Realignment Today: 3:56 p.m. - Big Day in the Big 12. League unanimously agrees to grant of rights after moving to add TCU as 10th member


3:56 p.m. Update:

KU athletic director Sheahon Zenger followed up Gray-Little's statement with a few comments of his own.

Here's my story with Zenger's quotes:

Intentionally quiet throughout most of the conference realignment chaos that had plagued the Big 12 conference during the past six weeks, Kansas University athletic director Sheahon Zenger was happy to speak up following the positive news that came from the league office on Thursday.

“This is a good day for the Big 12 Conference,” Zenger said. “The news of granting of rights and equal revenue sharing and league expansion bears testament to the hard work of our board of directors and the stability sub-committee within the Big 12 Conference.”

The first happy moment for the league came late Thursday morning, when the Big 12 confirmed its pursuit of Texas Christian University to be the 10th member. With Missouri in limbo, there remains some uncertainty whether TCU would be the 10th or ninth member of the league. Also unclear is where the league goes from here, with or without Missouri in tow.

“We all believe that Texas Christian University is a great addition to the Big 12,” Zenger said. “Their geographic proximity to the rest of the schools, their academic credibility and their athletic achievements make them an obvious fit.”

Zenger said the addition of TCU provided KU with extra reason to celebrate.

“The University of Kansas has a strong alumni base in the Dallas-Fort Worth area and continues to attract students from that area, as well,” he said. “For us as an institution, that’s an additional benefit of this news.”

A couple of hours after expansion news broke, the Big 12 also announced that it had unanimously agreed to a formal grant of television rights for a minimum of six years.

Both votes were unanimously approved and Missouri sat out each time.

KU chancellor Bernadette Gray-Little, who served on the league’s four-member stability committee, released a statement Thursday afternoon. In it, she, too, pointed to Thursday being a great day for the Big 12 and the Jayhawks.

“This is an outcome KU has sought throughout this process,” Gray-Little said. “And it is one that I’ve been seeking as a member of the conference’s stability working group. Stability heightens the appeal of the conference as we look at expansion.”

Sources told the Journal-World that the Big 12 continues to look at all of its options, including staying at 10 or jumping back to 12 members. One source added: “All of the obvious schools are still in the picture, but, at this time, there is no next in line.”

Those “obvious schools” include BYU, as well as Big East members Cincinnati, Louisville and West Virginia, which, because of TCU’s likely departure, are left scrambling to solidify the future of their league. Although TCU was scheduled to join the Big East in 2012, the Horned Frogs will not have to wait the 27 months required by the Big East for a team that leaves. Sources said, however, that TCU will be required to pay Big East exit fees, which some have estimated to be around $5 million.

Gray-Little said she hoped TCU would begin competing in the Big 12 next season.

Should TCU’s exit from the Big East lead to its collapse, Notre Dame, which competes in the Big East in all sports but football, likely would seek a similar arrangement in another conference. A source with ties to the Big 12 said the conference, which has courted the Irish in the past, would be interested in exploring the idea of adding Notre Dame to the Big 12.

Here's the link to our story in case you want to comment over there.

2:48 p.m. Update:

Kansas University chancellor Bernadette Gray-Little released the following statement a few minutes ago:

“The Big 12 board’s approval of equal revenue sharing and the granting of television rights to the conference demonstrate a commitment to the Big 12 by its member universities. This is an outcome KU has sought throughout this process, and it is one that I’ve been seeking as a member of the conference’s stability working group.

“Stability heightens the appeal of the conference as we look at expansion. KU supports the invitation of TCU to join the Big 12, and Jayhawks hope to start competing against the Horned Frogs next season. KU recruits many students from the Dallas-Ft. Worth area, and we have a strong alumni base there, so TCU’s addition to the conference would definitely be a plus for our student-athletes and fans.”

Stay tuned for more reaction from KU...

