Advertisement

Advertisement

Wednesday, November 18, 2009

Probe aims to determine if Mangino went too far

Coach Mark Mangino has a word with officials during KU's game against Texas Tech at Jones AT&T Stadium in Lubbock, Texas, on Saturday, Oct. 31, 2009.

Coach Mark Mangino has a word with officials during KU's game against Texas Tech at Jones AT&T Stadium in Lubbock, Texas, on Saturday, Oct. 31, 2009.

Advertisement

Videos

Mangino investigation

video thumbnail

Videos related to the investigation into alleged inappropriate behavior by KU football coach Mark Mangino.

Podcast episode

Press Conferences & Post-Game Interviews

Mark Mangino discusses investigation

Mark Mangino spent about 10 minutes discussing an investigation the athletic department is conducting, as well as the upcoming game against Texas.

Download podcast

Podcast episode

Press Conferences & Post-Game Interviews

Reesing discusses Mangino investigation

Senior quarterback Todd Reesing provided more information about the investigation that is underway of KU football coach Mark Mangino.

Download podcast

There never were any illusions when running back Brandon McAnderson chose to sign with Mark Mangino’s Kansas University football program in 2003.

The then-Lawrence High standout had done his homework, knew what would be expected of him if he signed with the Jayhawks, knew he’d be walking into a situation in which discipline and tough love would be handed out on a daily basis.

“I knew immediately,” said McAnderson, who played his final season at KU in 2007. “They told me, ‘If you want to get coddled, don’t go to Kansas. If you want to play for a guy that’s a disciplinarian, then that’s what you’re getting yourself into.’”

McAnderson chose KU, and the result was an experience that was simultaneously intense and rewarding, one the player says led to an eventual appreciation for Mangino’s rough-edged approach.

Following a tumultuous two days, however, in which in-house accusations against the coach have led to administrative action, the extent of Mangino’s intensity has been called into question.

The university announced Tuesday it was launching an internal investigation into unspecified personnel issues, the aim of which, the Journal-World has learned, is determining whether the coach’s extreme behavior has become an ongoing theme within the program.

The issue arose, according to a source with knowledge of the situation, when Mangino poked senior linebacker Arist Wright in the chest during a game or practice several weeks ago, prompting Wright later to approach athletic director Lew Perkins with concerns about the Jayhawks’ eighth-year coach.

The development comes during a five-game Kansas losing streak, in which the Jayhawks — who opened the season ranked 25th nationally and climbed as high as No. 16 after a 4-0 start —face the distinct possibility of a losing season.

Tuesday afternoon, during his regular weekly meeting with the media, Mangino declined to discuss the specifics of the situation, but seemed to bristle at the fact Perkins chose to make the matter public by releasing a statement to the media.

“If you want to know what was said, I’m not disclosing it,” said Mangino, who met with the Perkins for 10-15 minutes following the athletic director’s meeting with players. “He’s the one who’s disclosing information about it; I’m not.”

The coach went on to say that, despite the distraction, he remained focused on the team’s 7 p.m. game against Texas on Saturday and that speculation he has alienated certain players is unfounded.

“I haven’t lost the team one bit,” he said. “I may have lost some people around here, but it’s not the players.”

Asked to elaborate, Mangino said, “Take that for what it’s worth; you decipher it.”

A small group of players made available Tuesday declined to comment on the specifics of Perkins’ meeting with players — or the events that preceded it — and appeared uneasy when questions persisted.

Said quarterback Todd Reesing, asked whether he felt Mangino had the support of Perkins, “I think Lew is doing what he has to do in the position he has.”

The accusations, if determined to be true, could represent a significant blow to a coach who appears to have struggled with anger issues in the past.

In September of 2002, his first year at Kansas, Mangino publicly apologized following an incident in which he was seen yelling and pointing a finger at high school officials following a Lawrence High football game in which his son, Tommy, had played quarterback.

Two years later, he made headlines for a postgame news conference in which he criticized officials for their performance in the Jayhawks’ narrow loss to Texas.

