Realignment Today: 10:22 p.m. - Big 12 sources: Pac-12 not expanding; Pac-12 releases statement confirming news


10:22 p.m. Update:

Here's the full statement from the Pac-12:

WALNUT CREEK, Calif. — In light of the widespread speculation about potential scenarios for Conference re-alignment, the Pac-12 Presidents and Chancellors have affirmed their decision to remain a 12-team conference. Pac-12 Commissioner Larry Scott said, “after careful review we have determined that it is in the best interests of our member institutions, student-athletes and fans to remain a 12-team conference. While we have great respect for all of the institutions that have contacted us, and certain expansion proposals were financially attractive, we have a strong conference structure and culture of equality that we are committed to preserve. With new landmark TV agreements and plans to launch our innovative television networks, we are going to focus solely on these great assets, our strong heritage and the bright future in front of us.”

Stay tuned...

10:16 p.m. Update:

Just got off the phones and multiple Big 12 officials have confirmed that the Pac-12 has expressed its desire to stay put at 12 teams and not expand at this time.

Pretty logical conclusion based on all of the Oklahoma news today, but interesting to hear it confirmed.

Pac-12 commissioner Larry Scott also just released a statement saying, "We have determined that it is in the best interests of our member institutions ... to remain a 12-team conference."

Tomorrow could be all about putting the pieces back together for the Big 12.

Stay tuned...

9:58 p.m. Update:

Wild day winding down. Finally able to make sense of all that went down. OK, I'm lying, but it's at least straight in my head... for now.

I'll keep an eye on things for a while longer but in case nothing new pops, I'll leave you with an updated look at the percentage wheel... everyone's favorite!!!

  1. Big 12 - 44%
  2. Leftovers - 19%
  3. Big Ten - 16%
  4. ACC - 12%
  5. Other - 5%
  6. Pac-12 - 4%

Stay tuned...

9:27 p.m. Update:

Spent the past few hours trying to get a solid read on OU's move here. Are they legitimately trying to help save the conference or simply biding time until they can bolt?

Tough call. And I gotta tell ya, I've talked to plenty of people on both sides of this thing.

Here are the prevailing thoughts:

• OU's in as long as Texas makes some concessions and Beebe's out.

• OU's in but only because they can't get BOTH OU and OSU into the Pac-12.

• OU's doing this as a way to show they tried but hoping that Texas says no to the demands so they can bolt and say it was all UT's fault.

• OU's Pac-12 all the way and is trying to power play Texas into doing something. These two are divorced and it's uglier than ever.

Any of these could be true. I'm still leaning toward OU's interest in saving the Big 12 being legit right now. Why else would they go through all this if they're going to leave anyway?

Meanwhile, Missouri reportedly has lined up a sweet deal with the SEC that says if the Big 12 blows up, they'll head south. At the same time, plenty of Big 12 sources are saying that MU chancellor Brady Deaton is working his butt off to save the Big 12. I'm buying it.

According to those I've talked to, Deaton is a stand-up guy who is fulfilling his obligations to the Big 12 as the chairman of the board of the directors. At the same time, he cannot — and should not be expected to — control what OU or Texas are saying, doing or even thinking. That's when his obligation to Mizzou kicks in.

Right now, he's played this thing about as well as it could be played. If the Big 12 lives, he plays a huge role and is praised for it. If it dies, it's someone else's fault and he's a genius for setting up a nice landing spot for Mizzou. The guy deserves a raise.

Before you go off on how this is exactly what KU's leaders should be doing, you have to remember something.... Missouri had these options and that gave Mizzou this leverage. Kansas has not and does not.

Deaton and OU president David Boren are supposed to meet later this week and OU officials have said they should have their decision by the end of the week.

God willing, that'll be true.

Stay tuned...

5:36 p.m. Update:

Welcome to Believe It Or Not. Some of you may have been playing the game for a few days now, but we've reached the lightning round. Every report that pops up seems to support or refute one that came before it and it's your job to guess which one is right.

Answer correctly and you win absolutely nothing. But guess wrong and you'll be condemned to a lifetime of ridicule from your buddies.

Here's the latest round, that says plans are in place to have Missouri move to the SEC.

Game on.

Stay tuned...

4:01 p.m. Update:

From A Hail Mary attempt to save the Big 12 is being led by Mizzou chancellor Brady Deaton.

According to the article, a high-placed Big 12 administrator said Deaton, the head of the Big 12's five-member expansion committee, is trying to get everyone back to the table to try to see if the Big 12 can work out its differences.

The article also says: A high-ranking official at a Big 12 school said, "The Big 12 is going to stay intact except for Texas A&M."

Here's the link:

Right now, this is being dubbed as the Big 12's Hail Mary or its last gasp.

Stay tuned...

3:53 p.m. Update:

Another thought.... The mere fact that OU is even making these demands could mean that the Pac-12 has said thanks but no thanks to expanding. If that's the case, the Big 12 needs to move fast here and bring everybody together before the Pac-12 news is leaked.

Once that's leaked, which, if true, it will be, the power shifts back to Texas, which would likely try to make OU pay for trying to pull a fast one.

At this point, it doesn't matter how we get there but if the Big 12 is going to live and things are going to be better/more equal/less top heavy in the upcoming incarnation, it's key that every school involved swallows its pride and does whatever it takes to get to that end.

If not, we could find ourselves back to square one and the Big 12 may die anyway. The worst part about that? This whole thing would just drag on even longer.

Stay tuned...

3:39 p.m. Update:

Quick info about OU's request to have Big 12 commissioner Dan Beebe removed and replaced with an interim commissioner.

In order for that to happen, Beebe would have to be fired by the Big 12 Board of Directors, which is made up of the presidents/chancellors at each conference institution. Currently, MU's Brady Deaton is the chairman of the board and KU chancellor Bernadette Gray-Little serves as KU's representative.

No official word on how many votes it would take for such a motion to pass. Most likely 7, though it could be as few as six, provided Texas A&M is not included in the vote.

Still a long way to go before any of this matters. Just thought you'd like to know.

Be aware, though... one source not associated with the Big 12 in any way told me that OU's demands were insane and would never be met because of the message that would send to a league that has complained about Texas getting preferential treatment all along.

Not sure that's entirely true since, once the demands would be met, everything else would go more toward being equal. But the point's still worth considering.

Stay tuned...

3:13 p.m. Update:

According to Berry Tramel, of The Oklahoman, OU has said publicly that it would consider staying in the Big 12 if and only if the conference removes Dan Beebe as its commissioner.

Here's the link:

My take: No way do the Sooners say this without being willing to stay if it in fact happens. My second take: Beebe will be given his walking papers quickly. It's all about survival right now.

Make sure you read the story... Some incredible stuff in there, not only about this year but also about last year's realignment mess.

I'm not saying the Big 12 should bow down to all of OU's demands, but the ones that are most reasonable — equal revenue sharing, new commissioner, revised Longhorn Network — should be agreed to without hesitation.

Texas has a lot of power and a lot invested in Beebe, but at this point I gotta think UT is more interested in saving the conference than saving Beebe.

Stay tuned...

2:33 p.m. Update:

According to Tweets from Clay Travis, who covers Tennessee, "SEC now denies it has given Missouri an offer to join SEC. League not happy about this story going public."

Another from Travis: "SEC wants to wait for Big 12 to implode before pursuing Missouri. Not happy with leak."

And another: "Missouri spoke out of turn. With legal issues, SEC likely furious."

Travis' Twitter feed:!/ClayTravisBGID

2:16 p.m. Update:

According to Chuck Carlton, of The Dallas Morning News, a Texas A&M responded to Oklahoma State alum T. Boone Pickens' comments about the Aggies "sobering up" and considering not leaving the Big 12.

The response: "Texas A&M has made our intentions perfectly clear. We do not intend to be a member of the Big 12 past this season"

Can't say it any clearer than that. Good. Now we can get back to the business of sorting out the other 47 schools who hang in the balance here.

Stay tuned...

1:39 p.m. Update:

Here's the other thing to remember about Mizzou's pause regarding the SEC offer, if it is, in fact, on the table.

If the Tigers go now, they open themselves up to lawsuits and exit penalties. If they wait for the Big 12 to implode, they ride off into the sunset unscathed.

Not saying that's what's going on... Remember, multiple people within the conference that I've talked to have said that MU is all-in on keeping Big 12 alive.

Just trying to show both side here. After all, an actual offer from the SEC changes things quite a bit. Easy to be loyal to Big 12 when you don't have other concrete options. Now, though.... New ballgame.

Stay tuned...

1:12 p.m. Update:

A couple of potentially major developments here in the last few minutes.

The first, a Tweet from Mike DeArmond of the Kansas City Star, who said he was working on a story about Missouri having an offer from the SEC but that the SEC was wanting to wait until the Big 12 dissolved.

Speaking of that... Berry Tramel, of The Oklahoman, writes that T. Boone Pickens says the Big 12 is not dead and that, believe it or not, Texas A&M may be "sobering up."\

It's important to note the language of the Mizzou to the SEC story... It's my belief that the Tigers asked the SEC to wait on the outcome of the Big 12 here, not the other way around. If Mizzou wanted to bolt, they would've jumped at this opportunity and probably announced the move tomorrow.

But, as I've been told all along, the Tigers want the Big 12 to live on, and with reports starting to surface that point toward that end, it's very possible that Mizzou may tell the SEC thanks but no thanks, especially if OU and Texas return to the Big 12.

Long way to go before we get to that point, but multiple sources have told me that they've been impressed by the loyalty and dedication to the Big 12 that both MU AD Mike Alden and MU chancellor Brady Deaton have shown throughout the past couple of months.

Wild turn of events, to be sure. But, when you think about it, it's pretty much par for the course with the Big 12.

Stay tuned...

12:04 p.m. Update:

Getting back on track, this report indicates that talks of a Big 12/Big East merger are heating up and that, if such a scenario were to unfold, it would take place by way of the Big 12 absorbing the Big East's remaining football schools, not the other way around.

Such a move would keep a major conference in the middle of the country, though there remain questions about how major it would be if it did not include Texas, Oklahoma and Oklahoma State. Also in question is the potential league's BCS status.

I know this is not the dream scenario for Kansas fans but you can bet they haven't fleshed this thing out yet. If this is the direction they have to go, the powers that be will do everything they can to make it as attractive as possible in both football and basketball.

One thing to consider is that, with this talk ongoing, it simply increases the odds of the Big 12 still looking at expansion even if Texas and Oklahoma decide to say.

Like we've said all along, lots of movement here... Way too tough to pin anything down right this moment. Bottom line still in play: Waiting on a move by OU.

Stay tuned...

11:49 a.m. Update:

Here's a scenario that hasn't been talked about much... Longshot, to be sure, but, again, I'm being told that everything remains on the table for Kansas.

Here goes:

If OU and OSU leave for the Pac-12 and UConn and Rutgers go to the ACC, don't underestimate the idea of Missouri, Kansas and Texas joining the SEC...

We all know that Missouri has long been targeted by the SEC as a 14th school. With the news surfacing that West Virginia has been denied by the SEC, it's likely that Mizzou now sits at the top of the SEC's list.

If the goal is to get to 16 and the Big 12 loses OU, OSU and Mizzou, the SEC could do much worse than to bring along Kansas (MU's natural rival and the KC market) and Texas from the Big 12, therein saving those two from having to join the Big East/Big 12 leftovers and picking up a couple of major national brands in UT football and Kansas basketball.

I've said all along that I believe that KU will end up where Texas ends up... this falls in line with that and also keeps the KU/MU rivalry alive.

Texas A&M might not like this much. And I'm sure Texas Tech would throw a fit, too. But isn't that going to happen anyway? Besides, what kind of leverage does either one of those schools have at this point?

I think Kansas could do worse. And I'm not sure the SEC could do much better.

Stay tuned...

11:37 a.m. Update:

Brett McMurphy of CBS Sports is reporting that multiple Big East sources have told him that West Virginia applied for entry into the ACC and SEC and was denied by both.

No word on why just yet. Maybe they don't fit the cultural or academic profile. Maybe those conferences are done with expansion. Maybe those conferences already have deals in place with other schools.

Right now, just about any conclusion seems logical.

Here's what it all means for KU.

My first read is that this could be huge news for the Big 12. With UT and OU wavering, the possibility of expanding the Big 12 with a school like West Virginia has to look more attractive than the idea of adding SMU or even BYU to the fold.

That said, the fact that the SEC denied WVU could mean that they're eyeing and talking with Missouri for their 14th spot. Sources continue to tell me that Missouri is all-in on the idea of the Big 12 surviving, but could you blame them if they were playing both sides of the fence here just to be sure.

One last read I have on this has to do with that whole Texas and Kansas to the ACC thing. While the ACC moved fast in adding Syracuse and Pitt, they've hit the brakes hard since then and are likely lining up to get the best 15th and 16th teams they can. Reports have indicated that UT and Notre Dame would be dream additions for the ACC. But a source told me that if Notre Dame's not interested Kansas has as good a shot as anybody, so long as that's where Texas goes.

If your head wasn't spinning before, it should be now.

One last thing... I posted this link from The Oklahoman's Berry Tramel the other day. Here it is again since the West Virginia to the Big 12 movement could kick back up again.

Stay tuned...

10:26 a.m. Update:

"rob4lb" posted this link in the comments below and I think it's worth looking at. Nothing directly related to realignment here, but it does show, yet again, just how strong KU's brand is at least in terms of apparel and how they relate to other schools already taken care of in this realignment mess. I'm sure this just makes everything even more confusing for KU fans, but it's worth a look.

Good find, rob4lb...

10:19 a.m. Update:

Minor detail here, but I find it interesting nonetheless.

According to a report from Idaho, the Mountain West conference has contacted TCU — which is set to join the Big East in 2012 — about the idea of staying in the league or possibly rejoining.

There's also some good stuff in here about Boise State, which, according to the report, has not been contacted by any other conference as of yet. No surprise there, but with this thing being all about football, I can see why the question was asked.

I know we're dealing with the big conferences and waiting to see where KU fits into one of those, but all of this movement by the so-called lesser conferences and smaller schools is definitely worth noting. Is it possible that these guys make moves quickly to secure their own futures and, in doing so, make life even more difficult for those schools — think Big East and Big 12 — who get left out of the super conferences?

Scary thought. Definitely possible. That said, I don't think this should worry Kansas.

8:51 a.m. Update:

Chip Brown's latest report from indicates that Texas will make a decision within the next two weeks and that the reason the Longhorns will wait has to do with them wanting to see if OU/OSU can get into the Pac-12 without them.

If they can't, Texas would have a lot more leverage to entice the OU schools to return to the Big 12. If they can, Texas could potentially go with them.

There's also talk that Texas and Kansas moving to the ACC is still being kicked around.

Stay tuned...

8:33 a.m. Update:

This could all change by the time some of you wake up and read it. Then again, it could all be right on the money and I could look like a genius.

We’re at that point with conference realignment, and, although it’s now dragging into it’s third week of DEFCON 3 status, there’s something a little comforting about it all.

Despite what some of my Twitter followers have requested, I’m not the kind of guy who throws stuff out there just to sound like I know something. I’d rather speak from a position of knowledge and lay my head down at night knowing that everything I wrote had a reason to be written and had some truth behind it. Right or wrong.

That’s become difficult with this round of realignment. Not because my beliefs have changed — and not because I haven’t been getting a ton of sleep — but because everything else has changed all of the time.

Consider this. Last Saturday morning, a source told me, before it was widely known, that Pittsburgh and Syracuse were ACC-bound and that the move would be announced Sunday. I posted it on our web site. It turned out to be dead on. And that got the juices flowing.

During the same conversation, the source said the ACC had targeted Texas and Kansas as the 15th and 16th schools. Naturally, by mid-day, since the first part of the equation turned out to be true, I thought I was sitting on the scoop of the century and proceeded accordingly, trying to verify, confirm or at least get another sniff from another source that the Jayhawks and Longhorns were headed off to join the Tar Heels and Blue Devils. Never happened.

By Saturday night, no more than 12-14 hours after the original conversation, the ACC talk had cooled considerably and, the next day, a different source told me not to stick my neck out on that one. Whoa! Bummer.

So what changed? Well... In short, everything. Maybe Texas was bluffing. Maybe the ACC never was interested. Maybe the ACC was interested in Texas but not Kansas. Maybe Kansas and Texas were ready to move together but the ACC wasn’t quite ready to make another major move and, while waiting, one or all of the parties involved got cold feet. Or maybe it just wasn’t true from the beginning. Any or all of those could have been accurate. And, right now, anything short of talking to the Big 12 presidents themselves seems less than likely to yield much information. There are just too many pieces involved in this deal, some that fit and some that don’t.

“If the ACC was talking about those two (KU and Texas) they were talking about five other scenarios also,” a source told me when asked if there was ever anything to the KU and UT to the ACC rumors.

Great. Clear as mud. Yet, somehow, it really was. In this whole convoluted wreck of a power struggle, the only thing that’s clear is that nothing makes sense. At least not for very long.

So maybe that’s how we should start operating. Reports surfaced Monday night that said Notre Dame, everyone’s prized gem, should make a move to the ACC right away. What? That goes against everything we’ve ever known about Notre Dame’s position in all this. The only thing crazier right now would be if someone said Notre Dame was joining the Big 12. Wait a minute...

“The entire landscape of college athletics could change this week,” a source said Monday at the risk of stating the obvious. “Or it could just stay put. It’s that fluid.”

So we’re forced to wait, specifically for OU and Texas and generally for God knows what else. Those of us trying to follow this thing will make calls, fire off emails and at least be comforted by the few answers we do get. I gotta be honest, even a “No way, you’re crazy,” seems like good information these days.

Monday was a big day for Kansas. It started out bleak, stayed that way until the afternoon and then started to turn oh so slightly once OU and UT wrapped up their board of regents meetings without making a devastating announcement that, without question, could’ve buried the Big 12.

From what people are telling me, everything’s back on the table again. The Big 12, Big Ten, ACC and Pac-12 all remain options for Kansas, as does the less glamorous idea of the Big 12 and Big East leftovers combining forces to form a decent-but-not-dynamic conference out of the ashes.

Here we go with another day. I’m ready if you are.

Let’s kick today off with an updated percentage wheel and a couple of links from late Monday night.

  1. Big 12 - 33%
  2. Leftovers - 23%
  3. Big Ten - 20%
  4. ACC - 12%
  5. Pac-12 - 9%
  6. Other - 3%

Here are a couple of links that address the Notre Dame to the ACC talk... Oh, you thought I was just kidding about that? Take a look.

And, last but not least for our first post of the day, let’s get back to the good stuff from the SportsBizMiss, Kristi Dosh, whose fun perspective in all of this has been refreshing. There’s some good stuff about Kansas in the intro, toward the bottom. It’s just her opinion on what should and might happen, but, hey, she’s talking to people and, as I’ve pointed out, with this story, you never know who’s going to wind up being right.

I’m sure some news will surface soon, good, bad, real or indifferent. This should get you through until it does.

Stay tuned...


The_Original_Bob 11 years, 2 months ago

"Despite what some of my Twitter followers have requested, I’m not the kind of guy who throws stuff out there just to sound like I know something."

/cough ahem Chip cough Brown ahem.

Matt Tait 11 years, 2 months ago

Wasn't meant to be a shot at anyone... Just full disclosure. Enjoy the blog.

KU_alum_2001 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, this is the only reason that I got a bit offensive (with all due respect and apologies) when you posted that random Tweet from the BYU fan. Unlike all your other stuff that has had some relevant and material backing to it (article, blog, interview, etc), that one had zero merit. That's why I was a bit aggressive that day. We all enjoy your updates but in that one case, posting some random Tweet from an unknown source just seemed rather irrelevant.

Hank Cross 11 years, 2 months ago

Baghdad Bob Chip Brown only puts out the information/disinformation that Dodds tells him to put out. He's not a journalist, he's Bevo's unofficial spokesman.

Spencer Goff 11 years, 2 months ago

Yep, alongside "Thunder" Dan Beebe.

It pleases me that at least one of these guys won't have their high paying job soon.

Ben Kane 11 years, 2 months ago


when do you expect a decision by OU? tomorrow? next day? two weeks from now?

Matt Tait 11 years, 2 months ago

The original mess started on Sept. 2 when OU's David Boren came out and said the Sooners were exploring their options.

That same night, Boren said he didn't foresee things dragging out for more than three weeks.

So it's possible that OU's decision could come by the end of the week. Especially now that Boren has been authorized to act on OU's behalf in any realignment.

That said, counting on them to decide in the next few days could be hazardous to your health.

ahpersecoachingexperience 11 years, 2 months ago

Can you imagine if we had hired a big time football coach and decent ad when we had the chance! We all would be sleeping a little better.

Jabberhawky 11 years, 2 months ago

How so given that neither football coaches or ADs have any control over or input into these decisions -- which are being made at the very highest levels by Chancellors and Boards of Regents?

Mandie Eutsler 11 years, 2 months ago

It would help if we didn't completely suck at football right now. We have 3 things on our side. 1. academics, one of the top med school programs in the country 2. Basketball, who wouldn't want to watch Bill Self and Roy Williams try to outcoach each other on Big Monday? 3. Money, the Jayhawk is the 2nd most recognizable logo in college sports because we sell a lot of gear and there are KU fans across the country.

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

I don't know where you came up with 2nd most recognizable logo. I gear sales, we are 21st, which isn't bad. See list in this link.

Mandie Eutsler 11 years, 2 months ago

I didn't say in sales, I said recognized. But coming in 21st isn't bad when considering that's out of 120 FBS schools. My point is that while this conference alignment fiasco is about football, it's also about money and we can compete.

Mandie Eutsler 11 years, 2 months ago

...and it helps that everyone knows who we are...