2:11 p.m. Update:

That "other" announcement that was supposed to come from the Big 12 today? It had nothing to do with Missouri at all. Instead, it relates to the league's formal agreement to a granting of television rights for a minimum of six years.

The vote was unanimously approved and the only way it had anything to do with Mizzou is that the Tigers, as they did when the league voted to pursue TCU, did not participate in the voting.

Here's the language, followed by a link. This is wonderful news for the conference. Biggest positive day for the Big 12 in a while.

The Big 12 Conference Board of Directors agreed to a formal grant of television rights for a minimum of six years during a teleconference today. The approval by the Board was unanimous; however the University of Missouri did not participate in the vote on the advice of legal counsel.

Interim commissioner Chuck Neinas was authorized by the Board to immediately distribute legal documents for institutional execution. An earlier vote related to equal revenue distribution becomes effective upon the formal assignment of rights by all institutions. The Board did not set a deadline but indicated a desire to expedite the approval process.

The grant of rights was included in a joint resolution proposed by both the University of Oklahoma and the University of Texas. In addition to the grant of television rights for at least a six-year period, the proposal included agreements related to high school content and access to football games for institutional third-tier telecast packages.

Specifics of the resolution included an agreement that during the term of the grant of rights: there will be no changes related to current or future primary television rights agreements or Conference bylaws, rules or policies related to member institution branded outlet rights; Conference bylaws will reflect that no member institution branded outlet will show high school games or highlights, noting that it is permissible pursuant to NCAA interpretation to use scores, standings and statistics of high school games; and, that additional games beyond the one member institution retained football game for telecast purposes must be approved by both institutions and both Conference telecast partners.

Stay tuned for more reaction to both moves...

1:06 p.m. Update:

A couple of quick thoughts regarding the news that TCU is being pursued officially as the 10th member of the Big 12.

One source told me Tuesday night that, with Missouri still in limbo, interim commissioner Chuck Neinas would be aggressive in moving forward to try to force Missouri's hand a little bit.

I think this news clearly does that. How the Tigers react to it will be up to them, but this is a clear sign from the Big 12 that the league is prepared to move on — and flourish — with or without the Tigers.

As for TCU itself as a good fit, there's no question that this makes the most sense, even more so than adding BYU or Louisville, both of which are still very much in the mix in terms of Big 12 expansion talks.

TCU is the best fit geographically and in football and brings with it continued strength in Texas. That might not be a big deal for the Texas schools but it is for the rest of the league, which depends so much on the Lone Star State to fill its rosters, particularly in football.

That's the other thing Missouri has to think about here. If they go to the SEC, they can kiss their recruiting ties to Texas good bye.

Here's an interesting note from the past about that. Years ago, when Arkansas and UT were in the SWC together, the Razorbacks had an average of 40 players from Texas on their football roster. In the years that followed after Arkansas left for the SEC and Texas joined the Big 12, Arkansas' list of football players from Texas on the roster dropped to below 10 on average.

That said, I've never thought Missouri was leaving and I still don't think they are. They had a chance to take their moment in the spotlight and feel the love and then return to the league in good graces and they blew it. Had they announced Tuesday that they were committed, the league would've smiled and said, 'Welcome back.'

But sources have told me that what MU pulled on Tuesday really angered a lot of the league and now if the Tigers come back, they'll do so with their tails between their legs and having lost a lot of their clout within the league. They'll also be a complete afterthought now that the Big 12 has moved ahead with expansion.

Missouri had a chance to play this thing right and gain a lot of love but they waited just a bit too long and now will be forced to do some serious damage control if and when they do recommit to the Big 12.

Stay tuned for more reaction regarding TCU...

12:59 p.m. Update:

Here's this from Oklahoma president David Boren, which pretty much mirrors what DeLoss Dodds said earlier. Isn't it nice to see these guys getting along!

"TCU is an excellent choice as a new member of the conference. They bring strong athletics and academic credentials and were enthusiastically and unanimously supported by (the Big 12) conference."

