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Wednesday, May 6, 2015

ISU seen as strong challenger to Kansas

Iowa State coach Fred Hoiberg holds a championship hat and claps for his Cyclones after winning the Big 12  Tournament on Saturday, March 14, 2015. ISU beat Kansas 70-66 in Kansas City, Missouri.

Iowa State coach Fred Hoiberg holds a championship hat and claps for his Cyclones after winning the Big 12 Tournament on Saturday, March 14, 2015. ISU beat Kansas 70-66 in Kansas City, Missouri.

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Kansas University’s men’s basketball team figures to face stiff competition from Iowa State in its quest for a 12th-straight Big 12 title.

“They are going to challenge the Jayhawks, but as we know, the Jayhawks seem to persevere — 11 straight titles,” ESPN hoops analyst Miles Simon told Big12sports.com Tuesday at the league’s spring meetings in Phoenix. “Someone is going to have to knock off the king. Iowa State could be that team next year.”

Simon provided reporter Wendell Barnhouse with a detailed analysis of both teams. KU won the Big 12 regular season at 13-5 a year ago, one game ahead of both ISU and Oklahoma. Iowa State won the conference tournament.

Of KU, Simon said: “First of all, it starts off with Perry Ellis returning. That’s big. He comes back for his senior year. I think he’ll have an All-America type season, pick up right where he left off. Remember, he was hot on Buddy Hield’s heels for Big 12 player of the year (until he hurt his knee), so that’s huge first and foremost, but the recruits (forwards Cheick Diallo, Carlton Bragg) ... you get a guy like Cheick Diallo. He’s a big-time energy guy, plays hard all the time, a good defender. You don’t have to run any plays for him. He’s a huge get for Kansas, especially in the post area.

“He can play alongside Perry because Diallo is going to do most of his work around the basket. Then you look for Frank Mason to continue to make a big jump, also Devonté Graham I think is going to be huge going forward. Brannen Greene I think will have to step up his game on the wing, especially with Kelly Oubre gone,” Simon added.

Of Iowa State, a team that lost to UAB in the second round of the NCAAs, Simon said: “Fred Hoiberg arguably is going to return a Top Five team (nationally). You are going to return four of your five starters. I think you are going to have a hungry team. Monte Morris will be on a lot of All-America lists as well as Georges Niang. Jameel McKay is one of the best defenders in all of college basketball. You have Naz Long. You get the transfer, Hallice Cooke, from Oregon State.”

Asked about Texas, Simon told Big12sports.com: “I think the Texas Longhorns could be a darkhorse team. I think they are an NCAA-caliber team right away. I think (new coach) Shaka Smart is going to have a great impact. He adds to that Final Four pedigree of coaches the Big 12 already has, and I’m excited to see what he does in Austin.”

Schneider hopeful: New KU women’s coach Brandon Schneider also was interviewed at the meetings by Big12sports.com.

“I think we have some high-character kids. I’ve had the opportunity to work with them obviously just briefly, but I think we’ve got a good core and foundation to build upon,” said Schneider, who took over for Bonnie Henrickson on April 20.

Asked how KU could best emerge as a national power, former Stephen F. Austin coach Schneider said: “I think obviously you always are going to have to try to improve your roster as much as you can. I’m excited about the five signees that are coming in. We still have a lot of scholarships we can give out in the 2016 class. We’re looking forward to doing everything we can to improve our team.”

Mack to decide soon: Former VCU commit Tevin Mack, a 6-6, 200-pound senior small forward from Dreher High in Columbia, South Carolina, will announce his college choice next week, his mom, Paula, told wistv.com. Rivals.com’s No. 61-rated player has a final list of KU, Texas, Clemson, Georgia, North Carolina, UCLA and West Virginia. He has not yet made a campus visit to KU.

Mack visited Georgia last weekend.

“He’s been there, like, 10 times,” Paula told the Spartanburg Herald-Journal. Mack’s older brother played for Georgia coach Mark Fox at Nevada. Paula told goupstate.com that the decision must come next week because her son has finals the ensuing week.