Page Butler 11 years, 2 months ago

Nobody likes what you have to say ever. You should just leave your negative thoughts to yourself and go find another message board to haunt.

westlaw 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, what about Mr. McKechnie quote saying that he wants KU and KSU staying together? Does that statement cool our chances of trying to get into other conferences?

Matt Tait 11 years, 2 months ago

I don't believe so. I don't think other conferences are paying attention to what regents are saying at Kansas.... at least not at this point.

There's a reason that the OU and UT regents are getting so much attention. All that matters with regard to KU is what the people negotiating on KU's behalf are saying behind closed doors.

At least that's my read. Could be right. Could change. We'll see...

GabrielMichael 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, Thank you so much for your regular updates! I am praying that things end well for us jayhawks but have been completely entertained by your posts on the soap opera (or is it a sitcom?) that has become our conference!

Matt Tait 11 years, 2 months ago

Good to know. Thanks. Entertaining it is!!!!

Marcia Parsons 11 years, 2 months ago

Except that I'm getting to the place where I'm nervous about reading the updates for fear something awful is going to be there.

rhollinshed 11 years, 2 months ago

This is the worst soap opera in the world. ABC should've replaced "All My Children" with conference realigment. Maybe ESPN can market it and sell that too?

buckleyhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

I'm so over all of this, yet this is one of the first things I do in the morning. Soap opera for men...

Tait, what's your word count up to in the last 2 weeks? When this is all said and done, my guess is you will have doubled your "production" for the year. And pretty much every word has been relevant to this mess. Crazy...

kureader 11 years, 2 months ago

Agreed ...

Maybe we should all sign a "Raise For Tait Petition" and send it to the LJW.

lothario64118 11 years, 2 months ago

I don't think OU/OSU would have trouble getting into the PAC 12. Nice ego UT.

texashawk10 11 years, 2 months ago

I believe Matt said yesterday it would take 9 out of 12 votes to get in and I believe Colorado is against any expansion to 16 because they lose their guaranteed game in SoCal every year, I would imagine Utah would feel the same way but I don't know if they would vote against expansion yet. The Arizona schools also don't want to lose SoCal games either so if they were to get stuck not playing USC and UCLA every year they would be "no" votes as well. I would be surprised if Cal or Stanford approved OSU or Tech because of academics. OU might not be able get a "yes" vote out of Cal or Stanford either.

Sam Constance 11 years, 2 months ago

Neither are an appropriate fit from a culture or academics standpoint.

Literally, football is the only way it makes sense, and even that is somewhat of a stretch.

Word is that the Pac 12 presidents aren't wild about adding any of the Big 12 schools...

sm5561 11 years, 2 months ago

This article [1] that Matt posted last night got me thinking. It talks about Big 12 /Big East leftovers merger and also MWC/C-USA merger. Everyone's talking about 4 super conferences, but with the threat of anti-trust litigation those two little conferences could be included in the BCS/Playoff/etc. I hope we go to the B1G, but lets face, we're never going to win that league. If winning the leftover league gets you onto the national stage then that might not be so bad.

Of course, I'd rather be in one of the big four conferences. Just trying to stay positive!


mdfraz 11 years, 2 months ago

You don't improve a program long term by playing weaker competition. Does anyone give two craps about who wins the Sun Belt? The WAC? Conference USA? The answer is no, and we would be on par with CUSA and the MAC if we end up in the leftovers conference. Winning that conference means nothing. Nobody really even cared about Boise dominating their conference(s) until they started beating big name schools in bowl games.

While it wouldn't help us to be doormats in a major conference, it would help us less to be competitive/win a league that is a mid-major, IMHO.

sm5561 11 years, 2 months ago

Again, not my 1st, 2nd, 3rd or 4th choice. But if it's where we land then I will give two craps about who wins that conference.

mdfraz 11 years, 2 months ago

Of course WE would give two craps. We give two craps about what happens to KU right now, but that doesn't matter much in the big scheme of things. I realize you're not saying that conference would be all that good for us, and I also realize you're trying to look on the bright side, but I just don't see how there could be a positive spin for us ending up in the leftovers conference. Well, maybe if we did achieve some success in football there we could parlay it into an invite to a better conference, but if we end up with superconferences right now, I doubt there would be room for us later if we don't snag a good spot in this round. Sorry to rain on your attempt at a parade.... :(

sm5561 11 years, 2 months ago

I see your points. It's tough to find positives in the football leftovers conference but I'm trying.

I still think that's a pretty good basketball conference if you include some of the non-football big east schools though.

TXBBall55 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, what would be involved with KU forming its own KU BOR? The states of Texas and Oklahoma have it right!

ashmole 11 years, 2 months ago

Last Saturday morning, a source told me, before it was widely known, that Pittsburgh and Syracuse were ACC-bound and that the move would be announced Sunday.

That source seems to have been the New York Times, which ran the story online Saturday morning.

Matt Tait 11 years, 2 months ago

Nah... I don't use other papers as sources. Besides, the original Times article, which I referenced, said only that Syracuse and Pitt were conducting talks with the ACC and nothing about the Sunday announcement.

Brett McMurphy of CBS Sports actually broke the story that day about Syracuse and Pitt applying to the ACC. Lots of good people working on this deal. I'm just trying to be one of them.

Ben Kane 11 years, 2 months ago

on the bright side, you'll probably end up with a cushy job offer after the dust settles :P

KU_Dude 11 years, 2 months ago

Let's just be an independent. Who needs a conference anyway?

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

We do. You seriously overestimate KU's value. We couldn't afford the revenue cut by going independent.

Dan Edwards 11 years, 2 months ago

Good reflection, Tait. I must admit getting caught up in all the rumors and whisperings is hard to resist. Hell, it's like crack.

However, my gut tells me that schools and conferences are using you guys (the press) to bluff and gain leverage. The same thing happens in our national politics (another corrupt system ruined by big money). The power of the press is not lost on anyone in the know... so there's zero doubt in my mind that schools/conferences "leak" BS to reporters with ulterior motives in mind.

So at this point I'm taking everything with a grain of salt. None of us here are involved in the decision-making process--we're spectators at best. So I am resigned at this point to whatever happens. I'm sure we will make the best of it. And who knows, maybe all the dominoes will take a couple of years to fall into place (cough cough B1G cough). Despite our crappy "TV market" KU has a lot of prestige and academic rigor (and the research dollars that go along with it) so I have to believe in the end conferences will realize we're an attractive add (or perhaps they already do). Either way, the decision isn't my call, so I'm going to try not to worry about it (operative word:try).

Rock Chalk!

Matt Tait 11 years, 2 months ago

I think you're right. No question that some of these administrators have leaked information to boost their school's position or alter the path things may be taking...

Par for the course. Hang in there.

FLJHK 11 years, 2 months ago

I haven't had this much fun since the VCU game.

Mandie Eutsler 11 years, 2 months ago

I'm disappointed about this whole conference nonsense. They are going to end rivalries that have lasted over 100 years. So, everyone in the SEC gets to keep their biggest game of the season and have the prime time College Gameday? What about the fka Big 12 schools? What about the loyal fans who thrive on those rivalries? None of these people making decisions are thinking about the people who travel with their team to away games, and there are many. Now a 2 day trip for away game turns into 4 days. How much class are these kids skipping now? It's ridiculous that they are supposed to be getting an education, and they spend less and less time at school. Thank you BCS for ruining college sports. It's supposed to be about playing your rivals, schools that are close to your school. Students taking buses to Manhattan to watch the Hawks. It was a way to attract KIDS to come to your school. Show them how much fun it is when K-State or Mizzou comes to town. They are losing the traditions and it sucks.....

William Daniels 11 years, 2 months ago

At this point I really don't care if the Big 12 can survive. The damage has been done. We lost three good schools. I don't care if there is equal revenue sharing at this point: things will never be equal. Assuming the conference survives, it will be OU, TU, and the tag-alongs. That is not a good position for KU to be in. KU needs to realize that there is no way to repair the damage and quit trying to save the Big 12. While OU and TU are dithering and playing chicken with each other, we are looking like helpless victims. If we left now, we could put an end to this conference, and raise our stature nationally in a demonstration of power. That would have untold and long lasting benefits. Everyone talks about this being about football and to a lesser extent basketball, and I think that is a big part, but remember the negotiations are being made by Presidents and Chancellors, not ADs. Therefore, the academic side of the equation is playing a much more powerful role. One of BGL's main goals is to strengthen KU's academic position. Joining PAC, ACC, or B1G would go a long way in elevating KU's academic stature. We have an opportunity to secure KU for the long haul in academics and athletics. Let's do this. And for those who say that KU can't play that card? I disagree, I think KU has enough to convince a conference to take them. But for you doubters let me give you something to ponder....assuming KU cannot make such a bold move because it just doesn't have enough, a conference who feels taking KU will end the Big 12 and is in a good position to get the best pieces, may just take KU first.

Eric Dawson 11 years, 2 months ago

[I posted this earlier today in the KUSports "Exit Strategy" article comments. For your consideration if you haven't read it there already...]

Observations on three points from this turn of events that bode well for the existence of a continued, expanded Big 12 with an equal partnership model -- and both Texas and Oklahoma on board for the long haul.

  1. Because of the Longhorn Network, other conferences have rebuffed Texas. For all of them to date (even in reports from the Pac12 -- west coast reports, not Austin reports), it's been equal revenue sharing or "thanks for dropping by, but we're really not interested." This has left Texas spinning in the wind, to its great embarrassment. To quote Jon Wilner of the San Jose Mercury News: "there is no chance that any school will have more than 1/16th of the revenue, whether it comes from the conference’s first, second or third-tier rights. no chance... They [the Pac12 CEOs] have all the leverage." That leaves staying with the Big 12 the best option all around for all concerned, even Texas.

  2. Boren's comment that OU wants to be in a conference where its all for one and one for all on equal footing has just ratcheted up the pressure on Texas to put up or shut up on how Texas actually prefers staying in the Big 12. The conferences that have equality models are stable, growing and thriving. Too bad OU didn't do this years ago, when apparently any votes to change the conference model went 8-4 instead of the needed 9-3, and the 4 were always Texas, Nebraska, A&M and -- yep, OU.

  3. Texas BOR: Powers doesn't need their okay to stay Big 12, does to leave. That tells the world that the BOR would prefer to stay with the Big 12, and that any deals Powers works out to leave must get their okay. Note well these words, people: "After the vote, Powers said only that the process is “ongoing” and left without further comment." Boren comes out from his meeting shooting, and the big gunslinger from Texas comes out essentially "no comment". That tells me that Powers heard some harsh sub rosa words from his BOR.

So now Texas needs to weigh the pros and cons of: Sharing equally in the Pac1# (or any other conference) versus Sharing equally in a rebuilt Big 12.

Any logical analysis would favor sharing equally in what currently is considered -- on the field -- perhaps the best college football conference in the country.

But up until now, logic hasn't played a big part in all this. It's been blinded by greed. It's been madness.

Ron Prichard 11 years, 2 months ago

Good post. The only thing that scares me is if Texas waits everything out like some reports seem to suggest. If Texas truly does wait to see if OU gets into the PAC and OU does not, for whatever reason, then OU has lost it's leverage and Texas is back in the drivers seat. There wouldn't be much incentive for them to compromise. About the only remaining leverage would be the possibility of future instability (I can't imagine going through all this next year again) if they don't agree to equal revenue sharing.

The downside to Texas trying to call OU's bluff is if OU is really accepted to the PAC. Then Texas is left by itself and probably tries to go to the PAC as well, but would be left with very little leverage.

Sadly, I think this all comes down to a huge game of chicken between Texas and OU as to whether or not the Big XII survives. Personally, I am rooting for OU to win and stay with equal revenue sharing as that is the only way this conference survives long term.

142466 11 years, 2 months ago

I agree that the probability of Texas waiting on OU to officially go to the PAC before Texas goes anywhere is significant, maybe 33%.

If that happens, I think it increases our chances of entering the PAC. Because Texas would have less leverage with the PAC; Texas would not be bringing OU with them. So at that point, the PAC (if they so desired) could tell Texas, " No. We will not accept TTech. We want KU".

TKHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

So just to summarize where we are at right now, and believe me I am trying to stay positive and deeply believe our AD and President are doing everything in their power to do what's right for the University of Kansas, but let's face reality:

Texas and OU are in a peeing contest. Texas is waiting to see if the Oklahomas can get into the PAC without them. If they cannot, Texas will welcome them back with open arms, and a position of power, and how "stable" does that make our conference? If the Oklahoma's are excepted, then Texas has to decide, just as the song says, "should I stay or should I go?". This leaves KU,KSU,MU,ISU and Baylor (I omit TT b/c they align themselves with Texas) in a wait and see mode, with our fall back option being a possible merger with what currently remains of the Big East. However that plan even has a potentially bigger hole in it when one considers while we wait and watch Texas wait for OU, the SEC and ACC may be eyeing WV, UConn, and Rutgers, futher picking apart our "fall back option". Wow, what a great position we are in! I realize there is not much we can do, it is what it is. Its not like KU can just independentyl give up on the Big 12 now and petition the ACC for membership, but I just wanted to summarize where we are at right now, given that our fall back option is sinking by the day and in the mean time the best we can get is that Texas will make a decision in the next 2 weeks.

This whole thing is embarrassing for college sports and unfair to college athletes.

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

If somehow the ACC convinces Notre Dame to join the conference, I could see Texas coming with them.

jgkojak 11 years, 2 months ago

Not sure what people don't get about Boise State.

15 years ago they were a JUNIOR COLLEGE. It would be like Johnson Co. Community College (which probably has higher academic standards than Boise State!) declare themselves a 4 year school, and suddenly became a football power. You wouldn't be letting them into the Big 12.

And when their current coach goes some day, they will slip back into mediocrity or worse.

jgkojak 11 years, 2 months ago

If the ACC ends up adding UConn and Rutgers (which they will feel pressure to do, as letting those teams wallow in the Big East harms their future brand) - then the B10 is really boxed in and has nowhere to go but KS/MO.

It would, in fact, not surprise me if Texas and Oklahoma end up saving the B12, that the B10 comes calling on MO/KS to join as teams 13 and 14.

This is the best possible scenerio for KU - gets us to the B10 with a rival.

Gives KS State a home in the old B12, who with Tex and Oklahoma will be just fine.

mdfraz 11 years, 2 months ago

While I would love the stability and prestige (especially academically) of the Big 10, if the Big 12 is staying together somehow, I would be absolutely shocked if KU left for another conference, even with MU. While words from administrators don't seem to matter much, EVERYTHING from KU that has been said is that we want the conference to survive. I just don't see us going back on that, because 1) I think we believe it's in our best interest, notwithstanding the potential chronic instability of the conference, to stay here, and 2) we (and MU) would look like giant backstabbers nationally if we did leave when UT and OU were staying. Would that hurt us nationally or even regionally? I really don't know but it's a consideration. Couple that with the fact that our leadership apparently really doesn't want to leave KSUck, and obviously the BOR would rather we stayed with them, and I just don't see us spurning a surviving Big 12 even for a Big 10 invite. I'd feel more stable there for sure, but I think there's a big potential downside....

AlecRaenos 11 years, 2 months ago

Screw UT and OU. They made their beds, if they decide to stay and KU gets an offer somewhere else, leave. Screw both of them. They didn't think for one minute about any other school but themselves, why should KU? Why shouldn't KU look to go to a conference where the schools don't backstab and plot against each other for a "better" deal. If the B1G comes calling, with or without UT and OU coming back, we bounce immediately and don't look back.

texashawk10 11 years, 2 months ago

Why would Kansas and Missouri look like backstabbers if they left together to go to a more stable situation. Don't most people on here say Colorado and Nebraska made the right decision and are now in stable conferences and don't have to worry about all of this BS that is going on now.

mdfraz 11 years, 2 months ago

You didn't pay attention to the vitriol directed at CU and NU last year? And people complaining about aTm this year? Those were schools were may not have been fully committed to keeping the Big 12 togehter, as we've seen. We, on the other hand, along with the other "have nots" in this scenario, have been saying all along we were working as hard as we could to keep this conference together. In fact, to the dismay of many posters here, that's about all our administration has been saying publicly. Yes, there would be a perception that we were talking out of both sides of our mouth, or even flat out lying.

I'm not saying it's a reason we shouldn't jump on an offer to a more stable conference. I'm saying it could be a consideration. I'm also not saying that if OU and UT do decide to stay that we may not be better off somewhere else.

When you look at what our administration has been saying all along about keeping the conference together and also trying to stay with KSUck and/or Mizzou (although we'd be with Mizzou in the Big 10), I'm just saying I'd be shocked if we jumped ship if it looked like the Big 12 would survive. Not saying it's right or wrong, just saying that's my impression.

billbrasky 11 years, 2 months ago

I guess i don't get why the SEC is being dismissed. Not that i think it's an ideal option, but we would take any BCS conference in a heart beat regardless of if it means leaving KSU correct?

If MU joins the SEC and they are looking to get to 16, i can't see how we aren't in the next 2 with either WVU, or Louisville (unlikely because of UK already being there).

If the Big 10 decides to expand, i don't see how we aren't in there along with ND, MU, and whoever (ISU, Cincy, L'Ville)

My percentages would be like this:

Big 12 saved - 35% SEC 25% Big 10 20% Leftover 20% (with moving into Big 10 if/when they expand)

jgkojak 11 years, 2 months ago

KU will never go to the SEC(!!!!)

Do you know why Lawrence was founded? What's the name of one of our High Schools? FREE STATE.

Why? 1) no cultural fit with the SEC schools 2) no historic ties 3) the academics of the SEC are questionable - only two AAU schools (Florida and Vanderbilt) 4) Travel not much better than heading west to the Pac

I promise you the KU Admin has no desire to head to the SEC. In fact, I'd rather play in a leftover league than have KU associated with the SEC.

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

The SEC would beat being in an irrelevent conference. If the "Free State" thing is such a big deal, why were we in a conference with four Texas schools.. If MU goes to the SEC, we will have some cultural tie. If MU and A&M join, you will have 4 AAU schools and look at the recent US News Rankings- there are several other schools in the SEC ranked ahead of KU.

I don't think it's ideal and now given that WVU is no longer being considered for the SEC, I fear that MU will end there as the 14th school. There may not be room for us anyway.

142466 11 years, 2 months ago

I agree with your free state point. This point surfaced in my mind immediately when all these realignments commenced. If KU seeks entry into the Big 10 or PAC we should educate them about the roots of our State & the town of Lawrence. In a close call, this could make a difference.

texashawk10 11 years, 2 months ago

The former slave/free status of a state/territory has very little impact when it comes to conference realignment. If past slave status was a big deal, KU would never have been in a conference with Missouri or the two Oklahoma schools and would have left when the Texas schools came calling. 7 out of 10 schools in the current Big 12 are located in places that fought for the Confederacy during the Civil War so that is not a big deal. If KU were to somehow end up in the SEC, I would be more concerned about coming out of Baton Rouge without getting cans and bottles thrown at me for wearing KU stuff there. LSU has one of the most abusive (verbally and physically) fanbases in the country and there are several more SEC schools that aren't much better than that either.

BleedingCrimsonAndBlue 11 years, 2 months ago


Am I reading too much into your percentage wheel from this morning, or is there a reason that you have the Big Ten chances at 20%. That seems significantly higher than they have ever been on your other versions of the wheel during this mess. Thanks

blindrabbit 11 years, 2 months ago

billrasky: The dead from Quantrills 1863 Raid are rolling in their grave about your SEC proposal! They, the SEC would not allow a bunch of Yankees to pollute the legacy of the "Stars and Bars" anyway; they don't want us! Also, KU would need to be willing to step down in academic standing as well as uptick it's "cheating ability" if they were to join and remain competitive.

Stephan123 11 years, 2 months ago

Texas waits for OU and its weak sister to join the Pac then turns around and joins the ACC. This would significantly hamper OU recruiting in more Adrian Petersons. Plus, there may be more options for the LHN than in the PAC.

FreddyinLA 11 years, 2 months ago

The only thing, which makes sense to me about the annual conference realignment cluster*, is how much less I will be donating to these institutes of higher confusion.

TXBBall55 11 years, 2 months ago

Agreed. Consider my donations gone -- forever. I’m not donating to maintain a disgrace.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

Understandable, but I hope you won't hold the grudge against the academic-side of whatever institution. Their students, teachers, and employees really do appreciate your support, I assume, no matter how large or small.

OCJHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

I really hope we have our option or options lined up and are just waiting for UT and OU to bolt. Shrewd move to remove much of the ensuing litagation that will come from this cluster.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

Yes, if the Greedy 2+2 bolt, and KU, MU, etc. have landing spots in a major conference, then I could see KU voting to dissolve thus relieving much of the legal burdens. Unthinkable just a few days ago.

But if the Forlorn Four or Five remain, hopefully MU and others can be convinced not to vote for such, with the concession that we'll waive all or part of their exit fees. That way the Big 12-? can merge with the Big East football leftovers, and possibly with the MWC too, to form the Big 16. And hopefully retain the current TV. bowl, etc. contracts at least for a couple more years.

trey 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, I think you are doing a good job of finding and filtering information, and posting what you believe to be the most credible. Thank you for that.

Personally, I would love to read more from you regarding "what we should want" in addition to "what you believe is most likely". It's more interesting to hear someone advocate for something, and not just predict something. But if you don't think that's an appropriate part of your role, I understand.

I do think you can apply somewhat of a logic test to many of the scenarios being portrayed, and determine the likelyhood. I know... logic seems to be an oximoran in this discussion, but I bet we eventually see it. And I believe that geography will be a significant factor in the end...

