Realignment Today: 5:50 p.m. - More signs point to Big 12 liking 10 as U.S. government gets involved


5:50 p.m. Update:

More signs starting to roll in that the Big 12 is prepared to stay at 10, whenever it gets there. Louisville basketball coach Rick Pitino gave his thoughts on the ongoing realignment saga.

Pitino, who firmly is against the idea of the Big East's demise, said he had no idea which university would be the Big 12's 10th but added that West Virginia heading to the Big 12 was not yet 100 percent certain.

Here's the link. Pitino has a small role in all of this, but it's interesting to follow, nonetheless. You never know the motives a coach has for saying what he says. Take a look.

4:38 p.m. Update:

Evidently, McConnell's efforts here reached all the way to Kansas.

According to a Tweet posted on Tuesday morning from @kcchamberGOV, McConnell reached out to a U.S. senator from Kansas, Jerry Moran, and asked him to lobby KU chancellor Bernadette Gray-Little to talk to the Big 12 about admitting Louisville.

None by KC Chamber Govmt

The Tweet (link above) attributes the information to Moran, who was hosted by the Greater KC Chamber on Tuesday.

Stay tuned...

4:09 p.m. Update:

I said a while ago that the longer this thing drags on, the more crazy it becomes. It looks as if that's accurate.

Reports are now surfacing that West Virginia senators Jay Rockefeller and Joe Manchin have weighed in on realignment and are calling for senate investigations if any type of tampering is responsible for the hold up. Wow.

Here are the quotes, which come in reaction to reports that Kentucky senator Mitch McConnell may have been involved in blocking WVU's move to the Big 12 so that his alma mater, Louisville, would still have a shot to make its way to the Midwest.

First, from Rockefeller:
"The Big 12 picked WVU on the strength of its program — period. Now the media reports that political games may upend that. That’s just flat wrong. I am doing and will do whatever it takes to get us back to the merits.”

And, this from Manchin:
"If these outrageous reports have any merit – and especially if a United States Senator has done anything inappropriate or unethical to interfere with a decision that the Big 12 had already made – then I believe that there should be an investigation in the U.S. Senate, and I will fight to get the truth. West Virginians and the American people deserve to know exactly what is going on and whether politics is interfering with our college sports."

As much as involvement from U.S. senators makes you think this thing's getting serious, it's actually quite the opposite as the whole thing looks like more of a joke than ever. Wow.

For more on the McConnell involvement, check out the following links:

Stay tuned...

3:03 p.m. Update:

With Big 12 expansion now delayed, let's jump back in to where we were before the whole West Virginia to the Big 12 talk started.

A couple of things, real quick. I've noticed that people out there are blasting many members of the Big 12 media for messing this up. It's important for people to remember that this story — realignment — is unlike any story ever covered. It's fluid, it changes often, sometimes every hour, and things that are correct and real one minute can be completely off base a few hours later. Unfortunately, that's just the way it is with this mess. We'll get there, though.

OK, moving on.

One thing I stumbled upon a few minutes ago that I thought was very interesting was a Tweet from Chuck Carlton, of the Dallas Morning News that says MU chancellor Brady Deaton will be traveling to India on Tuesday to speak at a conference on radiopharmaceuticals. At the risk of looking like Captain Obvious, I'm guessing that the Mizzou portion of all this will be wrapped up before then.

Then again, that may not be possible.

With WVU and Louisville fighting to become the 10th member of the Big 12, many people are wondering why the league can't or won't just add them both. It's a good question. But sources tell me that Missouri's uncertainty, along with the fact that the rest of the field yields no attractive candidates have the league reluctant to move beyond 10.

If.... Big IF here.... the Tigers somehow have a change of heart or are rejected at the last minute, the league could look at bringing Mizzou back and adding WVU and Louisville to get to 12. I could see that happening. But that's only if the Tigers shun or are shunned by the SEC, which is harder to see happening.

What about BYU, you ask? Here's an interesting take from BYU's football coach that sheds some light on why the Cougars might not be a good candidate.

It's believed that the hold up here might be because the Big 12, which reportedly voted to accept WVU on Monday, is now split on adding Louisville or WVU.

Although it's not up to him, Texas Tech football coach Tommy Tuberville had some interesting things to say about why Louisville's the more attractive option.

Still trying to talk to some people to find out exactly where we're at and where we're headed.

Stay tuned...

2:04 p.m. Update:

The more this goes on, the crazier it gets. How crazy? According to Brett McMurphy, of, the Big 12 had a press release ready to go to announce West Virginia as its newest member.

I'll be back quickly with another update on all angles.

Stay tuned...

12:28 p.m. Update:

Well, leave it to conference realignment to show us one thing: Things are not always what they seem to be.

Tuesday, the talk throughout the college sports world was that, with Missouri leaving the Big 12 — which is still happening, by the way — West Virginia would join TCU as the newest member of the league.

There remained plenty of details to be worked out, such as when they would join, how much they'd have to pay the Big East to leave and what the Big 12 would do next, but it seemed certain that the folks from Morgantown, WV, were Big 12 bound.

Today, according to multiple reports, the move is on hold as the Big 12 seeks more information on West Virginia and Louisville (remember them?) makes another play to slide into the Big 12's 10th spot.

Pete Thamel, of The New York Times, wrote today that the whole thing is in a holding pattern and that it's a 50-50 deal between WVU and Louisville.

Many have asked why the Big 12 can't just add both and I think that would be an option if there were a solid 12th team out there. Right now, with BYU looking less likely and teams like Cincinnati, South Florida, Boise State and others looking less appealing, it just doesn't seem like going to 11 and then being stuck is something the Big 12 wants to explore. Beyond that, UT and OU have made it very clear that they would like the league to stay at 10. If there were a no-brainer 12th and the league could add Louisville, WVU and, say, Notre Dame, then I think OU and UT could get over it. But moving away from their ideal number just to add Cincinnati does not appear to be a concession they're willing to make.

So now we wait. At this rate, it seems likely that Missouri will make its intentions official before the Big 12 does.