12:06 p.m. Update:

Here's this from TCU chancellor Victor Boschini Jr., regarding the news that the Big 12 has entered into negotiations with TCU to add the Horned Frogs as the 10th member.

"These discussions with the Big 12 have huge implications for TCU. It will allow us to return to old rivalries, something our fans and others have been advocating for many years. As always, we must consider what's best for TCU and our student-athletes in this ever-changing landscape of collegiate athletics. We look forward to continuing these discussions with the Big 12."

Stay tuned...

11:41 a.m. Update:

Reaction from around the Big 12 about the move to add TCU starting to come in. Hoping to hear something from Kansas soon.

UT athletic director DeLoss Dods:
"Their commitment to academics and success on the field make them an excellent fit. With a solid budget and strong financial support, they have been proactive at improving facilities. Their close proximity to all conference institutions makes for a comfortable travel situation."

More to come. Stay tuned...

11:26 a.m. Update:

The Big 12 has confirmed its move to add TCU as the 10th member of the conference.

Here's a statement from the league, released a little while ago:

Acting upon a unanimous recommendation of its expansion subcommittee, the Big 12 Conference Board of Directors this morning authorized negotiations with Texas Christian University to become the Conference's tenth member, and instructed interim commissioner Chuck Neinas to immediately begin discussions with TCU.

The action of the Board was without dissent. On the advice of legal counsel The University of Missouri did not participate in the vote.

Hoping to hear something from TCU very soon.

Stay tuned...

10:26 a.m. Update:

Even with all of the Missouri talk still lingering, it appears the rest of the Big 12 Conference is ready to move on with expansion.

Several outlets are reporting this morning that TCU has an invite to join the Big 12 and could accept it as soon as today.

Here's a quick link to the report from Brett McMurphy of CBS Sports. Chip Brown of and Kirk Bohls of the Austin American-Statesman also have reported the news.

Assuming the news is true and assuming the Horned Frogs accept, a couple of questions come to mind.

  1. How will TCU navigate its way out of its plans to join the Big East? Previous reports have said that TCU would not have to wait the 27 months required by the Big East to leave because they are not yet members of that conference. Others have said the Big East could throw up a roadblock a la Baylor to Texas A&M a few weeks ago. Pete Thamel, of the New York Times, reports that TCU would be required to pay the $5 million exit fee to leave the Big East but would not be bound by the 27-month agreement. A good deal for both.

  2. If TCU is added, will the league stop there and stay at 10 or will it look to add more teams and get to 12 or more? Part of the answer to this question depends on Missouri's decision. The Tigers are still exploring their options and may opt to join the SEC if invited. If that were to happen, the addition of TCU would bring the Big 12 to nine and the league likely would look to add another school to replace the Tigers.

  3. With TCU in the fold, what happens to Louisville, Cincinnati, BYU, Boise State and West Virginia? Again, the answer here all depends upon what the Big 12 decides to do and, to a lesser extent, what Missouri decides to do. Sources have told me that BYU remains a hot commodity and that Louisville is not far behind. McMurphy says that sources have told him that if MU were to leave, the Big 12 would expand to 12. If MU stays, though, it's likely the Big 12 will add TCU and stay at 10.

Speaking of that, here's a link to an article that says Mizzou may not have the votes it needs to get into the SEC anyway. A Wednesday article quoting an unnamed Missouri official as saying the Tigers wanted the Big Ten first but that they'd be interested in the SEC because, "that's what's left," likely won't help garner support for MU in the SEC. If nothing else, the SEC is a group of proud schools who do not like to play second fiddle to anybody.

The Big 12 is expected to announce TCU's addition later this morning. Reports have indicated that the league also will make another announcement at the same time.

What this could be is anyone's guess. Missouri's staying? Missouri's going? More on the equal revenue sharing or the Longhorn Network?

