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Originally published March 13, 2009 at 12:00a.m., updated March 13, 2009 at 10:04a.m.

One and done

Top-seeded KU stunned by Bears

Kansas guard Sherron Collins walks back to the bench during a timeout late in the second half against Baylor Thursday, March 12, 2009 at the Ford Center in Oklahoma City.

Kansas guard Sherron Collins walks back to the bench during a timeout late in the second half against Baylor Thursday, March 12, 2009 at the Ford Center in Oklahoma City.

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KU loses chance at four consecutive tourney titles

Very few coaches have the opportunity to capture four straight conference tournament titles. That's what Bill Self had hoped to accomplish this year.

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2009 KU-Baylor March 12

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— Sherron Collins’ head was bowed as he mumbled responses to a batch of reporters’ questions Thursday afternoon in a somber Ford Center locker room.

“This hurts … bad,” Collins, Kansas University’s junior point guard, said after the Jayhawks’ 71-64 Big 12 tournament quarterfinal loss to Baylor.

“I’m not shocked, just upset,” Collins added after feeling the pain of “one and done” in the postseason for the first time in his college career.

“I am the leader of the team. I was not there today and should have been.”

Collins had 16 points, but was just 6-for-20 shooting, including 4-for-12 from three-point range.

His off day, coupled with the five-shot, eight-point outing from center Cole Aldrich, helped doom the Jayhawks (25-7) to their first loss in the first round of a conference postseason tournament since 1989, when the Jayhawks fell to Kansas State in the old Big Eight tourney at Kemper Arena in Kansas City.

“I take most of it (blame),” Collins said. “I didn’t lead the team like I should have.”

While coach Bill Self acknowledged that “our team is built around Sherron and Cole, and we need those guys to perform,” those two weren’t asked to shoulder all the blame.

“Everybody has been telling us or them (Jayhawks) how happy they are with them and all this and that. Today is a reality check,” Self said of his five-time Big 12 regular-season champs perhaps getting softened by all the positive publicity of late.

“First thing we are doing, we go back (on team bus) and go to school tomorrow and make all the players walk around class (campus) with all the other students wondering, ‘Why are you back here already?’

“And then we will practice as hard as we have ever practiced in the next two days and get them thinking about that as opposed to worrying about what just happened,” Self added.

What happened is, No. 1 seed KU dug a 17-point hole (30-13) just 13 minutes into the contest.

“To me, you are reigning Big 12 champs, you’ve got a chance to come here and validate your regular season … to not play with more energy than we did is totally inexcusable,” Self said.

“Our two key guys have got to provide that leadership,” he added of Collins and Aldrich. “Here’s a couple of guys that made first-team all-league, and you want to come to our showcase of our league, which this is, the tournament, and perform your best and kind of validate what everybody else has been saying about you the whole year. We obviously didn’t do that. We looked like a tired team today.”

The three-time defending postseason-tourney champs battled back from the early hole to lead by five points (58-53) with 8:47 left. Instead of folding, however, the No. 9-seeded Bears used a 12-0 run to grab a seven-point advantage (65-58) at 3:37.

“The whole thing is, this time of year you’ve got to play smart, you’ve got to guard, you’ve got to rebound. I don’t think we were very good in any of those areas,” said Self, whose Jayhawks were victimized by guard LaceDarius Dunn, who hit nine of 16 shots, including six of 11 threes, for 24 points.

A Dunn three, which gave the Bears a 65-58 lead, was answered by Tyrel Reed and Collins, who hit threes to trim the deficit to one (65-64) at 2:51.

Collins had a potential tie-breaking shot swatted by center Mamadou Diene (five blocks) with 1:51 left. Then, Collins shot an airball from three at :26, with KU down, 67-64.

“I had an open shot (three) to tie it up and missed it,” Collins said. “It got away from me the second I let it go. It slipped. I just lost it, didn’t make it.”

Henry Dugat followed with two free throws at :20.8 to extend the lead to five points. Collins then committed his fifth turnover aginst six assists, and Tweety Carter converted a meaningless layup to conclude the scoring.

“There’s nothing to say. We had them by five late. We let it slip away. It’s back to practice so we don’t let it happen again,” Collins said.

Indeed, the Jayhawks will practice once today, twice on Saturday, then gather at 5 p.m. Sunday to watch the NCAA Tournament Selection show on CBS.

“We’ve got a lot to work on. We’ve got a few days to figure it out. We are going to put a lot of time in the gym,” Aldrich said.

Some of the work may be against the tightly packed zone defense.

“The bottom of their zone was tough,” Aldrich said. “They were long and physical down there. We usually move the ball well.”

“We’ll practice as hard the next two days as we ever have — Friday, a couple times Saturday. Hopefully we’ll get confidence through work,” Self said. “I’m not a big believer something great has to happen all the time to be confident. You’ve got to keep working on execution at practice (to be confident).”

Comments

Benjamin Jones 5 years, 4 months ago

Self says "We looked like a tired team today," then promises to practice the team as hard as they've ever practiced for the next two days. Doesn't make a lot of sense.