Vick update: LeGerald Vick, a 6-5 junior shooting guard from Douglass High in Memphis who has decommitted from SMU, is thinking about reclassifying to the class of 2015. Vick, who is ranked No. 137 in the Class of 2016, initially chose SMU over Alabama, Mississippi, Tennessee, Providence and others. He has heard from KU, Kentucky, Louisville, UCLA, Texas and others.

Allen may ask out of letter: KeVaughn Allen, a 6-2 senior combo guard from North Little Rock (Arkansas) High, is expected to ask for a release from his Florida letter-of-intent, several outlets reported Tuesday. He’s ranked No. 67 by Rivals.com.

Comments

RJ King 7 years, 3 months ago

Didn't we see this same article a year ago???

So glad Diallo looks like he can run the floor. We will need that vs ISU if they play like last year.

Hmmm . . . Texas has a pretty good shot at any/all of the 3 listed above.

Jonathan Allison 7 years, 3 months ago

the circumstances make it sound like Mack to Georgia.

Vick looks like maybe a non-contributor at KU, UK, and Louisville, but without seeing any tape, could be a diamond in the rough for Smart's system...?

Again without seeing any film on Allen, he doesn't seem to fill an immediate need at KU, but we've seen Bill Self use a 6'2" combo guard at the SG position quite effectively before, so it stands to reason that Self could use the kid. Wasn't Tyshawn Taylor rated around the same place and Allen and Mack?

Alex Resnik 7 years, 3 months ago

I think Taylor was in the high 80's on ESPN and I'm pretty sure he decommitted from Marquette when Crean left.

Doug Longstaff 7 years, 3 months ago

Jonathan, according to Eric Bossi of Rivals, Vick's 137 ranking in the 2016 is a way low, and upon the next round of rankings, he will be given 4-stars and moved way up in the class. He fits the bill for what we need next year, in that we are a little guard-weak. Graham projects to start (educated guess, here), which leaves a couple of 6-7, 6-8 guys as your lone perimeter players on the bench. We really need another guard, just for depth and the ability to guard a smaller player in a pinch.

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

Agree with Doug on this one. The immediate need for KU is another ball handling guard and Allen fits the Bill in that department. Mason and Graham are the only two on the roster that feel comfortable handling the rock (please do not include Selden into this category).

Allen is the best of the bunch that is left (once he gets his release from Florida) and from what I've read he was pretty interested at one time in KU as he visited but KU had Mason, Tharpe, and Frankamp on the roster at the time. There is definitely a need now for another ball handler on this squad.

Brian Wilson 7 years, 3 months ago

You say that but Selden has to be in the equation since that is the position he will play in the NBA and HCBS has said as much in the past.

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

Then he better a get move on in the handles and quickness department. I'm not convinced that Selden will play a lot next to SvI and greene and if he does that's not gonna be a pretty combination. Just like its been the last two years alongside Oubre and Wiggins.

Selden is better on the court with Mason and Graham on the court with Selden operating as a true wing. Which is even more reason to have Allen on the roster. That's what made chalmers, Colin's, and Russ rob so good and kansas songood because they all could handle the rock and create opportunities in the paint.

Finally, and this juncture of Selden's career...he's not going to be playing in the NBA. It's a hard truth but unless something miraculous happens he next two years Seldeb will be bouncing around Europe (which there is nothing wrong with that) or the nbdl.

Brian Wilson 7 years, 3 months ago

News Flash

LaGerard Vick
KU gave offer for next year. LaGerard Vick a #6'5" SG from Memphis Tennesee. A 4 star unranked SG. This may indicate KU is not expecting to sign Mack. LaGerard committed from SMU. His tape can been seen on 247 and UK apparently is looking at him gas well.
http://kentucky.247sports.com/Bolt/WATCH-LaGerald-Vick-at-Under-Armour-37144400 0

Marius Rowlanski 7 years, 3 months ago

Interesting to note that Kentucky struck out in the spring recruiting period. Lately, it seemed that UK signed every recruit they wanted and although they still have the 2nd ranked class, it falls far from past classes.