But, hey, doesn't that seem about right?

Stay tuned...


blindrabbit 11 years, 1 month ago

The drama of realignment is proving to be more exciting than the sport competition.

d_prowess 11 years, 1 month ago

I hate that UT and OU don't want to go to 12 teams mainly because it would bring back a Championship game in football and that add another hurdle to reaching the BCS Championship game. It seems to me that if you truly are the best, you wouldn't be scared to play a conference championship game. There just seems something scared/soft about taking that stance that doesn't sit well.

DanHogan95 11 years, 1 month ago

Here, here. We follow these sports waiting for the great high-profile games, players dream of playing in big time high-profile games. Why rule out an obvious high-profile game? If you belong in the national championship game a conference champ win should push you in!

Eric Dawson 11 years, 1 month ago

Absolutely right! Those folks need to take care of business now and stop counting their chickens before they're hatched!

Now the B1G, the Pac12, the SEC and the ACC are all going to have Conference Championship games, and the Big 12 won't get back to 12 so it can, too?

The BEleven and Pac10 added members to get to at least 12 so they could have that game. Aside from the $ for the participants, they believed that their conferences were losing out big time to the Big 12, SEC and ACC by not being on the national stage the week after the end of the regular season.

Seems that same logic would hurt the Big 12(-) when it is the only one of the real "BCS" conferences* that will not be having a Conference Championship game.

*not counting the sinking BEast in that group any more, although technically they still are.

justanotherfan 11 years, 1 month ago

It's not the fear of playing a title game that has them nervous. It's splitting the pie 11 or 12 ways. If the conference goes back to 12, it needs to make more money. At 10, you split the pie only 10 ways, which means more for everyone. At 12, you need a bigger pie to get the same amount, and the concern with USF, Louisville and Cincinnati is that they won't bring enough cashflow to justify the conference at 12 without taking a small piece of the pie out of everyone's check.

nuleafjhawk 11 years, 1 month ago

I suppose that's one way to look at it. To me it just seems like a great opportunity to sustain injuries to players before a big bowl game.

ahpersecoachingexperience 11 years, 1 month ago

10 also gives you more non conference games. Another chance to play some scrub in front of a sold out stadium. Paying them in peanuts while they collect some serious cash.

Kyle Helmer 11 years, 1 month ago

I thought we were past what OU and UT want. Shouldn't every team have a say. 10 makes no sense at all. Get them both. Play with 11 for a while. How long did the Big 10 do it?

DanHogan95 11 years, 1 month ago

Hear, hear! (See how I got that right this time?)

B1G went for, what, a decade, with 11 schools. It went fine - other than the name being weird with the white space "11", it was great. B1G hung back hoping ND would make 12 and conf champ game but that never happened. Still, 11 was just fine. If both schools fit and can carry their weight, add them.

Unless, of course, they have some plan to bring in ND at #11 but won't add #12 to avoid the conf champ game.

Carter Patterson 11 years, 1 month ago

I'm going to guess SMU for the 12th to break the deadlock. UT can't say no without political ramifications. Fans don't want to travel any further than they have to. MU fans are starting to complain/defect because they don't want to travel 1200 miles on game day.

LAJayhawk 11 years, 1 month ago

A 5th Texas school? No thank you.

Not to mention that it is only 40 miles away from TCU... We got the Texas market covered (and definitely the Dallas area). SMU doesn't help the conference.

Eric Dawson 11 years, 1 month ago!/McMurphyCBS/sta... "Multiple Big East sources said they have been told by WVU officials that WVU rejected by ACC & SEC"

Not the first time it's happened, either.

sportjunky 11 years, 1 month ago

Learn to back up your statements when you make them. The burden of proof is upon you when you make such statements.

And why, might I ask, would someone want "to Google" themselves? They already know all about themselves, why do they need Google to tell them more about themselves? Learn the basic rules of grammar.

I dislike being snippy in these forums, but you are consistently that way.

Eric Dawson 11 years, 1 month ago

In line with sportjunky -- You made the claim, you back it up. Nobody else should have to do your work for you.

Thanks for the link. Reads like damage control PR spin to me. Which unnamed source do we believe? Perhaps the first, since the SEC would be better on most counts for WVU, yet these days WVU is very interested in the Big 12? Hmmm.

Ben Kliewer 11 years, 1 month ago

Here we go again...where's your link to THIS story?

Ben Kliewer 11 years, 1 month ago

That was in response to manginorh00lz, btw

Ben Kliewer 11 years, 1 month ago

Oh, I forgot, Kirk Herbstreit is master of all things. Okay, you're absolutely right, based on your irrefutable evidence that Kirk Herbstreit said something.

Ben Kliewer 11 years, 1 month ago

You keep saying "Learn to read" but it seems to be you that continues to make a bunch of baloney statements, then not remembering what you said, then providing flimsy support for the points you made, that you then say you didn't say.

Learn to not be a moron.

Ben Kliewer 11 years, 1 month ago

Oh, and I do Google all your statements. Apart from maybe, MAYBE finding an offshoot conspiracy theorist who agrees with you, there's generally little support for many of the confident statements you make.


Kent Wells 11 years, 1 month ago

Never argue with a pig. The pig likes it and you get dirty.

pstonef 11 years, 1 month ago

Great, now we have a possibility of pissing off WVU, a viable memeber, and possibly losing the opportunity because UT and OU will get their collective panites in a bunch if we also decide to add L'ville....hmm, consider this, we add WVU like we apparently verbally promised and add L'ville as the 11th school..maybe Mizscrewloose will reconc=sider and we get 12 teams or if they leave we deal with 11 very good memebers who WANT to be with the BXII. Worse case scenario, we screw around like we are and lose both WVU and L;ville because we appear as f^%ked up as we probably are !!

pstonef 11 years, 1 month ago

Sorry about the typos..multi-tasking

sm5561 11 years, 1 month ago

It seems to me there is a no-brainer 12th team... Missery. I thought that was one of their "demands"? 12 teams and grant of rights longer than 6 years. So add WVU and Louisville, sign the grant of rights for the length of the fox deal and be done with it.