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jhawk23 5 years, 4 months ago

"helped doom the Jayhawks (25-7) to their first loss in a conference postseason tournament since 1989"

I'm sure you meant, "first loss in the first round," otherwise we would have been the 18-time defending champions of the Big XII/8 tournament! Wouldn't that be great!

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Benjamin Jones 5 years, 4 months ago

In his quotes, Collins says, essentially, "I am the leader. It's all on me. It's my fault we lost." It's just that kind of attitude that led to the loss--Collins thinking he has to be the hero all the time. Hey, Sherron--you have four other guys around you wearing the same color jersey. Use 'em!

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rawkhawk 5 years, 4 months ago

Practicing seems appropriate at this point. KU will likely see zone defenses and efficient 3-point shooting from opponents in the tournament. KU has the talent, coaching, and team to still make a good tourney run, and I hope this loss will make them hungry. They need to get back to playing as a team and come out with energy next week. I'm thinking it will be a 4 seed for the 'Hawks.

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hawkitup 5 years, 4 months ago

It is Cole ALDRICH!! Not Aldridge!! How can you follow KU basketball and not know this!? Sorry...just a pet peeve.

I think this loss could turn out to be a blessing. I was worried we may win the Big 12 tourney and then get bounced in the opening round of the NCAA tourney, but now I don't think we will get bounced quite that early.

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areyouserious 5 years, 4 months ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

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Firemanlfd 5 years, 4 months ago

What I can't quite figure out yet is how an armchair coach like myself can see how poor our perimeter defense is, yet the coaching staff either can't see it or won't acknowledge it. Especially the past 3 games, our perimeter defenders have really been exposed.....just look at the stats and how many 3's have been hit on us with many of them being wide open. I love the heart of guys like Reed, Morningstar and Collins, but none of the 3 are superb on-ball defenders. Why not either rotate Appleton and Releford a bit more for defensive support or switch to a zone more often to compensate? It pains me to see our young guys struggle in an area of weakness without the coaches adjusting the gameplan to help compensate for the struggles.

Either way, I love this young team and their effort:} Let's get back to work and come out firing for the tourney!

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John Myers 5 years, 4 months ago

@Speakeasy - my thoughts exactly. I really feel for Sherron. There is nobody that puts forth more effort than he does. What he needs to realize is that he can lead the team without taking all the shots, just like you say. Taking control of a game doesn't necessarily mean you're the only one playing (Like Singletary the other nite for Tech).

At any rate, completely bummed by the loss, but I take some solace in the fact that OU, Pitt and UConn all lost as well.

I still think our Hawks are one of the best teams in the country when we're clicking. We just need to stop digging these 10-15 point deficits in the opening minutes of the game. If we can do that, and if we can keep the wheels from falling off when our opponents make a run, we can handily beat any team in the country.

Let's go Hawks - practice hard, come out fired up, and let's make a run in the tourney that really counts!

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ajs10 5 years, 4 months ago

Firemanlfd- So you're a better coach that Bill Self?

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tulsahawkfan 5 years, 4 months ago

What a day.. UConn, Pitt, Oklahoma lose too. At least we're not alone. The biggest downer though is Mizzou is left in the tourney with Okie State, Baylor, and Texas. I sure hope someone can pull the upset...

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cre017 5 years, 4 months ago

I don't know how teams just turn it off and on whenever they want but it is clear that is what this young KU team does. Maybe it's the press clippings that have gone to their head and maybe they feel it is their god given right to win because they are a Jayhawk. Collins needs to understand and make the other 4 guys on the court understand that everyone wants to beat the National Champion! I think coach Self has done a good job with keeping this team grounded but I don't think Collins has. I look for this team to be considered lucky if they get out of the first round. I don't want to play VCU we'll loose!

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joeloveshawks 5 years, 4 months ago

This was a really bad loss, but I honestly think that we can make some noise in the tournament no matter how we did in the Big 12. Syracuse beat UCONN last night and Pitt falls to WVU, so it is just a crazy time of year and it will be our turn to play spoiler in the big dance. We are probably still going to get a #3 or #4 seed, which is incredible considering what we last from last years National Championship team. I am very proud of our season and I think we still have a few more wins in us. Rock Chalk!!!

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jayhawkintexas 5 years, 4 months ago

Basketball 101--first day of class, lesson one: "How to Beat the Zone Defense":

  1. Run down the court faster than the other team.
  2. Pass the ball to your teammate if you have a defender on you.
  3. Lay the ball in the basket either through bounging it off the backboard or dunking it.
  4. These steps are also known as a "fast break".
  5. Run back down the court after the made basket and set up defense.

Okay, remember this lesson because it will be on the final. Class dismissed.

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BCRavenJHawkfan 5 years, 4 months ago

Let's see, in addition to poor defense, KU had more turn overs, had a poor FG%, not only shot less FT but a worse % than Baylor and Baylor had about twice the steals. Those are not things leadership alone corrects.

My opinion is that what we are seeing in this tournament is what most would have expected in the regular season. One would have thought that the regular season would have been everybody beating up on each other. I for one was surprised that one or two teams were able to separate themselves during the season.