And in 2007, video footage of the coach unleashing a profanity-laced tirade at KU receiver Raimond Pendleton after the player incurred an unsportsmanlike-conduct penalty made the rounds on the Internet.

Still, until now, the outbursts have been looked upon as a personality quirk of a coach with a blue-collar background and a penchant for tough love — a sentiment backed up by the team’s on-field success under his watch.

Since taking over a program that had endured six straight losing seasons, Mangino has led Kansas to its most fruitful stretch in history. His teams won six or more games in five of his first seven seasons — highlighted by a 12-1 2007 season in which the Jayhawks won the Orange Bowl and Mangino was named the consensus national coach of the year — and won back-to-back bowl games for the first time ever.

Largely as a result of the success, the university approved plans recently for a $34 million luxury-seating project to be constructed on the east side of Memorial Stadium, expected to be completed by the start of the 2010 football season.

“He’s obviously doing something right,” senior safety Darrell Stuckey said Tuesday. “He’s a guy that comes in here, and he does a lot of things that KU’s never seen before. We see (a) BCS game, we see bowl games after bowl games and bowl bids after bowl bids. So as a fan, as a person looking in from the outside, you can’t really complain too much about what he’s done here.”

This season, however, has gone far worse than expected.

With a core of talented playmakers returning on offense and a defense expected to be much improved, the Jayhawks were a trendy preseason pick to notch their first-ever outright Big 12 North title.

But a five-game losing streak in which the team’s offense has stalled and quarterback Todd Reesing was temporarily benched has hindered what was expected to be a “historic” year for the program.

And it’s no coincidence, Mangino said, that the investigation coincides with an extended losing streak.

“This is what comes when things aren’t going well,” said Mangino, who added he didn’t believe an investigation would be under way if his team were 5-1 in the Big 12 instead of 1-5. “You’re going to find disgruntled people. It’s the fact of any organization, whether it’s sports-related, whether it’s corporate — any profession you’re in.”

For their part, players — past and present — indicated that the coach’s approach to discipline, and the way he handles his players, hasn’t changed over the years.

“He’s always been very stern in his resolve,” Reesing said. “... The way he’s approached football is the way a lot of people approach it. He takes the same approach that coaches all across the nation do.”

McAnderson, who spent five seasons under Mangino at Kansas and credits the coach with instilling in him a good amount of discipline, reiterated Reesing’s feelings, indicating that Mangino’s approach — while intense — is normal within the realm of the sport.

“If it wasn’t football, if you took it out of that context, there were times, if it was just people standing around talking, you’d probably think, ‘Wow, that was a little too much,’” he said. “But given the situation, I don’t think so.

“People would disagree with me, but it’s the situation,” he added. “Some of the stuff people say and do in the situation. I mean, people bash helmets over their heads before they come out for football games, and if you saw something like that in the real world, you’d say, ‘Wait a minute, something’s wrong with this kid.’ But that’s part of football to me.”

What remains unclear is how the university’s administration feels about such matters.

KU officials gave no official timetable for the conclusion of the investigation, which will be carried out by KU associate athletics director for risk management Lori Williams, leaving the program with an uncertain future heading into Saturday’s game in Austin.

“I’m really not going to be consumed by this,” Mangino said. “That’s not my nature. ... Texas is my focus, and I’m not going to be distracted by that. We put too much hard work in 12 months a year to prepare for all these games to be distracted and not be ready.”

Comments

bcc 4 years, 8 months ago

Lets go Mr. Perkins fire his azz. The man went to far, after his team got into a very public brawl with the basketball team he yelled at a player for not doing his job in practice. Heck Mr. Perkins while you’re at it pull out the Wichita State stunt, you know the football program that you shut down. Yes they went through a tragedy that they may have never recovered from what happened, but you ever herd of a school called Marshal.

The only good thing that you have done Mr. Perkins is when you were at UConn you left the women’s basketball team alone, and left so the football team could take off.