Adam Tyler 7 years, 3 months ago

Would Calapri feel the same about the platoon system if he had landed Diallo, Brown, Newman, Zimmerman, etc.? I doubt it.

Sounds like sour grapes to me.

Benz Junque 7 years, 3 months ago

Sounds like realism. They don't even have 10 scholarship players at this point.

Brian Wilson 7 years, 3 months ago

Not true and it's a bunch of whining! Calipari is just butt hurt. Kentucky is fully loaded. They 11 scholarships taken, with only 2 more scholarships to give.

Aaron Paisley 7 years, 3 months ago

I'm pretty sure Kentucky is right at 10 scholarship players. I believe they had 13 last year, lost 7, and have signed 4 players so far.

Brian Wilson 7 years, 3 months ago

So much for "The Great" Calipari necessarily being the best coach in basketball. Even great coaches screw up. It will be interesting to see how he does without his OAD's because he still has a lot of 3 and 4 star players on his roster.

"If you ask me if I’m ever going to platoon again, my answer is NO. Last season was an absolute outlier. It’s just not the way I like to coach. I would rather play seven or eight guys because I believe that gives us the best chance to win. I think we wrote the book on platooning this year, but I hope we stick it on the shelf and never have to use it again."

It also demonstrates that so much hype brings so much failure..... a failed perfect season, a failed national championship. It would appear that he over recruited, got greedy keeping players away from other programs, and then couldn't handle the prima donna pressure.

Give me Bill Self any day of the week! RCJHGKU!

Brian Wilson 7 years, 3 months ago

Benz,
Not true and it's a bunch of whining! Calipari is just butt hurt. Kentucky is fully loaded. They just don't have any One and Dones! So, Booo Hooo!

11 scholarships are taken, with only 2 more scholarships to give. In addtion to having 3 MDA's in Polythess, Willis and Lee, they have added newcomers 5 star Center Skal Labissiere, 5 Star guard Ivan Briscoe, and 4 Star Cliff Matthews, Plus they just added a transfer in 5 star RS Senior Power Forward, Kyle Wiltjer. Not to mention already having a 5 star PG in Ulik that is taking over ball handling duties.

Tom Jones 7 years, 3 months ago

Wiltjer transferred out of UK to Gonzaga two years ago, actually.

If Skal is ruled eligible (and he probably will...the NCAA loves it's big dogs and cats), UK is top ten and maybe top five but won't have a ton of depth. They'll be starting five McD AA's, though.

Tough to find any tears for Cal.

Aaron Paisley 7 years, 3 months ago

How can they start 5 McD's players when they only have 4 on the roster?

Tom Jones 7 years, 3 months ago

Yeah, you're right, sorry. Forgot Skal's eligibility issue kept him out of the McD game, but he was a consensus top 5 recruit.

So 4 McD AA's and a higher ranked recruit than any of them thrown in there at center.

Len Shaffer 7 years, 3 months ago

"In his zeal to emphasize that future recruits should expect to have the chance to play 30-plus minutes per game, Calipari even exaggerated how short his rotations have been in the past."

Wait a minute, Calipari stretched the truth??? I'm shocked, SHOCKED I tell you!

Mark Lindrud 7 years, 3 months ago

I think things will be mostly status quo with a couple teams improving etc, but when the defending champs of the conference bring back 4 out of 5 starters and 2 top 25 recruits that help fill a weakness I don't see how we lose the conference title.

I am not trying to sound cocky, but this will be an experienced team, which seems to be Self's forte, and we will be very strong next year and deep. There will be several good teams in conference next year like ISU, and I respect Hoiberg immensely, but it is ours to lose.

Marius Rowlanski 7 years, 3 months ago

I agree completely Mark.