Look, I for one have to force myself to not judge this group of players on the success of last year's group.

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Firemanlfd 5 years, 4 months ago

Hey ajs10, appreciate your post but reread mine...never said I was a better coach. My opinion is that it seems obvious the big defensive weakness of our guards, I am just trying to understand why the coaching staff isn't making a change or adjustment to that area. It's not rocket science to see ( I did at least coach high school basketball so I have a basic knowledge) an area that needs to be tweaked or changed.

How bout giving your assessment or opinion or do you wanna hit me up with another question?

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JayhawkPhil64 5 years, 4 months ago

There has been a lot of foolish things said about Sherron Collins, both from a positive and a negative angle. Of course he is not the best point guard in the nation and yes he goes a little(well maybe more than a little) wacko sometimes but I am very glad to have him. His good points have far outweighed his bad points.

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BPSkelly 5 years, 4 months ago

Before we all jump ship here, lets all remind ourselves of a few things.

1) This teams "youth" will (and has) reared its ugly head a handful of times this season. It's easy for us alums/fans to get up in arms about teams lacking intensity, but guess what? College coaches have been trying to solve this riddle since the beginning of time. It happens, and sometimes at the most inopportune times.

2) For the "youth" issues, the reality is Collins wasnt very good and Aldrich was non-existent. This game was alarmingly like the UMass game. Collins plays like he has to win it with every possession, he takes a handful of crappy jumpers, and he and the rest of the team dont get it into Cole nearly enough.

3) More than our "youth" and our poor shooting, the fact we've had no defensive intensity for any stretch of time since the Missouri game is what is doing us in. The other factors are factors, but the deciding case against us right now is our "D" has been horrible. Clearly this is vexing Self as well, which is never good at this juncture. This doesnt bode well for next week... it just doesnt. Im pretty comfortable we'd win our first game, but if we're a 4 playing a 5 in the 2nd game... with no defensive intensity... guess what? Bye-Bye birdies.

One thing we alums/fans do far to much as well I think is base our perception of our team on what we do in Allen Field House more as opposed to what we do on the road. There are times we're so good in the Fieldhouse that we look like we could beat the Clippers. Its not that we shouldnt view it that way, but we need to put more stock in how we look on the road and neutral sites as well. Thats probably closer to what this team really is. Which is still really, really good. Just not the machine of perfection that we are when we are home.

Just something to think about before people start jumping off of roofs if we lose next weekend.

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namder 5 years, 4 months ago

Have faith in Bill! He will have them prepared for the NCAA's. This is the perfect opportunity to get this team focused and hungry. You never know what you will run up against in the tourney but you can bet this team will play with energy.

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sdoyel 5 years, 4 months ago

Sherron, man up. Don't let it happen again. We trust you. You're the leader, make sure of it!

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easyfive 5 years, 4 months ago

What is up with Morningstar, and Taylor? They act like there ready for the season to be over and go fishing... Morningstar keeps forgetting to shoot the ball when he is open. He is playing chicken! Shoot the ball fool!!! Sherron is passing the ball but the rest of the team don't want to shoot... Taylor just had two good games this year he has no heart. Releford may make mistakes but at least he tries to get to the hole.

Anyone know if it is true OSU offer Bill $35 mil, plus or not?

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Ben Kane 5 years, 4 months ago

Two things:

First: everybody needs to calm down a bit. We now have a chance to rest up ours chips, dings, and scratches and go back and work on some fundamentals that we don't have time for during the season. this loss is not the end of the world. Unless you need it for a one seed or to get in, the conference tournament is a waste of time and all you're really doing is praying somebody doesn't get injured.

Second: you have to realize that the Jayhawks have overachieved this year. We should be sitting back and enjoying that fact that we won the conference outright when no one, even us, expected that to happen.

For me, I'm going to enjoy the jayhawks in this ncaa tournament and it doesn't matter what round we get bounced in. Since I believe Cole and Sherron are back next year, let's get the youngins some experience and come back next year and kick some butt!

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Theutus 5 years, 4 months ago

i'm sorry, but saying "we have overachieved this year. We should be sitting back and enjoying that fact".

Thats spoken like a true under-achiever.

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Ben Kane 5 years, 4 months ago

was supposed to say "enjoying THE fact that we won the conference championship" not enjoying that we overachieved.

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SCHNBALL 5 years, 4 months ago

CBERRY, LET ME FOLLOW UP ON YOUR THOUGHTS. I BELIEVE THIS TEAM PLAYED UNINSPIRED BASKETBALL BECAUSE THEY WON THEIR CHAMPIONSHIP THE WEEK BEFORE WHEN WE BEAT TEXAS. IT WILL BE UP TO SHERRON AND COLE TO MAKE THE DIFFERENCE IN MOTIVATING THE YOUNG GUYS. I HOPE THAT WE CAN MAKE IT FOR AT LEAST 2 GAMES TO GAIN EXPERIENCE IN THE BIG DANCE. IF WE CAN MAKE IT PAST THE FIRST 2 ROUNDS, THEN WE ARE ON PLAYING ON HOUSE MONEY THE REST OF THE WAY. WE WILL FACE A ZONE IN THE NCAA FOR SURE, THE HALF COURT OFFENSE FOR US WE WILL BE THE KEY, AS I AM SURE ALL TEAMS WILL ZONE KU. WE MUST FIND A WAY TO PLAY OUR TEMPO. I LOOK FORWARD TO SUNDAY BUT HOPE WE DO NOT MATCH UP WITH A GUARD TALENTED TEAM.