For example, I really don't see much likelyhood that either Texas or Kansas go to the ACC (although I'd like it if we did). We're NOT in the "Atlantic Coast", no where near. If I'm the ACC, I'm going to sign up UConn (hoops) and Rutgers (NY market) asap. I'd own the whole East Coast (locking out the B1G), and have the best hoops league by a mile. I'll be shocked if this doesn't happen.

Another example, W. Virginia to SEC makes a ton of sense. They need 14th team, it's a greographic and cultural fit, balance East/West at 14 teams, good hoops and football. They may pursue MU as #15, but I'll be shocked if W Virginia isn't next SEC add.

I really don't believe that ANY team is going to leave their comfy home in the ACC, SEC, B1G or PAC to go to another conference. The money isn't going to be that different when all is said and done, so why leave?

The PAC is going to be the "West of the Mississippi" conference. As such, they don't have that many expansion options. Which is why they'll likely cave-in and take the little sister programs OSU and TTech, despite their weak academics and other shortfalls. That said I do think Texas is just as likely to go to the PAC with Kansas, as TTech. But does Larry Scott have the stones to play hardball with Texas? Open question.

The B1G is by far the hardest one to call. They don't need to go to 16, even if the others do. Especially if the East Coast is off the table (gobbled up by the very smart move by the ACC). They may think they can just wait until ND decides to join, or their TV contracts is up and adding markets will be a plus. That said, they are at risk in waiting if the other conferences are set to take some of their eventual targets.

If Rutgers and UConn go ACC, then the only real expansion possibilities for the B1G are (probably in order)...

ND, Texas, MU, KU, ISU.

If Texas goes PAC, and the PAC wants KU as #16, and SEC wants MU as #15, then the B1G may have to move now.

My view all along has been... Best Scenario for KU = B1G, Best Chance for KU = PAC. Least likely for KU = ACC. No Chance for KU = SEC. Absolute Trainwreck for KU = BigE Leftovers.

TKHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

Some real good points here. In my opinion the biggest stud in all of this is the B1G. They have remained rock solid through all of this and to be quite honest, even if PAC, ACC and SEC go to 16 team, I honestly haven't seen anything to convince me that the B1G feels they need to expand. KU would be lucky to get a B1G bid and I agree we should take it if offered, although doubtful. If you want a conference model, look at the B1G. Quite frankly from top to bottom their teams are really no more powerful than the Big 12, but they had their TV plan in place from day one and all have profitted from it and that has lead to their success.

FlintHawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Great article! Even if it's fantasy, I loved it. Thanks, Big!

pepper_bar 11 years, 2 months ago

Pac 12 isn't expanding, folks. Majority of presidents oppose expansion.

kansaspike 11 years, 2 months ago

That really makes the most sense. Glad to see KU bb has a "value" in that article.

utahjayhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Is anyone actually nervous that the outcome of this complete mess/disaster will be the survival of: 1) the Big XII with OU/UT or 2) the Big XII with UT, but without OU/OSU?? I'm actually more nervous now about one of these two scenarios verses us getting an invite to a true power conference. If the Big XII survives, I don't think there's any way we leave in the future.

Most importantly, I don't think there can be ANY level of long-term trust going forward in the former Big XII no matter how much lip service is thrown at a rebranding effort.

While not ideal, I think the best thing will be for KU to jump now, in order, to one of the following if invited: B1G, PAC, ACC.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

WVU fans are terrible, I hear. That and academics likely sunk them with the ACC. With the SEC also that WV didn't leave the Union way back when.

trey 11 years, 2 months ago

As follow up to my previous post, my view on realignment options for KU, including "what's best for KU", and "most likely for KU". Won't use odds, just rank. Interested in other's views...

Conference (Best for KU)(Most Likely for KU) B1G (1)(3) PAC (2)(2) ACC (3)(5) Big12 (4)(4), Caveat, includes current members + 1-3 adds. SEC (5)(6) BigE (6)(1), Leftovers, doesn't include UConn, Rutgers, W. Virginia, MU.

Obviously the huge heartburn is the last one... I fear that what's absolutely the worst scenario for KU, may be the most likely. But this is more to do with my lack of confidence in BGL, Zenger and the BOR than anything.

blindrabbit 11 years, 2 months ago

Logic: I think both of your points on your 11:41 post are correct. Attended a couple of games in Morgantown; not the epitome of higher education, rough crowd. Also, that Union connect is more real for the SEC than most believe. They still have nightmares about Gettysburg and Sherman's little "walk through" through Dixie.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

I'd presume that the SEC is most interested in OU/OSU, and are talking to them. I think they'd prefer OU/OSU/UT over UT/MU/KU. But any and all is possible these days.

But the Big 12 surviving as is, and adding BYU, WVU, and Louisville sounds interesting. Or going to 16.

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

In this scenario, the OK schools move to the Pac 12.

Fred Davis 11 years, 2 months ago

I told whoever would listen last summer that KU needed to find its way into the SEC, because while the hoops wouldn't suffer and only get better matching up with Kentucky twice a year - the ultimate coup would be for the football program and what it would mean to recruiting and KU's overall football profile... If I'm The Zeng, I'm doing whatever it takes to get to the SEC if the Big 12 folds...

I love K-State, but it's a dog eat dog world Baby... (And apparently - every man ISN"T a Wildcat)

TKHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, I hope your prophecy is correct about KU staying in the same conference with Texas. Please don't take my KU basketball card away from me, but I really enjoy college football and its much more enjoyable to me when KU is at least relevant in football. I like the way our football program is heading and expect good things for the future as we grow in depth and defensive talent, but to keep that recruiting going, we need Texas. Without Texas, recruiting suffers and KU football drops back to what it was pre-Mangino.

franklin2739 11 years, 2 months ago

KU to the SEC. Yes, we could do worse and so could they with WVU. I'll whistle dixie with my fingers crossed. Every game will be a boarder war and we will get killed, but given the alternative I'll take the SEC. The south always wanted Kansas I guess. Would K-State go to the pac? Or will the Pac stop at 14? Crazy, Crazy, Crazy.....

Ludwig Supraphonic 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, I didn't see our less attractive Step-Sister school listed in the top fifty apparel sellers link you provided. Perhaps they're boycotting cotton to encourage wool sales or overalls with college logos aren't available in purple. If the NY Times figures of college interest are even approximately accurate KU seems marketable. It also suggests how foolish the erosion of the Big12 has been. In good and bad years the outlying seats of Memorial Stadium were filled with chubby red people when NU played here. Both schools have large fan bases to boost TV ratings and fans of UT or OU would be tuned in to hope NU loses. OU/UT, UT/TAMU, NU/OU have huge fan footprints. The combined KU/MU fan base would be close to two million fans. These games are of interest across an entire region and are advertising bonanzas for businesses targeting the area. Fan bases reported in the NY Times for many of the schools touted as possible inclusions for the Big12 look less attractive. The dregs of the Big East provide marginal fan interest and large travel costs with little local interest. Other than national ads for beer or burgers are the same products equally marketable in Lawrence and Piscataway. How many people outside a hardened fanbase for KU and Rutgers/Louisville/Memphis/AirForce/Cincinnati/Houston/TCU/SouthFlorida/CentralFlorida/EastCarolina/Tulsa are going to have any interest in that match-up. That's a game to watch on ESPNU at 3AM when you have insomnia following the Prairie View A&M/Bethune-Cookman matchup.
Obviously we need affiliation with a major conference where our fanbase is at about the median level. Its surprising to note that we would rank in the upper portion of the Pac12. Suggesting it would be a step down in terms of fan interest, travel costs, and regional marketability from the Big12. How many seats would we sell in Arrowhead for a match up with any of the current Pac12 schools?How many seats in Memorial Stadium would be occupied in a matchup with any of the Pac12, WarmedOver Beast, Metro, WAC, MWC?

Joel Hood 11 years, 2 months ago

Doesn't AAU membership prevent KU from getting into the SEC?

Hammertoe 11 years, 2 months ago

The Passed Over Conference will emerge: The Big 12 Left Over 5 and what's left of the Big East. Mizzou has the best chance of landing in the SEC or PAC 12. 6 Million people in the state and only one D1 school. Great Football Stadium. 40 wins in the last 4 years... They have more to offer. The face of college athletics is changing before our very eyes and it's all due to football, greed, jealousy, and some very large egos deciding the fate and future of so-called "student athletes".....

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

"it would take place by way of the Big 12 absorbing the Big East's remaining football schools, not the other way around."

That's good news, even if UConn and or Rutgers bolts to the ACC. And if the Big East survives as a BB conference, and if we (Big 12+) have a deal to play against them routinely, it's the best of both worlds.

Ludwig Supraphonic 11 years, 2 months ago

Mizzery leaves and the OU/UT quartet go West. We continue with the dregs of the Big12, BEast. We're the big fish in a very tiny, BCS unworthy pond.

willie_fu_fu 11 years, 2 months ago

Things don't add up though. I remember reading if a conference were to go to 16 teams the other "major" conferences would expand aswell. So where would these teams come from if not the leftover Big 12-Big East schools? To me if UConn and Rutgers bolt for the ACC the B1G, Pac 12 and SEC will expand to 16 aswell. They are just waiting for someone else to make a move first.

jgkojak 11 years, 2 months ago

If KU's admin is even THINKING of joining the SEC, they better put their finger in the wind and measure the attitude of KU's fan base.

COJayhawker 11 years, 2 months ago

Agreed (and a little off topic). SEC would be great for us in terms of $$$ but lordy, who wants to see every other team hang 100 points on us during SEC conference play?? We're improving in that at least we have a pretty good offense this year, but Sister Mary's School for the Blind could score on our defense.

(Not knocking the kids on defense, they're trying..... not getting out-coached to the tune of 700+ yards would be a good start)

COJayhawker 11 years, 2 months ago

I'm starting my own Beerpong Superconference to cope with all this realignment talk.

Hank Cross 11 years, 2 months ago

Re 11:49 update: If OU/OSU go to P12 w/o UT, why wouldn't KU and KSU/MU to P12 be a better option, assuming it's on the table?

I think the chances of the B12's survival grow with each minute it exists. In fact, I'm thinking Boren is teaching a master class on negotiations with the end being the continuation of the B12.

The theory goes like this: OU belatedly recognized that the monster it helped create last year was going to continue rampaging and not stop until it destroyed the conference. Even A&M's departure didn't faze UT initially. Remember when Dodds said that he could see the conference continuing with 9 teams?

OU knew that the only way to get leverage over Bevo was to make a very credible threat to leave. Then Bevo would be forced to find a new home. During the course of negotiating w/other conferences, UT would have to signal that it would make concessions regarding the LHN that the B12 never could get from UT.

Once OU knows UT's bottom line through UT's negotiations with the P12, ACC, etc, OU can determine if that is acceptable. If it is acceptable, OU can get on the phone to UT and offer them the same deal to remain in the B12. UT decides that since it can't get a better deal elsewhere, it stays in the B12.

TKHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

Big 12 absorbing Big East rather than the other way around is appealing, but only if it leads to new, stronger leadership in the Big 12. Would Beebe be willing to step down if it would save the conference? Is Mark Cuban available?

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

And move the office back north, at least to OKC and hopefully KC. Maybe even St. Louis if it will help keep MU.

jgkojak 11 years, 2 months ago

Mark this down, you heard it here first:

The day the SEC offers MU a spot as its 14th team is the day the B10 offers MU/KU a spot as their 13th and 14th teams.

The B10 has nowhere to go (they really wanted Pitt), and they could still add Rutgers/Notre Dame or Iowa State/Notre Dame when the time comes. But for now, they will protect themselves.


1) They don't want the SEC to gain a foothold in the KC/St Louis markets. And they will NOT allow the SEC to grab MU (remember the B10 and the SEC hate one another).

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

Exactly what I was posting. Jim Delaney will not let the SEC or PAC encroach futher on his territory.

TKHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

If the source is correct that WV has been denied by the ACC and SEC, that would be HUGE for KU!! That would mean there is still space in the ACC or SEC for us to tag along with Texas, or worst case, if we absorb the Big East, WV is a strong football program. Plus, who is there bball coach? Huggy something??

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

KU fans have no need to worry...too much. KU is very much alive for 3 of the major conferences and the 4th (SEC) a longshot. Here's how we get in.

SEC - Only if they go to 16 teams. Pretty much locked out of poaching ACC schools. Have said they don't want schools already in their geographic footprint. Decide they have enough good football schools, and seeing what the ACC now has in BB, go after KU to rival UK. Still a longshot.

ACC - Very likely to go to 16 teams for self-preservation. After adding 2 schools very quickly, they are dragging their feet. Why? Maybe they realized that SU & Pitt are the 2 biggest catches in the Northeast and adding Rutgers and UConn would be pointless for market value. The ACC wants nothing to do with Texas Tech. Suddenly KU & UT look very good to them. Opens up big TV markets and gives them the state of Texas to recruit in which would help a struggling FB conference. Possible.

Pac 12 - If they expand, will go to 16. Have friends in Cali and the word is out that many presidents want nothing to do with OSU and Tech. Seems that they would give in on OSU (probably for Boone's money) but are pushing Scott to include Kansas. They also say that the Pac is very unwilling to give in to any special deals UT wants. Don't see Missouri ever going to the Pac as has been rumored. This is the only conference where KU & KSU possibly stay together, but the Pac actually has a lower opinion of KSU than OSU or Tech. Looking better for KU to get an invite.

Big 10 - Who knows if they will expand. The best thing that would happen is if the SEC offered Mizzou and the Pac offered KU. Do you really think Jim Delaney would sit on his hands and let those 2 conferences encroach closer to his territory? Probably not. If this happens, KU and MU should be on the phones with the B1G and say its now or never. Also, how many AAU schools does he have to choose from now? Looking better but then again its the B1G.

Leftovers - Good possibility. But I think KU would only be here until 2014, when Notre Dame's TV contract comes up. By then the B1G would be under pressure to go 16 if the other conferences have 16. Then we get the invite.

Kansas State - Sorry but the B1G is a non-starter. They will never take a non-AAU member. Nor will they take another school from a small state like Kansas. SEC & ACC - no chance. Pac - 5% chance. Leftovers or Mountain West - 95% chance.

jgkojak 11 years, 2 months ago

There are NO MORE AAU schools - Rutgers KU MU Iowa State Notre Dame

The only way I see KS being left out of a 16 team B10 is if they add Rutgers and Notre Dame, and suddenly the Iowa politicians start pressuring Iowa to demand bringing Iowa State into the league - and all things being equal, they go "meh" and take Iowa State instead of Kansas.

I am guessing, though, that the ACC adds UConn (a natural for basketball and addtl market) and Rutgers and that Rutgers would much rather play in the ACC.

At this point I think: B12 (Leftover version): 40 B10: 40 Pac: 15 ACC: 5 SEC: Just shoot me

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

I too have thought about that nightmare scenario of ISU being chosen over us. But I don't think Delaney or the rest of the B1G really care about what Iowa politicians have to say.

Hammertoe 11 years, 2 months ago

Big East and Big 12 left overs are talking right now. Flip on ESPN.

Michael Maris 11 years, 2 months ago

Has anyone even thought about the fact that NBCSportsChannel (currently known as Versus) might become a player in the TV Contract situations?

Versus (NBCSportsChannel) is pretty much on EVERY Cable System in the United States. So, Fox, ESPN/ABC and CBS are NOT the only options for Collegte Athletics TV Viership.

At some point and time, Versus name is going to officialy become NBCSports Channel. They are currently the outlet for Mountain West Conference sports.

But, they are NOT going to just rely on having the Mountain West Conference games on their network.

So, that could be an alternative player in getting TV Contracts.

Kevin Keitzman talked yesterday about having a new league formed (out of the left over Big XII and Big East schools) and hiring Kevin Weiberg as the new Conference Commissioner, based on the fact that he he already has Conference Commissioner resume.

Plus, he left the Big XII Conference Commissioner Chair to start the BTN. Now, he is at the PAC (not as the League Commissioner), but if Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, Baylor and possibly Missouri are left out.

Then, start a new league with those forgotten 4 (or 5). Bring in Cincy, Louisville, S. Florida, (now) West Virginia, Memphis, TCU, Central Florida and Houston (if another school is needed).

That would allow C. and S. Florida to have a school that is close to them for traveling purposes. You would be in some Top 10 TV Markets (DFW with TCU, Tampa-St. Pete (with S. Florida), Orlando (with C. Florida). You would still have to 50 markets with the other schools (except Iowa State and Baylor).

People can talk about Kansas & Kansas State in the Kansas City Market. But, they are really in the Kansas City and Wichita-Hutchinson TV Market.

If Kansas and Missouri are not invited to a FBS League, then they have to think of a situation that would be good for their schools and getting TV Exposure.

Course, if OU OSU, Texas and TTU don't leave, then you don't have to add as many of the aforementioned schools. But, OU, OSU, UT and TTU are constipated and have not yet taken a good dose of Metamucil to get rid of their constipation issues.

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

Good post. But would NBC really throw money at a leftover conference that looks like that? More likely they would rather try and lure away one of the Big 4 conferences.

Michael Maris 11 years, 2 months ago

Well, peole think that the Mountain West is a joke of a conference. And, they have Versus (soon to be NBCSports Channel) for their network.

So, adding TV sets in the middle of the United States is a bad idea for NBC?

Less population in the Mountain West Conference area, than in the middle of the United States.

William Weissbeck 11 years, 2 months ago

OK, let's play devil's advocate. Shouldn't we be shopping a deal to keep UCONN in the Big East with a Big 12 merger? Otherwise, whatever is left will be a second class BB conference. Louisville, WV and Cinci can very quickly lose their BB identity without the likes of Syracuse, Pitt and UConn.

nuleafjhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

WWWW - I don't normally point out spelling and grammatical errors, but I couldn't help myself on this one. Your first sentence should say D. Dodd's advocate......

Michael Maris 11 years, 2 months ago

810 Radio just reported that Misouri is the intended 14th member for the SEC. According to Gabe DeArmond @ B1G will have to become a player before much longer. If Big XII is done, I truely want University of Kansas in the B1G.

I know that people would like to see U. of Kansas stick with Texas. But, Texas has killed 2 football conferences (now) due to their greed. So, you want to join another conference with them, if they are still going to be doing their best to enforce their greed upon the next conference that they are seeking to get into?

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

If (likely) true, then the KU/MU pair to the Big Ten is the best option for all three parties.

Even if UT and OU kiss and make-up for now, I say we bolt to the Big Ten with MU. And encourage them to take a couple more of our schools too, except UT unless they come in on Big 10's standard terms.

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

This may not be good news for KU because all previous sources cited MU had minimal interest in the SEC and wanted the B1G. This may make it clear once and for all the B1G really does have no desire to expand.

Sam Constance 11 years, 2 months ago

Just a few of my own thoughts on all of this mess:

1) I have no desire, as a Kansas fan, to see the Jayhawks play in the SEC. For every recruiting avenue it would supposedly open up, it would also come with a nearly impossible environment in which to improve a struggling football program. If Kansas joins the SEC, I personally think that's the death knell for Kansas Football as a competitive, BCS-level team.

2) Regarding the superconferences, I think SportsBizMiss is spot on. It's a media creation, a pipe dream, and the only reason it has gained any traction is because people have somehow convinced themselves that it allows the conferences to circumvent the NCAA. The truth is, the conferences can circumvent the NCAA any time they want, without the need to re-shuffle all the conference alignments. The NCAA serves at the pleasure of the conferences, to use an old political term. They have no authority that is not given to them.

3) If the Big 12 were to absorb the football schools of the Big East, I'm a bit confused as to how their BCS status would be in jeopardy. Because at the end of the day, they would have 12 teams that are currently defined as BCS-caliber programs. Cutting them out of the picture because there is no presumed annual title contender would be the most blatant display I've ever seen of how much of a "good ol' boys" club the BCS truly is. Of course, being obvious about how it's a situation of 'haves' vs. 'have nots' hasn't ever stopped them from doing anything in the past. Aside from the prospect of losing BCS status, I'm not as down on the idea of a Big 12/Big East merger.

4) If they could make it happen, WVU replacing A&M as the 10th member of the Big 12 would be the least wave-making scenario from an "on the field" perspective. WVU is a fairly acquitted two-sport school over the last half decade or so, same as A&M. But don't anyone tell A&M I said that. They think they're just spectacular and I'd hate to raise any doubt to that...

5) It's too bad the people driving this thing don't care about what the student athletes and fans (the ones most affected by the realignment) think. Aside from the handful of fans who are simply excited by the prospect of something new and shiny, I think most fans perfer that tradition, rivalries and geographical alignment be the primary drivers of conference makeup. From a logistical standpoint, having conferences in which the conference itself is the only true tie-in between member schools is a nightmare.

franklin2739 11 years, 2 months ago

I agree with your seniments and you are right that this realignment is a bad thing but..... Rea, lignmnet blows, KU did not create this, but we must adapt to it whether we like it or not. If KU, or the state of Kansas forces KU (or they don't get invited) to a super co) into the have-not conference we will lose more than sports success. KU as an institution will lose prestige. Multi-Million dollar cancer institutes don't go to the North Dakota's, New Mexico states of the world. That is where we will be. College sports drive enrollment to a college. Enrollment drives research dollars to a college. Kids from Colorado, Chicago, or wherever are less likely to go to KU if they are not a BCS school. Tradition, sports, and prestige of a university all go hand in hand.
In terms of the SEC if (big if) we do go to the SEC we will keep a rivalry with MU, we will be in the second best b-ball conference, and with the extra money we can build up our football program. There is no rule that says KU cannot compete in football if they are in the SEC. We can improve other academic aspects of University with the extra cash (if we are smart). We just have to adapt and it may take time. Throwing our hands in the air and pushing to join a worthless conference with all throw backs will be bad for KU, all the land grant schools in kansas, and the state of Kansas.