No matter how much I want to (and will) vilify Missery for this it seems OU and TU are still the bad guys.

Eric Dawson 11 years, 1 month ago

From Thamel's article:

"Two people with direct knowledge of the situation said that lobbying by the Senate minority leader, Mitch McConnell, Republican of Kentucky, including to David Boren, the president of the University of Oklahoma and a former senator, helped slow West Virginia’s admittance to the Big 12."

Great! First Jay Nixon and his hand-picked MU Curators, now Mitch McConnell -- let's really screw things up, have even more politicos involved!

Would somebody please MAKE A DECISION AND STICK TO IT!

Me, I say add them both and go to 12, you d**n fools! Come ON, little schools, stand together and get it done!

LAJayhawk 11 years, 1 month ago

Well, that's good. Obviously, Mitch McConnell has plenty of time to do this sort of thing. The country has nothing else going on at the moment.......

Steve Reigle 11 years, 1 month ago

Oh, for crying out loud. Just add both WVU and Louisville. If Missouri leaves, we have 10. If Missouri stays (very unlikely) then add another to bring it back to 12. I have to wonder what WVU is thinking about the Big 12 about now.

d_prowess 11 years, 1 month ago

We have already added TCU, so by adding WVU and UL, we would have 11 (assuming MU leaves)

Steve Reigle 11 years, 1 month ago

Sorry, I didn't say it the way I was thinking it. If we go ahead and add both WVU and UL and Missouri does not leave, then we are at 12. If we add both WVU and UL and Missouri does leave, then we are at 11 and we add one more to get to 12. Sorry I was not sufficiently clear on my thinking.

JayDocMD 11 years, 1 month ago

Counting TCU, we will be at 9 when Mizzery leaves. So adding both would put us at 11, not 10.

Boise_Jayhawk 11 years, 1 month ago

Spellcheck on Virginia in the title.

Realignment is a nice distraction from the challenges KU is facing on the defensive side of the football field so far this year.

texashawk10 11 years, 1 month ago

That's how people there spell it, just like people from Missouri think there's a "z" in their state name.

d_prowess 11 years, 1 month ago

Stories are coming out now that the reports that WVU was a "lock" to the B12 was all drummed up by media (not our Matt Tait of course!) following rumors and so I doubt that anyone actually involved feels like they are getting jerked around. Just the fan bases, which we know don't matter at all in all of this!

pstonef 11 years, 1 month ago

I sure hope you are right..if I was WVU and we had an agreement in principle I would be PISSED

Michael Maris 11 years, 1 month ago

Well, last I knew. KU Rowing team was competing in Conference USA (from an article that was posted on this site months ago).

manginodrh00lz 11 years, 1 month ago

Please use Google. We're tired of helping you.

sportjunky 11 years, 1 month ago

No, apparently, YOU are tired of helping him. Please stop speaking for me and for everyone else.

Eric Dawson 11 years, 1 month ago

Thamel originally reported that at Monday's meeting the Big 12 BoD were unanimous on adding WVU.
Now Thamel is reporting that Senator Mitch McConnell has jumped into the fray feet first hollerin' "Whoa, Nellie!" and getting listened to, especially by former US Senator and current OU Chancellor Boren.

Assuming Thamel is relying on the same sources, this doesn't seem to be "drummed up by the media" at all. It seems to indicate it is more than us fans that are getting jerked around.

d_prowess 11 years, 1 month ago

Hey Tait, you need to get the LJW/KUSports to make up a new ad about how you are straight killing it on this realignment stuff. You have to be way past the 1 million hits so far!!

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 1 month ago

Interesting development... I dare hope that MIzzou stays and both WVU and Louisville come along....

kureader 11 years, 1 month ago

I still think it's great that the Big 12 is using "media publicity" to upstage Missouri.

It's as though the Big 12 is saying, "In your face Missouri ... we're sick of your whining and gloating ... we're going to replace you arrogant boneheads BEFORE you even leave!"

MU ... at least we probably won't have to hear them complain about the bowl they're selected for ... right now, it looks like they won't be bowl eligible! LOL.

pstonef 11 years, 1 month ago

THIS JUST IN >>>> The Big East trades the Big XII Louisville, WVU and a 12-Pack of Bud Light for naming rights to the Big XII Conference Championship and a Texas school to be named later!!! In response the ACC has agreed to switch places with the Pac-infinity for 83 hurricane shutters and earthquake insurance...Also ESPN sources reveal that the New York Mets will be the 2012 Super Bowl Champions in a new crossover league.

Can anyone even take these bozos seriously anymore!!?!?!?!?!?!

Thomas Matlock 11 years, 1 month ago

Just when you think that you have heard the last of it, it rears it's ugly head again.

franklin2739 11 years, 1 month ago


Does the fact that no big East Team can leave for two years matter in who we choose? I was thinking the Big 12 could be in breach of its TV contracts with only 9 teams next year.

LAJayhawk 11 years, 1 month ago

TCU likely will not have to wait as they haven't been a part of the Big East yet. And, apparently, one of the hangups for mizzou is the legality and fees of when they can leave. I believe the Big 12 wants them for one more year and will up the exit fees if they take off next year.... that's just what I've gathered from Matt's other posts.

Eric Dawson 11 years, 1 month ago

Its already reported that TCU is here next year to replace A&M, so that's good to go.

The issue is if mOO leaves after this season and WVU (or whoever) can't join until Fall 2013.

JayhawkLifer 11 years, 1 month ago

I was under the impression that Boren was all for 12 members (eventually). Has this changed or I am just remembering wrong? I searched the internet but couldn't find anything either way.

agraves 11 years, 1 month ago

Do you have a link to this information?

manginodrh00lz 11 years, 1 month ago

It's called a prediction. Not everything is fact my little forum sweetheart.