Basically, Iowa State will be more experienced but otherwise the same team as last year. Kansas on the other hand, is bringing back both a////// more experienced plus a more athletic team.

I see our starting 5 looking like:

PG: Frank Mason, III, Jr.

SG. Sviatoslav Mykhailiuk, So.

SF: Wayne Selden, Jr.

PF: Perry Ellis, Sr.

C: Cheick Diallo, Fr.

And key players off the bench are sophomore guard Devonte Graham, shooter Brannen Greene (who could easily start in place of Mykhailiuk), and the trio of Traylor, Bragg and Lucas in the front court.

I like our teams chances to repeat as Conference Champions plus much more.

Andrew Holmes 7 years, 3 months ago

To win the Big XII again next year, KU will have to do what it's done throughout this 11 year stretch. Go 9-0 or 8-1 at home and win 5 or 6 on the road. Other teams simply don't hold home court like KU does or consistently win on the road. Assuming KU goes 9-0 at home, they should only need to win 6 games on the road to win the league out right. IMO you have 3 guaranteed road wins (KSU, TCU, Tech). Then there are 3 or 4 teams that we should beat on the road (Texas, Baylor, OSU, WVU). Oklahoma and ISU will be our stiffest competition but I like our chances at the 12x repeat. Again, just my opinion.

Glen Miller 7 years, 3 months ago

KSU is never guranteed...... we should have throttled them this year and they beat us. When they play us in that building, the atmosphere and the amperage is turned up for them. Can't say that's a gimmie at all, no matter their roster. TCU is getting more talent and a few of their good players have been there a while. Texas and OSU are typically places we struggle at on the road, so I don't count my chickens. I think we will lose 4 or 5 conference games next year, including one at home. Too many good teams.

I look for us to win the conference again, but I think the big picture goal for next year will be to be ready come tournament time. I think next year is the year to make a run. UNC is the only team that I think might be better than us talent wise, but our coaching is better. I look for Self to develop as the season goes on and really hone in on making a deep run in the dance. I think even he is getting tired of trying to deflect tournament results with well we won the Big 12....

Tom Jones 7 years, 3 months ago

KSU wasn't very good this year and now their whole team's gone. They will be much worse next year and KU will be better. I'm putting the Octagon of Dumb in the W column right now and you can bookmark me and feed me a plate of crow if it doesn't happen that way. ;)

Jonathan Allison 7 years, 3 months ago

"KSU wasn't very good this year"

But they beat us.

Tom Jones 7 years, 3 months ago

And they lost their whole team, basically. A team that also beat ISU, SWEPT OU and beat Baylor. They weren't complete garbage. But they will be next year.

Like I said....bookmark me. No way they beat KU next year.

Rodney Crain 7 years, 3 months ago

Uneasy lies the head that wears an 11 time crown.

When have the teams we played not brought their best when they play us, especially in our conference? ISU, OK, and Texas are the best this year, fine, when the dust settles I like our chances. Somebody get a ball...

Brian Mellor 7 years, 3 months ago

I suspect some accuracy in the idea that when we DO lose the conference - which is bound to happen eventually, one of these years - it will be to Hoiberg and ISU. Will it happen this coming year, hard to say. A mouse could starve on the talent difference between the two teams last year, and they both should be as good or better this year.

What I'd like to see more than anything else is for ISU, OU, or another Big12 team that's not the Jayhawks make a Final Four run one of these years.

Tony Bandle 7 years, 3 months ago

The future of ISU is all predicated on Fred's health. As much as I want to beat him and the Cyclones [my brother and sister-in-law are ISU alumni] I want him to be healthy and competing against us for years to come.

PS They own the Fall [football] but I own the Spring [basketball[]. :)

Jonathan Allison 7 years, 3 months ago

I feel bad saying it, but I think that the theme for KU Football this season is "Winter is Coming".

Nevertheless I will watch in anticipation for any signs of progress and hope for those unlikely wins.