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Theutus 5 years, 4 months ago

I honestly think it's going to take someone OTHER than Collins to motivate this team. I think Little is probably the best guy for the job to be honest. His play style is ferocious. He is down there banging with bigs every shot, and fighting for the ball.

Collins is all effort, but it's cocky "i need to be the one with the ball" effort. Little seems like a true leader to me. Someone that is 100% effort, 100% team oriented, and would sacrifice anything to benefit the team.

Why he doesn't play more, i'll never know.

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ajs10 5 years, 4 months ago

Firemanlfd- "What I can't quite figure out yet is how an armchair coach like myself can see how poor our perimeter defense is, yet the coaching staff either can't see it or won't acknowledge it." Sounds like you are implying that you are better than our coaches...My assessment is that we played bad and we lost, it happens. So lets move on and play better next game.

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Matt Kenton 5 years, 4 months ago

I'm definitely on the 'More Releford' bandwagon. However, it might be too late. If he had been getting 20 minutes a game all season, he'd probably be ready now. But I'm guessing Self will not play him because he still makes some mistakes (like passing the ball to a ref or the other team). Our offense, and Self's style, seems to be dependent on 3 really solid guards. We're not good at isolating Aldrich in a post-up situation more than a couple of times a game, so we rely on the ability of the guards to draw the defense out (especially multiple defenders). When two of your guards are only good for standing there and shooting wide open 3's, this becomes a problem.

I've seen some glimpses of Tyrel becoming more active offensively, but Releford has the true ability to make things happen.

And to say that Brady is our "best on-ball defender" is getting harder and harder to believe.

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Mike Crosbie 5 years, 4 months ago

Don't get me wrong, I ALWAYS want to see our guys win every game, but realize that's not realistic. Like the old saying goes, evey cloud has a silver lining, and there has been a lot of talk about Cole and Collins leaving after this year, well, maybe a loss like this just might be what keeps them at KU another year?????

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kennethst 5 years, 4 months ago

Amazes me that some of you are so critical of Self and Collins......what short memories you have.

Sorry fellow KU fans.....we ARE NOT GOING TO WIN EVERY GAME!!!!!!!!!

deal with it.

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eroesh 5 years, 4 months ago

I believe Collins needs to quit thinking about the NBA and focus on the NOW. Who the F is going to take a 5'11" PG that shoots 30% in big games. Collins also needs to watch some tape of Jacque Vaughn. Vaughn did what needed to be done for the team to win. If it was score, he did. If it was give out assists, he did. If it was play tight D down the stretch and maybe get a steal with out fouling, he did. He's still doing it even if it's busting his ass in practice and only playing 5 minutes a game. If I know I'm not hitting shots, I'm going to use my driving ability to look for an open shooter to pass to...and hopefully get an assist. Especially with a 7'1" guy ready to come at me. J.C. that was embarassing and my wife went to G.D. baylor. She doesn't even pay attention and she found out the score.

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Larry Smith 5 years, 4 months ago

Easyfive,

No, that offer was never made.

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kennethst 5 years, 4 months ago

EASYFIVE-

Shut up....idiot. You know absolutely nothing about how much heart Taylor has.....I hate it when morons think they know everything about players and this team. You don't know %^&*.......Stop voicing stupid comments about which you know nothing.

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Larry Smith 5 years, 4 months ago

I think it is interesting in the new bracketology that is out today, KU still has a 2 seed in Kansas City.

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Firemanlfd 5 years, 4 months ago

ajs10 ....thanks for that assumption on my personal opinion and thoughts. Need I mention the old saying about aSSuming things? :} lol Thanks for your questioning of my "coaching abilities" just to toss out your opinion. Not sure I understand your purpose other than to be a smart@$%, but we are in agreement that it was a bad performance and we need to bounce back and kick it up a notch. Rock Chalk!!

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oldalum 5 years, 4 months ago

I remember another young team that used to implode whenever they were faced with a new situation (morning game, so-so crowd, one-and-done tournament). I'm surprised you aren't willing to give these guys the benefit of the doubt, especially considering how well that other young team turned out.

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kranny 5 years, 4 months ago

Chuckberry, Amen. I have enjoyed this team so far. From where they were to where they are now has been fun to watch. 5 STRAIGHT BIG 12 CHAMPIONSHIPS!

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PittJayhawker 5 years, 4 months ago

I agree with what a lot fo you are saying about Collins--Yes, he is a great player when he is on. I feel like so much of the time he's playing in desperation-mode and trying too hard to force things to happen when it's not there. He does have other players to work with and plenty of talent to utilize! He shouldn't feel the need to carry the ENTIRE load of the team.

