly humiliating. Sad effort, terrible game plan, terrible coaching. One of the worst drubbings in Jayhawk history. Gill better get this together. The team quit on him.

steamboat 9 years, 4 months ago

They sure did and WHY? was it the cell phone and girl friend issues? I hope not or we will be the laughing stock of college sports!!! Maybe an example of the cry-babies that stayed after MM ran the other ones off. I don't know either but you're right it all falls on the head coaches shoulders.

KWufan 9 years, 4 months ago

I find it very funny and stupid that the Baylor fans, with their glorious Big 12 history of dominating football actually had the audacity to talk smack. This is the best team they have ever had, I'll give them that, but why disrepect us when your history is much worse. That being said, the hawks from the beginning were not mentally in this game. Were all of our Texas players, who were in front of family, more concerned with that instead of the task at hand? Possibly. Were the Baylor players really that much faster than our secondary in terms of pure speed? (Boy, every time they ran a fly route, receivers were 5 yrds past the corners. I don't even want to mention the 94 yrd play, that dude is a burner!!) A combination of both, I believe was the main culprit in that beatdown. Nothing to be ashamed of, if your not as fast, your just not as fast. TGill will see this and recruit some more speed for our team. These guys do give effort, and it's hard when the other teams on a roll like that to not feel beaten halfway through the game, I don't know that about our team either. For some reason I do like to watch this team play, some of these guys you can tell have worked their butts off to become starters and I don't think they deserve to not be supported. C'mon everyone, we had a bad game it happens. Remember Nebraska took a beating from us and look at them a few yrs later, NC contenders.

Mark Lindrud 9 years, 4 months ago

This is a low moment for sure in KU Football. We can only go up from here so we can only hope the team doesn't quit and gets up from this moment to learn and get better. My one concern was if we were big enough and fast enough which it maybe we don't have enough size and speed yet.

We have some good players to build around, but we need to recruit the right players because it is apparent we don't have the right ones yet. That being said Gill needs to make the proper adjustments for the players to be able to succeed. We have lots of work to do that is for sure. So far every time we have been knocked down this season we have gotten up and won the next week. With KState next Thursday we have little time to lick our wounds and we need to fight harder and refocus to get a win in conference.

We knew this could be a long season with ups and downs so I personally am not relishing in wins too long and knock staying upset over losses too long either knowing this team will be up and down. It is a marathon and whether we like it or not it is going to be a long and bumpy season.

Matt Gauntt 9 years, 4 months ago

I'm so saddened by this. We have ONLY been a basketball school for years (since I was on campus at least in the 80's). Over the last 4-5 years we started to earn some respectability. People started following football, we looked forward to it, we smack-talked KSU, etc., etc. We finally got to the point where we could talk with the better recruits. Things were looking up. With this year, we took a HUGE step backwards. How could Lou do this to us? Awwwww poor players got punishment under MM. Now they get the punishment from Baylor fans. Which is worse - suffering some discipline or suffering the humiliation? I would take the former any day and I'm guessing that 99% of athletes would too.

We bring in Gill and he takes the player's names off the uniform - teamwork. Sorry, but people respond to competition, not the ambiguous "team".

truefan 9 years, 4 months ago

Yeah, not having names on the jerseys sure killed USC when they were dominating college football under Pete Carrol.

You are right about the coaching style though, Tubberville rips into his players (Iowa State 55 - Texas Tech 38)...and it's working really well for him.

Matt Gauntt 9 years, 4 months ago

Respectfully, I hope you will agree with me that Turner Gill and Pete Carrol aren't in the same league.

ZDKC 9 years, 4 months ago

Oh please, truefan. Do you realize that not having the names on the back of the jerseys is just a stupid gimmick. Unfortunately, this isn't a movie like the Mighty Ducks. You know, where coach uses some superficial means of teaching the kids a "lesson" (followed by training montage), and all of a sudden the team is playing for Olympic gold.

Let's save the "there's no 'I' in team" kumbaya hand-holding crap for Pop Warner football.

sava12 9 years, 4 months ago

One thing I remember from Ranger school YEARS ago was that no matter how cold, wet, hungry, tired and demoralized you felt, you could always count on your buddies. Times like these can help the kids come together. Keep the faith Jayhawk nation - no one feels worse than those kids who walked off that field yesterday.