Fire Mangino, it’s not like he hasn’t done any good for this college. He hasn’t taken a joke of a football team and made them respectful. He doesn’t have the best record compared to the others before him. He hasn’t won a BCS bowl game, or taken his team to back to back bowl games. Oh wait yeah he has, he has done all of those, he has also taken a half full at best stadium and packed it to standing room only.

So he pokes a man that plays college football in the chest, not only a football player but a linebacker. The man has a temper, he yells, he states what he saw at a game against Texas, don’t you recall that game. The game that, like so many others in college football, the “better team,” the team that could play for a “championship,” needs a little help to win the game. Much like what is going on in the SEC this year.

Your right Mr. Perkins, YOU are Kansas Football, not the guy that has stood on the sidelines the past 8 years. Bring back Terry Allen, he’s a heck of a coach. I am sure Ron Prince would like a second chance as a head coach, maybe Charlie Wies I here he is pretty good.

0

Tribehawk 4 years, 8 months ago

So... winning an orange bowl gives a head coach the right to physically abuse, verbally abuse, psychologically abuse, and intimidate his players--many of whom are still teenagers? So if MM had won the national championship last year, does that mean he could beat the crap out of a waterboy with a whip? I'm not saying that MM did everything that is alleged, but if the investigation shows he did, the man must go. There is no justification for a large, screaming, middle-aged millionaire pushing around poor teenagers while hiding behind a clipboard. Success on the football field doesn't give you a golden ticket to be a failure of a human being.

0

kranny 4 years, 8 months ago

His approach hasn't changed as said by players past and present. Recruits knew what they were getting into when they came to Kansas. This is football. If you can't take it, then don't come to Kansas to play-go to Fort Hays. He's not perfect, but he's been the most successful coach to ever be at KU. I will reserve judgement until all the facts are in.

0

KU 4 years, 8 months ago

Give me a freakin' break, Tribehawk! This is big-time college football, like BMac says. It's not the school of liberal arts or the music department. These kids get paid to play football in the form of a free ride for 4 or 5 years. They know what they are getting into and they have probably had high school coaches that flew off the handle at them, too. Football is a game for Gladiators, not girly-girls. It's violent. It's heroic. It's full of testosterone.

I'm not judging whether Mangino is the best coach in the world. I'm just sayin' these kids are playing the sour grapes card. Stand up and be a man! If you're at football practice and you can't take a poke in the chest from a coach, quit playing.

0

lando30 4 years, 8 months ago

I don't think Lew "wants" to fire MM. He's between a rock and a hard place. And as for Lew not doing anything good for KU, that's pure crap. He isn't Jayhawk football, but he has done a lot to help build a program that's supported, that's successful. When I was in school from 96-2000 no one gave 2 scents about football. There was no one on the hill, in the parking lots on the east or west sides tailgating. People care, and they show up and both Lew and MM deserve credit. As for the accusations, let them do the investigation and handle it from there. To me, it doesn't sound like a fireable offense. Going 1-5 with this team would be a better reason to sack MM than poking someone in the chest...

0

Tribehawk 4 years, 8 months ago

KU:

So Neil Reed had no reason to complain of being choked by Bob Knight because he knew what he was getting into when he decided to play for him? Does that mean if a woman marries a man she knows has anger issues, that man is justified in physically abusing her because she knew what she was getting into? Yes, football players expect to be coached hard, pushed to their limit, etc. Yes, football players are gladiators, but there are still rules of engagement and rules of war. There are certain lines that should never be crossed. A coach should NEVER physically assualt a player. The power imbalance is too great. If Wright did that to MM, he would be off the team and possibly arrested. If MM did that to Wright, Wright is expected to take it like a whipped dog and do nothing because "he's a football player." Maybe a single light poke isn't that bad--but what if it was a hard poke? What if it was a series of hard pokes that left bruises? What if it wasn't a poke, but a light punch to his shoulder? A hard punch? A light punch to his face? A hard punch? Where do you draw the line? The best policy is to draw a bright line that everyone can understand: NO PHYSICAL ASSUALT. PERIOD.