The game was a bummer, but I think this year has been frustrating in general. They've all showed signs of brilliance at some point or another this year and it's just going to take a while to get the maturity level up there. It's always going to be tough the year following a National Championship, especially when you lose ALL of your starters! That being said, this team has great potential and I definitely think they'll come around, even if it's not til next year! ROCK CHALK!!!

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kc_glandt 5 years, 4 months ago

Forget about Wednesday! Focus on Selection Sunday and our first-round matchup. I'm sick of all the whining. They're young. They're better than expected. Be positive.

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crmsnblu 5 years, 4 months ago

what ever happened to the idea of penatrate and dish when playing a zone d?

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jhawkinmissouri 5 years, 4 months ago

Hey speakeasy. You must be a genius. I agree that Self is a terrible coach. (Can you hear the sarcastic tone.) Maybe if he'd one a national championship or something you'd think he could coach. Also, if you knew anything about leadership, you'd know that Sherron is trying to shoulder the blame and take pressure off his younger teammates. He doesn't think he has to be the hero.

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jsatt93 5 years, 4 months ago

this hurts 2 the core, but hey i guess this comes with the price of being the 11th youngest team in the nation

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jayhawkox 5 years, 4 months ago

To be frank very few of the things I saw going wrong in that game had to do with Sherron Collins. Yes, he gets a little overeager at times but his overeagerness when the game is on the line was what got us the lead in the first place so it's hard to fault him for taking an open jump shot that he can make with some certainty. The things that ticked me off in this game were that our guards continually went under screens on the perimeter, allowing their guards to get easy shots off and that the defensive rotations around the basket either came too late or did not come at all. It certainly didn't help that we couldn't buy a bucket for a long stretch there, but those things happen and you have to dig in defensively and try to build momentum from there. Additionally, if we're not making shots and the other team is playing a stretched 2-3 zone, why not switch Cole to the high post and Markieff to the low post? Kieff has done a good job sealing the post as the season has gone on, but hasn't demonstrated the ability to hit that 12 foot jumper with any consistency, which allows the D to sag onto Cole and effectively take him out of the game. I feel like that could be a quick fix because we did break the zone a few times when Marcus, a much better shooter than his bro, was at the high post and got Cole the ball more as well.

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Nick Cole 5 years, 4 months ago

“I take most of it (blame),” Collins said. “I didn’t lead the team like I should have.”

I hope by this he means that he should not have been jacking up more shots after going 1-8 to start the game and instead acted like more of a point guard (i.e. making plays, driving and getting shooters the ball and dishing to Cole for dunks). He took 20 shots. If you take away 6 of those and turn them into assists (which could have been done in this game the way the were collapsing that zone) we win. Simple as that.

Dear Mr. Collins,

When you just don't have it, let someone else step up. Carrying "your" team does not mean taking shots when you are having a poor shooting day. It means making things happen. If you are off, dribble drive and dish the ball to the open man for Christ's sake. When will you learn this? Hopefully before our next game.

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pharms03 5 years, 4 months ago

idk about anybody else but i have been impressed lately by marcus morris an tyshawn taylors play. I think they have both, especially marcus, have stepped it up lately.

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JS82 5 years, 4 months ago

This team has already exceeded my expectations by winning the Big 12 title. I consider anything they do as a great accomplishment from this point on. I was definitely disappointed they lost but know that it is a young team with some pieces of the puzzle missing. This has been a good coaching job by Self to even get them where they are. A 3 or 4 seed for this team is not that bad. This year I expected below that. I hope they do well in the tournament but if they don't I know they have gained alot of experience that will carry over to next year. Go Jayhawks!

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kushaw 5 years, 4 months ago

I don't think some of you truly understand how hard it is to be in the "Role" that Sherron Collins is currently portraying for the Kansas Jayhawks this season. You do realize how exceptional a talent Sherron Collins is? The top 8 or 9 players the last few seasons for KU were just as good or a little bit better than Collins with Collins definitley holding his own "Talent Wise". This year Collins is having to shoulder so much responsibility it really is a task that only a few excpetional basketball players can handle. Collins has to be the leader, the point guard, the distributor, the playmaker, and sometimes even the defensive stopper. Talent wise he is far above everybody else on this year's squad unlike year's past.

I think we're being too hard on Collins. Collins is definitely playing his heart out! The other guys just need to catch-up, but if we're all giving an honest assessment, the rest of the team isn't quite there yet. Does this mean we can't still win? Heck no, but it's just one of those situations we have to realize and understand the "Role" that truly presents itself for Collins. You can complain about Collins turnovers, but it really is uncharacterisitic. It's just him trying to make plays.

I also give credit to Collins for taking the loss like a man! He doesn't make excuses and he really does tell it like it is. You got to love that about this kid! He definitely does shy away from the truth. It will be intersting to see how this young KU squad responds? The 2006 team won regular season conference and won 3 straight for a Big 12 tourney title and then lost in the first round of the NCAA. This 2009 team won the regular season confernce outright, lost in the first round of the big 12 tourney and ....................................I'm anxious to see what their fate is going to be as a team and how they conclude this season. I'll take a first round big 12 tourney loss and a better showing in the NCAA tournament than a Championship in the Big 12 tourney and a first round NCAA loss. I can't wait for Selection Sunday and the start of the NCAA tournament. Go Jayhawks!