Sam Constance 11 years, 2 months ago

Well, it seems we're defining "have" and "have not" conferences here in terms of BCS status, and I think you are grossly exaggerating how detrimental not being in a BCS conference would be to things like KU's academics and research pursuits.

Academics and research money, while affected by conference affiliation, are much more affected by the rankings and success of a schools academic programs. And there are plenty of schools outside of the Pac-12, Big 12, B1G, SEC, ACC and Big East that get sizeable support for academics and research.

In fact, the SEC is largely subpar from an academic standpoint, so I don't know how you can bring up the prestige and support of our educational institution, then talk about how we can go to a conference that is below the one in which we currently reside.

I'm not saying we should join Conference USA, per say, but the SEC is by FAR my last choice for joining an existing BCS-status conference.

ohjayhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Working in WV amongst all kinds of WVU fans, the word they have is the info for story that they were denied by the SEC came from the Big East, not WVU or the SEC, and is somewhat erroneous. The chatter here is that WVU was told by the SEC they would have to wait until A&M was officially added and then discussions could move forward between WVU and the SEC. So, there's another rumor to add to all the others.

Michael Maris 11 years, 2 months ago

I believe that Tait posted above the following statement:

''11:37 a.m. Update:

Brett McMurphy of CBS Sports is reporting that multiple Big East sources have told him that West Virginia applied for entry into the ACC and SEC and was denied by both.''

ohjayhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

And, I believe, what I was saying is that Brett McMurphy from CBS Sports got that info from the Big East, not WVU or the SEC, making it a bit more suspect. It sounds like the Big East may be playing damage control.

Hank Cross 11 years, 2 months ago

More grist for the B12 lives meme:

"Boone Pickens doesn't believe the Big 12 is dead. The Oklahoma State benefactor even believes Texas A&M's departure for the SEC can be stopped."

Read more:

I don't buy he's freelancing w/o some inside info.

Ludwig Supraphonic 11 years, 2 months ago

The least interesting matchup of the Big12 leftover league would be with ISU. If we were to court the BigEast dregs; would any of them be a more attractive date. Who would have thought our best date would be Putrid in Purple. Pray our future isn't with the LeastBigs.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

Denigrating others doesn't help, and just hurts your own cause. Keeping it classy is best.

Ludwig Supraphonic 11 years, 2 months ago

"WVU fans are terrible. I hear." "Greedy 2+2" "Forlorn 5" Heed your own counsel.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

That's quoting others' terms and observations. And seem very accurate where "dregs" and "putrid" are not.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

"Texas A&M may be "sobering up." "

If UT, OU, and KU agree to equal revenue sharing with all institutions, if UT agrees to terminate the LHN and all agree to a Big 10-like Big 12 network, and if the conference expands back to at least 12, then maybe it works and A&M could decide to stay. Especially if they can't afford to leave.

Chris Shaw 11 years, 2 months ago

Interesting take by Lubbock Online.

Come on Big 12! Get this done! Wake up! Midwest is where you need to keep your roots!

I love how Iowa State, KU, KSU, Mizzou, and Baylor are sticking together. Even though it's the small schools......they are at least showing stability and leadership. Mizzou having this offer is a good thing. As long as they don't take it it shows more stabillity! It's progressing folks!

Ben Kane 11 years, 2 months ago

any journalist who uses keegs as his kansas source as to what is going with KU loses all credibility in my book.

jay381 11 years, 2 months ago

Don’t forget T Boone has enormous influence not only with the OSU he practically bought, but also with A&M. His political influence in both OK and TX is huge especially in the party of Perry who would be looking for some major contributions in his Presidential Campaign. Just saying I am sure Perry would not at least take his call any time, any day or probably on almost any subject as would a lot of the regents etc. In this crazy process anything is possible. However, there is a reasonableness to his comments if they are not too late.

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

What's strange about the MU to SEC article is that is definitively states that SEC approached MU. During the A&M courting, the process was carefully orchestrated where A&M told the conference they intended to leave, then applied for membership and was then approved. The reason being that if the conference approached A&M, they could be guilty of tortuous interference. It is strange that after being so careful with A&M that the SEC would approach MU in this manner. Of course the source is a "booster'. I don't think MU wants to go to the SEC.

AlecRaenos 11 years, 2 months ago

I dont think the SEC cares anymore. Its obvious that any legal threats haven't kept the ACC from raiding the Big East. The payout on the earlier 2000s settlment when the ACC raided the Big East the first time was 5 million and some games they had to schedule.

SEC is like screw it, we aren't getting left out.

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

Agreed. Don't think I would ever take the word of a Mizzou booster.

trey 11 years, 2 months ago

If BGL, Zenger and the BOR don't land us in one of the Big 4, they should all be fired.

The Big12/BigE "leftover" conference would be a disaster for KU.

Quit thinking about where we will be most competitive in Football. Think about...

Where we get the most Football money (feed our athletic dept overall). Where we can recruit best for hoops. Where we can keep Bill Self.

We have to dramatically improve our football program, REGARDLESS of where we land. That has a lot more to do with $$$ and recruiting, then whether we can win more games in a crappy conference.

Kyle Cornish 11 years, 2 months ago

This has nothing to do with basketball, nothing to do with basketball, nothing to do with basketball, nothing to do with basketball... Say it with me... nothing to do with basketball.

The conferences don't care about basketball. If it's good, great, if not, oh well. Just so long as they are getting money in football. That's not opinion, it's fact. Nobody is going to make a conference or decision based on ANY OTHER SPORT other than football. Period. End of story. Bill Self has no power.

Steve Gantz 11 years, 2 months ago

It's true for the vast majority of schools. But KU's basketball is attractive to other leagues and we will be pursued by others when/if this league falls apart.

trey 11 years, 2 months ago

You are an idiot. Though basketball money is not anywere near the money as football, it is not irrelavent.

Our basketball programs and associate brand DO have value, and are the reason we are in the conversation.

My point is...

I would FAR rather get our ass kicked in football, in the ACC, SEC, B1G or PAC (at least in the short term). Take the $$$ we would get from one of those leagues. Get big-time hoops recruits, keep Bill Self, compete for NC's in basketball.


Go to this loser "leftover" conference. Which read the new today, MU aint going to. Win 6 football games, and go to a crap bowl game. And see our Basketball program decline.

But maybe I'm different. Maybe you get all fired up about beating Cincinatti in football and going to the Houston Bowl.

Kyle Cornish 11 years, 2 months ago

I am not an idiot and I don't agree that any of this is right, but I promise that you are blind if you think KU basketball will save us. It will be what football can bring. If it's enough, we are in. If it's not, we compete in a crappy bush-league conference.

Kyle Cornish 11 years, 2 months ago

In fact, if basketball could save us, it would have already. But it hasn't. We aren't being courted by anyone yet. It's about TV sets, markets and what can football do to you. If you haven't figured that out, you are a Moron.

Michael Maris 11 years, 2 months ago

I say that if the Big XII survives and adds schools to get back to 12 teams. Then, KU, K-State, Iowa State, Missouri all tell Texas that the TLN now becomes the Big XII Network (not just the TLN).

Texas really wants the league to survive. Then, you need to make sacrifices as well. Equal TV Revenue Sharing (PERIOD).

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

UT is motivated to keep the LHN and all of the money. That is why they are shopping themselves around. Honestly, and I doubt this will happen, I believe that you set up an equal revenue sharing model with a Big 12 network, you convinced A&M to stay and tell UT to take or leave it, you will have a viable conference. If UT leave and you still have A&M, the TV package might be reduced but only slightly since you still have three Texas schools. I would love for this to happen, but I doubt it will unless we fire Dan Beebe and hire Boone Pickens as Big 12 Commissioner!!

FarSideHawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Is there a fast forward button to all this?! Enough already, you greedy $%^$^!

Make the decision and end this misery soon!

Chris Shaw 11 years, 2 months ago

I know Mizzou is disliked and all of that, but this is one time where Mizzou and KU need to truly ban together. If, for some crazy reason this Big 12 thing can survive, I think you're going to see a very powerful conference.

However, even though making concessions can seem weak (From Texas' perspective) they would gain more power and strength and even stability going forward. Don't be "Notre Dame" Texas. You see where their football program has been since the mid 90's!

kansaspike 11 years, 2 months ago

Fizzou to the SEC only bolsters our BIG 10 odds.....seems like a good development to me.

blindrabbit 11 years, 2 months ago

Please, no talk about A&M having second thoughts: If the Big12 survives, let A&M go anyway. Every time I look at their games and sideline cheerleading activities, think I'm watching some sort of repressed sexual issues.Their "jazzhands" routines have no place in college athletics, should have been abandoned at the middle school level. With that military B.S., they should form a league with The Citadel, West Point, VMI and Virginia Women's Institute for Leadership and take that damn dog with them.

Al Martin 11 years, 2 months ago

The official term in our family for the A&M Corps is "Jackbooted Morons (tm)". Me, the wife, the kids, all have that immediate response if one of them comes on screen.

THEPIC 11 years, 2 months ago

MU does not want to go to the SEC. If the BIG 10 comes calling see how loyal they are to keeping the BIG 12 alive.

Ron Prichard 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, what does MU's invite to the SEC mean for the Big XII/Big East "merger" if things fall that way? Specifically, what does it mean for Kansas? It seems like it would make Kansas the premier school in that league. As much as that sounds enviable, I realize it means much less money and possibly no BCS spot. Sounds like that option just got a lot less desirable, if it was even desirable before.

TKHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

With all the possibilities swirling around out there, the Boone Pickens article reminds me that the best case scenario for KU and for college sports in general is for the Big 12 to survivie, with our without A&M, perferably with. I keep getting caught up in the questions of where we will end up and lose sight of the fact that I really need to be pulling for my conference to survive. Crazy, but if Texas finally starts playing fair, it is possible for the Big 12 to come out of this as strong as the B1G or SEC. I am thankful there is someone out there with a loud enough voice (aka enough money) to keep reminding people of that and calling BS on the bluffs.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

With A&M is best. And adding BYU and WVU, and going back to north and south divisions.

Kristen Downing 11 years, 2 months ago

Wow, we are counting on, depending on, trusting MU and UT?! That sounds like a wild ride. There was huge article in the USA Today Sports section on Larry Scott that made him sound like a brilliant sport God. I hope the egomaniac leaders of UT and OU read it and get their panties in a wad and maybe, come to their senses. Come on T. Boone, show it to them.

Marcia Parsons 11 years, 2 months ago

Why can't the rest of the Big12 schools offer to pay for their share of the Longhorn network and turn it into the Big12 network? Do you think Texas would ever give up control?

Randy Bombardier 11 years, 2 months ago

Wow. Perhaps all this drama was just to get UT to believe, "It is more blessed to give than to receive." Perhaps it was all about equality. Perhaps the Big 12 can survive, thrive, and hopefully grow. We need at least 12. Colorado State has nearly as many students as KU, 28,000 or so. I think they are a logical add. BYU, Air Force and if TAMU still goes maybe consider another Texas school, maybe. Trouble is that if TAMU still goes to the SEC all of a sudden more of the high school prospects coming out of Texas are going to be swooped up by SEC schools. If we then add another competitor from Texas such as Houston, SMU, or TCU then we will be at a severe disadvantage. Not saying we cannot overcome it.

Perhaps the best way to overcome that is to be the best football conference. In that line of thinking adding TCU would definitely help. Still would love to get Arkansas but after all this drama that is not going to happen. So, perhaps the net advantage is to add the best football schools we can get. I think that is TCU and BYU. Hmm. Sure thought this thing was dead. Kudos to MU for waiting. I think they realize there would be a lot of glamor in the SEC but they are near the top of our conference and would probably take a beating in the SEC, a lot of parity there.

HawkfanNWichita 11 years, 2 months ago

A&M should be careful what they say. They could if the Big 12 survives and the big schools stay be stuck in this conference they have talked so much about wanting nothing to do with any more.

Maybe we can just trade them fair and square with Arkansas. Arkansas would have much more to gain from being in the Big 12 than A&M has to gain by going to the SEC.

R2D2 11 years, 2 months ago

If Fizzou does indeed have an SEC offer on the table then it may just force the Big 10 to think about their future if Fizzou is indeed in their plans. This could really speed up the KU/MU to Big 10 and I think it would be great for the rivalry and where both schools need to be!

Alan Braun 11 years, 2 months ago

Fizzou would be a good cultural fit for the Society of Ex Confederates. I'm not at all sure whether it's a good move for KU though, I think we might be more attractive to the B1G with them than without. The two together do a much better job of cementing the Missouri media market, especially Kansas City. And Mizzou with Illinois does a better job of controlling St Louis than Illinois alone.

texashawk10 11 years, 2 months ago

Since ESPN is the one footing the bill for the LHN, I would imagine they would have some power to change the terms of the network if it continues to struggle to find carriers for it. I still haven't heard or seen anything about any of the cable or satellite companies here in Houston carrying the LHN yet and if it can't get any traction here, I don't imagine it's doing very well in the other major Texas cities. ESPN would be wise to tell UT, we tried our best to make this work, but we're going to turn this into a Big 12 network. It could still be based in Austin since that's where all the equipment is, but it wouldn't be centered around UT.

I also seriously doubt ESPN wants to see the BCS go away even though they would likely be the carrier if a playoff format ever developed, but they would lose a bunch of money by not showing all of the bowl games they currently show. I would have to think it would in ESPN's best interest to ensure the survival of the Big 12 as a strong conference. Pay UT a partial buyout for what's left on the contract and convert it into a Big 12 network because that's in ESPN's best interest. UT needs to keep the boss happy and if they don't play by ESPN's rules, this guy gets mad,,,

astrofunk 11 years, 2 months ago

Well, it's available in Austin for those who have Grande cable (that would be me). Most Austinites have Time Warner which doesn't carry TLN.

trey 11 years, 2 months ago

Agree. There is no way the Big12 going to survive by "adding W. Virginia". Please.

doctorWho 11 years, 2 months ago

RE: The response of the SEC to Mizzou boasting about a future SEC invite. Mizzou has just shown us yet again why you need to keep your negotiations under wraps. Wow, guess the never learn across the border . . .

I have no idea if KU has any deal making going and I hope to H it stays that way until when and if a move is actually made.

kureader 11 years, 2 months ago

Hey ... you did my post!

... what else would you expect from Missou? This is exactly why Zenger is staying quiet.
You know that every Big 12 law firm has given orders to their school's staff to stay quiet.

A few officials at Oklahoma, Texas, and MU (not to mention T.Boone) just can't resist the opportunity to step in front of a camera.

KU will land on its feet ... last year, I was really worried ... this year, not so much.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

Mizzou would way rather be in the B1G than in the SEC.... could their "loose lips" be an attempt at goading the B1G into action?

I mean, if ND really would rather go ACC and the SEC gets Mizzou.... who else would the the B1G invite? (I feel the only way KU gets into the B1G is with Mizzou... and thats only if the B1G changes their stance and decides they want to add more teams to keep up with the other conferences)

djhawk75 11 years, 2 months ago

If Mizzou is trying to goad the B1G into taking them by leaking the SEC deal it would be a poor choice in tactics. It too much resembles a girl in the 9th grade who is trying to get some boy to like her by going out with another guy.

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

Agree doctorWho about being quiet about negotiations. So many people on this blog want KU to be aggressive and proactive and make public statements. It will backfire. In defense of MU, it was a booster who was cited as making the statement about MU getting an invitation.

blindrabbit 11 years, 2 months ago

albraun: Agree Mizzou would be a good fit for Soc. of Ex. Confederates! The thought of KU in that mess conjures up visions of the abuse that was visited on Yankee Ned Beatty in Deliverance by the Southern inbreds..

lama 11 years, 2 months ago

When does the Star wise up and make DeArmond cover something besides Mizzou? The dude is a homer.

Phoggin_Loud 11 years, 2 months ago

Another from Travis: "SEC wants to wait for Big 12 to implode before pursuing Missouri. Not happy with leak.

And another: "Missouri spoke out of turn. With legal issues, SEC likely furious."

When are these guys going to learn?? It already cost them the B1G, now the SEC.

Silly Tigers.

Jeff Coffman 11 years, 2 months ago

The MU invite, clearly shows the conference would be down to 4 and therefore fades away.

I'm pleased to hear that Rutgers is talking to the Big Ten, the key is to get them to want to expand, once that occurs, KU's future brightens.

The more I think about it, the more I think: Big Ten - Best Pac 12 - Great ACC - Good SEC - Survival Anything else...including Big XII revived is a mistake.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

"I'm pleased to hear that Rutgers is talking to the Big Ten,"

I'd guess this means they've been told that the grass is rather brown for them in the ACC. UConn's a shoo-in though, so who on the east coast will the ACC target next for number 16? WVU makes some sense.

texashawk10 11 years, 2 months ago

WVU was already rejected by the ACC and SEC. Only real option left on the east coast for the ACC would be South Florida, but I don't know how realistic that becomes for them.

Randy Bombardier 11 years, 2 months ago

UConn is a shoe-in where? Not the ACC. They had a nasty lawsuit when Miami and BC left BigEast for ACC.

Kevin Kelly 11 years, 2 months ago

I'm sure 'The Leauge' was very upset guy from Tennessee. My biggest problem is that this whole thing is being driven by people who prefer the NFL. Who use the wrong terminology out of habit and don't care three craps for college football....except to go on and on about how great the NFL is.

Confrence....the CONFRENCE is upset you 'ECB'.

Dan Edwards 11 years, 2 months ago

Despite posturing to the contrary, it is absolutely true that it's the conferences in the driver's seat on all of this. I don't believe for a second that Syracuse and Pitt just cold-called the ACC one day and said "please take us". The conferences are well aware of what schools they are interested in--it's definitely a "don't call us, we'll call you" kind of thing.

I know they all frame it as if the school did the initiating and the asking, but I firmly believe that's BS to avoid legal entanglements (see: the A&M/Baylor debacle). The order of operations is thus:

  1. Conference X calls President of School Y on the down-low (maybe even meeting in person in a secure location).

  2. Conference X says "Hey we think you'd be a good fit for us". School Y either says sure or no thanks.

  3. If both parties agree, Conference X says OK we'll you need to initiate this. Write out a letter of application and wink we'll consider it.

  4. Letter is written and school is invariably accepted.

Schools can try to pester conferences for membership but I think it only makes them look desperate and weak. The four soon-to-be super conferences KNOW they have all the power and that any school they tap on the shoulder will most likely jump at the chance (yeah yeah I know ND is the exception). So they don't really need us or any other school to call them and let them know we're interested--they already know we're interested.

So count me in the group that is happy BGL and SZ aren't out there in front of the cameras begging for an invitation to Conference X. I cant think of a single case of that tactic working.

jgkojak 11 years, 2 months ago

Think its hilarious is MU screwed the pooch a second time by "prematurely" announcing an offer from a conference.

I'm sure they did this to pressure the B10, but all this does is make them look stupid.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

I doubt many schools would object to getting rid of Beebe....

off with his head!

TKHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

Since Boone T. Pickens has rekindled the "let's save the Big 12" fire, I'd just like to repoint out something that Bill Self brought up. 9 is the perfect number sports conference. If the TV money is still there (which even without A&M it is), then now the pie only has to be cut in 9 pieces rather than 10. My math is right on that isn't it? Now, I know that a 9 team conference is vulnerable because if even one leave, especially someone like OU who takes OSU with them, then the conference fails. So, the key is the conference has to be fair and equitable (TEXAS!!!) so that everyone is on an even playing field. Now you have a 9 team conference that is "stable" (stable=big time money maker), that can sit back and watch these mega conferences fail to thrive (and trust me they will), and basically sit back as the B1G has and say, we will expand if its the right thing for us, but we won't just because you are. Bigger is not always better. I'm not saying I wouldn't be thrilled with ND or BYU, but we don't need them. 9 is fine, if the playing field is even. Then the money is good, all is fair and anyone wanting to leave the Big XII (9) for the SEC or PAC would have to take a paycut to do so. Sounds "stable" to me.

jgkojak 11 years, 2 months ago

OU lists removal of Big 12 commissioner Dan Beebe as one of demands

LOL- for once we can all agree with Oklahoma on something!!!

Phoggin_Loud 11 years, 2 months ago

Ken Starr gets a gold star if OU decides to stay.

AlecRaenos 11 years, 2 months ago

Maybe, but Boren did not sound happy with Baylor's threat of litigation. I'm betting if OU decides to stay oneof their demands is that Baylor is punished. Hopefully kicked out of the conference. I hate Baylor.

Phoggin_Loud 11 years, 2 months ago

That may be true, but their actions kept this conference from imploding weeks ago. If people can't honor contracts, they deserved to get sued.

Marcia Parsons 11 years, 2 months ago

I can't see why they would be punished, but I'll bet they will have to agree to drop their threat of a suit. As a matter of fact, if the conference stays afloat and the TV contract survives I can't see what grounds they would have to sue for damages.

LAJayhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Maybe Bill Clinton will give him a victory cigar......

BigMitchin_ 11 years, 2 months ago

Finally Beebe's reign will end! It's one way or another, and if he doesn't resign I'm sure they can vote him out. Come on Big XII. Take WVU, Louisville, and TCU

BigMitchin_ 11 years, 2 months ago

sad you feel that way. Should have looked at your avatar before even commenting back. Have fun praying for the CrapPAC

Kevin Randell 11 years, 2 months ago

I wonder if Baylor, KU, KSU, and Iowa St. are sending "moving" representatives to Beebe's office as we speak?

hailtoku 11 years, 2 months ago

No deal. Bebe way more valuable to this conference than Oklahoma.

pepper_bar 11 years, 2 months ago

Translation of the OU/Beebe news: As the NY Times reported two days ago, the Pac 12 is not expanding.

tman1991 11 years, 2 months ago

The funny thing is that article about OUs demands didnt even mention Colorado leaving.. As if no one cared..