Andy Tweedy 9 years, 4 months ago

Going back to Mangino, the results have been eroding since 2007 and this probably shouldn't be that surprising. But it was Baylor, and it sure is embarrassing...BUT...lets see how good or bad Baylor is at season's end before comparing this to the last 50 years of KU football. We've already won as many games this year as we did my entire sophomore and junior years, and it wasn't much better my first and last year either. If they can beat KSU, maybe this won't sting so badly!

Brian Leiker 9 years, 4 months ago

The best comment I heard at the game was some dumbass Baylor fan, telling us KU fans this is going to happen in bball as well. "Let me introduce you to Perry Jones". I said congrats on your first top 10 player. It sucks he'll be matched up against a 1st team all american jr who has proven himself at this level. Then he went on to say that our football team has no tradition and yada yada yada...I said 3 years removed from a BCS bowl victory. Your recent tradition of a SWAC championship 17 years ago sounds alot like Kstates dominant tradition. Crickets.

khummel60 9 years, 4 months ago

Good article in the Fort Worth Star-Telegram about KU's program.

As for the game, it was indeed painful to watch. The anti-Gill bandwagon is getting very full. Any day now I expect to read about a mob of angry Jayhawks marching through campus with pitchforks and torches, headed for Gill's office.

I know I am risking the wrath of the angry mob in saying so, but I still believe you have to give this staff time. I never believed we would have a good team this year - no matter who the head coach was. I did think we would show more improvement by this point in the season, but I'm still hopeful. I have to be hopeful - Gill isn't going anywhere any time soon. I share the frustrations about the coaching staff and lack of preparation and execution, but I really don't understand the point of all the "fire Gill" talk. Its not going to happen no matter how much you scream it, for all the reasons the above-referenced article states.

I agree with what KWufan said above - we were not that far out of the game in the first half. That fumble on the goal-line was a 10-point mistake, and I think it just took all the wind out of our sails. Had we scored a touchdown on that drive things might have been different. We still would have lost, I believe - as we were clearly over-matched - but it might not have been so lop-sided.

The most disturbing thing to me was how badly we were out-manned in every aspect of that game. Not only did we not control the trenches, but their players were faster and more physical across the board. No amount of coaching or play-call trickery can overcome that. I don't think we've ever won at Baylor, not even with MM, so the odds of us doing it yesterday were not good. Still, I expected us to be competitive and we clearly weren't.

The most promising thing I read from that article out of Fort Worth, is that the other coaches consider Gill to be a real threat on the recruiting trail. The only way we are going to prevent embarrassments like yesterday, I believe, is to get better talent to come to KU. That's not to say the coaches don't have to get better, because frankly I'm disappointed in them too, but no coach in America could turn this team into a winner overnight.

steamboat 9 years, 4 months ago

Good points throughout your post. How many games did MM win his first couple years? We had some pretty bad losses in his first years and we will surely have more... BUT It's a very young team, So if our kids learn and catch on and bond together along with a decent bunch of recruits this thing will turn around. As much as it hurts to lose as a fan, I'm sure the players hate it 10 times as much. Nobody expected a BCS bowl this year did they? Speed and size are the trademarks to great teams, if TG gets HIS players to play with the tuffness and heart he had at NU he will be a winner. This isn't fun but I really think TG deserves a better chance than alot of fans are wanting to give him. RRRROCK CHALK!!!!

truefan 9 years, 4 months ago

Great post, and you even forgot to mention the players we lost. Take a 5-7 team that has a good offense and one of, if no the worste defense in Division 1 football. Now, take away the best player on offense (Reesing) the second best player on offense (Briscoe) the third best player on offense (Meier). Then take away the best player on defense (Stuckey) the second best player on defense (Tharp) and the third best player on defense (Thorton) and what does our coaching staff have left?

Answer: Replace Reesing with a young, unpolished QB (Pick or Webb), replace Briscoe with Wilson, and replace Meier with Patterson. This results in an offense that goes from good to unproven and even with play makers they still have to run everything through the unpolished QB (Pick, Webb, Mecham, Matthews). Then replace Stuckey with a senior safety who never played before because of his lack of pass coverage abilities (Oguntodu) but is great at stopping the run. Replace Thorson with Strozier who is good, but was always the backup for good reason. Now replace Tharp with Springer who gives up some speed but makes up for it with size and power. After substituting those players on defense, add in injuries to the already thin D line that is also undersized do to poor defensive recruiting by the prior staff.