Pbbut 11 years, 1 month ago

You're kidding! Someone from Missouri would have a second thought before they had a first?

sportjunky 11 years, 1 month ago

Actually, the 3:03 update doesn't say that Mizzou is staying. Rather, the 3:03 update merely mentions the very remote possibility that Mizzou could end up staying, which is exactly what Matt has said all along. However, I admit that the titles of a couple of the updates say that it is a foregone conclusion are certainly imply that Mizzous is definitely gone, but the text of those articles always (or very nearly always) states that it is not 100% certain.

Of course, you'll Google to find the lone exception and then try to use that as proof that your are 100% correct.

Joe Ross 11 years, 1 month ago

Matt, why the hell do OU and Texas want to remain at 10, especially considering we have been at 12 forever?

Daniel Kennamore 11 years, 1 month ago

Because they want as little competition as possible between them and a national title game.

Vernon Riggs 11 years, 1 month ago

Let all of the ADs meet, talk and then vote. Grow to 12? Stay at 10? Most votes win.

TKHAWK 11 years, 1 month ago

The Big XII needs to quit waffling and decide, is it committed to getting to 12 or does it want to stay at ten. If you want to stay at ten, fine, but change the stupid name. I don't know why, but the B1G having 12 seems to make sense, but the BIG XII with 10 is dumb. If their long term goal is to get to 12, then you take a great school like Louisville along with WV, even if it means you are stuck at eleven for a little while. What if we take WV, then next year decide we want Louisville but now they've accepted an ACC bid? You strike a deal when you can strike a deal. Obviously MU is leaving or else we'd be saying take L and WV and we'd be at 12.

TKHAWK 11 years, 1 month ago

Its worth pointing out though, what a difference a month makes. A month ago no one thought the Big XII would survive. Now 2 programs are jockeying to get a bid! I honestly believe by the time we get back to 12 (and I pray we get back to 12), this conference is going to be stud!

blindrabbit 11 years, 1 month ago

Maybe, Missouri Drama Queens are trying to find enough crows to serve for dinner; getting ready to turn the Tigers tail. If they stay in Big12 can you imagine the tiger dung they are going to have to live with, nobody is going to help them clean up their messes

Big10 did not want them! Apparently SEC does not either! Got their feelings hurt when they realized they can be easily replaced! Realized the University of South Carolina was also in Columbia! Real MU fans realized what crap they had in Nixon, Deaton, Owens and Alden! Realized they can not compete any better in SEC than Big12! Realized that their slaver claim did not "cotton" to the real Confederates! Realized that Missouri has a Western side and not just St. Louis and Jeff. City! Realized Colorado, Nebraska and A&M had more value to others than they do! Realized that most schools would not want to schedule a bunch on whiners!

Eric Dawson 11 years, 1 month ago

@blindrabbit: FWIW, WHB 810am (Kietzman) has been reporting that Deaton went into the mOO BoC meeting wanting to stay in the B12, but MO Gov Jay Nixon's appointees followed Nixon's desires and the BoC railroaded Deaton into going to the SEC.

True? Kietzman insists it is, but those who know aren't publicly admitting anything.

If true, it does make the delay in a mOO decision, and Deaton's remarks that it could be a matter of a couple of days or a couple of weeks, much more interesting, though, doesn't it?

Also of note is that Deaton is supposed to be making a presentation at a conference in India next week (1-9 Nov). If no decision has been announced by the time he leaves, what would that mean? There wouldn't be an announcement while he's gone, would there?

If Deaton really does think staying is the best deal for mOO (as just about everyone not wearing black & gold glasses would objectively conclude once they had all the known facts), then he really is caught between Scylla and Charybdis. If he does what he really thinks is best and has mOO stay, he risks immediate crucifixion by the BoC and a legion of mOO fans and donors. If he moves mOO to the SEC and mOO disappears into the bottom of the conference and out of the media eye, eventually he will be viewed as the man who destroyed mOO's national athletics reputation (such as it is).

All I can say for certain is that with the exception of hiring Pinkel, mOO's track record with major athletics decisions has not been the best in the past decade. That's cannot be very encouraging to the average mOO fan.

TKHAWK 11 years, 1 month ago


I heard a rumored scenario yesterday, MU leaves, Big XII adds UL and WV as full members, ND as everything BUT football and BYU as football ONLY. Does this rumor hold any water with anthing you've heard, or is that just pie in the sky?

blindrabbit 11 years, 1 month ago

If the Oklahoma University President David Boren stories are true; he needs to get things straight if you know what I mean! Always been leery of slimy, smilin Mitch McConnell as well

Steve Brown 11 years, 1 month ago

Matt kudos for great reporting, much appreciated.

Hey, clarify something for me please, I've been having so much fun with rumors, innuendos and half truths I forgot the real world.

Has SEC officially extended an offer to MU that they are considering or is the offer so far, behind closed doors on the table yet not announced. is it you can join us if you want, or tell us if you want an invite and then we will have a final vote.

I am wondering if we dressed up the WV pig that she may look more appealing to SEC East teams than all of them flying half a country to Columbia.

Matt Tait 11 years, 1 month ago

The offer is not yet official. Remember how the SEC handled the Texas A&M move? That's how they're handling this. They want Mizzou to break up with the Big 12 first and then they'll be clear to offer.

Makes sense. Is good business. And protects against lawsuits and whatever else.

That said, I'm sure it's been made clear that the offer will come. If not, there's no way Mizzou goes to these lengths with their flirtations...

Or is there?

TKHAWK 11 years, 1 month ago

One more point then I need to move on with my day. 11 is not an undoable number. I believe the Big 10 has given us a template for that.

Ben Kliewer 11 years, 1 month ago

I say they invite both UL and WVU. That way, in the case that Mizzou leaves, we're at 11 (And nobody seemed to think the Big 10 was any lesser for it the whole time they were at 11) in the less likely scenario that Mizzou stays, we're at 12. I'd rather be the Big 12 with 11 teams than the Big 12 with 10 teams. Plus, 11 teams provides the same scheduling as a 10 team league. In fact, didn't the Big 10 play a schedule where you actually didn't play all the other teams in the conference when they were at 11? If I remember correctly, they played an 8 game conference schedule and everybody skipped on two teams. That seems like it would benefit UT and OU's preference more. More teams in the conference, without a championship game, and you don't even play everybody. Seems to me that TOSU made it to the NC twice with that formula.