BigMitchin_ 11 years, 2 months ago

It's not near as significant as Nebraska or A&M, Colorado could be replaced much easier.

KCHawk81 11 years, 2 months ago

It would bring me an incredbile amount of joy to see ESPN lose a boatload of money on the longhorn network. I'm not above schadenfreude. Seeing ESPN fold entirely? A man can dream, can't he?

STLJHawk86 11 years, 2 months ago

Assuming the SEC, B1G, PAC, and SEC each migrates to a 16 team Super Conference format, as of this moment there are 14 slots available. Further assuming UT, ATM, OU, OSU, and TTU each claim one of these spots there are still 9 slots to be filled. And if academics are given at least some consideration (in addition to the heavy weighting football receives), based on the numbers presented here and surveying the landscape of what the Super Conferences will have left to choose from to fill out their ranks, it seems darn near impossible that KU will not land in a Super Conference. .

LAJayhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

The firing of Dan Beebe to appease OU reminds me KU axing Al Bohl to keep Roy. We all know how that worked out......

Seriously, though, Beebe has lost 3 schools under his watch (so far). Probably time to go anyway.

Ron Prichard 11 years, 2 months ago

However, if OU demands that Beebe be replaced and the other schools agree, they are painting themselves into a corner if they still want to leave. The more concessions they get out of Texas the harder it will be for them to leave. I haven't seen the entire list, but what was reported actually seems reasonable to me. If OU really wanted to leave, why come out and publicly state your demands? Simply say you wanted to stay but the conference is too far gone and Texas is too stubborn to agree. Bam, you're out the door and hardly anyone would blame you. With OU and OSU gone, MU bolts, Texas and Tech are likely gone, and there aren't enough schools left to enforce the exit penalties. The lawsuits may still be a possibility, but they have a lot of problems, too. OU could lay all the blame on A&M and even Texas for not negotiating and say they had no choice. It would be tough to prove otherwise, especially if the entire league falls apart.

I may be an optimist, but it seems like the Big XII still has some life.

LAJayhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Agree, Big 12 just gained some serious ground. To answer your quesiton: "why come out and publicly state your demands?"

My take is, something is up with the PAC making them seem less of a suitable option. Perhaps PAC does not want to take OSU, or is only willing to take OU with Texas, or PAC is honest in saying they don't want to expand..... OR if the last option is correct, the more likely scenario is that they don't have the votes from enough PAC schools to expand.

Whatever the case, it seems to me that OU may have lost the leverage to leave, but now wants to save face by making demands to stay. Total speculation, but seems very possible to me.

JayDocMD 11 years, 2 months ago

I do look forward to another crushed dove speech.

LAJayhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

EXACTLY what I was thinking... simply forgot to put that in my post. Well done.

TheColonel 11 years, 2 months ago

IMO: much of this info is a chess game to avoid being labeled as "the school that tipped the domino that redefined college athletics".

OU makes demands they know can not be met. Thereby avoiding blame for leaving when they are not met.

MU vows to keep Big 12 going (when they really don't care) since they have a soft landing in SEC. But if Big 12 explodes and they go to SEC then they don't look like the bad guys.

KU, K-state, et. al. say nothing, bc they are playing all their hands and don't want to look like they have wandering eyes to their prospective suitors, when in fact they do.

In the end, and as they should (I am not criticizing), everyone is looking out for #1. Read the tea leaves that way, and I think you'll be able to spot the PR smokescreens much easier.

All in all, fascinating stuff. Keep up the great info Matt! Been reading lots of sources and your continual updates are unlike anything else out there on the web.

trey 11 years, 2 months ago

Though I'd like to believe that there is still hope for the Big12 to survive, I can't see it. This play by OU is a very smart one...

They are publically saying that they will stay in the Big12, ONLY IF, it's run like the other four strong conferences. Meaning...

Equal partners, equal revenue sharing, commissioner that serves all the members equally.

Which is a perfectly reasonable and appropriate criteria. And would ensure that the Big12 not only survived, but likely THRIVED over the long run. The Big12 has the "assets" (ie. schools, tradition, rivalries, academics, demographics) to be a big-time winner. If (big if) run like the other conferences.

Problem is... no way for Texas to save face in this. They are being painted (rightfully so) as the bully who is getting their come-upence. Even though there deal will not be any better in another conference, I fear they would go to save-face.

And OU now will not be seen as the school that broke up the Big12. They've laid that clearly on Texas footsteps.

BGL and Zenger... keep your focus on the B1G and PAC.

lothario64118 11 years, 2 months ago

late night games, 2 time zone change sux.

Ron Prichard 11 years, 2 months ago

I really don't have a problem with the OU demands that are being reported. Removing Beebe is a no-brainer. That should have been done years ago. Curtailing the LHN and equal revenue sharing should also be workable. Even Texas should be able to see that now--even if they don't want to admit it. You absolutely MUST have equal revenue sharing if you want a stable conference. I think some people are finally realizing this can be a very, very strong conference if it is stable. If we could add BYU, Louisville and possibly WVU (sorry manginorh00lz) we could actually have a very powerful and possibly very stable conference. The question still is, is Texas willing to negotiate?

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

Those lists of which schools are left out of the 64 fail to mention WVU. They were forced to be independent for years since the Big 10 didn't want them. Could happen to them again if the Big East folds on the football side and its true that the ACC, SEC, and B1G aren't interested. So my guess is they would be very willing to join a reformed Big 12. They do play good football.

Hank Cross 11 years, 2 months ago

Beebe is a buffoon and UT's throne dwarf. It was obvious last year when did nothing except encourage the forgotten 5 to beg Bevo for mercy. Two valuable members of the old B8 walked on his watch. If he had an ounce of decency he would resign now and save himself the humiliation.

AlecRaenos 11 years, 2 months ago

I wouldn't necessarily call CU valuable. THose idiots never fit in anyway. Losing Nebraska stung though. IMO Losing Nebraska hurts more than those whining nancies in College Station.

Spencer Goff 11 years, 2 months ago

Yeah man, when I see Nebraska on TV (the Big 10 Network no less) I still think they are supposed to be in the Big 12. It just doesn't feel right.

KUAlum2000 11 years, 2 months ago

I need to go get a tub of popcorn. This just keeps getting better and better!! Almost the same as watching March Madness to see what wild thing will happen next.

Randy Bombardier 11 years, 2 months ago

More like watching golf. Movement is very precise and measured with a lot of whispering in the foreground.

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

I thought today was going to be boring! Here are a couple of thoughts: 1) I wonder if OU and maybe more specifically O-State were getting signals that they did not have full support to join the Pac-12. It's got to be embarrassing to OSU and also Tech that they getting cited for not have acceptable academics. 2) It would really be embarrassing for Tech and OSU to publicly apply to the Pac 12 and not get accepted. If they are getting signals, they probably are doing the smart thing by looking at other alternatives. 3) Does the MU leaks (and remember it was a booster) eliminate MU from consideration or is this just temporary. If MU is eliminated, who becomes the 14th member? Tech? It sounds like the SEC rejected WV. 4) Would the SEC say, this is not worth it and rescind its invitation to A&M? I'm sure 13 members could work. 5) If WV applied to the ACC and the SEC and got rejected, it has to be embarrassing. This should be a cautionary tale for anyone advocating an aggressive approach by KU. The sands are shifting rapidly and as Matt said, it's best to keep all options open. 6) How viable is the conference if the OK schools stay and UT leaves?

jgkojak 11 years, 2 months ago

Very viable - OU/OSU/KU/KSU/MU/Baylor (ho hum)/ISU/maybe TTU

Very easy to add members to that group without dilution.

(for sure Louisville, Cinci, WVU and TCU and even S Florida looking for homes).

blindrabbit 11 years, 2 months ago

Regardless of how this realignment mess turns out, if I was KU Athletic Director, I would be dancing any tune possible to convince the world that KU is serious about improving our football program. We've been "burdened" by the success of our basketball program; knowing that at least one former BB coach discouraged football improvement so as to not compete with his ego.

Tear out the stadium track, since KU is not competitive in Track and Field anymore! Require KU students to stay beyond the half at football games, free beer if you do! Somehow, improve people moving to and after game, free parking at satellite lots! Give up on Arrowhead! Limit JuCo players! Promote more family friendly environment, works for K-State! Add seating (as needed) on track, East side plan, North bowl! Encourage moving the Chief's to anywhere! I'm sick of that yearly bull manure! Try to schedule some top flight or service academy games! Improve town/gown athletic interaction! Hire a top flight PR person! Try to get State to upgrade antiquated Kansas high school sports guidelines!

bad_dog 11 years, 2 months ago

Yeah, I'm sure the players of the home team don't care because why would you want more people supporting you? Heck, they'd probably rather play at LHS or Free State where even fewer fans can attend. In a similar vein of logical enlightment, you probably believe the players on the visiting team wanted the fans to stay so they could make more noise and be disruptive when they're on offense, right?

And we know no one ever purchases refreshments, gear or programs in the second half, right? It all about ticket sales, correct?

bad_dog 11 years, 2 months ago

My, my. Poor, poor KSA. Contrary to your numerous futile denials, you merely choose not to understand. My "broken English" is truly difficult for one to comprehend. Well, let me break it down for you another way. You stated: " The only people that care about fans leaving at halftime are other fans already in attendance at the game. This is a non-issue. What matters is number of tickets sold."

KSA, by virtue of your own admission directly above @ 5:19, "...there are some refreshment sales that are lost." Don't the charities that staff many of these refreshment stands care about lost revenue? Doesn't Kansas Ahtletics care about potential revenue from sales of gear? Don't the University and television stations care about the appearance of a partially filled stadium? Don't the players for both teams care how many fans remain? I did explain that to you above, but alas, I forget you only prefer to address that which is convenient for you and disregard that which contradicts your oft-spouted illogical conclusions. All under the guise of "I can't understand your broken English". To paraphrase the great philosopher Forest Gump: "Lame is as lame does".

Please advise if you still require additional translation. I'll be at the local watering hole.

bad_dog 11 years, 2 months ago

Again, derision of small towns & rural folk. Yet another hallmark of the banned account holder formerly known as KSA 21-3503.

Care to address the substance or perhaps you prefer to add 3 more denials before the cock crows? Probably requires yet another translation. I suggest remedial English classes for you as summer school has come & gone yet again.

TalksForALiving 11 years, 2 months ago

As I said yesterday, this all stems from UT greed.

The former Big 8 schools came from a tradition of understanding what league loyalty meant. As soon as the league office moved to Dallas that was the end of any kind of communication from North to South. In hindsight, who can blame Nebraska and Colorado for feeling abandoned by their conference?

Fortunately, the Oklahoma schools still remember what it takes to be a strong and unified conference - and have the fortitude to stand up to Texas and demand they become one of several rather than just THE ONE.

Say Bye-Bye to Bee-be now. And, while you're at it, move the league office out of Dallas and back to Kansas City - or Oklahoma City, somewhere they understand what it means to be part of something special.

Tony Bandle 11 years, 2 months ago

Way to go you've pi$$ed off two conferences. Want to go for double or nothing??

Fred Davis 11 years, 2 months ago

So it took Oklahoma to demand what everyone around here or with an iota of sense has been saying - GET RID OF BEEBE.

Thank You Oklahoma.

blindrabbit 11 years, 2 months ago

Talks: Conference loyalty fell apart when Wayne Duke left the Big 8 and headed for the Big10. Can't remember when that was in relation to Big 8 SWC castoff combo. I'd say move Big-12 conference headquarters to OKC, not that I trust the Oklahoma's all that much!

joshar 11 years, 2 months ago

If the Big 12 stays together, is this going to happen every year until there is one last team left. Teams keep dropping off. They all need to get together, minus A&M, and ask, who is going to stay? If four out of the nine left say they are leaving, then allow everyone to either apply for other conferences or band up with other the remaining Big East. If everyone is willing to stay, might start looking to expand a little and get a stronger commissioner . Add a few teams, TCU, BYU and possibly Boise State. It's fine to pick up another Texas school but four is enough. Big 12 should be one of the stronger conferences, it just has too big egos.

Marcia Parsons 11 years, 2 months ago

Sounds good, joshar, except that's what they did last year and all 10 members said they were going to stay. Now we see what that was worth. Money seems to trump honor.

TKHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

A&M brings the ball up the court....Baylor steals.....alley-oop to OU.....OU leaping over the Texas defender.....SCORE!!!!! Dan Beebe is gone, the Big XII lives on and the fans storm the court! What a game!

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

KU needs to look out for themselves. Sorry.

Brett Marsteller 11 years, 2 months ago

KSU can do nothing but hold us back. They have nothing to offer.

Hammertoe 11 years, 2 months ago

Other than a 59-7 beat down in last years Sunflower Showdown in FOOTBALL!

willie_fu_fu 11 years, 2 months ago

I gotta say KSU fans must be pissed that the only way they get mentioned in all this realignment talk is as KU's tag-a-long, even with all of KSU's great success vs Kansas in sports last season.

Alohahawk 11 years, 2 months ago

I wonder if Vegas is laying any odds on who goes where for all these conference realignments. I doubt there would be any takers, since nothing seems even close to set in concrete. :-?

Thomas Thompson 11 years, 2 months ago

I would like for someone to stand up to Texas and tell them to share TV revenues equally or take a hike with their LHN. If that means Bebe takes a hike, so be it. Kupops

lothario64118 11 years, 2 months ago

It's MU I don't trust. Even if everything is ironed out, as soon as the Big 10 decides to expand and does offer a spot for MU that school would take off in a minute.

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

Please just blow up the conference already. How can their be any trust between these schools now. If they don't break up, the conference will be held together with band-aids. The same expansion talk will come up next year.

TKHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

Big XII board could probably replace Beebe without him even knowing. He's probably not following any of this anyway.

DevilHawk 11 years, 2 months ago

The comments by OU could be because the Pac opted not to include Oklahoma State and the two schools are trying to stay together.

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

This makes a lot of sense. OU was deadset on leaving. The Pac never really wanted OSU. Something big may have happened. Now there may be the Don't Trust Each Other Conference.

DevilHawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Re: 10:22 pm update:

The statement from the PAC certainly is interesting - and very timely.

Eric Harrison 11 years, 2 months ago

An interesting take on why Kansas seems to wield little to no power (yet puzzling that UConn and others are seeming to have a little).

That said ... I'm finally beginning to feel like UT isn't going to get it's LHN in full force anywhere so why not take the best deal it has (it appears the LHN in the BigXII-2 is the only option not seeking it's complete abolishment), it's current home. So let's talk expansion and not contraction. My Thoughts: 1. WVU 2. TCU 3. BYU 4. AFA 5. Louisville 6. Cincy 7. Houston 8. SMU

pgittemeier09 11 years, 2 months ago

smu and houston have thee smallest available fan rather have colo st louisville and cincy

Matt Warman 11 years, 2 months ago

West Virginia brings a lot of tv sets -- more that Air Force/SMU/Houston combined They bring solid basketball and football traditions too. They rank poorly as a university though -- plus they are in the eastern time zone. Big 12 could bring in 1) wva/cincy/louisville OR look west and add 2) BYU/TCU/AFA

I think the TV people are going to want option 1.

Ludwig Supraphonic 11 years, 2 months ago

The NYTimes link you mention is very clear. The OU/UT fan base >all 8 of the potential expansion schools you list. The KU fanbase>Louisville/Cincy/Houston/SMU combined. I don't think the conference with the most members automatically wins. Review Hx of the Mountain West.

Michael Maris 11 years, 2 months ago

It was a damn joke. About like your blind views of joining the PAC.

Michael Maris 11 years, 2 months ago

I'm thinking that you are Ahperse (incogonito).

All you do is criticize the fans of Kansas that comment on this website (who do not agree with your thoughts and views).

You are calling people that post on here (that don't agree with your views) ignorant for them making comments of possible alternatives.

Well, I think that KU should join the B1G.

So, Pray for the B1G.

Michael Maris 11 years, 2 months ago

If the conference is going to expand back up to 12 teams (assuming that Texas, OU and Okie State stay), then you take Houston (top 10 TV share), Cincy (#34) and Louisville (#50). That is two more cities that are in totally different footprint and are some what regionally positioned. It would be nice to add Tampa-St. Pete (#13 TV Market). But, that would a big stretch if Texas, OU and Okie State stay put in the Big XII Conference.

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

If the Big 12 is saved, they need to get to 12 members and have a play-off. Given the implosion of the Big East, it should be easier to find three new schools. Unfortunately, there aren't alot of desirable schools out there after BYU which gets you to 10. Cincinnati and Louisville are close geographically, but are not even close to being the most popular team in its own city. WV probably gives you a good portion of Pittsburgh. South Florida is intriguing but very isolated from the rest of the conference. Schools like Colorado State and New Mexico are closer but do not elevate the competitiveness of the conference.

I really think you stay out of Texas and eliminate TCU, SMU and Houston. KU in particularly should not support any Texas schools as these are the schools that KU competes with for recruits.

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

You got to be kidding. I live one mile from the Rice campus and run around it every day during my morning run. It is a great university but it has no fans. There are only about 2500 undergrads which means a very small alumni base. For some reason there is 70,000 seat football stadium on campus which hosted a Super Bowl in the 1970s. They get about 15,000 people per game and you can get alot of deal on tickets. If you want to elevate academic profile, Rice is good, but that is not the objective.

By the way, I think KU has a game a Rice scheduled in the next few years. Rice did beat Purdue a couple of weeks ago.

DevilHawk 11 years, 2 months ago

SMU and Houston are currently in C-USA, so that would make sense for the time being. However, TCU is scheduled to join the Big East and is recruiting quite well (5x 4* recruits currently). If the Big East collapses, then we could leave TCU out in the cold. On the other hand, some other major conference could choose to add TCU and enable easier access for the conference to Texas recruits.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

List of things to do if the big 12 is saved:

  1. Fire/Replace Beebe
  2. Deal with the Longhorn Network and revenue sharing
  3. Increase the amount of $$ required to leave the conference.
  4. Expand!

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

Incorporate LHN into a regional network much like the Pac has.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

... and maybe some group therapy to work out those trust issues

kureignman 11 years, 2 months ago

I've felt that for the big 12 to survive they have to get rid of Beebe and increase the buyout. Otherwise we will be going through this again when someone gets upset. The other points are right on as well.

sekjayhawkfan 11 years, 2 months ago

Are there any social media savvy Big 12 supporters out there who would be willing to organize online fan input so those making the decisions know what WE FANS think? (I would, if I only knew how!!) I was once told by an elected state representative that 5 or 6 postcards from the home district on an issue were a "mandate" because so few everyday people contact those making the decisions. Everybody just gripes to each other (or posts their comments here) but how many of us contact the people who are making these "go" or "stay" decisions that will affect us as sports fans and TV consumers? Perhaps now is the time for Big 12 conference fans to make sure those contemplating the abandonment of Middle America know what WE think. (Social media worked in the middle East and they're overthrowing some pretty scary tyrants and dictators there!)

Time to take a stand and let all the university presidents, athletic directors and university regents across the Big 12 know how we feel! Might as well bombard the admissions and public relations people at each school while we're at it, since they count applications and gauge public discontent! Hey - somebody get us started while we all warm up our outboxes!

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

A Facebook page could easily be set up. Last night we could have set up one to "Free KU from K-State".

sekjayhawkfan 11 years, 2 months ago

Funny :0)

If Matt's report is correct - and Missouri's Deaton is drawing up a Hail Mary play - then NOW is the perfect time to mount a web offensive to make sure the rest of the country knows loyal Big 12 FANS aren't going down without a fight! In today’s new media world, all universities have Facebook pages, and the news media obsesses on reporting stories of consumer uprisings! That's why we need an all-out web campaign right NOW - to make sure public (i.e. government) officials running Big 12 schools know they can't "sell out" to TV networks and the "left" and "right" coasts at the expense of student athletes and middle America college sports fans! (Non-Facebookers like me will need to find another vehicle for our input, but what do we have to lose?!!)

Eric Harrison 11 years, 2 months ago

Your a joke if you don't think WVU isn't a good option. Sure geographically it doesn't make the most sense, but their market (DC, Pittsburgh, etc.) is worth it as an 'add-on'. And what else are they going to do. You obviously didn't read the link provided if you think SMU is in the vicinity of WVU (not to mention the football product and facilities differences).
The only issue becomes the division formatting: North: KU, KState, Mizzou, WVU, ISU, BYU South: UT, OU, OSU, TT, Baylor, TCU

East: WVU, Mizzou, ISU, KU, KState, UT West: BYU, TT, TCU, OU, OkState, Baylor (this one is decent)

Zipper1: OU, KU, KState, TCU, Texas Tech, Iowa State Zipper2: OkSt, Mizzou, WVU, Baylor, UT, BYU (the splitting of the rivals doesn't make sense with Iowa State, KState, TCU, BYU, and WVU)

bad_dog 11 years, 2 months ago

Verbalized despise toward and denigration of rural folk.

Yet another indicia of the banned poster formerly known as KSA 21-3503.

Countdown to yet another transparent and unbelievable "Who, me?" from KSA 21-3503 in 3,2,1...

bad_dog 11 years, 2 months ago

Just as predicted, right on cue, KSA. Right on cue, albeit pretty weak.

It took you all of 2 minutes to respond with that oh so believable, ersatz denial.

Perhaps you'll pray for me too?

Thanks, but no thanks.

Eric Harrison 11 years, 2 months ago

Yes, I'm aware its not a perfect east-west (namely the oklahoma's, KStates, but switching them out makes for pretty unbalanced divisions).