The result is an offense that is too young to put together long drives through the air which makes running the ball difficult and a defense that goes from bad to worse at pass coverage but improves in run stopping ability.

troutsee 9 years, 4 months ago

Talent poor, especially in the lines.

Sloooow, especially at linebacker.

Inexperienced, short QB.

Say what you want about us being in the game, but Baylor moved the ball effortlessly from the opening drive. I have thought since game one that our defense is slow, slow to react, and certainly is not attacking in its style, as Torbish had advertised.

No game changers on either side of the ball. The talent simply is not there.

A very painful game. Maybe we can come together, but I don't see it happening.

steamboat 9 years, 4 months ago

If you did quit then do us all a huge favor and keep your @$$ off this site!!! PLEASE

CatsEatBirds 9 years, 4 months ago

Glass is half full perspective:

If the every other game = good performance for a W trend continues, your remaining wins are KSU, ISU, NU, MU. Something tells me every hawklet fan in the nation would take those wins right now.

Who do you think you match up well against the rest of the schedule? Did they learn the bubble screen lesson from BU, because if not, you're going to see a lot of that?

troutsee 9 years, 4 months ago

You are right. We would. But that is wishful thinking. This is a very marginal team with marginal talent. To win those games we will need good coaching, no turnovers, a much more aggressive defense, and no breakdown on special teams. Based on what I have seen so far it just ain't a gonna happen.

grandpa 9 years, 4 months ago

troutsee. I again agree with your comments. I was at the game with my family and our team played pitiful. Baylor was much more physical than us on both sides of the ball. The Baylor quarterback continued to tear our weak secondary apart as there was no pass rush on him. Our linebackers were doing nothing . We had no blitzing at all. You are going to get burned once in a while on a blitz but you have to plan it. They ran the same pass play on us a dozen times successfully. No excuse for the 94yard touchdown pass. Our quarterback played a poor game holding the ball too long and making poor passes and decisions. Our playa calling was poor. Very little long passes at all; even when I was yelling: Throw the ball to #81. Ran Beshears too many times on short yardage when Sims would have made a First down. .

Kenneth Hillman 9 years, 4 months ago

agree grandpa. And running it up the gut (Baylor's strength) on 4th and 2 was unbelievable. The tv announcer was politically correct in saying that play call was "interesting". I call it uf'nbeliveable. Why would we make that play call, especially coming off a timeout to make sure we have the right play called. That is terrible. We looked AWFUL in every aspect of the game...except for Rojas, great job punting. Maybe we can get a 5 star punter so we can say we're getting 5 star recruits. You'll get a lot of work at KU Mr. 5 star punter.

I miss Bill Young. We keep talking about talent at offense and defense and that is reason we are being outplayed...what a weak excuse. Bill Young did more with less and so did Mangino. I'm not saying bring those guys back, I'm saying it's do-able. We don't have to have 5 star recruits to win. We do need quality coaches though. I think the talent is there to AT LEAST be competitive. I will be patient for wins but I will not be patient when we look poorly organized, poorly game planned, make poor play calls, we don't manage the game properly...etc...etc... We did have some fumbles and that is not on the coaching but that is not the only reason we got drilled.

jhawkfan48 9 years, 4 months ago

I went into the season expecting 2 wins and 10 losses. We are on the way to meeting my expectations for 2010 with the North Dakota State/Georgia Tech surprises. We have two fundamental problems--a talent gap on defense that started after the Orange Bowl and now the lose of key offensive talent following the 2009 season. After the Orange Bowl we lost Talib and Mortensen. We lost Holt after the Insight Bowl. They have not been replaced. We lost our key offensive players at the end of last year. The bottom line is that the recruiting has failed us and that began under Mangino following the Orange Bowl. Turner Gill has indeed inherited a lack of talent but at his salary it is his problem to solve or he will be back at Buffalo or equal shortly.

troutsee 9 years, 4 months ago

GP, Thanks for your analysis. I am glad that I decided not to buy tickets to that game. The Baylor game is the only game I am going to miss all year. Sorry you had to endure it live. It was bad enough on TV. Unfortunately I will be in Ames and in Lincoln.

jhawkfan48 9 years, 4 months ago

Speaking of recruiting I just noted that Rivals does not have us in the Top 50 for 2011 football. As a refence KSU is 37 and Mizzou is 42.