Brad Farha 7 years, 3 months ago

But we did win in Football this last Fall!!!! That was a fun game.

Gerry Butler 7 years, 3 months ago

I just have the same feeling as Mark. with the 4 starters we have back,and the 2 high profile recruits love the mix. experience, and very high quality players coming in,still feel Coach Self, will add another solid play this year. wether it be the 7ft kid or the VCU commit.Bottom line as always the championship STILL runs thru Lawrence. Always has, always will

Brad Farha 7 years, 3 months ago

For what it's worth, it's refreshing to read this article and comments, and not see 3 or 4 guys all posting about how the other 3-4 guys are idiots.

Brad Farha 7 years, 3 months ago

For sure Joe. We can debate and make our points without being hostile. It creates a better environment to share ideas.

Tom Jones 7 years, 3 months ago

Those shirts still crack me up.

"BIG XII CHAMPIONS!"

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

They won the big 12 tourny. Are they or are they not Big 12 champions as well?

Tom Jones 7 years, 3 months ago

They are not. Kansas was the Big 12 Champions.

The shirts should say Big 12 TOURNAMENT Champions.

And yeah, Benz, I know it's the Big XII's fault, not the Clones.

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

Good Grief. Never hurts to pay a little respect to another program.

Tom Jones 7 years, 3 months ago

Where did I say I don't respect them?

They just weren't the Big 12 Champions.

Benz Junque 7 years, 3 months ago

Those are the shirts provided by the Big 12. Blame them.

I like Kansas' chances of running the title to 12 straight next year. We lose LESS and our new players added are better. With so many returning players on both teams, I look for KU to keep the same defensive game play as they had in the game last year in Lawrence. And having Diallo makes KU even better equipped to deal with them since he can neutralize a lot of the advantages ISU had with McKay.

Besides, the Bulls are going to fire Thibs and hire Hoiberg this summer anyways, right?

Glen Miller 7 years, 3 months ago

Well it's not surprising....... we couldn't decide on a Champion between TCU and Baylor for the Football Playoffs. What makes you think basketball would be any different? LOL

Robert Brock 7 years, 3 months ago

I don't think that our primary ball handlers - Mason, Graham, and Selden - frighten Iowa State, Texas, or Oklahoma much. The Big 12 conference championship, like college hoops in general, is really about guard play - not so much about bigs.

Freddie Garza 7 years, 3 months ago

I've got a ton of respect for Hoiberg and what he's done with that program over there. I swear I'm torn some days, like I'm happy for the stiff competition and challenge presented by ISU, but part of me sometimes wishes that he'd get snatched up by an NBA team.

Joseph Bullock 7 years, 3 months ago

Alex and Jonathan, Tyshawn was the #11 PG & #77 player, overall, by Rivals (I'm not sure about ESPN. He played at St. Anthony HS, under Bob Hurley. They were 32-0, and won the HS Nathional Championship! I remember Tyshawn saying in an interview, that his dream was always to win a National Championship in HS, play for the defending National Champ in College, and help them win a National Championship! If Rushawn decommitted from anywhere, it would have had to have been a 'Verbal', early on, but I don't remember that being the case. And Brad F., it is refreshing to see people being 'Respectful' of others opinions. OK, everyone line up-it's time to check your temperature! Ha ha ha ha ha

Aaron Paisley 7 years, 3 months ago

Tyshawn Taylor was a Marquette commit (don't remember if he signed an LOI or not), but he decommitted from Marquette when Tom Crean took the Indiana job before he eventually committed to KU.

Joe Ross 7 years, 3 months ago

I am not a doomsday prophet, but Iowa State is knocking at the door for supremacy in the Big 12. Hoiberg has his kids competing. They execute. They are aggressive. They play well together. And as anyone knows who attended the Big 12 tournament either in the arena or the courtyard, their fans are more rabid than our own Jayhawks'. If Cheick Diallo had not committed to Kansas, it would be very thinkable that Iowa State would be the favorites to win the Big 12. Had Iowa State landed Diallo instead of us, there would have been no discussion about it whatsoever. Thats how close Iowa State is. And their consistency of growth under Hoiberg leaves me thinking that when and if Kansas falls, it will be at the hands of our neighbors to the Northeast.