0

Jim Darnall 4 years, 8 months ago

How fast we are to rush to judgement when things aren't going well. Mangino is tough and the kids all know this and deal with it. It is the fans that can't seem to deal with it. If he is overly tough, that will all come out and he will probably have to pay for it one way or another. It is too bad. The bottom line it is all about winning and not losing. We fans don't seem to have a lot of patience when it comes to losing. I also think we are forgetting the real level of talent on this team. We are not getting the players in here we should be after the season we had a year ago. I think we are still out gunned in talent verses many of the other teams. What ever happens we will all have to move on.

0

TexasJayhawk78 4 years, 8 months ago

Let's face it, Lew has no interest in supporting Mangino and never did. His only concern is himself. Lew's butt is on the line with this construction project and he does not want the target placed there.

I heard a coach last night say his team stunk. He got all red in the face as he yelled at players. Do you think there will be an investigation with that department as well? Good thing that last three pointer did not go in.

0

KU 4 years, 8 months ago

Tribehawk, if I'm wearing shoulder pads and a helmet and a coach "pokes" me "in the chest"--which is the visual that is conjured from the story titled "Investigation Under Way"--I don't think it's significant. At this time, that's the only "evidence" we have. I'm not assuming Mangino choked a player or punched a player, a la the Oregon kid who laid out the Boise State kid. If that sort of incident comes to light, I am already on the record in another post as saying that would cross the line and be the end of Mangino.

If a player can't take getting poked in the armor by a coach, he's got too thin of skin to play major college football. Part of our problem this year is we aren't physical enough. I can't tell you how many times I've seen linebackers get run over by running backs or holding on for dear life hoping the back trips so they can make the tackle instead of punching the ball carrier in the chest and drilling him to the ground.

0

guscornhawk 4 years, 8 months ago

Curiosity got to me. Thought I would do some research on average pounds of pressure delivered by a football player...lets say Artist Wright. According to Sports Science measurements a vicious hit could measure up to 4800 lbs of presure equal to a 35 mph car crash. According to the author of "Physics of Football" an average hit, average mind you, can put up to 1600 lbs of pressure on the body. I would guess that a poke in the chest is considerably less. Nevermind the head blows these players give each other after a good play by smacking each other in the helmet. Just some food for thought for those who think a poke in the chest is assualt.

0

guscornhawk 4 years, 8 months ago

Sorry, didn't leave my sources...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7tGY-... - Sports Science video

and

http://www.popularmechanics.com/outdoors/sports/4212171.html

Just so you know I'm not making that up...

0

bcc 4 years, 8 months ago

Tribehawk: I understand your reasoning, however I disagree with you.

What you are saying is a coach poking a player in the chest is physically assaulting a player? Yes it can be, off the football field. If Mangino went to this player outside of practice to chew him out and poked him in the chest, then yes I would agree with you, but this doesn’t seem to be the case. The player getting choked by Bob Knight was abuse but this is completely different. If yelling at a player and poking him in the chest while in football practice is “ to physically assault” a player; then what is a slap to the helmet and telling a player to get there head in the game? Aggravated assault? What about a slap on the butt on the field, you see that all the time? Is that sexual harassment?

Yes there is a fine line between motivating a player and assaulting a player, but I personally don’t feel that to poke a player at football practice is the same as to assault that player.

0

Tribehawk 4 years, 8 months ago

KU: If the poke was a single, light, non-threatening poke on armor that one might expect in that context, then I agree this is not a big deal. I guess I'm assuming that the allegation would have to be more than that for a player to bring it up and for the AD to call a team meeting and then launch an independent investigation. But, we all know what assumptions can be worth, so I may well be wrong.