Also PS my reference to the link was this article ( about major markets and adjusting them to city interest. ie Houston is likely the third (if not 4-6th) most popular college in a pro-sports heavy town. NOT the major win that the 10th biggest market would infer.

blindrabbit 11 years, 2 months ago

kueric: West Virginia U. is a pariah back East; nobody (B1G, SEC, ACC and even their current home BigEast) wants them and there are reasons. Ever been to Wset Virginia, and we thought Arkansas was bed! Been to games in Morgantown, students and crowds are awful, kinda hicky. And you advocate adding them here, talk about a "fish out of water". I'd go for western add-on's among them (maybe) BYU, Boise, Colorado St., New Mexico, Rice, Houston, TCU or SMU

Eric Harrison 11 years, 2 months ago

I completely get it, being in DC I know all about WVU and their couch burning, backwoods redneck filled city that make Lubbock, Manhattan and even Bryan-College Station seem civilized. It's a hole and their fan-base is proud to be trash-y (but seriously and I mean plenty of offense/judgement passed: KState, A&M, Texas Tech, Iowa State aren't exactly Yale, Virginia, Rice and USC in terms of fanbase/student body), true. But the remaining BigXII(-3+3) would be a league needing anything possible to keep it as strong as possible. Potentially with our pick of the leftovers who else could it be other than WVU? Louisville? Cincy? AFA? CSU? Houston? Not as strong of programs, athletic departments, fan bases, facilities (Louisville and Cincy maybe, but even they are only slight upgrades to the 'fit' and 'culture' of the Big 12. I'll even give you that Cincy is making upgrades to it's football facilities, but it's not a college city (they probably cheer for the Bengals and Ohio State and probably Notre Dame and the Colts plus maybe even Kentucky, Louisville and/or the Browns before they check on the Bearcats score). I like AFA and a lot, but it's not a move that wins conference realignment, stability and money flowing. Cincy and Louisville bring basketball ... who gives a RIP about that in this scenario?!? Only KU fans.

Robert Lofthouse 11 years, 2 months ago

~ Bring in Romney as interim commissioner, charge him to do what he did with the Salt Lake Olympics years ago - turn the thing around and put the B12 on solid footing - then hire a marketing genius as full time commissioner and aggressively transform the B12 into the first 16 team super conference that includes ND to balance out UT and OU ~ leaving the other conferences standing in their dust to wonder what happened to them..

Varlo52 11 years, 2 months ago

I have finally come to the conclusion that we have been attempting to treat the symptoms, not the disease. Expel Texas and and the league would heal overnight.

Matthew Pyle 11 years, 2 months ago

Crickets from Lawrence, KS.... waiting for the shoe to drop perhaps? I certainly hope not. This could be catastrophic for the University if we get out maneuvered and end up in a sub par conference. Nobody seems concerned but the freaking fans....

TalksForALiving 11 years, 2 months ago

The Big 12 has to keep television markets in mind when expanding. Those untapped major midwest/mountain markets are:

  1. Chicago
  2. Houston
  3. Minneapolis
  4. Denver
  5. Salt Lake City
  6. Las Vegas

Who fits the footprint?

Eric Harrison 11 years, 2 months ago

Chicago - B1G owns it with Northwestern, Illinois, Wisconsin and now Nebraska (the BigXII's in is Kansas, Iowa State ... can't get in there directly) Houston - It's a Texans city. Followed by A&M then a distance to UT followed by Tech, LSU and TCU who are on par with Houston in that town. Houston (along with UT, TT AND TCU) does 'get' you half a Houston market (between LSU and A&M getting the other half). Another market you can't really get into directly. Minneapolis- Is all Minnesota all the time, its the only D1 state school. How on earth do you plan on getting in there otherwise? Denver - A pro town. CU the biggest, CSU the second, but their program and facilities aren't up to BCS level. KU has a stron presence, and AFA wouldn't hurt, but it's a tough nut to crack. Salt Lake is a Utes town. BYU is big, but it's big where ever Mormons are (Phoenix, some parts of Texas, California, etc.)
Vegas - Doesn't care about college at all and will be a Pac10 town and more of a gamblers paradise than college sports town.
as your own

Of the schools out there (BigEast, CUSA, Independ, etc.) WVU, Cincy, Louisville, BYU, AFA, Houston, TCU, SMU, Tulane, USF, UCF are your only real options. The Florida schools seem a bit too far away. SMU and Tulane don't have the facilities. You're left with WVU,, Cincy, Louis, BYU, AFA, Houston, and TCU. I'd prefer on-field talent AND TV sets of the remaining and give me WVU, TCU, and BYU. I'll take AFA as my 4th choice then Cincy 5th. And Louisville 6th.

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

Why do you think Houston is untapped? UT is more popular here than A&M and TT is also more popular than Rice or Houston. While UT and A&M have similar alumni bases, those who did not go to college or went to smaller universities typically side with UT. You see slightly more burnt orange here than maroon.

blindrabbit 11 years, 2 months ago

Talks: The Denver Rockies and Broncos know that only too well; fan support locked up from the following States (yeh, Know populations are not large) Colorado, Montana, Idaho, Utah, Wyoming, New Mexico Western Kansas and Nebraska and parts of Nevada and Arizona.

Hammertoe 11 years, 2 months ago

Mizzou to the SEC, K-State and ku left to join the Big East with the other step children. That could happen.. 6 Million people and 40 wins in the last 4 years in Football make Mizzou sexy to any conference..

NOVAhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Jeanshorts are not sexy to anyone. Completely off topic...sorry...just trying to lighten it up a little in here.

NOVAhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Well it's true that their idea of a formalwear is a Tommy Hilfiger shirt tucked into carpenter jeans, finished off with a pair of Doc Martens. But I would contend that the concept of "jorts" is even more relevant to our friends in the east. Friends, that sadly, we need to work with to find the best way out of this mess.

See, I made the post somewhat relevant...

Pitthawk34 11 years, 2 months ago

Dont forget the Old English to top things off.

Sam Constance 11 years, 2 months ago

No, Manhattan is Carhartt and Dickies.

Columbia is jean shorts and wife beaters.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

Well I guess there are worst fates than being the prettiest of the remaining stepchildren....

Funhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

"...the power shifts back to Texas, which would likely try to make OU pay for trying to pull a fast one."

Remember the "Dallas" TV soap opera about the Ewings? If the University of Texas is J R, the University of Oklahoma is Sue Ellen.

Spencer Goff 11 years, 2 months ago

Look, even if OU/OSU couldn't somehow get into the Pac 12 (which I do not think for a second that is anything other than the UT reporting machine at work) what makes anybody think the SEC wouldn't snap them both up in a second.

If the Pac 12 waffles at all, and OU and OSU are out of the Big 12 searching for a taker, the SEC would likely injure their fingers typing in phone digits.

This is how UT operates, it is how this conference has been turned into a pile of crap.

If you try to fix it by keeping UT alongside its conference mates it "flirts" with other conferences by leaking emails and phone calls from Ohio State. It tells you that "it can go anywhere and take its brothers too!"

There are only two real fixes here: kick their asses out of the league, write them off as bad apples, and if you are so concerned with the state of Texas then pick up TCU as a start. Or give in and be a stool boy forever.

I would begin the fix by letting Texas go. Then I would send Beebe down to College Station to pleasure their Board of Regents HOW EVER THEY WANT right before he gets his walking papers, maybe they would come back in. Either way that is win-win. But NOBODY will do that because they all want to play with UT. They complain about the monster, yet they facilitate the monster.

Ever seen the Wal Mart episode of South Park? UT isn't the problem, they are just the egomaniac. Well, at least not all of the problem. No, no, they are not alone.

WE'RE THE PROBLEM. We facilitate the crap because nobody has the balls to say, "No, we are done. If you can get a better deal and situation playing in another conference then so be it." Nobody in the Big 12 has any cajones, except maybe OU, finally. And honestly, UT probably will just keep calling their bluff until you see OU and OSU lining up against USC or LSU. Doesn't sound like a bluff to me, just ask A&M if the SEC is ready to expand.

At one point this conference had three of the ten most successful football programs in college history playing ball here, four of the top twenty. This time next week it will be lucky to have any of them, and not be in "talks" with the Big (L)East football schools.

The cycle never stops unless this thing implodes. This is a joke.

Steve Brown 11 years, 2 months ago

yes, we are the problem, I support renewing the B12 w.out Texas.

NOVAhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

agreed... I believe that we can better position ourselves for acceptance in the B1G if we can sell them 2nd oldest college football rivalry in the nation.

BoiseHawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Knee-jerk opinions are all we have at this point.

Spencer Goff 11 years, 2 months ago

I agree, because unless we are planning on trying to go with them, it means that "rivalry" selling point is gone.

I feel like KU will get looked at by a BCS conference, but honestly, if we lose Mizzou in this and they do not throw our name in the hat, we have no allies. I know we hate them on the field, but oddly, we have a pretty strong relationship in the offices and academics. I actually had a theory, at one point, that we had a grad student exchange program with them because it just felt like some of us went that way, and they sent some of theirs back. But it was probably to keep the gene pool from getting too thin, so who knows.

Right now, I'm just so pi$$ed about all of this. How in the hell did this thing get so screwed up?

Unless BGL has some dirty deed worked under the table somewhere, I see us as headed to the Big (L)East circus. Which is basically a conference composed of schools trying to buff their resumes to get into one of the potential power 16's. Sounds like a stable situation to me....




Somebody kill that stupid bull and leave it on the steps of their state capital.

ahpersecoachingexperience 11 years, 2 months ago


OU is upset because UT is showing a second game in on tln. A second game that every other big 12 ad said NO to except one... Sheahorn!!!!!!!!

Brett Marsteller 11 years, 2 months ago

Listening to local sports talk here in Michigan and they are saying how they want KU. Not all of the schools leaving their confrences can be a powerhouse (Syr, Pitt) and having a top 5 bball program does have some pull. Who knows... Big Ten would be nice though. I really do think that KU has more options then they are saying.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

You're prlly right about the B1G wanting ND for expansion... but there's a slim chance Mizzou and KU still get an invite simply because the B1G is falling behind in the conference movement.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

I have a number of Mizzou friends (who have no affiliation with the athletic department), they all seem to want to head to the B1G over the SEC. Considering the chancellor of Mizzou is leading the "save the big 12" movement... my thoughts are that Mizzou is seeing the SEC as a fire escape from the Big 12 in the event it collapses. They'd probably accept an offer from the B1G on the spot (so would KU)... but the B1G doesnt appear to be in a hurry to expand further.

Lets face it, Mizzou would fare even worse than Texas A&M in the SEC.

ahpersecoachingexperience 11 years, 2 months ago

Listen the two smartest people when it comes to realignment are Larry Scott and me. The PAC is in a total position of power to say yes to OU and no to OSU. We, yes we, know that the same can be done with TT. If we let these schools in because UT and OU say we have to then it's a sign of weekness and bending over on our part. So tell your little brothers to stay at home and we will go after schools like ku, MU, byu, to further expand our market exposure.

OU UT Ku Insert school To the PAC

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

And MU. Yes, from their perspective that's the best combo. But if UT doesn't want to play nice, then who would replace them? I'd say OSU.

AlecRaenos 11 years, 2 months ago

PAC wont get OU without OSU. They are going to whatever conference they end up together. No matter what kind of pressure PAC exerts. OU will NOT go anywhere without OSU. Wish in one hand sh*t in another, PAC wont get OU and UT without their siblings.

Andy Tweedy 11 years, 2 months ago

Maybe someone already said this, but this Misery thing is funny! And it is EXACTLY why our leadership has been smart to keep their mouths shut! Nothing good can come out of public posturing, especially if you aren't someone with a lot of power in the game. I can't tell anybody what SZ and BGL have been up to, but I'm willing to bet it's a lot more than some on here are giving them credit for.

DallasJayhawk1 11 years, 2 months ago

Makes sense if Pac votes no. I don't blame them.

DallasJayhawk1 11 years, 2 months ago

5:36 Update: reports of Mizzery to SEC and Auburn would move to east division--this after SEC refutes the rumor.

I can't take this anymore. I was all ready to say Big12 looks like it really has some legs with OU's demands for Beebe to be gone---now this bomb.

jphog 11 years, 2 months ago

Why not try to get OU to go with us to the Big 10? Then the Big 10 would just need to pull in UT, Notre Dame and another school to complete the madness.

Kristen Downing 11 years, 2 months ago

Looks like the Big East was moving before the Big12 to add teams. Are we the slowest conference always?

Jayhawk444 11 years, 2 months ago

Don't forget the reports that the Big12 had already contacted BYU and Arkansas and had targeted 3 other institutions (WVU, Pitt, and ???) before OU went public with its "we're looking" statement about 3 weeks ago

Spencer Goff 11 years, 2 months ago

You are basically asking if Dan Beebe was the dumbest of the dumb. Yeah man, he was driving that bus full steam ahead.

trey 11 years, 2 months ago

Don't get fooled, this latest talk of OU Demands, and Mizzou Hail Mary to "save the Big12" is a big CYA. OU and Mizzou don't want to be seen as the ones that break up the Big12. They're doing a smart thing... getting their demands of the league and Texas out in public. Stay out of court with Baylor and public opinion.

I'm unfortunately not seeing today's developments good for KU...

MU is now in a great position with SEC as their worst-case scenario (been telling you NO WAY they were going to the leftover conference). MU to SEC is bad for us. Because MU/KU combo our best shot at B1G.

OU Calling out Texas (though right) likely will send Texas PAC'ing, along with TTech. Will be ironic that OU and Texas end up together (or planned?). But means no slots for KU in PAC.

To say out of the Leftover League, we need...

B1G to "wake up" and grab MU/KU and pick 2 (ND, Texas, Rutgers, ISU, K-State). PAC to say "no thanks" to OSU or TTech. Still don't see ACC or SEC as realistic.

Please... anything but the Leftover League.

willie_fu_fu 11 years, 2 months ago

I'd take the B1G with Missouri, Rutgers and ND in a Heartbeat.

franklin2739 11 years, 2 months ago

Look, why would the Big 12 stay together after all the crap we have been put through by the UT, OU (OSU by default), and MU. These schools do not trust one another in this league. I'm tired of the drama and just want this thing to implode as soon as possible, so I can get back to life. A huge TV contract did not fix the problems in this conference. the teams who have left or are tearing this confrence apart voted against equal revenue sharing because it did not bennifit them. Now they want it? this is a mess that has to do with egos and media types proclaiming the 16 team conference era is coming. Its not going to get better with a new commisioner. The Big 12 can't patch up this mess. It is sad. Really sad but true.

Kevin Randell 11 years, 2 months ago

Ouch....well...may be we should print that off...give it to Gill and the boys and let them do something about it!

willie_fu_fu 11 years, 2 months ago

Yeah like hang it in the locker room as motivation to never let that happen again.

Randy Bombardier 11 years, 2 months ago

The SEC is starting to get me ticked. The Big12 is the closest thing to competition they have. If all of our players took steroids and played for pay like they do down there we'd be winning just as many championships. It is all about football down there. Football is God in the South. They will do anything to keep their dominance. This is war. We need to fire Beebe and get someone in there who is going to kick some SEC tail. Make an offer that Arkansas can't refuse. Get Kentucky and Tennessee, LSU and the Mississippi schools. This is what I would like to see, a strong, united, fair, Big 12 expanding to 16.

In lieu of that, Think Big12. The chances of KU AND KSU going together to the Big just got a whole lot more probable. The chances of KU going to the Big now is about 80%.

Bville Hawk 11 years, 2 months ago

inteldesign, you say " Make an offer that Arkansas can't refuse."

An offer like giving them a disproportionate piece of the Tier 1,2, and or 3 TV revenue? I think that's already been tried...

Ryan Mullen 11 years, 2 months ago

Mizzou is so dumb. If they want to go to the worst acedemic conference and get there brains beat in let them.

Ryan Mullen 11 years, 2 months ago

Yea me too. I am at work at sometimes just type real fast without looking at what I posted.

Ryan Mullen 11 years, 2 months ago

Gosh dangit. Alright I need to slow down.

NOVAhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

The University's silence on this subject has gone on long enough. How do we know that they are seriously considering options outside of B12's survival? As much as I hate it, a package deal with Mizzou is our best shot at landing somewhere decent and all indications are that they are positioning themselves to join their friends in the dirty south and leave us with the untouchables. Come on KU, give me something!

willie_fu_fu 11 years, 2 months ago

I would not at all be suprised if KU has an offer of some sort and was told not to say anything due to the uncertainty of everything else that's going on. Kinda like how Mangino brought in a few "suprise recruits" that he kept hidden from other teams till they were able to qualify.

TheColonel 11 years, 2 months ago

I think both Missouri rumors are true. Here is why:

1) it is consistent with the comments the Auburn AD made a few weeks back about being willing to move to the SEC east to accommodate expansion 2) it fits with the earlier reports that the SEC was angry that Missouri to SEC had been leaked and exposed them to potential litigation (Baylor are such great team players) 3) it fits that Missouri would try to perform damage control by leading a hail-mary pass to save Big 12. If it succeeds, great, Big 12 is saved. If it fails, oh well, we're off to the SEC and don't sue us Baylor, we tried to help!

TheColonel 11 years, 2 months ago

I think we should make "pacKUp" t-shirts? anyone? :-p

Jeff Coffman 11 years, 2 months ago

I like it, who knew KU and the PAC fit so nicely together!!

Stephan123 11 years, 2 months ago

If OU leaves and is offered an invitation by the PAC, OSU will not be part of that invitation. The PAC can probably force this to happen as they have the power. Tech into the PAC seems improbable. KSU has little or no chance. KU, on the other hand, may be an option for PAC selection. Texas is too much of a mess and potential hazard to the PAC's health. So what two additional teams could become candidates to make the PAC a 16 team conference? Can not think of any acceptable ones. If that is true, the PAC probably will not expand at all and stay at 12.

JayhawkLifer 11 years, 2 months ago

You know what would be really funny ( & ironic). MU goes to the SEC & the Big10 comes calling for KU since MU bolted! I know it is probably out of the realm of possibility, but it would be great nonetheless!

Andy Tweedy 11 years, 2 months ago

I don't know where Misery will play next year, but I do know one thing:


Josh Galler 11 years, 2 months ago

My prob

Big 12 with out OU.OSU and merge with BYU and Big East 30% Big 12 without OU OSU UT Tech and merge with BYU/Big East 30% Big 10 20% ACC 10% Pac 10%

jaybate 11 years, 2 months ago

I still think this is most likely to shake out along infrastructure lines.

The only question is what infrastructure is most important to Texas at this time.

Fortifying the existing Super Corridor?

Or establishing east-west lateral off the Super Corridor across the southern tier of USA--from SEC country, through Texas and on to Pac 10+N country?

If the Super Corridor is most important, then Texas stays in the B12, reduces its revenue asymmetry, keeps TAM going to SEC, and lets the B12 stand pat.

If establishing an east west lateral off the Super Corridor is more crucial, then Texas forms a B12/Big East hybrid (in hopes of stemming the Super Corridor up into the Northeast later), sends TAM to SEC, and OU to Pac 10+N, and works a super conference merger with SEC/B12 remnants/Pac 10+N a year or two down the road.

Okham's Razor suggests preserving the Super Corridor status quo is simpler, and less risk, so Texas stays in B12 and makes whatever concessions at the 11th hour required to hold the B12 together to keep UT's BOR and the big power interests it reflects satisfied...for now.

On the other hand, Texas oligarchy again and again evidences a tendency towards grandiosity and so the latter option is quite possible, regardless of how greatly fraught its complexity and inevitable unforeseen consequences would be.

buckleyhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

I sort of agree with this, except that Aggies hate (with emphasis) UT, especially after the LHN bit, and will not stay with UT any longer. With that, the writing is on the wall...the big boys (namely OU) do not want to be a part of a conference that is extremely unstable (it was already unstable before this whole mess).

Like most of us have been saying, the instability makes it so that everybody needs to get out before the roof collapses...which makes SZ's comments a couple of weeks ago at the game disappointing.

I really hope that the "silence" coming out of KU means backroom deals have been/are being made. I for one, unfortunately, am not real hopeful however.

FLJHK 11 years, 2 months ago

About time you chimed in. Been missing your sage commentary.

scraptown 11 years, 2 months ago

OU and OSU are a package deal, as is UT and TT, you can hope and pray they're not, but sorry friend, they're not seperating, to believe otherwise is foolish. If there's no package, then there's no deal, and they remain in big12. MU has their fall back, and they'll be in the SEC if and when the Big12 falls apart. But this leaves a glimmer of hope for the KSU/KU package to Big10, because believe me, that's going to be a package too. Ol' Brownback isn't going to let his alma mater be left out in the cold while the school from the district that didn't support him can prosper in a big name league. More than likely we're looking at a hybrid big east/big12, though I'm starting to think the PAC is second guessing further expansion, and if that happens, the Big12 will survive with the addition of at least 3 more schools...

lama 11 years, 2 months ago

There's no way Tech and UT are a package deal. UT would throw them under the bus in a flash. If the Texas Legislature didn't care about UT and A&M separarting, Tech won't be a blip.

Also, Brownback has no leverage with the Big 10, and neither does KU.

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

Exactly. Brownback has nothing to do with it. And how many times does it have to be pointed out that the B1G will NEVER take KSU. They are not an AAU school. They have Tier 3 academics. How do you think Snyder can recruit any JUCO player he wants. Plus, the B1G is too smart to take 2 schools from a small state like Kansas. Just wishful thinking by purple fans.

scraptown 11 years, 2 months ago

Maybe you're right, but I bet when the dust settles, TT is playing with UT, and KSU is playing with KU, and the reason for both is politics.

Mike Skiles 11 years, 2 months ago

Fire Beebe? He deserves it, and the conference schools should happily vote him out for sheer incompetence. I for one, would pay for a ticket to be in the line to give him a kick in the rear on his way out the door.

NOVAhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

So the PAC votes later this week on Eastward expansion. Is this an approval vote on OU, Texas and Co or simply a head-count to see where the current members stand? In either case, I hope KU has a contingency plan in place like Mizzou seems to...

DevilHawk 11 years, 2 months ago

"University of Oklahoma President David Boren has said the two in-state rivals will remain in the same league whether they decide to stay in the Big 12 or join the Pac-12.

"Whatever we do, we're going to do it together, and I think that's very good news for the state of Oklahoma," Boren said."

Still sounds as though the PAC doesn't want Oklahoma State, although that might have changed based on the Mizzou-to-SEC comment. If the PAC was looking at adding OU, UT, KU, and Mizzou, then OSU can fill Mizzou's spot as Mizzou goes to the SEC.

Overall, this seems like fairly good news for KU, unless we absorb the Big East remains. However, even if that happens, it's possible that the new conference wouldn't last long as the B1G offers a spot to KU.

Kevin Heath 11 years, 2 months ago

I'm going to bring up something which I haven't heard much about, but I believe to be a valid point of concern in Texas. Now I have strong connections in Texas to say the, not connections in the know or any inside information...but information about what the average Texan is saying about all this.

Texans are concerned that their Texas schools won't be playing other Texas schools. As it stands now TCU is going to the Big East and aTm is going to the SEC. If Baylor gets left in the cold and UT goes to the Pac 12 with or without Tech that really fragments the Texas schools. No matter what any Texas fan says about the other schools in the conference, they like that their road games are largely in Texas (Austin, Lubbock, Waco, College Station) and Oklahoma (Norman and Stillwater). People in Texas ARE ABSOLUTELY talking about not wanting to have to travel to Arizona, California, Washington, Utah, and Colorado for road games. Like them or not, they travel. The average Texan likes playing close to home so they have a chance to go to games.

The other thing that is being talked about A recruiting. People are saying these Texas kids like to play in Texas because they play so many games IN TEXAS. As a potential recruit, if I'm going to be playing a lot of games in California and I'm from Texas, well, I might as well consider that offer from Cal or Stanford. One of the reasons the kids in Texas stay in Texas is because they get to STAY in Texas. They get to play in front of their families.

Now I don't know if this matters for you know what to anybody who is anybody in the decision making process, but these are real concerns talked about daily by your average Texan regarding the conference realignment process.

Jayhawk1116 11 years, 2 months ago

It's a great point, but (sadly) nobody with power seems to care about the "student" athlete or the fans. All they care about are TVs.

Jabberhawky 11 years, 2 months ago

Nope -- I think you're wrong, here. They damned well care about the "student" athletes they're targeting as recruits. And, as Westcoast notes, lots of Texas kids want to play in Texas. Reduced the number of times they'll be playing at (or near) home -- and you've eliminated a major reason for staying at home...

Jabberhawky 11 years, 2 months ago

Westcoast --

I've gotta say (as someone who grew up in Texas and knows the mentality down there) I think you're spot on. It doesn't mean UT won't bolt for what it perceives to be greener pastures -- but the points you raise make perfect sense from a Texan's perspective. Well done, sir.

Spencer Goff 11 years, 2 months ago

"Texans are concerned that their Texas schools won't be playing other Texas schools. As it stands now TCU is going to the Big East and aTm is going to the SEC."

No offense, but not a damn piece of me feels sorry for any of the Texas football fans of any school. I understand that you are saying Texas fans don't want this, that you are making observation, so don't read this as an attack at you. But here is how I feel about this:

They lose their rivalry, sorry.

Other states lose their rivalry, incoming wealth, possibly BCS status, and have to work their ass off to get into a good situation.

Not to mention, no city in all of this is going to suffer as much as Kansas City. Big 12 tournament gone. KU/MU game at Arrowhead, in doubt. City composed of four or five different conference foes that enjoy the sports season (ISU, NU, KU, KSU, MU) because they can razz each other. Gone.

All so UT can have their damn network, control a conference, and puff their chest out.

buckleyhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Has anyone thought about or mentioned the fact that this is going down during a period in time when UT has been seriously sub-par (UT standards) in football? Just wondering what kind of impact that had on any of this...

Kyle Sybesma 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt I think you are doing a great job. This can't be easy for a journalist who is looking for facts to report and all you get is rumors from "credible unnamed sources". We appreciate all the info you have given us. This has been the best soap opra ever for sports fans.

We've heard all the rumors about KU and UT to the ACC. KU taking T Tech's spot with UT, OU, OSU to the PAC 12, KU, UT and MU to the SEC. What we haven't heard is any "credible sources" saying KU is going to the Big 10 which tells me......................KU is going to the BIG 10 when all this is said and done. That just seems to be the way it works.

buckleyhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

I don't know that OU (and to a lesser extent, MU) ruling the roost is much better than having OU and UT. Without UT this conference becomes Mountain West-heavy (in the Bud/Bud Light sense - because of OU), if you know what I mean...

You are dead-on about Beebe, though. That should have happened a while ago (read: 1+ year ago).

franklin2739 11 years, 2 months ago

We cannot kick UT out. It won't happen. Yes, they are a problem and will be a problem until the state of TX leaves the union. UT and OK are the big 12 in terms of football dollars. OK would never stay in this conference without UT and they might not stay in this conference with UT. That is where we are.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

"until the state of TX leaves the union"


Randy Bombardier 11 years, 2 months ago

KU to Big is going to happen. The silence is deafening. I think the Kansas Board of Regents is not meeting like it is an afterthought or to wring their hands. Our administration has been very quiet. The Big has been very quiet. I think I know why. Like MU, we are just waiting. If OU stays, MU stays, Texas shares, they do nothing. But if the rest make the move, we do too. I think it is a done deal folks. I could be wrong, but I think we are going to come out as the class act of this whole thing.

Andy Tweedy 11 years, 2 months ago

...and I think Kate Beckinsale is going to be by to pick me up any minute. Why? Because she hasn't said a word about it!!! Just Kidding! But...I hope you're right, although I'm a little skeptical that the silence means anything.

willie_fu_fu 11 years, 2 months ago

It seemed like when Nebraska was headed to the B1G one thing that came up alot was research and money for research. The B1G could be looking at Kansas and what will happen now that Kansas is applying for designation as the National Cancer Center Institute.

statesupporter 11 years, 2 months ago

Yes, KU is the real deal in this, as is K-State with the bio-science research. What our state may lack in television sets, is made up for in real academic progress. I am not thinking both schools need to stay together. But they both provide a lot to any conference they join. We should be proud of our state's recent accomplishments in these areas.

jmason 11 years, 2 months ago

Per ESPN and the Birmingham newspaper, Missouri has informally agreed to join the SEC. The BOR need to get on this quickly and make sure that KU doesn't need to watch out and help their little sister to the west.

Andrew Washington 11 years, 2 months ago

Are we likely to loose our rivalry with mizzou then?

blindrabbit 11 years, 2 months ago

If KU to B1G, will Iowa State go also, they are AAU, would make 14 teams. What would be K-Sates fortunes?

Bville Hawk 11 years, 2 months ago

The Big 10 is most appealing in a lot of ways, but I'm afraid if we end up in the Big 10 we can kiss goodby any Texas recruiting connections we've built up. Since we would be playing all of our conference games north of I70 and most north of I80 I can't see many Texas or Oklahoma kids wanting to play football for Kansas.

olathefbfan 11 years, 2 months ago

K-States fortunes are tied to KU, and vice-versa. Regardless of what Matt thinks or is hearing from KU administrators. The BOR and politicians in the state won't have it any other way (and for those who think otherwise, Lawrence is not particularly beloved outside of, well...Lawrence). Any democrats in positions of power in this state? No. And I say that as a democrat myself. Lawrence is viewed as the unwanted Berkeley of KS.

Memories on this MB seem to be short. Does anyone remember last year, when the first round of this Groundhog Day experience was taking place? The BOR issued the following statement to the Topeka CJ: "KU and K-State will always be in the same conference together. There's not going to be a split."

Nothing has changed. Maybe a little less hubris is called for, fellas, and a little more reality. From a cursory glance at MB's for the other schools, KU and TT seem to be the only ones spending a great deal of time and energy blasting other schools in the conference in an effort to build themselves up. (Okay, I haven't checked any Baylor sites).

Lew Perkins spelled it out when interviewed about the goings-on last year. There weren't any (decent) conferences lining up to invite either school. Of course, sure, sure, both schools have been talking to conferences this year, but if either had an invite somewhere decent they probably would have jumped at it, or at least leaked the info to the press (like everyone with an actual or pretend offer seems to be doing in this conference).

All of this said, here's to ALL the schools in the conference landing in a good place. My guess is we are surviving here, in these discussions, on but a fragment of what's actually taking place behind closed doors.

statesupporter 11 years, 2 months ago

I don't pretend to know much, but I am thinking the B1G would be hard pressed not to include Iowa State. We are talking about millions of dollars at stake for that state each year. I know the corn crop is decent and all, but they will not sit idle with an in-state school already in the conference. This is not Baylor vs. TCU; private institutions in which conflict cannot be controlled. We are talking about state funded organizations that will do everything in their power to include each other. I also think KU is sitting very pretty here. However, the B1G could only go to 14 like the ACC/SEC and Pac might do. That could close doors very quickly for Kansas, but leave better leftovers for a conference. That is where this might get even more interesting for the K-State's, Oklahoma State's, Texas Tech's. If Texas and OU go Pac14, Missouri and A&M go SEC14, ACC stays14, the B1G will go for Rutgers and ND. If ND declines, don't be suprised if Iowa State gets the nod. How could the state of Iowa not raise hell if they didn't? Easy question, they would, and the B1G would have to listen because they are going to be the last to act. Sometimes luxuries come with strings attached.

Spencer Goff 11 years, 2 months ago

Yeah, I'm seeing the Mizzou to SEC thing all over ESPN. I'm expecting Matt to post an update at some point. I'm sure he is scrambling like mad at the moment.

I keep hoping we find a home once the dust settles. Someplace is going to have an opening, it is up to our chancellor to snag one of those openings.

If we end up as a without fire her. If we end up in the B1G she has a job for life.

Tradition has obviously gone out the window, you only get to keep your rivalry if you are UT and OU. So I'm eagerly expecting nothing but drivel out of our board of regents on Thursday. "We would like to preserve our traditions... blah blah blah.... Do what's best for ALL of the state of Kansas... blah blah blah..." Meaningless drivel and politically correct answers at a time that requires decisive action, always a good fix.

I keep asking God to level UT's area codes, yet he hits Guatemala twice. "Lord... It is spelled A-U-S-T-I-N. If you put your finger on San Antonio just follow I-35 north. You can't miss it. Earthquake of 10.0 magnitude is fine. A meteor, within reason, is fine. Can't risk too much fallout. An epic flood is fine. I'm workable."

statesupporter 11 years, 2 months ago

Doing the best for your state is more than blah, blah, blah. But....If we can get at least one of our schools into the Big 10, that is very good for our state. If not invited, which I think is unlikey if KU get the invite, K-State would find a good situation with schools that they have more in common with than most would think. Both of our larger institutions are wonderful, and nothing is wrong with either. We should be proud of both and work together to secure the future for our future students.

SeattleTom 11 years, 2 months ago

If people haven't been following all this insanity. The clearest thing is today. I point people to the headlines. Every site I go to has 2 headlines:

Missouri with a Hail Mary to save the Big 12 and

Missouri leaving the Big 12 to bolt to the SEC

The weird thing for Kansas is the ACC is a great fit except for geography and the Big Ten seems likely to take Kansas because of geography (I can't see 4 options better for Big Ten unless they raid Maryland and Virginia)

buckleyhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Nothing new here, but (beyond the theater analogy) an interesting take from every Kansas Citian's favorite liberal free paper...

Bville Hawk 11 years, 2 months ago

I liked the theater analogy. A tragic farce(?) is being played out for our enjoyment.

Jeff Coffman 11 years, 2 months ago

Without Texas, the Big XII falls.

If OU leaves, Texas is going to look elsewhere, because they don't think the same amount of money is there.

Ultimately, the Big XII is gone.

So with that premise, where are we going....the first place that offers us.

Right now there isn't a lot of movement in the Big XII because of the threat of lawsuits. The SEC is going to pick up at least one more school from the Big XII (probably MU, but if OU/OSU can't get into the PAC), OU/OSU will be in the SEC.

Immediately, the dual will be on for UT and KU, the ACC, the Big Ten and the PAC 12 will make a move for those schools. Personally, the Big Ten is the best bet.

The one thing that really scares me is if the ACC goes after UT and ND, the Big Ten won't come after us at that point.

However, UT, ND, KU and Rutgers (or ISU) would make the Big Ten expand. And don't think they haven't been talking to both ND and UT.

Vernon Riggs 11 years, 2 months ago

How many Conferences can Mizzou anger? B1G? SEC?

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

Remember last year when Mizzou was widely reported to be already in the B1G? Didn't happen. It may possibly be true that the SEC has offered, but more likely just talks. Anyway if it is true, I don't think Jim Delaney will let the SEC approach that close to B1G land. I'm sure before they accept, there will be talks with the B1G. And if they take Mizzou, they will probably take KU. Who else? Notre Dame isnt going to budge yet, Rutgers is more interested in the ACC, and Iowa chance.

buckleyhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

I think this is all a plan by the LJW and Matt Tait to get as many web hits/comments as possible. The End.

KGphoto 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, you got the good life brother. Conference realignment might very well be the bell cow of expansion in You get more hits than Kim Kardashian. Tell Keegan he needs to buy you steak dinner for life. Job security these days cannot be under-appreciated.

I applaud all you do, but I have to say, for my taste, the conference stuff is WAY too much. I hate this Sh!t! Not your fault.

Wake me when we start playing in the B1G. I'll be the one saying "Told ya fu<<ers!".

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

It is hard to sort through everything. If you read the press releases about the MU 'offer' from the SEC, it mentions that the offer is there if or when the Big 10 breaks up. That is great security for MU, but if and when the Big 12 breaks up, MU may have other offers from other conferences. I'm sure that given a choice, they still prefer the Big 10. It may be hard to decide between the Pac 12 vs the SEC, but it's nice to have options.

This is not similar to the Big 10 flirtation last year. This looks like the SEC is pursuing MU.

The ACC actions earlier in the week has been a brilliant strategic move. They have effectively locked out the SEC from poaching members severely limiting possibilities for the 14th member- it's either WV or MO. The ACC has limited Big 10 expansion options. That's good for KU but if any conference can wait for expansion, it's the Big 10.

LogicMan 11 years, 2 months ago

Yes, the B1G can wait. But if they are interested in KU, why force us into a lesser conference, with lower revenues, and have our athletic programs degrade? Where if they come knocking now, we can and will bend over backwards to expand the stadium, improve parking and access, etc.

And their 12+ members can teach us to play football, while we school them on basketball. A tidy, neat package. Get it while it's hot, B1G!

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

I'm sure the response from the Big 10 as to why wait is that they are not a charity organization even though they are non-profit! KU better make sure it retains is AAU membership.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

Big poker game between UT and OU over who makes the first move and leaves with a black eye.

UT decides they're going to wait a couple weeks to apply to the PAC and see if OU and OSU can get accepted on their own... if they're accepted and decide to leave... everyone's angry at OU.

OU counters this by making these demands they probably don't think UT is willing to accept... it immediately puts the ball back into UT's court, even though UT has said it would wait awhile to decide. UT either says "No" and looks evil to everyone, or "yes", and OU is everyone's hero.

LVCHawk 11 years, 2 months ago


"Before you go off on how this is exactly what KU's leaders should be doing, you have to remember something.... Missouri had these options and that gave Mizzou this leverage. Kansas has not and does not."

Ummmmm, I thought we had options? Thats what the story was 2 days ago.

buckleyhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Scares me as well. There has always been the underlying "KU is doing something, we just don't know about it". Scary.

If we are playing (as in being) Syracuse, I will be just doesn't seem like that's the case whatsoever.

lv_jhwk 11 years, 2 months ago

I'm obviously not Matt, but my guess is that he was referring to Mizzou having a tangible back-up offer on the table. We do have options, but any offers coming KU's way won't be until the dominoes actually start falling.

Graczyk 11 years, 2 months ago

I'll chalk that up to Matt being tired. That kind of statement just can't be dropped out there with no explanation or context.

Matt Tait 11 years, 2 months ago

No, no, no, no...

By options, I mean an actual offer from another conference... If that's, in fact, the case for Missouri.

Kansas does have options and is doing things to set itself up in the best position possible but those options will only present themselves if the Big 12 blows up.

Sorry for the miscue. Didn't mean to insinuate that KU no longer has options. They do. But if the Big 12 lives on, they won't need them.

HawkSchooner 11 years, 2 months ago

Maybe the question Matt and the rest of the media should be asking is what are KU leaders doing?

rob4lb 11 years, 2 months ago

The "Kansas has options" was a quote from an Orangebloods article.

Pbbut 11 years, 2 months ago

If the conference survives, don't go to the Texas State Fair unless you're carrying live rounds. If the conference dissolves, the freaking Red River Shootout better be gone or we'll know these guys all just opportunistic slugs. A divorce is a divorce.

NOVAhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Ok, off to bed for the evening. Hopefully no nightmares about KU vs DePaul in the 2012-2013 Big9/East conference tournament.

NOVAhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

I guess I have to amend my own post to say the Big4/East tourney. Good Night!

Andrew Washington 11 years, 2 months ago

At this point it doesn't seem like any of the other bcs conferences are showing much interest in Ku. However, Im hoping that theres some kind of deal with the big 10 that we're just not hearing about... Supposedly we have some ties to the ACC but that doesnt seem to be getting anywhere fast

pepper_bar 11 years, 2 months ago

"OU is gone." - Matt Tait, yesterday.

He's guessing, just like the rest of us.

Matt Tait 11 years, 2 months ago

Fair enough... But what has my "guess" been the entire time? Big 12 in the No. 1 slot on the percentage wheel.

Remember this, things change fast in this deal. If and when people were reporting that OU was gone, that may have been the case at the time. But OU's not the only one who has a say in that. If the Pac-12 presidents voice their displeasure about expansion after OU makes up its mind, then expansion may not happen.

Doesn't change the fact that OU wanted to leave. Circumstances changed, though, and now they may not be able to.

Long way to go still....

MWShields 11 years, 2 months ago

rrockchalk, I wouldn't dismiss ACC just yet. They moved quickly to add Pitt and Syracuse and I think they are now waiting to see who else is going to be available before jumping to add anyone else. I think they will add UConn, apparently Roy and Coach K are pushing for KU and my guess is that Mark Turgeon is pushing Maryland admins to do the same. I think if B12 crumbles ACC is an option.

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

ESPN reporting the Pac 12 is not expanding.

pgittemeier09 11 years, 2 months ago

ha ha...jayhawkfirst needs to be saved apparently

buckleyhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

If the PAC-12 is not expanding, that is simply delaying this crap for another 2 years. Straight bs. Fans want to know they are in a stable conference at this point. And if the B12 continues to exist, fans in the middle of the country do NOT know they are in a stable conference. Straight bs.

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

I agree. I wish it would just blow up and get to 4 - 16 team conferences. Apparently Scott didn't have the votes to expand.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

We can vote to up the amount of $ to leave... hopefully it'd pass

buckleyhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

Agreed...this is too much at this point. Just get it over and be done with it. I would certainly chip in -- I don't like thinking about this more-or-less nonstop for multiple days/weeks.

Joseph Kuebel 11 years, 2 months ago

Shda done that after NU & CU left! Another great move made by Beebe. It woulda have helped UT (at least helped them secure tln didn't destroy the conference). Figure he would thought of this (sarcasm), as his ingenuity "saved the conference" and earned him a raise last Nov. This clown makes 997k a year!?!?! This is a disgrace.

Can Beebe!!

Andrew Washington 11 years, 2 months ago

I agree. If the big 12-2 does survive, then it will most likely continue to be an unstable long until the pac-12 decides to expand again? Currently OU, mizzou -and other schools have shown serious interest in leaving the big 12. How about we take this chance to make the big 12 stable..force texas and all other members to equal sharing-then add two other members and increase the buyout penalty like the ACC did. clearly there are serious "family issues" that need to be worked out.

by the way heres the link to espn article -apparently the pac 12 IS satisfied for the moment

KUAlum2000 11 years, 2 months ago

I'd be interested to see the percentage wheel trend over time just to see how wildly each of the pieces of the pie have been swinging all over the place.

A week ago i would have swore the Big 12 was done, but now i'd even increase the percentage to 50% that it stays together. If Beebe gets bumped, i'd move that up to almost 80%.

pgittemeier09 11 years, 2 months ago

maybe this gives us time to upgrade the facilities with the a&m exit fee and new tv money

Hank Cross 11 years, 2 months ago

I guess that settles that. Good for the P10. I'm glad they held to their ideals and didn't admit lesser institutions like OSU and TT.

Jeff Coffman 11 years, 2 months ago

OU/OSU/TAM to the SEC and now Missouri.

UT/KU to the ACC

UT/KU/ND/Rutgers to the Big Ten.

Leaving the BU,ISU,KSU and TTU by themselves.

OU will go to the SEC and take OSU with them, they won't have the academic problems and will get there.

The Big XII is dead and everyone knows it. OU didn't run off without a plan and the plan was PAC 12 first, SEC second. There is a reason that the SEC hasn't made a second move, and that is that the new markets it wants are TX, MO, and OK. And now with the PAC 12 unwilling to expand, the SEC just became a lot tougher.

Jeff Coffman 11 years, 2 months ago

Speculation, but forgot the "OR" when talking about the UT/KU options.

I could see the Big Ten expanding, with UT and ND, and yes they would go to 16.