But rather than looking at these things negatively, the growth of all teams around the league is what you want to see if youre Kansas. We need to play the best and beat the best. Our leagues level of play needs to elevate so that we are on par with the performance of other conferences in the tournament. And by the way, Godspeed to Hoiberg as he recovers. Get well soon...

Benz Junque 7 years, 3 months ago

The problem is that they do not recruit well enough to sustain it year in and year out. They have Niang, Long, Nader and McKay as seniors with not much coming up behind them to replace them. ISU will be very good this season but they'll struggle to stay at this level all the time unless they start landing some better recruits.

Rich Hetherington 7 years, 3 months ago

In all fairness, we've been thinking that for a while now, yet Fred has has a knack for bringing in just a couple decent recruits and making them mesh with good transferees. Babb, White, Lucious, Kane, McKay, Nader, etc... when you're getting transfers who compete for you, you really don't have to rely on recruiting quite as much. But he did recruit Niang and Ejim and a few others, so I think he'll be fine.

Benz Junque 7 years, 3 months ago

A while now? He's only been there for 5 years and have only been decent competition for 2 years.

Joe Ross 7 years, 3 months ago

Benz...Ive made this point before. Things are ALWAYS changing...dont look at where they are now. look where they are going. if ISU ever topples Kansas for the regular season crown AND wins the tournament, recruits will notice. Its not as if they havent already.

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

JRoss, Is that a bad thing? I was starting to get worried that you didn't think that was a good thing. I agree with you about the rest of the league needing to elevate it's play. .

Honestly, I could give 2 sheets about #12. If the rest of the league was doing what they are suppose to be doing, KU IMO wouldnt be flaming out in the NCAA tourny in the second game of a weekend. It's a false sense of accomplishment and success IMO.

Benz Junque 7 years, 3 months ago

Oof. As I have pointed out on multiple occasions, Kansas has been conference champs in 13 of their 14 Final Four seasons. This whole notion that winning the conference leads to a false sense of how good they are and THAT is what causes them to lose early in the tourney is ridiculous. Having a team with a bunch of young guys and with notable holes and with key players suffering from injuries is what has caused it.

KU has a good balance of talent and experience with no significant holes in their roster for next year. If they can stay healthy they should be a good bet to do well in the tourney.

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

Which also brings up the ridiculous notion that you have to win it to make the final 4! Considering...Self has only made the final 4 2 out of those 11 years in winning the Big 12. I'm not saying don't win the conference but what I'm saying is I DONT CARE.

Coach K and Duke have made the final 4 plenty of times although to a lesser degree in a tougher league winning or not winning the conference title.

Considering that Kansas has won more conference titles than another school (one of the stats that Kansas atually leads) in the country...don't you think Kansas would have a few more Final 4's?

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

Brett, is Kansas a Blueblood or what? I hear what you are saying but those are excuses. What you're sayinf is that you're happy that Kansas is just part of the conversation. That Kansas plays in an inferior corn fed conference?

To some extent you are correct if that is your mindset or the way you view "Kansas". I Don't view it that way. I look at it as Kansas a has the best facilities, best fieldhouse, best training table, best wee eighth trainer, and best coaching staff in all of college basketball. There is reason He kansas doners and board of trustees poor millions of dollars into this program. Corn fed program? Have you seen the revenue and financials accoroding to Fobes? Quit acting like the big fish in a little pond. Kansas is a national program pouring in Top 3 numbers financially. Time to think Nationally instead of regionally and locally, Brett. Most Kansas fans forget that because they are to busy fighting and puffing their chest out over big 12 scraps.