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kushaw 5 years, 4 months ago

I meant to say he doesn't shy away from the truth.

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SCHNBALL 5 years, 4 months ago

kushaw, maybe your right about collins, he does have alot to shoulder this year, but he must set the tempo early in the game. i just hope we make it through the first 2 rounds to gain that all important experience in the tourny. this is a top three program with a coach in the top three. When this season started out and i first started watching this board, everyone, including myself, expected 8 to 9 losses with no talk of a comference championsip. I hope that our junior guard will lead this young team past the championship they have and remind them how special last year really was and come out with a little more grit the next game out. I spend alot of time in KY, now take ku vs uk, i think we are in the right spot.

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Theutus 5 years, 4 months ago

kushaw, i think he's been a hell of a contributor, and stepped it up in the beginning of the season when he had to...

At this point though, i think he IS shying away from the truth. The truth that he needs to stop shooting, and start penetrating/dishing to actual shooters. And start feeding Aldrich the ball more often.

Right now, the "truth" according to him, is that he has to do it all himself. Thats not the case. Hopefully he realizes that after this loss, and is prepared to play a true PG role when the tourny starts.

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Ben Kane 5 years, 4 months ago

It looks as if Lunardi has put us in as the last 2 seed and dropped OU to a 3 seed. If he's right, it looks like the only threat to that would be Misery (God I hope they lose), WVU if they run the table, or Xavier.

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jayhawkintexas 5 years, 4 months ago

It could be the case that they are tired, thinking too much and feeling the weight of being the defending national champions and current Big 12 champions. Maybe what they need are a couple of days off, react rather than think when they are on the court and just have fun playing Jayhawk basketball (up tempo, fast breaking, stingy defense). I hope they are loose, enthuastic and show lots of heart in the tournament. If they are and still get knocked out early, well, there's always next year.

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kushaw 5 years, 4 months ago

Theutus: The Truth is that KU's shooters didn't step up against Baylor yesterday. Yes Tyrel Reed was 2-5 and hit some crucial 3's down the stretch, but it wasn't enough. When Morningstar goes 0-4 that's not a good sign. Taylor did his part shooting 2-3, but Collins was 4-12. If you have noticed towards the end of the regular season, Collins was actually deferring towards his teammates in the first half. Go look at his shot attempts in the last 8 games. I think it will surprise you.

As for KU overall yesterday, I don't think they played that badly. Actually, I thought the Zone Offense was excuted the best I've seen in quite sometime. Don't get me wrong, the FG percentage will say otherwise, but sometimes you go through a bad shooting night or bad shooting day in this example. There was just a lid on the basket. So the question basically is........Was KU overachieving with the players that they had or was yesterday's game a true representation of what this KU team is all about? I Chalk it up to bad shooting morning/day. KU hasn't played too many Noon games so if it does happen in the NCAA tournament then I think we will be a little more prepared then the way we started against Baylor. Also, I like the fact that Baylor played zone because you can bet that some teams are definitely going to try it in the NCAA tourney. I chalk it up to a lot of factors yesterday, but maybe Baylor, for once this season, actually played to the level they are capable of? If they did they did at KU's expense. I'm still convinced that it's no so much on Collins as is the rest of the team to take that responsibility to catch-up to Collins and get on the same page. Honestly, they aren't there yet, but the good thing is that KU is good enough at the two most important spots (Center and PG) to make up for our limitations.

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kennethst 5 years, 4 months ago

KU Shaw is right on!!! Thank you.

Your comments are always spot on....

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justanotherfan 5 years, 4 months ago

One thing that few people are noticing is that, other than Sherron, no one else is stepping forward and taking any responsibility from the players.

I haven't heard Tyshawn or Cole or either Morris or Brady or Tyrel step forward and say, "hey, you know what, I need to step up and take some of the burden off Sherron."

Not only that, when they are playing, no one is stepping forward to take that burden off Sherron. He's the only one with the "intestinal fortitude" to want to take big shots. He's the ONLY one. He's not afraid of the responsibility. Yeah, he struggled yesterday, but make no mistake, this team goes no further than Sherron can take them.

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Jim Pendleton 5 years, 4 months ago

Just back from OKC. I am again seeing comments from players/coaches about either lack of energy or being ready to play. Hate to keep repeating this, but I just don't know how this happens. Bad enough to hear it during the regular season, but once post season rolls around, this should never be the case. Only so many games to play, and now that number is less than before.

It really scares me these last three games (and others during season) that we have managed to fall behind so big. Yes we keep coming back, and I felt pretty good when we got up five yesterday. The problem is you expend so much effort coming back that you often don't have enough to finish. Can't happen in the NCAA's.

An odd fact from the first two rounds - All five of the lower seeds that won the first two days also lost to that opponent at home during the regular season. Pretty unusual.