Ben Kliewer 11 years, 1 month ago

Haha, didn't see your comment before I posted TKHAWK. Looks like I'm not the only one who sees the potential.

Steve Brown 11 years, 1 month ago

Ring ring: BillyBob: hello Bevo: Hey, Billy Bob it's me Bevo. Billy Bob: What you want today Bevo?

Hear you been flirting with my little sister, Tiger. Yeah, but you got to know she called me, we didn't contact her. Either way, here is some advice, take her if you want, she likes sleeping on the back porch don't let her inside, we never did. She has high opinion of herself. Also, send the $30 million exit fee to us, we are the bank for the B12.

We know, B1G called us to warn us, our eyes are open.

One more thang BillyBob, don't expect to send her back to us for postseason, we like you guys but Tiger isn't welcome at Cotton Bowl, Alamo Bowl, Houston Bowl nor ElPaso bowl, don't be sending her back to us post season.

Bevo, we got it, same deal as Aggies, hey when are you guys going to quite acting like your own country.

Well BillyBob, Texas is our own country.

jgkojak 11 years, 1 month ago

Well, seems the issue is the Sen. Minority Leader (McConnell) is meddling in this -

also, I like the idea that maybe the SEC has seen the light and wants WVU as its 14th member - it sure makes more sense division-wise and geographically.

THAT would make me LMAO.

However, I think the truth is that McConnell is lobbying Boren over Louisville.

Note Louisville is better academically than WVU and certainly a better fit geographically. And it'd be fun because Pitino doesn't want to get his clock cleaned in the B12, so he'd probably leave.

Gregor Southard 11 years, 1 month ago

Does "10" mean no bball tourney as well? I really only have two opinions on all this: good riddance Misery and no Notre Dame unless all sports teams join.

jgkojak 11 years, 1 month ago

No-- bball tourney will give Top 6 a bye and have bottom 4 "play in" for the 7 and 8 spots.

And I'd be OK w/the other ND teams other than football - first, as an enticement if they ever decided they needed conf. membership. Second, that's a lot of eyeballs in a lot of eastern big city markets watching KU basketball. Definitely worth it.

texashawk10 11 years, 1 month ago

PAC 12 when they were still at 10 teams only invited the top 8 teams to their conference tournament for a few years.

Lance Hobson 11 years, 1 month ago

I know everyone hates BYU but they would be such a great addition. Great academics, great sports, huge following. Not sure if I could hate them like I do Mizzou, but I'd sure try.

Ben Kliewer 11 years, 1 month ago

I'll actually agree with you on this one.

sportjunky 11 years, 1 month ago

Agreed. I'm not sure where the "everyone hates BYU" comes from.

jgkojak 11 years, 1 month ago

What is messed up is -- here is how the timeline should have gone:

1990 Arkansas asked to join the Big 8, we say "sure!" and go to 9

1996 Texas, TTU and A&M join the Big 8 to form the Big 12- are outvoted on nearly everything by the old Big 8 w/Arkansas (who hates Texas) right there w/us

1996 W/Arkansas in, and demanding to not be w/Texas, Colorado is in the same division as Texas and OU

2010 When Nebraska is courted by B10, sure - they'll join, no matter what we would have done to stop it- but when they leave we bring in

2010 BYU and Utah - with BYU/Utah out west, Colorado stays put.

2010 To get to 14 we add TCU

William Weissbeck 11 years, 1 month ago

Someone correct me, but when there was talk of adding Arkansas, it was to drop K-State. That was the wrinkle.

LJD230 11 years, 1 month ago

Time to quite the rumor mongering and speculation. In the end does it rally matter? No matter how big or little the conference or the configuration thereof, a degree from KU will be only worth a plug nickel.

Too bad all this drama associated with this nonsense won't benefit the academic mission of KU.

Alan Braun 11 years, 1 month ago

What needs to happen is for the politicians (e.g. Mitch McConnell) to butt out of this. They need to concentrate on fixing the economy, not worrying about college football. From the way the NY Times story reads, it really sounds like his meddling, particularly playing his friendship with the OU president, is what soured the WVa deal.

gccs14r 11 years, 1 month ago

Maybe the best thing that could have happened in all of this is that all of the principal characters could have kept their mouths shut until the ink was dry on all of the agreements. (See the ACC for a recent example.) Then there could have been a single coherent announcement and it would have been done. All the leaks and wild speculation have taken what should have been a straight negotiation and contract signing and turned it into a circus. Now we have U.S. Senators involved? That's beyond stupid.

Andy Tweedy 11 years, 1 month ago

But we should all know by now that there is always some "unnamed source" that wants to feel important and is just champing at the bit to leak what he may or may not really know. And while I totally agree with you, what juicy gossip would we have without those sources?

142466 11 years, 1 month ago

B12 needs to get back to 12 very soon, with a FB championship game, and then to 14, maybe even 16, soon thereafer. Why?

  1. Because that's what the other surviving BCS conferences are doing. If we stay at 10, the negative impression that all these departures have caused will only intensify. FB recruits and the public will say, "You're inferior, you couldn't even get back to 12. During all the realignment moves of 2011-2012, you didn't strenghen yourselves like the other surviving BCS conferences did. Your name is even silly." Early December of this year, and especially Decembers thereafter, people will say, "Man, these BCS championship games are thrilling." FB recruits, the public and the Madison Avenue execs will say, " I35 league doesn't have one, though. They missed the boat. They won't be around much longer."

Living in west Los Angeles has taught me that in the entertainment business (that's what big time college sports mostly is) perception becomes reality. Publicists, agents, and the media make sure of that. With my midwestern roots, I refused to believe that for a while. Now I realize that it's mostly true.

