Originally published October 10, 2012 at 05:07p.m., updated October 11, 2012 at 12:00a.m.

Bill Self to receive the Wooden’s Awards ‘Legends of Coaching’ honor in 2013

Kansas coach Bill Self greets several young Jayhawk fans following a brief interview with media members as the team arrives on Wednesday, March 21, 2012, at the Hyatt Regency St. Louis at the Arch.

Kansas coach Bill Self greets several young Jayhawk fans following a brief interview with media members as the team arrives on Wednesday, March 21, 2012, at the Hyatt Regency St. Louis at the Arch.


Kansas basketball coach Bill Self will be awarded the John R. Wooden Award’s “Legends of Coaching” honor in 2013, Coach Wooden’s daughter, Nan Wooden Muehlhausen, announced Wednesday at the annual Los Angeles Athletic Club Wooden Award tipoff luncheon.

The award recognizes coaches who exemplify Wooden’s high standards of coaching success and personal integrity.

The “Legends of Coaching” award was adopted by the Wooden Award Committee in 1999, as North Carolina's Dean Smith was the first recipient.

“This is a great honor and humbling, but non-deserving; plus it’s a legends which makes me sound even older than what I am,” Self said. “I had a chance to meet coach Wooden and get to know him fairly well back in the year 2000 because of an award we received. Cindy and I were able to spend a weekend with him and his family. That was a cool experience. To be thought of in this regard with some of the coaches that have won this in the past is pretty humbling.”

Honorees are selected based on character, success on the court, graduation rates of student-athletes, coaching philosophy and identification with the goals of the John R. Wooden Award.

Self will be recognized, along with the men’s and women’s 2013 John R. Wooden Award winners and the Wooden Award All-America teams, at the Los Angeles Athletic Club during the weekend of April 11-13, 2013.

“Coach Wooden would have been honored to present this award to coach Self in recognition not only of his coaching excellence, but also his character and commitments off the court," said Greg Wooden, coach Wooden’s grandson.

Self has won eight straight Big 12 regular-season titles and five league tournament championships in his nine seasons with the Jayhawks. His KU record is 269-53 and his 83.5 winning percentage with the Jayhawks is the highest in program history.

Overall, Self is in his 19th season as a coach with a 476-158 (.751 percent) record. His KU teams have reached at least the Sweet 16 six times in his nine years at KU, which includes two Final Fours and a national championship in 2008.

Away from the court, Self devotes time to his “Assists Foundation,” which directs funds to help children in a variety of ways, including scholarships and grants to school-based, private and public agencies.

In the classroom, KU has achieved an Academic Progress Rate (APR) score of a perfect 1,000 in each of the last six years under Self. In the Self era, Kansas has had 25 Academic All-Big 12 selections, which is best in the conference, and 26 of 27 four-year players at KU have earned their degrees.

Self is the third Big 12 coach to receive the Wooden Award Legends of Coaching honor and the second KU coach chosen. Roy Williams, now at North Carolina, was the recipient during his time at KU in 2003, while Texas’ Rick Barnes was the winner in 2009.

Legends of Coaching Honorees

2013 — Bill Self, Kansas

2012 — Geno Auriemma, Connecticut

2011 — Tom Izzo, Michigan State

2010 — Billy Donovan, Florida; Rick Barnes, Texas

2008 — Pat Summitt, Tennessee; Gene Keady, Purdue; Jim Boeheim, Syracuse

2005 — Jim Calhoun, Connecticut

2004 — Mike Montgomery, Stanford

2003 — Roy Williams, Kansas

2002 — Denny Crum, Louisville

2001 — Lute Olson, Arizona; Mike Krzyzewski, Duke

1999 — Dean Smith, North Carolina

Georgetown series coming: KU and Georgetown are negotiating to play a home-and-home series starting in the 2013-14 season. KU officials indicated that no contract has yet been signed. Next year’s game will be in Allen Fieldhouse, the 2014-15 contest at Verizon Center in Washington, D.C.