Benz Junque 7 years, 3 months ago

We'd all love to make more Final Fours. We all think that Kansas probably "should" have made a few more of them. I am just sick of the silly notion that caring about winning the conference is somehow PREVENTING them from doing better in the tourney. It's the most ridiculous argument of all time. That's all.

Keith Gellar 7 years, 3 months ago

Don't really care about the big 12 tourney any more. Lets try to get past the 2nd round of hte NCAA tourney. just funny seeing how everyone gets all worked up about big 12 title and streak. how abt we start a FF streak..would love that.

Keith Gellar 7 years, 3 months ago

yes, because the ceiling for other schools in the conf is the big 12 championship.

Jonathan Allison 7 years, 3 months ago

seems to me that there Butler had themselves a FF streak of 2. Kentucky currently has a FF streak of 2. I consider two to be a streak, but maybe you consider no less than 3?

Keith Gellar 7 years, 3 months ago

for now, i'd just be happy with getting past the 2nd round, although we should have pretty good odds to make it to the FF this year.

Adam Tyler 7 years, 3 months ago

We won a game today.

If we win tomorrow, that's two in a row.

We win one more, that's a winning streak! It has happened before.

Name that movie!

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

Who cares about streaks? Set a standard. Go to 6 Final 4's in a 12 year period like Izzo and Michigan State. Go to 7 Final 4's and Win 2 National Titles in a 9 year period like Duke and Coach K. Go to back to back Final 4's and win the Title like Louisville and Rick Pitino. Go to 4 Final 4's in 5 years like Kentucky and Calipari. Go to 5 Final 4's, 3 national Title games and win a title in an 8 year period like Calipari did at Memphis and Kentucky.

Go to 2 Final 4's, win the title, and win 11 straight Big 12 titles in 12 years! Yay! Hip Hip Hooray! #blueblood

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

Pitno has done that twice at two different schools.

Benz Junque 7 years, 3 months ago

We get it. You think that Kansas should have done better in past tourneys. We all agree. There is no point continuing to rehash it. We all already agree with you. No one is saying that Kansas has the greatest tourney record in history so why are beating this dead horse?

However, you aren't going to convince anyone else to stop being excited about future seasons and the hope that they will end well. If you want to be negative about our chances then enjoy.

Scott Proch 7 years, 3 months ago

I particularly like the 26 straight NCAA appearances to go along with our Big12 streak! NOBODY is close to that one!

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

The only streak that matters is the 26. And when kansas breaks UNC's streak in a couple of seasons all anyone is gonna do is look back and scratch their head and see that KU under performed when it mattered most.

Tom Jones 7 years, 3 months ago

It's always easy to go the "self-pity" route, but here are the facts:

Kansas has 74 tournament wins with 8 Final Fours and 2 titles since the field expanded to 64 teams. They trail only Duke and UNC in the first two categories. UK eerily also has 74 wins and 8 FF's with 3 titles in that time span. Duke has 88 wins, 9 FF's and 5 titles and UNC has 76 wins, 9 FF's and 3 titles.

MSU has 53 wins, 7 FF's and one title, Louisville has 48 wins, 4 FF's and two titles and UConn has 54 wins, 5 FF's and an astonishing 4 titles. Florida has 42 wins, 5 FF's and two titles.

So, yes, even if you are of the unfortunate opinion that FF's and titles are all that matters, KU is top five, well ahead of everyone not named UK, UNC and Dook in wins and behind only UNC, Dook, UK and UConn in titles in the modern era.

If Embiid doesn't get hurt two years ago, KU likely wins several tourney games and your post doesn't exist. Regardless, there's not much of a case to be made for KU "under performing" during their incredible tourney streak. Winning the tournament is damn hard. Nobody but Dook and UConn have averaged more than one per decade in the modern era.

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

Let me know what period of "time" you want to handicap this discussion? Is it all time? Is it Modern Era? Is it Self Era? Is it the 26 year NCAA streak era? Let me know the time frame in which you would like to reference so we can keep the discussion consistent.

And...You forgot Florida above.