  1. The number of available, compatible, invitees to the Big 12 is limited. Geography dictates that. Many of the potential new members (especially the schools on the eastern fringes) do, in fact, have viable options other than the Big12. Looks to me, though, that in so many ways the Big12 is their best option, provided they are convinced that the Big12 will always have BCS status. Make them choose the Big12 before they go elsewhere and are lost forever.

  2. The behavior of OU, and especially UT, obviously from the time this chess match commenced, and in retrospect even before that, indicates that they are not commited to the league long-term. Their incentive for doing so is much less than the other members. If UT and/or OU depart, a league that still has at least 12 decent FB members, preferably 14, will enjoy a much greater chance of BCS survival that one with only 10 members. The BCS people will strip a withering, nonconforming, league of its BCS status. For KU and KSU that could be a point of no return.

Hank Cross 11 years, 1 month ago

You're more right about point no. 1 than you may know. The Pac Expansion - which triggered all of this - was the brainchild of the Creative Artists Agency developed at the behest of Scott.

JayhawkLifer 11 years, 1 month ago

Found it. Quote from Boren: "Obviously, I think if we could eventually -- and that doesn't mean in one year, maybe it's going to take two or three years -- if we were to eventually get back to 12, I would feel better about it."

From this article

Granted this was almost 2 months ago &, as we all know, things can change, but I have always been under the impression that Boren wants to go to 12 & Texas is the hold out.

jgkojak 11 years, 1 month ago

Tuberville- endorses Tulane- “Travel destinations for our fans. A lot of people would think I’m crazy, but I would go after San Diego State and I’d go after Tulane. They both have great stadiums. Both would grow immensely if they went to a conference like this. I know right now, one, San Diego State is doing pretty good. Tulane is not, but they’ve got the Superdome, they’ve got New Orleans for people to go in and out. I think you look at things like that and TV markets.”

Ben Kliewer 11 years, 1 month ago

Alright. I've seen it at least twice already. "Quite" and "Quit." Seriously people.

Quite, as in "That was quite a game last night" not how you spell:

Quit, as in "Boy, our defense sure quit in that game last night"

Or Quit, as in "We should all quit this arguing" even though that's slightly grammatically askew.

nuleafjhawk 11 years, 1 month ago

I'm quit tired of your complaining. Please quite.

lol - all in fun Kleave

Phoghorn 11 years, 1 month ago

It would be quite nice if this site would quickly quit witholding an edit button so we could begin a quest to quietly quarantine our quirky and questionable typos.

GoodbyeMU 11 years, 1 month ago

Say Goodbye to old MU... add Lou, WV and pick up Cincy and the big east is dead

Pbbut 11 years, 1 month ago

Crazy...this looks like McConnell's "jobs plan". Get involved in conference realignment and get the lawyers busy. Seriously, might this put a "hold" on any pending action? The SEC has been very circumspect in their public appearance and might continue that line in dealing with Missouri, especially since the senator in question is from Kentucky, a state that has a member school in the SEC.

MorganR 11 years, 1 month ago

Except for the comment about "panties in bunch" I agree with you IF the Big 12 (10 - whatever) extended an offer to West Virginia, we should honor that commitment. To do otherwise is bad form.

I have no opinion about the mertis or demerits of Louisville joining the Big 12. I do, however, resent Senator McConnell's intervention. I think it is inappropriate. Doesn't the Senate have more pressing issues to address? Perhaps, this is a Machiavellian effort by the Big 12 to get Congress involved in the realignment issue.

jgkojak 11 years, 1 month ago

Manchin was Gov. of West Virginia (and very popular) until last year. Both he and Rockefeller are Democrats - and of course McConnell is a Republican.

(Note its probably Jay Nixon's doing that MU is moving, so perhaps Manchin and Rockefeller should talk to Jay!)

I'd love to see Congressional hearings... let's bring in ESPN to testify about the kinds of meetings/cash it's been dangling in advance of all this.

All the NCAA has to do is put a travel limit for players in conference (mileage limit - exempt Hawaii) and a lot of this nonsense would stop.

phoggedin 11 years, 1 month ago

This is crazy. I don't understand why the league won't simply add BYU. These "culture" arguments don't wash with me. BYU has a fantastic football program, with a national championship in '84 and strong fan support, both for home games and across the nation. They travel very well and have a solid athletic department overall. BYU is also ranked much higher than either WVU or Louisville in terms of academics. BYU can move now and is not held back by a 27-month commitment to the Big East. Raising the vague issue of "culture" seems more like religious prejudice than anything else to me. I'm pretty confident BYU brings more tv sets than any other school under consideration, by far. They're not Notre Dame, but they have a meaningful (and growing) national following.

142466 11 years, 1 month ago

What you say makes sense to me. Along with BYU, add Boise or Air Force.

DallasJayhawk1 11 years, 1 month ago

This whole thing is a joke. I am going to be in New Orleans this weekend for a bachelor party--hopefully it's settled while I'm having a Hurricane at Pat O's in the French Quarter.

Hank Cross 11 years, 1 month ago

I wish there was a "like" button for your comment.

iluvdbskxjayhawks 11 years, 1 month ago

Can we admit both Louisville and WVU? That's the best solution. It's kinda sad they both are fighting to get into Big 12. In six years, Texas and OU might leave again.

142466 11 years, 1 month ago

Makes sense to me. What Rockefeller & McConnel are probably saying is "me too". Now maybe an Ohio Senator & the southern Ohio House member will demand , "me 3". Then they'll all open their office windows, spit into the wind, and calmly return to the Floor to pontificate about the wisdom of the free market.

jgkojak 11 years, 1 month ago

This is ridiculous.

If the feds want to get involved, then get the frack involved and investigate the entire last two years.