Gus: I think your info is illuminating, but not particularly relevant to what's at issue here. If a linebacker obliterates a player during a play, that is not assault or battery because it is expected given the context. But if a linebacker, after a play, runs to the sideline and slaps the head coach, that is assault/battery regardless of the force of the blow because it is not expected given the context.

bcc: It all has to do with context and what could be reasonably anticipated in that context. I think your examples given their context would be instances of expected physical contact. But what happend to Wright obviously was not expected, anticipated, or welcomed as evidenced by the fact that he spoke to the AD about it. I've been throwing the word "assault" around on here, but I guess to be technically correct, I should call what happend to Wright (allegedly) "battery." The Kansas staute for battery defines it as this. "[I]ntentionally causing physical contact with another person when done in a rude, insulting or angry manner." 21-3412 (a)(2). Kansas deems this a class b misdemeanor. Your examples would not qualify for battery given the context, but MM's alleged behavior would--if it's as bad as I'm assuming for Wright to have reported it.

0

Philip Bowman 4 years, 8 months ago

Those who are talking about firing Mangino have the wrong man in their target. It is Perkins that should go. He has spent his time at KU looking for ways to line his pockets; with the millions that have been spent on the facilities, not a dime went to cleaning up and repairing restrooms in the stadium. Of course the fatcats all have their comforts. What about the other 50,000 ticket holders?

0

beebe1 4 years, 8 months ago

Physical violence is a major part of football. Coaches have been known to lose their temper and over step a little. The worst was the Ohio State coach for hitting a player on national TV. But the players know that a lot of it is part of the deal. I have heard lots of stories about players and coaches, going clear back to the '50 's.

In this case, it seems that the instigator was out of line. And the fact that parents supported him is also out of line, but not a surprise in this day and age. Frankly, a discussion about controlling hi s temper off the field might be ok as to the coach. The instigator should be quietly suggested that he go elsewhere next year. As for you complainers, you have about cost us the best recruit crew we ever had -- due next year of course. And the purported progress is about to be lost indefinitely. And standing up for Bowen would put us back in the 'Allen' days.

Yeah we've got coaching problems, but they center on a poor scheme of defense and poor special teams. My regret is that MM didn't see it first and get it corrected a couple of years ago!

0

88hawk 4 years, 8 months ago

I know that Al Bohl left under a cloud of controversy, however, he should be credited with bringing tailgating AND Mangino to KU. I was on campus 85-88 and other than one year, nobody cared about the team unless we were hosting OU or Nebraska, then, of course, the crimson and blue would be severely outnumbered by our guests! Terry Allen was no Knute Rockne, but I had to endure Bob Valesente! Lew has helped commercialize our sports, which does have a place, but don't forget AL brought the college game day experience to KU! Artist, get a life. Why is this story just now coming out when he supposedly was poked over a month ago. Obviously, since he's still playing, it's not that big of a deal!

0

jhokfan 4 years, 8 months ago

I best the same stuff goes on at Florida, Texas, et al. As long as they’re winning it never surfaces.

0

booze_buds_03 4 years, 8 months ago

"In 110 years of Kansas Football since 1890 (1,175 games at the end of this season), KU has won about 51% of its games (excluding ties). In conference games, KU has won about 40% of its 590 games.

In eight years as Kansas Football head coach, the average Mark Mangino season is about 6-6, 3-5. In short, he has been the average Kansas football coach in terms of on the field performance. In all other areas, he has far exceeded average (interest in the program, tickets sold, revenue generated, quality of recruits, facility improvements, bowl games, etc.). In my opinion, you can create a solid argument that he has been the best coach in our program's mediocre history.

Mangino has basically five problems:

  1. There are some (not a majority) of boosters who got too excited about 2007
  2. He wasn't hired by Lew Perkins
  3. He is a bit of a hot head
  4. He weighs 500 pounds---and most importantly...
  5. He went on a 5 (soon to be 7) game losing streak just after his boss announced a huge stadium improvement project designed to further feather the AD's cap and make the new Chancellor look good.

For every former player who didn't like his playing time and is now coming out of the woodwork to bad mouth the guy, there is another that says that playing for Mangino made him a better man.