This, that: No. 8-rated James Young, a 6-foot-6 senior guard/forward from Rochester (Mich.) High, is expected to commit orally to Kentucky today over KU, Michigan State and Syracuse. ... Clayton Custer, a 6-foot junior from Blue Valley Northwest High, will attend Friday’s Late Night in the Phog on an unofficial recruiting visit, reports. He is ranked No. 100 in the class of 2014. No. 43-ranked Elbert Robinson, a 6-10 junior forward from Lakeview Centennial High in Garland, Texas, also will attend. Seniors to attend include No. 5 Aaron Gordon, 6-8 forward, Archibishop Mitty High, San Jose, Calif.; No. 23 Wayne Selden, 6-5 guard, Tilton (N.H.) High; and unranked Joel Embiid, 7-foot center, Rock School, Gainesville, Fla. … Late Night will begin at 6:30 p.m. Friday in Allen Fieldhouse, with doors opening at 5:30 p.m. ... KU will hold its annual basketball media day this afternoon in the fieldhouse.


TexasHawk44 1 year, 6 months ago

See- King of the D-bags still. Congrats, Jaybate. Do you take a box of Ex-lax everyday before you erupt your B.S. on here?


Nathan Scholl 1 year, 6 months ago

Rock Chalk Jayhawk Coach Self! So proud to have a coach with such a good heart and so much pride in building his players and molding them as men. Best graduation rate in the country the last few years.

I know people get mad at bashing him, but "Coach Cal" as the annoying Kentucky fans so disgusting call him will never win this award! Horrible graduation rates for his players (he could care less about their education, just winning), no integrity (Memphis and UMass), and his success on the court will be taken away eventually based on new NCAA violations that will come forward. Following in the footsteps of the even cheating, even racist Adolph Rupp.

Martin Rosenblum 1 year, 6 months ago

I don't know why this image was in my head. But, after reading and reflecting on Jaybate's storied body of work, it just came to mind.

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain! by memhawk


jaybate 1 year, 6 months ago

Part 5

And maybe Self and Norm and Billy got their backs up and said we'll show these guys. We'll go recruit anyone we want anywhere we want anytime we want and let the chips fall where they may.

And the chips have been falling every since. And harder and harder.

Kansas seems to have allowed Self to recruit deeper teams on average, than at Illinois, but I believe it has not let him recruit one of the Top Five guys unless off a rebound, or really quite the quality of a guy or two he landed at Illinois.

So when the OAD rule came along that you mention, HawkKlaw, this only worsens Self's problems and strengthens the ShoeCo valve on the top talent, plus emboldens them to move further down market in trying to valve talent.

And when Self, at a school that has thumbed the eye of the status quo in ShoeCo pecking order, keeps angling to get enough talent to win big, in spite of the cold shoulders, then especially after the ring in '08, we are talking about a cowboy, a noncompliant, that the status quo begins to work harder at marginalizing.

Or so it seems to me in this opining and speculating.

Thanks for your response, HawkKlaw.

And remember: we are only dealing with the ShoeCo angle so far with a slight touch on the summer game angle and with no exploration of the Agency angle.

What we can be pretty sure of is that the ShoeCos, summer teams, and agency create a someone variable, but ultimately reinforcing regime that cause those outside of its informal institutions to have to swim against the current in recruiting.

And we have yet to explore threads between this complex and the media-gaming complex.

Perhaps you, or someone, else will.

I'm tired for now. :-)


jaybate 1 year, 6 months ago

Part 4

But underneath the program was getting hollowed out by a Chancellor trying to retake control of the basketball program by firing Roy's boss and replacing himself with a guy perhaps likely to make Roy leave. And the program that had risen to power on Roy's skills and on Roy's riding the coat tails of the Mike/Phil/Sonny hoops machine that probably had some kind of still little understood connection to The Corporation of Dean Smith, was beginning to have to go it alone without those coat tails.

But here is the real doozy. After Self walks into a program that is apparently not on Nike's and not on Reebok's and not on Addidas most trusted list any longer, Lew Perkins becomes the AD and signs a mega deal with Addidas, the shoeco with the least summer game chops and the least WWW style agency chops for such big bucks it was like a thumb in the eye to Nike and Reebok. And Nike has regrouped and is on the come big time.

So: KU is odd man out, but the richer for it. But KU's Self is having to recruit naked. KU has just stuck its thumb in the eye of Nike at a time when Nike has shouldered out Reebok, and bought Converse, and George Ravelling has finally seen old friend and then arch rival and then nemesis Sonny Vaccaro marginalized. Big George and Phil are suddenly in the driver's seat.