142466 11 years, 1 month ago

If the feds join the hunt they will indeed go back more than two years. They'll say they want to "get to the bottom of this". The televised hearings would be even more entertaining and revealing than Watergate. That's what Congressional subpoenes do. (That good sport, Roger Clemens, learned that). Several commitee members will be seen raising their eyebrows to new heights. The final Committee reports will condemn the mercantile depths to which all these otherwise noble non-profit academic institutions have stooped. "Sadly, the grand game of college FB is no longer the autumnal Saturday afternoon amateur diversion that TR promoted", they will say. With that brilliant discovery, they will assemble a nonpartison group of outsiders to recommend corrective measures. No Jeffersons or Lincolns in D.C now.

But it won't ever get to that. Faced with the threat of federal intervention, the Conferences, the BCS, and the universities will finally sort all this mess out to the satisfaction of enough of the public and polititians to allow the feds to drop it. There's too much money at stake for it to conclude otherwise.

orbiter 11 years, 1 month ago

There must be some U of L money in that cash enema McConnell is perpetually receiving.

blackhawkjayhawk 11 years, 1 month ago

Looks like Mizzou's incompetence is spreading.....maybe Dan Bebe wasn't the problem? This is exactly how to NOT do conference expansion. Instead, do your work, make a decision and live with it.

Also, June Jones for KU coach!

DallasJayhawk1 11 years, 1 month ago

No way June Jones leaves SMU--he has the good life here in Dallas. And he's getting paid BIG TIME.

Michael Maris 11 years, 1 month ago

Ok, Missouri fans (in faovr of going to the SEC) are walking around with Blinders on.

Missouri played their cards and got Texas and OU to agree to share the Tier 1 and Tier 2 TV Revenue.

The LHN will NOT be a success. No cable carrier in Oklahoma, Kansas, Iowa and Missouri are going to carry the LHN. Very few Cable Companies in Texas are carrying the LHN. Constant round table talk about Texas Athletics and watching the Texas Volleyball, Olympic Tumbling and other sports are not going to be watched with religion even in the great State of Texas on a regular basis.

Therefore, the LHN will eventually become the Big XII Channel and have programming very similar to what the BTN does for their league. Then, the Tier 3 Networks will become obsolete for the other Big XII schools. No more mentioning of K-StateHDTV, Jayhawks Access, etc..........

Fox Sports is blocking Missouri fast exit to the SEC, due to the fact that Brady Deaton signed just months ago a new Tier 2 TV Network contract. Fox will lose money when Missouri goes to the SEC where CBS (Tier 1) and ESPN (Tier 2) take over the Missouri fanbase tv watching. So, Fox is basically losing out to CBS. Which Fox does not want to do.

Missouri, if the Big XII was to blow up, your ticket to the B1G would more than likely take place (probably with KU in a pod system with Iowa and Nebraska).

But, your impatient Governor (Jay Nixon) just can't stand the fact that Missouri would continue to play in the Big XII.

Let me finish with this, when Boston College, U. of Miami and VaTech left for the ACC. Those 3 schools were all players in the Top 25 Football Picture. Now where is Boston College and U. of Miami ranked in the top 25 (on a consistent basis). Change is NOT always good.

Oh well, have fun Missouri.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 1 month ago

 Good post. The SEC is trying to add to their TV networks and academic record, not improve it's football/basketball lineup. Mizzou seems to think they would survive in the SEC, and its a possibility I guess, in the long term... but in reality, if they want to improve their athletics/ compete for a conference title or attend a BCS Bowl, they won't get a better setup than they have now. Good luck winning a conference or even division title in the SEC... half of Mizzou's FB team is from Texas, and that would certainly end with a move to the SEC, just like it did for Arkansas. 
I also believe the timing of their move does not bode well for their basketball program. The Tigers are almost certainly going to have a poor season this year in the Big XII... they have a new coach, a stable of players who have been coached under Mike Anderson's playstyle and they have some injuries... on top of a very questionable new head coach. If they have a poor season this year and enter the SEC as a losing franchise... the Tigers hoops program may never fully recover.

 As far as I see it, the Tigers are selling out for a little extra $$ and a chance to unjustifiably stick their noses up at us and the rest of the Big XII... Chances are we get the last laugh in their departure though.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 1 month ago

Apologies for repeating the Tigers have a new head hoops coach.

Eric Dawson 11 years, 1 month ago

Agree with your post. Would also note that apparently the unofficial motto of the SEC is "If you ain't cheatin', you ain't tryin'", so mOO is going to have to spend a lot more $$$ (cheatin' or not) to get anywhere in the SEC. And remember that the "extra dollar" analysis mOO was given was flawed in its assumptions. Throw in the exit fees they will have to pay, and it may be years, if ever, before mOO would actually net any money on the move.

blackhawkjayhawk 11 years, 1 month ago

MU's move is a boon for KU. I believe we could now dominate the KC market in both recruits and fans. Please leave MU, as fast as you can. You need to start making your new home in Irrelevantville.

Jayhawk444 11 years, 1 month ago

So it's the Big12 that is balking at BYU and not the other way around? That's crazy. If they want in...grab them and Louisville (after MU leaves) to get to 12. Screw UT and OU

Todd 11 years, 1 month ago

Matt, what is the conference's rationale in staying at 10? I don't understand wanting to stay at 10 when the biggest knock on the Big 10 was that their season ended a week or two before everyone elses and got forgotten.

Eric Dawson 11 years, 1 month ago

The Pac10 never had a title game either. If we stay at 10, the Big 12(?) will be the only MAJOR conference that does will not be playing on Championship Weekend while the B1G, SEC, ACC and Pac12 are busy entertaining the masses.

Do we want to be with the "Big Boys", or are we going to stay 10 and be linked in people's minds with the already weakened BEast?

Come on, Big 12 leadership -- LEAD!

hawk4evr2 11 years, 1 month ago

The only chance that KU has of ever being competitive again in football in the Big12 is if they get back to 12 teams/2 divisions. We will never be able to climb out of the bottom 1/3 of the league as long as we are playing the schedule we had to play this year. Yet, I have heard nothing, as is the norm, from our AD as to what his/KU's wishes are when it comes to how many teams there should be. Have I missed it or is he simply that intimidated by Texas and OU that he is afraid to voice his opinion, assuming he has one.