Heard interesting comments about the tourney on 810 while driving home. Was thinking this myself, but hadn't heard anyone else say until today. Their guys in OKC basically said there has been no atmosphere at the games whatsoever. Totally agree with that having been there. The OU-OSU game had it, but more because of local ties. Most of them left before the MU game. Anyone there who didn't have a ticket for our game could have picked one up for next to nothing, plus most rounds not sold out.

Second and perhaps more important to me, the change in tourney dates this year. I realize many people for years have not gone much to the first day. Even less so in years tourney has been in OKC or Dallas. But now the games start on Wed, so it is even worse. Either session Wed, there couldn't have been more than 3-4K people in the stands at any one time. The crowds were decent Thurs, but not great. The old Friday games (qtrs) particularly in KC would have been pretty close to full.

I know the coaches and league say it helps the teams having another day off, and it also may help the last two teams playing come NCAA selection time, but I don't agree. Unless you have a 7-8 (or worse) in the final, it doesn't really change things much as we have seen play out over the years. We played a tough final game against Texas last year on Sunday and then find out we are playing at 11:20am on Thursday. Didn't seem to bother us much last year.

In addition the ones it really hurts are the fans like myself who will make these trips. You have to take an extra day off work. Your chances of having good weather to do other things this time of year is iffy at best (weather bad in OKC yesterday). Temp only going to be 40 today. A 5pm Sat start for the finals would have made for a late travel night. A 2pm Sun start at least allows you to get home at a halfway decent hour even after the selection show. While I realize most of the tickets were sold, it doesn't look good when your arena isn't very full for your league's big event. Hopefully they will reconsider for future years.

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Eric Schneider 5 years, 4 months ago

Here's the problem. Morris was the only one looking for Aldrich. The guards were content to pass it around the perimeter. Marcus tried to step up but didn't get enough touches. If he can stay out of foul trouble the offense should run through him, especially against a zone. He is a matchup nightmare for every team in the country. He is an excellent passer, he can put the ball on the floor against many of the guards out there, and he has a very high baskentball IQ.

As for everyone being so high on Releford. Have you been watching the same team I have? He is a defensive liabilty against a three guard lineup. He makes terrible decisions if the lane to the basket isn't open. Yes, he has improved immensely. But not anywhere near enough to get the kind of minutes everyone seems to want him to get.

And finally Sherron. You've carried the team this far. Now the freshman, Tyshawn and Marcus, are ready. Let them do their job on the court. Saying that, everyone needs to remember that Tyshawn was the fifth leading scorer on his high school team last year. Marcus is going to be the only one of the two who will always be comfortable taking over a game. If Sherron is feeling it fine. But otherwise share the burden.

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lrahardja 5 years, 4 months ago

The team just didn't perform well against the zone, just didn't have it. Perhaps still soaking from the Big-12 champ status.

Did you watch Johnny Flynn of Syracuse against Connecticut in 6 OT? Flynn clearly knows how to lead, break down the opposing defense, and leverage his team mates with inside and outside passing.

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OKJAYHAWK5 5 years, 4 months ago

The offense HAS to go through Cole... EVERYTIME!! I cant believe a post man as good as him getting frozen out as much as he does. Sherron being a leader has nothing to do with shooting it 30 times a game, it is about getting the rest of the team involved. If this is not fixed in the tourney, the zone will kill us again and it will be an early exit for the Hawks.

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cklarock 5 years, 4 months ago

Sherron's the man on this team, and has been. We're going to go as far as he and Cole take us -- he's become an even better leader as this season has gone on, and he's doing the right thing.

Some days they just don't go in, and some days you come out flat . . . when you do that against a talented team on a mission, you'll get beat. The guys will take this loss into practice, and come out fired up for the NCAAs.

And while the team won't rest on their laurels, as fans, we can. If I say I'm happy that the team won the Big 12, and I don't feel that I need anything more to consider this season a success, I'm sure it won't affect the team one bit.

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Brian Powell 5 years, 4 months ago

Firemanlfd, how in the world can you claim that Brady is in the not-a-great-on-ball perimeter defender?? Have you watched any games this year?

Sure, in our losses his man might have hit a few, but he had to have x-ray vision most of the time to see through Brady's hand. They weren't a bunch of wide-open looks. He denies his man the pass more than he gets scored on...

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BCRavenJHawkfan 5 years, 4 months ago

Well now, Baylor just beat Texas. Takes the sting out of our loss a small amount. Wait, the guy is shooting the Phillips 66 free throws. One of four for the Jayhawk fan.

In watching the Baylor/Texas game it was mentioned that Baylor was projected preseason as a top 20 team, and picked to finish third with Kansas in conference. So perhaps it is the tournament that is bringing the leaders back to par so to speak.