And so what I am saying here is that Self, the legendary recruiter that could pull them into ORU, Tulsa and Illinois, suddenly wasn't recruiting in free space at the margins of the heavyweights. He had joined a heavy weight that had joined the light heavy weight in shoes--Addidas.

And so: Self probably began to get the cold shoulder among the Nike guys.

And so Self and his assistants, Norm Roberts and Billy Gillispie, began to get the cold shoulders from the Nike guys.

And the summer game teams that depended heavily on shoeco subsidy to get their wheels greased, began to give Self and his assisstants the cold shoulder.


jaybate 1 year, 6 months ago

Part 3

And sometime during this period some new forces entered into the Sonny/Phil/Mike thing that it might be argued that Roy and Dean were riding the coat tails of to some pretty rich years of Nike driven recruiting east and west of the Mississippi.

German based Addidas, which actually pioneered the modern track, football, and basketball shoe, though never getting much credit for having done so, waded back into the frey.

(Note: I can recall when my junior year of highschool in 1971 or so, my team kicked the Chucks and dawned the Addidas, or were they Pumas? Anyway, they were light years better, if not lasting style icons as were the Chucks. But I digress.)

But so did an outfit named Reebok and Reebok high jacked Shaq and Shaq's dominion began in the wake of Mike leaving the game for good.

The question to me has always been: who behind Addidas and Reebok was so powerful that they could muscle Nike aside even for awhile?

I don't know that answer, but I bet its out there. Addidas is German money. And German money has solid ties in Kansas, or so I have heard. But Reebok? I don't know that legacy. Does it track to some place? Is it overworld, or underworld, or money? I don't know. But it matters in unsnagging the whole story of shoes on hoops.

And it was during Shaq and Reebok's reign that Sonny left Nike and George Raveling wound up with Nike.

And we find ourselves suddenly witnessing a major upheaval and power struggle between Roy Williams and former KU chancellor Bob Hemenway, who had come from UK's trouble near death penalty and hiring of Rick Pitino.

And what we see is long time Nike-guy Roy with his Nike shield fading and his recently assaulted virtue regarding Jaron Rush, suddenly getting his trusted AD shield fired and replaced with Al Bohls of that well spring of the right way...Fresno State (tongue sticking out my cheek here).

And so, despite having said many times he was staying at KU, and despite having perhaps his greatest team, Roy suddenly missed grits and took Wanda to be closer to Wrightsville beach and Dean's Corporation, that was falling into disarray from lack of good coaching.

This was the deep situation that Self walked into at KU. On the surface he was taking over for a legendary coach who had had the KU program on a role and had managed a squeaky clean image for 15 years.


jaybate 1 year, 6 months ago

Part 2

But stop and think about this for a second. How many other coaches have ever imposed such vast regional recruiting restriction on a former assistant. I can't think of one in the history of college basketball. Not one.

So what was really going on here, if the Dean-Roy yarn was apocryphal?

Well, we know that Roy was very close to Michael Jordan, close enough that at the very peak of Michael's career he could get his KU players face time with his airness. Michael could, if I recall correctly, find time to put in a good word for Roy...if the player were west of the Mississippi, of course. At the same time, I recall that Michael could put in a good word for Dean's recruits, too.

So what?

So: at this time, according to Wetzel and Yaeger's "Sole Influence" book published in 2000, Sonny Vaccaro and Phil Knight had turned Michael Jordan in an unprecedented money making spokes person for Nike and many other companies. And Roy, before coming to KU, had been at ground zero of the evolution of this then largely unprecedented in scale relationship between a shoe maker and a basketball player.

Without putting too fine of a point on things, Roy was not only a Mike guy, but a Nike guy from the get go. And as Mike is quoted in "Sole Influence", Sonny and Phil made Michael into something vastly bigger than a basketball player. He made him into a money making machine for himself, and for many of those around him.

Is there any reason to think that Roy and Dean were not a least loyalists, and probably beneficiaries in certain ways, of the Sonny/Phil/Mike nexus?

And what do you think happened to Roy as he grew more and more popular and more and more successful as a Nike guy at KU?

Well, among other things Roy began to develop relatioships with certain private schools like Pem Day where players like Jaron Rush that he was very, very interested in having play for KU, went to high school. And KU alums like Tom Grant apparently stayed close to these players as they readied to go to college. And someone like Grant ran an AAU team with a coach like Myron Piggie. And Myron Piggie had reputedly been in scrapes with the law for drug dealing. And such players were supposed to go to the schools they have been being shepherded toward.