TheColonel 11 years, 1 month ago

The Big 12 has become such a joke. Adding a team that is located in the middle of the Appalachians to replace Missouri? Are you kidding me? Raise your hand if you want out of this mess...

Jeff Kilgore 11 years, 1 month ago

Some people have the right opinions, Colonel. Thank you. Regions do matter. If they didn't, all conferences would collapse.

Jeff Kilgore 11 years, 1 month ago

Oh no. A federal investigation. This will change everything. The walls are closing in.

Vernon Riggs 11 years, 1 month ago

Matt, Is there anyway that the brakes were applied to expansion because talks with Notre Dame joining the Big12 are heating up and/or Mizzou is having cold feet joining the SEC (or the SEC backed out on Mizzou)? Everything seem at full speed yesterday.

Matt Tait 11 years, 1 month ago

No question that that's possible... A source told me tonight that everything that's being discussed has a shred of truth to it.

I know that's not real significant, but I do think it carries some weight.

There's a lot going on out there...

Daniel Kennamore 11 years, 1 month ago

Staying at 10 in this atmosphere is so infinitely stupid that it will of course be the Big 12's course of action.

phoggedin 11 years, 1 month ago

I agree. Staying at 10 seems idiotic. It's solely a move to preserve income for a few years until the next tv contract is negotiated. But I think the league would be in a much stronger position if it simply expanded now, with the best available candidates. If you can get Notre Dame, get them. (But the reality is that Notre Dame is not coming.) The other main candidates are West Virginia, BYU, and Louisville. So add all three. Everyone else is a significant step down (including Cincinnati, SDSU, Tulane, and others). The move here is completely obvious, but of course, the league can't seem to get it together to make the right move. And now, Congress is involved. The Big XII has turned its opportunity to return to the ranks of strong and stable leagues into another disaster. This ridiculousness with WVU and Louisville just makes the league look inept.

Vernon Riggs 11 years, 1 month ago

Adding BYU over Cincy is better but it pulls the conference over three time zones (Moutain, Central and Eastern). Does that cause any concerns?

LogicMan 11 years, 1 month ago

There must be something big going on behind the scenes. Some pure guesses:

Notre Dame is now inquiring about full membership.

BYU blinked, and is making last minute concessions to get in, maybe with AFA or Boise so that we go west instead of east.

Big East is crying uncle and asking for absorption by the Big 12.

MU has had a change of heart (or played their cards very well getting everything they want, including to pick two more teams for its north division).

The Big 10 has made invites, freezing the process.

Or really far out there, NU, CU, or A&M want back in now that UT has wisely decided to play nice. I wouldn't bet on this last one, except maybe on CU in a few years.

Kyle Sybesma 11 years, 1 month ago

I would agree on most scenerios you layed out. No way is CU, NU or A&M coming back. A large portion of CU's alum live in the California area.

I don't see the Big 10 making any moves unless they feel they can finally make a deal with Notre Dame.

I do beleive the Big East could be asking the Big 12 to take on all remainin football members. And maybe Notre Dame fits in as the 16th school.

I also wouldn't be surprised if BYU is back in discussion if the Big 12 wants to go to 12 with W Virginia, Louisville and BYU. But I don't see any scenerio that involves Boise St or Air Force.

Daniel Kennamore 11 years, 1 month ago

That link in no way backs up you assertion that the PAC is still an option.

First off, the PAC already said no...not OU.

Secondly, OU starting their own network makes them LESS likely to go to the PAC.

Daniel Kennamore 11 years, 1 month ago

Sorry. Mistook you for a serious poster.

I'll remember not to feed the troll next time.

jgkojak 11 years, 1 month ago

I doubt the B10 is involved.

Most likely: The "we'll stay at 10" is aimed at BYU - who could see their B12 ship go sailing soon - and be stuck as an Indy with that mega-MW/C-USA conf. at their back door.

If we get BYU, losing MU is not a big deal, and we easily replace all the TV markets lost and break even on academics/football/basketball.

Possible: Notre Dame is done with the Big East and needs a home for its non-football sports.

Hank Cross 11 years, 1 month ago

The B12 would eff up a one car funeral.

That being said, I can understand where UT and OU might be coming from. If you're going to bring in an equity partner (i.e. another school) that partner must bring enough value to cover its own nut, plus add to the remaining shares. That was part of the issue the B10 had with MU last year, MU would have to add about $40 million in value to make it worthwhile. No way could it do that. Don't know why the SEC doesn't see that. But that their problem.

The question therefore is does B12 + WVa, LVille, and Cincy bring in more $$ than B12 + WVa or LVille and staying at 10? If the answer is No, then there is a good financial reason for not going to 12.

However, as long as the B12 stays at 10 - KU's future is subject to the whims of OU and UT.

Brad Boline 11 years, 1 month ago

Why would Big 12 not add both, missouri is gone period. OU and Texas only want 10, the rest want to expand. Can't they meet in the middle and make 11. Then Texas and OU would get there wish with no Big 12 Championship game.

142466 11 years, 1 month ago

Yep. That is where OU, and especially UT, are coming from. Green is the favorite color of all the participants.

KU, KSU, et al forsee their incoming flow of FB green drying up six years from now, maybe even sooner, unless the Big12 becomes at least 12 again. Better for the little fellers to divide their portion of the pie into somewhat smaller pieces than to risk losing their seats at the table.

manginorhO0lz 11 years, 1 month ago

Nevermind, scratch everything I just said.

chipmunk1956 11 years, 1 month ago

It's embarrassing to be a part of this conference. The Big XII is the laughing stock of the country right now. I don't care who's to blame for this last fiasco or if someone did jump the gun in leaking info. about the WVU invite., or even if WVU was never formally offered... at this point, it doesn't matter. I agree with manginorh001z... this conference is so screwed up, it wouldn't matter how many teams they added, it still wouldn't be stable! It stinks that, because we suck so bad in football, we have to be yanked around by the incompetent "leaders" of the football 'have's."

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