If KU had found a way to pick up 2 more wins this season (7-3 instead of 5-5), none of this would be an issue. (Heck, maybe even if Briscoe comes down with that pass in the end zone in Boulder and the record is now 6-4).

I don't believe that Perkins has ever been out to get Mangino. However, Lew is a business man. If you aren't part of the solution, you are part of the problem to him. Mangino is now part of the problem.

He's gone. Perkins will handle the dismissal pretty well. Mangino will have the opportunity to exit with dignity. The question in my mind is whether or not he will have the temperament and wisdom to do so.

For the future, I'd like to see Perkins go for it (and I think he just might). We need youth and enthusiasm. We do not need experience or ties to the past. Kansas needs to first catch the mid-tier programs in the conference before we can set our sights any higher."

0

Layne Pierce 4 years, 8 months ago

I am very concerned that MM is being run out on a rail because of the losing streak. The fact is, however, that you have to look very carefully at team morale, which this year, going back to the fight with the basketball players, Leuken being hurt and leaving the team, Crawford leaving, that something is going on with morale.

If MMs beligerance has harmed morale, and contributed to this debacle of losses we now find ourselves in, then Lew will have to make a tough decision, if on the other hand there is nothing more than a couple of sore players, then nothing will happen.

I would have preferred that the matter not be made public. In doing so, the deck is already somewhat stacked against Mangino, and he will be damaged goods, even if he stays.

0

railer20 4 years, 8 months ago

Everyone is blowing this way out of proportion for what little facts we have. The way I see it is these players have been coddled, babied, and told how good they are their whole lives and Mangino is letting them know that until they prove it they aren't crap.

As far as Perkins' and Mangino's jobs that everyone is criticizing, look where we were before Mangino came, and what Lew has done to help him build this program to what it is. KU IS NOT A BIG TIME PROGRAM, and if Mangino goes we will not get anyone better than him to come and coach here, PERIOD. We have been spoiled by a few good years and need to realize what KU's reality is...8 or 9 wins most seasons with a 10-12 win season every once in a great while.

0

jhawk613 4 years, 8 months ago

Mangino should be fired, BUT NOT BECAUSE OF THIS.

A 24-39 conference record and that is with the 7-1 conference season of 2007. Exclude his ONE winning year and his conference record is 17-38. That's flat-out horrible.

He's done a great job building a team from nothing. I think he will get one more year to create some semblance of success without Reesing and Co.

Perkins has a limited window to vault to the next tier of teams. If he keeps Mangino and passes on other coaches he risks falling back to the bottom half of the Big 12 North. Once that happens, recruiting difficulty increases.

He should go after a coach like Turner Gill or a coordinator of one of the top 10 teams in the country. Recruits need to see that KU is committed to winning and Mangino is a 8-4 coach at best (and that's with his 4 weak non-con games every year).

0

jhokfan 4 years, 8 months ago

I hope Mangino can weather this storm. No coach will come to a program with our history unless they intend to use us as a stepping stone. The Urban Meyer's of the football world only come to Lawrence as a means of improving their resume. If Mangino is canned I'll bet my house that the next coach will be gone in 4 years or less. He'll either get fired or leave for another job.

0

jesusisajhawk 4 years, 8 months ago

This is way too big of a distraction to introduce during the season. Put the guy in anger management classes or something and be done with it.

0

rastameta 4 years, 8 months ago

Before everyone talks crap on the players complaining. Read this article:

http://kansas.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1018041

0

Larry Ewart 4 years, 8 months ago

Well, as far as I am concerned the damage has been done. Our recruiting base will be hard pressed to recover from this kind of fallout. If you think a 3 or 4 star athlete is going to sign at KU now after hearing what current and former players are saying you are in a dreamworld. These are still kids and they would not sign a letter of intent knowing that they are going to be verbally or physically abused. Playing for tough coaches who require discipline is one thing but being abused is another. The university has no choice in my view. He has to go!