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jaybate 5 years, 4 months ago

jaybate extention course: An Introduction to the Rhetoric of Theutus (no prerequisite)

In this course, distinguished rhetorician and visiting Professor Klaus von Schtup of the Scheisskopf Institute for Advanced Posting, Baden Baden, Germany. He will lecture on the emerging rhetoric of internet posting by focusing on the rhetoric of Theutus, a respected analytical voice about the American sport of Division 1 college basketball and about the University of Kansas Jayhawks in particular. Dr von Schtup has done extensive analysis of Theutus' posts and will present his rigorous content analysis in a quantitatively advanced format called "empirically unverifiable-metrics." Students will study the most famous claim of Theutus declaring Sherron Collins to be too dumb and undisciplined to learn from his mistakes, or to be a good leader. There will also be a course component focusing on Theutus' tendency to call a poster a "hypocrite," when that poster asserts a contrary opinion. Finally, students will be introduced to Theutus seminal concept that if someone suggests that a 25-7 record is quite good for an inexperienced team lead by Sherron Collins, the most effective rhetorical device is to counter with a false claim that that person is settling for underachievement. Term papers for this class will focus on Theutus' continued inability to persuade a critical mass of posters to walk the plank with him into the logical abyss of questioning Sherron Collins' leadership abilities on this team. Dr. von Schtup is, of course, world reknowned for his pithy epigram "Repeat an Error Often Enough and It Is Still an Error."

(.00000005 credits)

Note: This online course is not available in certain provinces of China, due to state censorship.

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jaybate 5 years, 4 months ago

BCRavenJHawkfan,

I am pulling for Baylor to win it all if KU can't! :-) I have for a long time yearned for a team with a really lousy record to win it all, so people understand how much of the tourney is being on a hot streak.

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BCRavenJHawkfan 5 years, 4 months ago

jaybate,

you are so right. Survive and move on.

Hate to see Eaton go down. Really respect the guy as a player.

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Derek Bowman 5 years, 4 months ago

I was at the game and here are a couple things I noticed. When they were going good (culminating in the Mizzou game) they were aggressive on both ends of the floor. What I saw Thursday was a team missing that aggression especially on the offensive side. Both Morris twins were able to receive the pass at the elbow all day and when they'd square to the basket their shot was NEVER challenged, yet they passed up the open shot sooooooo many times!!! Tyshawn had some of the same issues and it was driving me crazy!!!!! These shots I'm talking about were all 10 feet in yet the boys apparently had no confidence to go ahead and take the chip shots.

I saw Tyshawn FINALLY do it once in the 2nd half where he took it from the elbow to the rim with some aggression for the easy basket....but there was just not NEARLY enough of that.

Cole struggled against the double team....no other way to put it. Numerous times they'd double down on him and he just doesn't quite have the grace to dribble out of it. He stands in one spot, clumsily struggling to maintain possession and it disrupts the entire possession. Baylor's bigs got double teamed several times and I saw them dribble out of it, square to the basket, and find the open man under the hoop for a jam more times than I wanted to.

Folks, these are just observations I saw from my perch in the Ford Center. I hope nobody takes this as though I'm hammering them. I've actually been thinking about this and it seems that recent history might be on our side here....because I can remember past years where we had shaky endings to the season....and we were all thinking they'd make an early exit....and then, what do you know, they ended up going about two rounds farther than we thought. Perhaps that's what they're setting us up for!!!! That'd be cool because honestly, if someone told you back in November that they'd win the conference and go to the sweet 16 wouldn't you have taken that?

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Jfanallways 5 years, 4 months ago

something no one has mentioned appleton had the flu last week and seeing cole sit so long in TT game and not looking like himself i wonder if he and maybe others might have just a touch of the flu i know the team gets shots but i dont think thats gives them 100% immunity appleton case in point.

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kushaw 5 years, 4 months ago

ksglfr: You bring up some good points and those points would be valid in any other game except the Missouri game. Missouri is a poor example to use when evaluating the strengths and weaknesses of the Kansas Jayhawks. Missouri does one thing well and that's "Hurry-up" the opposition. Now, if KU was getting ready to play Louisville or Okie State then maybe we would have something to compare and contrast in terms of spacing, aggressiveness, and ball movement. Missouri, although very effective, plays a "Junk" defense and full-court press that really doesn't resemble normal game type situations. That is why Baylor, playing the zone that they did, will help the jayhawks just in case they play Syracuse a second time and a mid-major that can't really match-up with Cole Aldrich. I hear what you're saying, but I just think Missouri is a bad example just in case Kansas plays somebody from the Big 10 or Pac 10 or a legit (which 80 percent of teams implement) man-to man type of offense.

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poo86 5 years, 4 months ago

Sherron Collins needs to Watch Johnny Flynn at the point Guard...Flynn shows how much patience he has wit the ball..he's like Chris Paul...Unlike Sherron..he goes to the cup only looking to score when he gets to the paint his dribble is picked up and alot of times he takes out-of-control layups instead of keeping his dribble and another thing about Collins. KU is not going to win if SHERRON COLLINS is a one Dimensional Player..The Kid Clearly does not PLAY DEFENSE..he only looks to score....that is a problem wit this team also...But Self lets him do what he wants to...Clearly Tyshawn Taylor has stepped his defense up tremendously..in the Baylor game jerrols was doing anything he wanted....to tell the truth Collins really hasn't guarded the Premiere POINTguards in college...so Collins has a lot of DEFENSE to play in order for KU to win!!!! Stop giving this kid ALL the credit when hes only a Scoring point guard who doesnt Play Defense well at all....

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