Only Jaron Rush got caught in an ugly scandal about Grant enabling him improperly for KU and Piggie had his skeletons leaked. And Roy quickly said he would no longer recruit Jaron, apparently in hopes of keeping the NCAA from leveling infractions on KU, at least this was the version put out by Wetzel and Yaeger in Sole Influence.


jaybate 1 year, 6 months ago

Part I

HawkKlaw, this is in response to your remarks to my post above.

I like your angle that the OAD rule signals an earlier origin than 2008. I like it, because it caused me to think back further to Self's pre '08 recruiting at KU.

As nearly as I can tell, Self has never landed a Top 5 player like Xavier and Josh without it being a rebound from a program imploding from serious infractions.

And when I go all the way back to Brandon Rush, he had narrowed his list to going elsewhere than KU for a time, while he was awaiting to see the fall out of the then just new, or just pending OAD rule. Self got him at the last minute and then he had to go through a delay in getting clearance to play.

My point here is that your observation of 2006 and my observation of 2008 may just be spiked points of transition away from his favor in recruiting that were operating to less apparent degree from the moment he started at KU.

This is potentially VERY interesting.


Think back to Self at Illinois. Self inherited Frank Williams, but Self recruited a couple phenomenal players to Illinois. One of them was maybe better than any perimeter player he has recruited to KU. And he left Bruce Webber an awesome team with some incomings.

What I'm saying here is that Self arguably recruited better at Illinois than at KU, or at the very least, as good as, in terms of his top recruits. Self's top recruits at Illinois were not, if I recall correctly, guys rebounding from imploding programs, as they have tended to be at KU. This is most remarkable, given KU sharply greater brand recognition and status in basketball. Why would Self be able to recruit as well, or better at Illinois? Champaign-Urbana is out in a corn field. Its never been a destination basketball school. It had often been a chess pool of recruiting corruption, according to Bob Knight. It didn't really get cleaned up until Lon Kruger and Bill Self made it a right way program, or so it has been reputed.

Next, think about who Self replaced and the circumstances of who Self replaced when he came to KU.

Roy Williams came from The Corporation. He came from UNC, which was Dean Smith's towering achievement. He successfully corporatized a college basketball program. His model became the business model for many big time D1 hoops program.

And Nike shoes and Michael and Sonny Vaccaro were long time players around the Dean's Corporation.

Roy has reputedly admitted that Dean and Roy made what Roy suggested was a gentlemen's agreement in which Roy recruited west of the Mississippi, and Dean stayed east. Its a nice tidy version of events for human consumption, isn't it. Faithful assistant loves former boss so much that he agrees not to recruit east of the Mississippi. We almost respect Roy for it. What a great guy!


justinryman 1 year, 6 months ago

Love the picture. Coach Self isn't looking at all the cameras or media outlets, he issmiling at some young kids that are fansof the school he gets to coach at.
He is paying it forward for future generations. The media all get thier alloted time, good to see him take afew moments to makea kids year!

Class act in action


daytonahawk2 1 year, 6 months ago

Two Kansas coaches on the list and one Kansas player ... not bad.


ClydeTurnbuckle 1 year, 6 months ago

Who's the One four-year player that didn't get a degree???

C.J. Giles?


Chris Shaw 1 year, 6 months ago

BTW....................12 hours and 35 minutes until basketball season starts! Thank god!


Steve Kubler 1 year, 6 months ago

Absolutely love this quote from that article.

 "This season’s nonconference schedule is actually somewhat weak -- but only by Kansas  standards. At almost any other school this would be considered a brutal slate."

Eight is close, I consider it tough enough based on the number of newbies Self has to work into a team.


Konkis Dongington III 1 year, 6 months ago

Nonconf schedule analysis from over at ESPN:

Spoiler: they rated our nonconf an 8. Personally I think this is a bit too high. UT has by far the toughest nonconf I've ever seen for a BCS school. What say you?


Tony Bandle 1 year, 6 months ago

John Wooden was a great coach because he was able to buy players for over a decade. He was a mean-spirited, bastard who cursed at opponent players during games [I was there, the Final Four, 1971, the Astrodome, courtside, KU vs UCLA]. Also, he used his influence to brow beat the NCAA into making him and his program at UCLA "untouchable".