Phoggin_Loud 9 years, 4 months ago

Horrible performance!!!

New A.D. on the way.

The clock is ticking, Mr. Gill.

yovoy 9 years, 4 months ago

Truefan, this is the best post I've seen. Sure, it's going to be accused of sounding like an excuse (and it almost feels like one), but I think it put what we have vs. what we had into pretty sharp perspective.

I won't make a peep to fire OUR Coach until after his 3rd season.

I will also caution the Baylor folks to enjoy it. Unless they have another QB as special as RG3 is lined up and ready, their fortunes can turn on a dime. They can look at us and know what can happen in the course of a couple of seasons. Of course they seem to be more all-around stacked than we ever did, and they'd have to have a coach lose his mind, but these things happen. We had it happen. I wouldn't wish it on them, and I won't wish it on them, but they should enjoy it: it likely won't last.

We've been slow at LB for a long, long, time. We have solid 'backers if the man with the rock isn't especially shifty or if he's within 2 yards of our man; but if either of those conditions isn't met, then they're toast. Johnson isn't slow, but he's not that "next level" LB that we'll need. Not yet, but I like this kid. Hell, I like Springer, and the kid that's hurt. When's he get back?

I know, I know, anything can happen, but some of us might want to abandon the wish for a "W" against the kittehs. Hate to say that, but with what will likely be a sparse KU crowd (I'm sure some of the wonderfuls on here will abandon the team) they'll probably make Memorial sound like it's a home game for them. If you're as interested in keeping the purple out of our house as you are in bitching about everything, get your butts into the seats, give them to KU fans ONLY, or eat the cost of the tickets. That's what I've done when I couldn't make games. I've swallowed Ben Franks to keep purples out of my seat. Step up AND shut up.

ZDKC 9 years, 4 months ago

This pretty much sums it up for me:

From a Baylor message board...

"How poorly coached can they be? They didn't watch any film of us? We throw two types of passes, the deep bomb and the sideline 2 yd pass.

I'll say it again, Auburn dodged a huge bullet by not hiring Turner Gill."

cobweb 9 years, 4 months ago

Good Christians aren't supposed to taunt. They should show love towards their crappy opponent.

travis1975 9 years, 4 months ago

First, let me apologize for the lack of class by our students. There is no excuse to taunting and I'm sorry that occurred. As a long time fan of the Bears, I certainly know what it is like to be on the receiving end of that type of treatment. Kansas is a fine school and I am sure your football team will recover and see better days ahead. I look forward to seeing you in basketball and hope we can keep you on your toes in that sport. :-)

Best of luck with the rest of your season and good luck!

khummel60 9 years, 4 months ago

That was First Class - Thank You! Good luck to Baylor. Hope they win the Big-12 South.

Phoggin_Loud 9 years, 4 months ago


I appreciate your kind words. I have no doubt that classy folks like you are the majority of the Baylor fans.

I don't think I'm going out on a limb to predict that if Baylor fans are taunting, then there will be far more to come this season from other team's fans.

The only way to stop the taunts is to get better...and fast.

Unfortunately, I think the problem is with this coaching staff. They were unprepared and out-coached. I haven't been this upset on a Monday after a loss in quite some time...and I don't expect it to get better anytime soon. Now I'm bracing for the transfers and the re-commitments. I would love to be wrong, but I have lost hope in this staff.

Best of luck this season. You have a tremendously athletic and disciplined team. Enjoy it while you can, it can go away in an instant. 2007 seems like a decade ago.

drob 9 years, 4 months ago

I'm a Baylor grad that now lives in KC. The taunting was in poor taste, and I apologize for that. I think some of it was not knowing how to handle actually playing well. To KU fans, I'd say it's not as bad as it seems. Once a game starts going bad like that, it tends to snowball into a complete disaster. KU's not as bad as they looked, and Baylor's not as good as they looked. I do hope that we can win a couple more and actually see what it's like going to a bowl game. That would be nice! The last time Baylor went bowling was the year I graduated. Yikes! What would make me extremely happy would be to do the same thing to ksu in three weeks. If Baylor could do that, I'd lead the taunting! LOL!

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