Note: I've tried to make my post not stick for several seasons now, but somehow it keeps just lingering around like a bunch of annoying gnats. I wish we could find that damn gnat repellant because I would love to get rid of them. #begonedamngnats

Tom Jones 7 years, 3 months ago

Sorry, that's correct about Duke. They have 12 FF's. And these stats are from when the tournament expanded to 64 teams in 1985.

And I did actually throw Florida in there.

Hey, KU should have another title...maybe two. They've had the horses. Most of the other blue bloods could say the same, though.

But the notion that they've not lived up to their blue blood status is false, IMHO.

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

That's the most frustrating part, Tom. I agree about another title or 2 and I understand the difficulties, but even without the titles...the missed opportunities with so many great teams just to get to the Final 4 is pretty annoying from my perspective.

I get it's difficult, but getting 1 and 2 seeds and missing out on opportunities drives me nuts. Seeing Duke win the 2010 NCAA Championship after the entire bracket opened up for them is aggravating as hell (Kudos to them for taking advantage of that).

On the flip side...seeing the bracket open up for Kansas in similar fashion in 2011 and see them flame out against VCU to get to a Final Four is double aggravating. Same can be said with the Michigan Loss in 2013 and then watching wolverines go all the way to the title game.

I just get tired of watching Kansas lose and pave the way for other schools to take advantage of that when the bracket opens in Kansas' absence. Michigan State has done it twice recently and gone on to win the region when Kansas has lost early.

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

Not that it matters since I'm not sure why we are discussing the "Modern era", but Duke has 12 final 4's and not 9. Again, not that it matters because it's not pertinent to the discussion, but just wanted it noted.

Andrew Holmes 7 years, 3 months ago

Yes KU may stack up, but I think where people will start looking is at 2009 when KU lost to UNI and then in 2011 when the tournament was blown wide open for KU. Though I agree with your assessment of KU's success compared to other top programs, has any of those programs been knocked out of the tournament prematurely when they should have been winning? Just curious as I don't know the answer and am too lazy to really look it up my self.

Chris Shaw 7 years, 3 months ago

Yes Andrew....all the major programs have been knocked out early. It happens to all the great programs. But the difference between Kansas and the other great programs is that they don't take advantage when the "Timing" is right for them to take advantage.

Bill Self really had a great opportunity to do something unheard of (coach K level and most recently Calipari) from 2007-2013...but the uni, vcu, and Michigan games sting like no other when you put them next to the elite 8 loss to UCLA in 2007, the 2008 championship and the 2012 title game loss.

Still a really really good run but it could have been historical and memorable.

Tom Jones 7 years, 3 months ago

All of them. MSU's really the only one of those programs without at least a couple really embarassing early round losses.

Waylon Cook 7 years, 3 months ago

My god the love affair this paper has with Hoiberg is creepy.

Aaron Paisley 7 years, 3 months ago

Curious how nobody is mentioning another Big 12 program that most consider to also be a preseason top 10 team as a threat to win the Big 12 title next season. Oklahoma only lost two players from their rotation and will have the most quality and depth in the back court of anybody in the Big 12 next season. OU may not win the title next year, but to not even include a team that finished tied for second last year and is returning the defending Big 12 POY while also not suffering heavy casualties in the discussion as a Big 12 challenger is just naive considering Lon Kruger's track record in college basketball.

Brian Wilson 7 years, 3 months ago

News Alert: LaGerard Vick

has been given an offer letter for next year. LaGerard Vick is a #6'5" SG from
Memphis Tennesee. He is a 3/4 star unranked SG.
This may indicate that we are not expecting to sign Mack. LaGerard decommitted from SMU. So Larry may of recommended him our way. Who knows. But his tape can been seen on 247 and I would have to say he is underrated as UK apparently is going to offer as well now:
http://kentucky.247sports.com/Bolt/WATCH-LaGerald-Vick-at-Under-Armour-37144400

Jay Scott 7 years, 3 months ago

Nobody cared the first time you posted this.

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