The rest of you can buy into his sainthood...not me. He was the greatest cheater of all because he got away with it and still emerged as the perceived pinnacle of coaching virtue.

The spirit of the Award remains legitimate....the reality of the man is much, much less. This takes nothing away from Bill's honor and the other worthy recipients, but to me, it sure explains a bunch of the other names on the list.


TexasHawk44 1 year, 6 months ago

Sorry to ignore you Jaybate. You are still the number one idiot on the board. Your son, BennyBob, is of course the prince in waiting HEM is only a pompous pretender to your throne -- he is far too coherent to ever be a true threat.

So you can grab a cooking pot and wooden spoon and begin your glorious walk through the trailer park in your Power Ranger slippers and Toy Story PJs. What a magnificent parade it must be as the stray cats and dogs blindly follow you in hopes that some Captain Crunch falls from your tattered bath robe as you bask in your glory!


HawkKlaw 1 year, 6 months ago

Congrats to Bill Self! He is already a living legend here at KU, so it's nice for him to get some national recognition. Nobody in the NCAA is more deserving (despite what our humble coach says).

But some of the reasons why Bill Self won this award are the same reasons why he has had some recruiting struggles recently.

First off, his character. Bill Self doesn't take short-cuts. He doesn't sugar-coat things for incoming recruits. He is honest about how hard each player will have to work to see any amount of time on the court. He's honest about how hard each player will have to work in the classroom while at KU. You're kidding yourself if you don't think that turns some of those 5-star, Top 20 future NBA lottery picks away from KU.

Second, graduation rates. Bill Self is concerned with developing students for the long haul. He wants them to be successful after they leave KU. Recruits who are only interested in playing NCAA bball for 1 year are not interested in graduating or thinking about anything other than making millions of dollars in the NBA within 12-14 months. Sure, Bill Self wants the most talented prospects every year (every coach does), but he holds a special place for those players who stay at KU for 3-4 years and leave with a degree in their hands.

Third, his coaching philosophy. Bill Self has always taught the philosophy that the team is above the individual player. Kansas basketball doesn't live or die with any one recruit or player. If a recruit thinks the name on the back of the jersey is more important than the name on the front, he is not the kind of player that KU is looking for. Bill Self is concerned with KU, not with some big recruit with a unibrow using the school to catapult himself into NBA stardom.

Lastly, Wayne Selden, please be one of those players that Bill Self is looking for. :-)


Glen Miller 1 year, 6 months ago

Look, love him or hate him.... once Calipari gets the recruits he can coach them and harness all those egos. I personally don't like the guy, but anyone who says he's not a good coach is just not being honest with themself. He CAN coach. That being said, I wouldn't trade Bill Self for any coach int he country. When it comes to recruiting, coaching and turning boys into men (the complete package) nobody does it better in my opinion. I'm proud to have coach Self and will always trust in his plan because he's never let me down as a fan. He's always put a great product on the court and brought responsability among the players and their classwork off of it. Keep it up coach RCJH!!


Ron Franklin 1 year, 6 months ago

I can't believe because of Self's inability to recruit and coach I have had to suffer through 53 losses in the last decade. Uggghhh, Makes me Sick.


jaybate 1 year, 6 months ago

J-J-Jenny, would you tell TactlessHawk .22short that life is a box of chocolates and that as in "Islands in the XTReme Stream" there is no one thing that is true, its all true, as the ants burn on the log in the hard rain as I walk away drinking wine with tenente thinking about caporetto and standing up to type.

Yeeeeee hawwwwww!

Never thought of combining Groom and Hemingway until the monumental indolence of TactlessHhawk.22short.


jaybate 1 year, 6 months ago

Response to DCLawHawk from yesterday's thread....


"I see jaybate has started the rotors on the black helicopters again."

I love it. Great expression. Now go sell it to SecState Hilary and her standing private contractor army at State. :-)

I hear State is starting a black ad campaign for the re-re-revamped Academi. Its a black screen with the sound of muted black rotors and then the following chirons scrolling up the screen STAR WARS style...

"Once up on a time In a republic, long, long ago, There was a young alias Named DCLawHawk And it heard black rotors On a black helicopter And then felt microwave battle field and crowd Control technologies That made it hear voices That said:

"Be all that you can be. In the Academi!"