I still don't think OU wants back in the conference and the SEC will take them in a heartbeat.

I still believe the PAC 12 problem turned out to be Academics, Stanford among others.

PAC will regret not moving because they won't have 4 teams to go after that expands their viewing base.

manginodrh00lz 11 years, 2 months ago

I think we should seriously look at forming alliance with KSU and go after the following to form a new conference: Tulane, Fresno State, Akron, Troy, Arkansas St, Iowa St, Florida Atlantic, W. Virginia, Baylor and Rutgers. Pray for the Continental Conference.

Kevin Randell 11 years, 2 months ago

Heck ya!!!!! I live here in Oklahoma and for weeks now I have been hearing from my family and friends that are Sooner fans.."We are going to the Pac-12....the Big XII is dead.....and to bad for you KU". All I have to say now is....hey like apples?.....The Pac doesn't want do you like them apples?!!!!!

Hank Cross 11 years, 2 months ago

Bye bye LJW server. 1,000 comments or bust,

djhawk75 11 years, 2 months ago

Either the Pac-12 just could not find a way to work out the details with the Longhorn network, or they began to realize what a pain in the a** it would be to work with Texas.

Josh Galler 11 years, 2 months ago

ok now we can get BYU, TCU and Louisville and maybe add USF, WVU, and Cincy to be first super conference

Andrew Washington 11 years, 2 months ago

wonder if theres any chance we work something out with a&m and somehow add tcu and byu to form a stronger big 12. If a&m leaves how can we find 3 strong football schools to fill the gap?

DevilHawk 11 years, 2 months ago

"Any of these could be true. I'm still leaning toward OU's interest in saving the Big 12 being legit right now. Why else would they go through all this if they're going to leave anyway?"


It would allow OU to blame UT for the conference going up in flames, but it also would take power away from UT in all discussions with the ACC, B1G, Pac, and SEC.

It seems that UT is now looking at equal revenue sharing no matter what conference it is in. That being the case, it becomes a question of which league is the best fit for the school.

ACC: Not a fit in any manner, unless the league decides to expand to 18+ schools by adding OU, OSU, UT, and other schools in the region.

B1G: Fits in academically and regionally. However, it also includes Ohio State, Michigan, Wisconsin, Nebraska, Iowa, and Penn State.

PAC: Fits in academically and athletically (baseball). However, it does not fit in geographically unless the PAC adds other schools in the region.

SEC: Fits in with the football-culture of the SEC but is far better than the SEC academically. Additionally, the road to football success would be far more difficult in the SEC - even compared against the current Big 12 (w/ A&M). This makes me wonder if UT has a standing offer from the SEC, but the Texas Regents want to make certain that the school maintains better ties academically.

(Just my thoughts on the situation at the moment.)

Eric Dawson 11 years, 2 months ago

The standing offers from every one Texas has approached have equated to "we'd love to have you, but (1) ditch the ugly girl and (2) the game is limited to equal stakes, so you'll have to ditch or equally share your network, too."

We've seen just how quickly Texas has jumped at those offers.

Meanwhile OU and OSU can still look at the SEC along with MU (gets the SEC to 16), and then Texas will have really screwed itself into the ground. Texas is going to have to deal with the Big 12 and OU. If Boren means what he says about stability, we should see equality coming to the Big 12 in a big way, the way it should have been from the beginning. Otherwise we'll just see more of the same next year.

I would not be at all surprised to see Powers and Dodds resigning in the not too distant future after the way Texas has been publicly humiliated these past weeks. No one wants to be rebuffed before the entire school, especially the so called prettiest girl in the school. (Bevo: "I mean, come on, what is this bull? We aren't Missouri!?!?)

jaywalkinhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

To be a fly on the wall at some of these meetings. You really never know what is going to happen from one day to the next. Would be interesting if Oklahoma was never going to leave, but wanted to rein in TX the entire time. Taking it the the brink than pulling back. Mind blowing!

I hope the BIG 12 can survive this...

Andrew Washington 11 years, 2 months ago

IF somehow we keep the current 10 members and add decent football programs from tcu and byu, then the big 12 would be a very strong football conference. right now, the big 12 needs to get texas to cooperate. This is the opportunity to implement equal revenue sharing and to add at least two stronger members!

Hank Cross 11 years, 2 months ago

What sucks about this is that OU lost its leverage over UT. UT can sit back and ask where else OU is going to go. No one leaves Bevo's ranch without its say-so.

Josh Galler 11 years, 2 months ago

but if they want to equal sharing vote again, UT would be the only one, so they would have to, would they?

Spencer Goff 11 years, 2 months ago

I disagree. I think one phone call between the SEC and OU and that leverage is right there.

And let's be honest; Mizzou, OU, OSU all makes far more sense and fit the SEC better than the Pac 12. Plus, with the pod system, it would be easy to pair up schools in a solid format.

If they aren't talking about it now, it is very likely they will be. So my feeling is that if the Big 12 is going to survive, Bevo will have to suck it up, at least until next year when emails from Ohio State are leaked again.

What I really wish is this... That somebody would $hit or get off the pot. To quote Inigo Montoya, "I hate wait."

Andy Tweedy 11 years, 2 months ago

Were you aware that the dude who played Inigo Montoya went to kansas?

Spencer Goff 11 years, 2 months ago

Yeah man, read that and thought, "I KNEW I liked that guy!"

Spencer Goff 11 years, 2 months ago

I have a gut feeling the SEC just performed a coup de grace.

Now they get OU, OSU (academics, what dat be?), and Mizzou.

They would literally own college football and everything about it. Their second tier rights might be worth as much as some others first tier rights.

And with Texas still out there as the "pretty girl" it means KU cannot go anywhere till she-bitch makes a decision.

On the plus side, it means KU can feel free to wait for a Pac 12 spot in addition to a B1G spot. I'm so excited...

statesupporter 11 years, 2 months ago

So the west is out, are the ACC, SEC, and B1G content? The SEC needs another. Who will it be? It won't be Missouri. Evidently not WV. Louisville? South Florida? TCU? Uconn? Cinci? Rutgers? Could the new Big 12 be pretty exciting? Magic number is 12 to 14 right now. We need at least 3, but more likely 5. SEC needs one. I would be excited about Louisville, WV, Cinci, TCU, S. Florida. Leave Rutgers and Uconn. Wouldn't it be funny that ESPN's UConn gets left out? Wouldn't it be interesting if the eastern schools, with the tv markets that everyone want, actally end up alienated by this latest round, while the flyover country of Kansas wins? Raise the exit fees to $25 million, get to 12 or 14, get the revenue thing right = college athletics as we know them are saved.....for now. Or, does OU, OSU, and ???? go SEC to end my moment of happiness?

Kristen Downing 11 years, 2 months ago

Man, is this good or bad?! No one is really in charge of the Big12 right now.

Travis Clementsmith 11 years, 2 months ago

I think OU will use the SEC as leverage still to try and get the vision they want in the Big XII. I think SEC will take OU and OSU in heartbeat if they express that interest. I don't think the B1G is saved quite yet. I think the SEC would do cartwheels if it could land OU, OSU, A&M and MU. The only thing better would be to replace MU with Texas. If MU were to balk, I bet the SEC could entice Tech if they wanted.

Oddly, that scenario would probably tie MU to UT even stronger than before. ACC would accept that duo. B1G (provided UT gives up the LHN) would like them and MU, though I suppose Rutgers could still figure into it all.

If OU and Texas find a way to coexist, schools wanting in the Big XII will have suddenly changed their tune about their situation (looking at you Louisville). If we go to 10, I say its still BYU. If 12, add Louisville and Cincinnati, although South Florida is an interesting market to possibly open up?

Travis Clementsmith 11 years, 2 months ago

Also meant "KU to UT". I'm really losing it tonight!

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

I don't think Mizzou is leaving unless the Big XII is really dead.

milwaukeeJAYHAWK 11 years, 2 months ago

My head is spinning.

Can this rollercoaster pull over so I can finally puke?

Pbbut 11 years, 2 months ago

Also an opportunity for SEC to make another move if it is known that there is true dissatisfaction on OU's part. The SEC may not be as attractive academically to Boren as the PAC, but OSU may feel right at home.

pills4profit 11 years, 2 months ago

Don't think OU and PAC are done...Doesn't anyone remember the SEC coming out and saying they were not interested in A&M and then boom, A&M says they dont want to be in the BIG12 a couple days later. A week after that SEC accepts A&Ms application. My timeline is probably off, but the PAC could be doing the samething?

OU is probably making ridiculous demands that they know are outlandish, only for them to be rejected so they can claim they tried. In a week they will apply to the PAC, then they will be gone.

Travis Clementsmith 11 years, 2 months ago

I don't think so. PAC presidents and fans were really divided about having to take OSU and Tech, as well as the LHN. I think this is a closing statement on expansion for the PAC for a while.

Josh Galler 11 years, 2 months ago

my new projections

Pac 12-No expansion

SEC-Will add TCU to 14 staying at 14

BIG-staying at 12 until ND come to sense and add one more to 14

ACC stay at 14 with Syr and Pitt with option to 16 with UCONN and Rutgers

BIG 12- merge with rest of Big East, USF, Cincy Louis, WVU, and BYU to become 14

statesupporter 11 years, 2 months ago

Agree, and Uconn is the big loser here, unless the ACC gets it done. Very ironic.

Travis Clementsmith 11 years, 2 months ago

That's not it at all. Otherwise, why not wait for it all to happen? Oklahoma is not going to be the 13th school to the PAC. Who's going with them? If the PAC doesn't want to be viewed as the instigators, who is going to apply for membership with them that makes it financially attractive? PAC will explore their TV Contracts as a 12 member conference, play a few championship games, and the, if the situation hasn't stabilized itself, make a more aggressive play. PAC will stay at 12 for a few years now. Most of the PAC fans out west want it that way.

SoCalAlum 11 years, 2 months ago

From Matt Tait's 9:27pm update: "Right now, he's played this thing about as well as it could be played. If the Big 12 lives, he plays a huge role and is praised for it. If it dies, it's someone else's fault and he's a genius for setting up a nice landing spot for Mizzou. The guy deserves a raise. "

No, Matt - YOU deserve a's a maddening, dizzying story and you're providing us with essentially non-stop coverage. I hope you get compensation for "hits."

Thank you.

pills4profit 11 years, 2 months ago

Yeh, thanks matt,

however, you're almost doing too good of a job. haha, keep this blog up on my computer at work all day and refresh it probably 3 times (maybe more) an hour. Your insight and everyone who is commenting is providing me with hours of entertainment. Some updates leave me excited for the future, others make me throw things across the room, some make me clutch my whiskey bottle, but there all entertaining and informative.

Keep up the good work, and hopefully we can get back to our lives someday. However, I think the realignment issue wont be done for years to come...

Dan Pawlowski 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, I wan to thank you for the great job you are doing keeping us updated on the situation.

JayDocMD 11 years, 2 months ago

So, there goes leverage against TX for major financial concessions. I'm sure everyone will agree to ditching Beebe, but the LHN issue will be the problem. I'm fully expecting OU to now begin an open flirtation with the SEC if for no other reason than to gain leverage back from TX.

ahpersecoachingexperience 11 years, 2 months ago

Reads a lot like the sec statement right before they accepted aTm

kureignman 11 years, 2 months ago

Now that the PAC is out of the way, get the ADs and Presidents of the 9 schools in a room and hug it out. Fire Beebe, get equal revenue sharing, raise the buyout to an absurd amount, rename the conference to the highest bidder (the Big Tostitos Conference maybe) and use the revenue to lure a top program, and put this realignment talk to bed.

DallasJayhawk1 11 years, 2 months ago

I just upped my % prediction on Big 12 from last week 40% to now 100% with the Pac news. You can take that to Vegas.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

People on ESPN boards are saying that the ESPN channel just reported Mizzou remains committed to saving the Big 12...I didn't catch it though and don't see any stories yet...

ahpersecoachingexperience 11 years, 2 months ago

Reading between the OU, Osu, MU, follow aTm to the sec?

FLJHK 11 years, 2 months ago

The PAC was wise. The Oklahoma schools and T. Tech were a poor fit, and UT just brings too much baggage.

I expect the SEC and ACC be the first to race to 16 now. SEC likely to target OU, OSU and MU. ACC likely to take UConn and Rutgers.

UT and ND remain wild cards with the potential to upset everything.

The Big East has been mortally wounded, with more casualties likely. Very tough to predict how that gets resolved.

The Big 12 remains very unstable at best. If poached by the SEC, consolidation with the Big East leftovers is likely.

KU likely needs to bide its time for awhile. I would urge legislative action in the manner proposed by a poster the other day, designating KU as the flagship university of the State of Kansas. While our AAU credential is of huge importance, more needs to be done to enhance KU’s academic standards. Our ranking among universities is not as high as it should be. My understanding is that our rating is hurt to some extent by our lax admission standards, but that those standards are dictated by State law such that we accept all Kansans with a high school diploma. (Please correct me on this if I am wrong).

In 1920, the AAU had only 19 members. Six were Ivy league schools, 5 were Big 10, 3 were Big 8, 2 Pac 12, and two independents (Johns Hopkins and Univ. of Chicago). That’s some impressive company. KU needs to reestablish its academic excellence, and Topeka must play a key role.

At that point, KU either: stays in a reinvigorated Big 12 subject to the efforts of a new commissioner, or we gravitate to the Big 10, our alternative natural home.

Brian Skelly 11 years, 2 months ago

My guess is that Scott didnt have the votes for all those guys. Im sure this gets revisited at another time, but in reality, this isnt all that shocking...

... despite the media driven drivel we've been getting.

Kudos to your coverage Matt. Im quite sure its not coming to you, but you've earned your salary --- try pulling an UT and ask for a raise :) Keep up the good work.

Hank Cross 11 years, 2 months ago

I don't think he had the votes either. The Mountain and AZ schools were solid noes. And the money was good enough for the CA schools to associate with the likes of OSU and TT.

Andy Fischer 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt, thanks for your hard work the last few days. I have been checking in hourly to get updates. You do your homework that's for sure

buckleyhawk 11 years, 2 months ago

I will reiterate this fact, regardless of how good of a job you are doing Tait (and yes, I still love Blackbird), this sucks. Let it be over. I don't want the B12 to stay together anymore. I want stability. I don't want to think about realigment.

That's it. No more.

Pitthawk34 11 years, 2 months ago

Well this gives us time to start focusing on football at kansas. If we want to be serious about where we want to end up in future it is time to make an investment in our old shell of a stadium. We need the seats full and a committment of all to move forward in renovations to bring us to the year 2011. If we do nothing then we deserve our future fate.

Pitthawk34 11 years, 2 months ago

More seats maybe but there are just things we can do to make our stadium more attractive and add to the seating capacity per numbers to be seen on paper. First of all renovate the west side to the U to incorperate luxury boxes. If we really want to be serious take the damn track out. Seriously someone needs to bring the track issue to the AD along with the stadium shell. Looks like in the future the only shot we may have is the big10 so we had better get our stadium upgraded over the next 5 years.

Randy Bombardier 11 years, 2 months ago

If this thing, the Big 12, gets put back together, add TCU, BYU and Boise State just because its all about football. If MU suddenly decides it has to take the SEC deal, add Colorado State just because it is regional and a university of 28000 students. That is not too bad of a drop off in quality.

Travis Clementsmith 11 years, 2 months ago

You people and you're insistence on Boise St.! Texas will block any conversation on TCU. If the Big XII gets its house in order, BYU will be a member relatively quickly. Then you decide whether to stay at 10 or continue to 12. The contract was for 10, so right now, 12 just divides the pot more.

But, if 12 is determined to be the best course of action, Louisville and South Florida would be the two I want. Open up another recruiting ground for goodness sake. Texas is already covered and Idaho is, well, Idaho. Get our feet wet in Florida!

Hank Cross 11 years, 2 months ago

If KU comes out with some mealy-mouthed statement supporting Beebe, it really does deserve to get thrown to the wolves. KU might not have any great options, but UT will never be in a better place than the B12. Side with OU and demand reform and Beebe's walking papers.

jayhawkfirst 11 years, 2 months ago

If the Big XII is going to stay together, who is going to provide the leadership? Nobody wants Beebe, for good reason. The presidents need to meet Wednesday, fire Beebe, and appoint someone with vision. More importantly someone who won't cower to Texas. I don't think OU, OSU, or MU really wants the SEC. They all know how difficult it would be to compete. A strong commissioner is needed ASAP.

Pitthawk34 11 years, 2 months ago

and a top rated contract attorney to get all members on board without any loopholes. Thinking 24 month notice on any member leaving and a 50 mil withdrawl fee. Some group motivational counseling for all members would be a good idea a well.

Steve Brown 11 years, 2 months ago

Barry Switzer just to put it up UT arse.

Travis Clementsmith 11 years, 2 months ago

The problem, IMO, really wasn't "Beebe", it was and still is, "Beebe's position". If you want to hire someone with "vision" and "backbone" you have to have a position that offers the authority for it to do so. I'm not trying to be a Beeb apologist, for all I care, he can go. But, the man did put together a huge TV deal for us last year. He has worked with what feeble excuses for tools we gave him to do the job.

If you want strong leadership, you need to make the position of leadership a strong one. It isn't so much Beebe as what the institutions allowed Beebe to be able to do. Was it really Beebe's fault that Texas and OU have egos bigger than Alaska. That's right, Texas, I said Alaska! Is it Beebe's fault A&M has an ego more fragile than the glowing leg in "A Christmas Story"?

That's what I mean that the Big XII needs to get its house in order first. If it wants to be a visionary conference with visionary leadership, it needs to create a platform for that person to steer by.

FLJHK 11 years, 2 months ago

Excellent points. Beebe probably needs to go, but no commissioner can be effective without a change in structure among members. No one can make a dysfunctional conference functional without the commitment of members.

yates33333 11 years, 2 months ago

Right on. Poor Beebe, he gets to be the scapegoat. A&M is the biggest arse followed by O.U. and U.T. I like the "glowing leg" analogy. I wish it were stuck up the Aggie's you-know-where. Jealousy, envy, and false pride, they names are Aggie.

pepper_bar 11 years, 2 months ago

Discredited blogger Chip Brown at Orangebloods spinning furiously, trying to make it seem like Texas has always been the power broker in the Pac 12 courtship:

Reminder: NY Times had the story about the Pac 12 not expanding this past Sunday, citing the lack of votes among the presidents to go forward with it.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

interesting.... I'm liking the part about already notifying Dan Beebe... hopefully it's accurate.

Benjamin Piehler 11 years, 2 months ago

If it's true the Big XII is surviving, we need to get to expanding quickly because the Big East is probably looking at some of the same schools we are... they're already talking about Navy and Air Force.

The Big East just had a meeting where the remaining schools minus UConn said they wanted to stay (not sure if TCU was present or not)... but maybe its possible to raid the big east while the buyout there is so low.

willie_fu_fu 11 years, 2 months ago

I would have to think East Carolina would be on their radar aswell.

okiedave 11 years, 2 months ago

Wednesday morning paper in Tulsa stating the only option for OU and OSU appears to be the Big 12. Bob Stoops appears to favor staying in the Big XII. He likes his fans to be able to travel by car to see away games. Glad to see the Big 12 survive. Bring in BYU and Colorado State and TCU.

Mike Skiles 11 years, 2 months ago

Matt - Its been said already by many posters, but I wanted to add my view as well. YOU have been doing an absolutely SUPERB job keeping up to date on the latest news in this crazy realighment circus, and more importantly you have been very astute at cutting through the chaff to the essential points and your gut insights based on all of the conflicting information. You sir, have been one of the few sane journalists covering this story! Thank you for your tireleess efforts, in keeping the Jayhawk community informed. WELL DONE!

yates33333 11 years, 2 months ago

What has Beebe done that Boren wants him sacked? Boren seems to have been the horse's a s s in this recent round of confusion. What you get when you get a politician.

Bring TCU and BYU in. Of course, ideally, get Notre Dame. That's a dream. They all have pretty good basketball programs as well. Louisville wouldn't be a bad idea. Nor would Houston if they remain committed to rebuilding their sports program. BYU and Notre Dame to replace the the two lost in the northern division was perfect, but a pipe dream.

If you get Houston and TCU or SMU you get better established in the Houston and Dallas-Fort Worth area. TCU in the Big East is laughable. But......

Hammertoe 11 years, 2 months ago

The Big 12 needs new leadership immediately. Go after TCU quickly. Trading a and m for TCU is not a bad trade. ESPN reported Mizzou is the most attractive school in the realignment mix due to academics, football, and state's population. If Mizzou takes the SEC offer, all bets are off.

Mike Barnhart 11 years, 2 months ago

Texas wouldn't support adding TCU. Let's sack Bebe, confine Texas to screwing members of other conferences (not ours), strengthen our current commitments ($20 mil. exit fee) and convince Arkansas it'd be happier & richer in the Big 12.

Steve Brown 11 years, 2 months ago

"Sorry for the miscue. Didn't mean to insinuate that KU no longer has options. They do. But if the Big 12 lives on, they won't need them."

Whether we need options or not may depend upon the strength of UT after the dust settles. Say B12 survives, so is UT is stronger or weaker?

B12 minus Buffs, Cornhuskers and Aggies seems to strengthen UT voting block. Hats of to Sooners for calling out Ringo, where's Gary Cooper as High Noon is approaching.

"Don't forsake me oh my darlin' get along, get along."

Steve Brown 11 years, 2 months ago

While we have great respect for all of the institutions that have contacted us, and certain expansion proposals were financially attractive, we have a strong conference structure and culture of equality that we are committed to preserve. Larry Scott Pac12.

if this had been our B12 mission statement then how strong would be today! 1. they contacted us. 2. culture of equality.

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