0

Tribehawk 4 years, 8 months ago

Just to add a little gas to the fire...

http://www.kmbc.com/news/21656836/detail.html

If half of what all these reports are saying is true, Mangino must go. It's unfortunate that Lew (or possibly the people bringing these accusations to him) waited until a 5 game losing streak to act on all this. It makes everyone look bad and opportunistic. If this stuff is true, it is despicable and shameful behavior and all the BCS bowl wins in the world can't change that or justify it. And buckys1 is right--we've likely lost all our recruits at this point--deservedly so if the investigation proves any of these allegations.

0

jayhawkboogeyman 4 years, 8 months ago

rastameta - Just read the Rivals article. Dealing with a handicapped father (smoking=lung disease), I can tell you right now if someone said to me what they players in that article say Mangino said to them, I would without hesitation break his nose then and there. It seems strange to me that all these horrible stories are coming out all at once, and I am trying to keep an open mind, but if it is true that he said those things to players, he can leave the University of Kansas straight to the depths of hell as far as I am concerned.

0

danno1313 4 years, 8 months ago

Man, the KU FB players would really hate me! Five wins, not getting it done!

0

kansasbb33 4 years, 8 months ago

I don't know the details of what has gone on with Mangino and his players but it sounds like this might be a little blown out of proportion. I'm not saying however that Mangino doesn't need to change his ways a little but come on look at what he has down for the KU Football program. These are college students who sometimes needs discipline. I hope the right decisions are made and KU can turn it around next year and have a successful season.

0

jahawkdave 4 years, 8 months ago

MEANgino hasn't shown the self discipline to lose any weight how is he going to have the self discipline to control his anger. I have no issues with his weight at all, but he must show discipline to demand it.

Would he allow one of his players to: be overweight and out of shape, get 23 parking tickets, poke a coach in the chest, cuss out campus parking officials, disrespect a coach/opponent/ref..... Heck no he would not put up with any of that crap for a second. Mangino is simply a disciplinarian with no discipline himself.

Just because we had one extreme in Allen doesn't mean we need the other extreme in MADgino. Everyone who is saying this is football and the players need to suck it up, are absolutely right. This is football and the Head coach needs to suck it up, you don't produce W's you get canned! He's getting 3 gimees a year... Northern Co's, Intrn'l Fla's, central this, western that, eastern who. We can and should do better than Mangino.

0

Christopher Johnson 4 years, 8 months ago

Mangino's weight shouldn't be a part of this discussion. Every single person lacks discipline in some part of their lives. Mangino's happens to be something that's hard to hide. Jahawkdave, you've undoubtedly got undisciplined parts of your life along with the rest of us. Don't point to his weight as a primary legitimate source for how strong his self discipline is. If you're going to do that, at least discuss the parts of his life that he has an incredible amount of discipline. I guarantee he works as hard or harder than any of us at his job. He lives his job. He sacrifices family time and all while exposing himself to the public for all of this bad mouthing. How many of us would do this and continue working at our jobs like he does. Sure, any good football coach or salesman, or any other profession works hard. But don't point to one area of his life that he struggles with (his weight) and act like it's a legitimate illustration of what you think is a failure. That's a sad conversation, my friend.

0

jahawkdave 4 years, 8 months ago

Hawkandtigerfan you are right that should not be an issue and I retract my comments regarding weight, but not the other issues I've brought up.

Whitlock's 2 cents:

http://www.kansascity.com/182/story/1579447.html

0

Dale Kroening 4 years, 8 months ago

Story on ESPN quoting more former players. I have to say the poking, hollering, and cursing a player happens in football no matter what university pretty much, but the fact of him getting personal and degrading players about their families and family issues is where he crossses the line. I was behind him, and will be if this is untrue, but if it is true which is looking more and more likely, its time for him to go. Players are coming out of the woodwork now - Rivera - Herford- Brown -Collins - Crawford- Brorsen. This doesnt look good, and is an embarrasment to this university.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=4669621

0

Commenting has been disabled for this item.