"Don't call us Blackwater! Don't call us Xe! Call us Academi!"

"Sis Boom Bah!"

Only in America can we afford not one but two standing armies in permawar peacetime.

Now I ask you: who else can afford so much security without being able to afford it except in push button Fed Notes, eh?

Here is another swell microwave battle field and crowd control inspired dream.

Hilary and Congress fund the building of the Academi Academy somewhere underground out near the underground FEMA COG, then Army, Navy, Air Force and Academi academies join the Big 12 to make it a super conference.

Then SecState Clinton retires and becomes Big 12 Commish.

KU develops a great new rivalry with Academi Academy coached by "A Large Man Formerly Known as Mangino."

Academi Academy teams wear the new DoD invisibility suits--the ones that use fiber optic threads to bend the visible light spectrum around each player. Coach Self and Coach Weis joint develop strategy that helps KU teams become the only Big 12 team to stay above .500 with Academi Academy.

(Note: all fiction. No malice.)


Jason Keller 1 year, 6 months ago

I hope we get everyone coming to late night. Add Gordon, Seldon and Embiid in with Frankamp and Green and that would easily be Bill's best recruiting class since he got here.


pizzaboy225 1 year, 6 months ago

Who was the one four year player who didn't graduate?


Martin Rosenblum 1 year, 6 months ago

Interesting that no "Legends" have followed Wooden at UCLA.

Also interesting is that there are two KU coaches and a former KU player on that list. No other team is represented with such multiplicity.


TexasHawk44 1 year, 6 months ago

HEM- I am really not interested in reading your long-winded musings. You might consider reading Hemingway and note the style. He was a master at beautiful brevity, but always meaningful. It is just a suggestion.

And no, Hemingway was not perfect either. But he was damned good and better than 99.99% of the other people attempting the craft. Kind of like Bill Self is at running a major basketball program.

But hey, I am sure you know better.


REHawk 1 year, 6 months ago

p.s., jb and HEM, I will strive to join the club at Gump Central. Congratulations to the two of you for the glowing recognition.


REHawk 1 year, 6 months ago

Congratulations, Mr. Self. Quite an honor for such a young Jayhawk mentor.


DDDHawk 1 year, 6 months ago

How many reminders do we regularly get that we are SO LUCKY to have Bill Self as our coach? Wow! Congratulations, Coach Self!


jaybate 1 year, 6 months ago

Jim Calhoun and Mike Montgomery?

Horrible picks!

Self? YES!


Jack Wilson 1 year, 6 months ago

From Gump-Central: Found this nugget. Answers maybe why Bedore compared Mason to Sherron Collins:

"More of a power floor general who lacks elite athleticism similar to former Kansas guard Sherron Collins, Mason's relentless scoring ability could help make him an intriguing option in Self's rotation in a few years."


TexasHawk44 1 year, 6 months ago

I believe the HEM is on the short list for this award next year. Or is it Jaybate? I get the gumps confused.


Ralster Jayhawk 1 year, 6 months ago

HEY BBall2012, WHERE IS CALIPARI? I'm betting he never makes this list because of all the things he "never knew about" that seemed to happen at 2 different universities he was at. What is your response, BBall2012. My god, Calipari won a N-a-t-i-o-n-a-l C-h-a-m-p-i-o-n-s-h-i-p ! ! ! That shoud count for something, eh? (Read the criteria in the story please).


79ictjhawk 1 year, 6 months ago

Wow! A well deserved award for KU's great coach.


Geezer 1 year, 6 months ago

Lute Olson and Jim Calhoun??? Really?


iamakufan 1 year, 6 months ago

This says something we here in Kansas already knew. I'm glad to see Coach Self receiving national recognition for what he has done. Well deserved award. Congratulations to Coach Self.


akgjenkintown 1 year, 6 months ago

This is why Bill is the best fit for KU and for college basketball. It is difficult to question how he recruits and why not all are highly ranked. Listen to the podcasts. We are lucky to have Bill and not a bunch of one and done guys. (2 to 8 minutes)

Andy Katz has picked Kansas as #2 in the ESPN preseason poll. Bill thinks that is much too high at least until January ( first 16 minutes.


javelin 1 year, 6 months ago

Impressive list of coaches. Coach Self absolutely belongs there! Congratulations Coach!


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