Stay tuned...


baldwinjhawk 10 years, 8 months ago

On the SEC conference site they questioned Mizzou's cultural fit with their schools. So I told them that if they were looking for a slave state with hillbillies in it.. well mizzou is your girl.. take em.

Randy Bombardier 10 years, 8 months ago

I always preface my remarks to SEC folks with "Get off your sister. That's just not right. No, you shouldn't marry your cousin, and yes, 14 is too young even if she does chew."

Steve Brown 10 years, 8 months ago

revenuers still swinging from the trees down by the river.

Thomas Young 10 years, 8 months ago

Saw this on the Missouri Talk forum at the StL PD site today:

Scott van Pelt on his ESPN radio show today said "How many houses is Mizzou going to rush before they realize they aren't greek material."

ku_foaf 10 years, 8 months ago

Missouri and Oklahoma are NOT southern states, no matter how much they want to be or claim to be! The truly southern states will be quick to tell them so. Arkansas is in the same boat, but a little closer.

mom_of_three 10 years, 8 months ago

Actually, Missouri and Arkansas have been considered Southern states since prior to the civil war, due to the fact they allowed slavery prior to the civil war. I would agree on Oklahoma since they have not been a state for as long - I do not consider them southern. But if Missouri was not considered a southern state, there would not have been so many issues with the Kansas nebraska act.

panalytic 10 years, 8 months ago

That is some interesting news. Thanks for all the updates Matt.

Mike Nicco 10 years, 8 months ago

2nd What is it with Mizzou...always shootin off their mouth.

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

"Or shooting themselves in the foot"...which would be dangerous if it was anyone else, since their feet are always in their too-loose-lipped mouths. But given MU's brain being further south, it's not a real issue.

Vernon Riggs 10 years, 8 months ago

You would have be to be a Jayhawk fan since Dec-27-1980 to fully appreciate the humor in that statement. Well done oklahawk58!

Hammertoe 10 years, 8 months ago

All Mizzou said was they were looking at their conference options, just as Oklahoma, Okie State, Texas and Tech already stated. I hope they don't leave, but wouldn't blame them if they did. Road trips to Alabama, Florida, LSU....who won't like that?

CloveK 10 years, 8 months ago

The people that make those road trips only to watch mizzoo get pounded in the ass game in and game out. I however, will be laughing my ass of if they make the move thinking they are hot stuff.

For the record, I don't want them to leave.

Hammertoe 10 years, 8 months ago

Jealously is an ugly emotion. Mizzou has won 40 games in the last 4 years. KU has never accomplished that.... The Mizzou fans will love it!

Matt Tait 10 years, 8 months ago

Yep. In too much of a hurry to get it posted. It's there now. Thanks for pointing that out!

DanHogan95 10 years, 8 months ago

Thanks for hustling to get it out there!

Jaminrawk 10 years, 8 months ago

Geez, they HAVE to go to 12 teams. Staying at 10 is too risky, IMO. Get that BIg XII Championship back. As far as I've read Texas is the only Big XII school in favor of 10 teams. Lets get BYU, Louisville & WVU and build up the strength of the conference.

hawksfan08 10 years, 8 months ago

It's good to see the big 12 finally on the proactive end of this mess instead of sitting idly by waiting to see if Misery will leave.

Robert Greenwood 10 years, 8 months ago

Nice to finally see the Big 12's efforts to add schools coming to fruition. I would like to see schools scrambling to get in instead of scrambling to get out.

tao7 10 years, 8 months ago

Where does this leave SMU? In or out of Big 12 if TCU joins. TCU coach not to happy with SMU right now. Does that matter?

TXHawk55 10 years, 8 months ago

Completely wrong assessment (I live in Dallas now). SMU is hands down the #1 "free agent school" around -- now that TCU is off the market. For a good check of the facts, visit

SMU probably doesn't get added, but not for the reasons PFC mentions. They'll be a HUGE pick up for a conference.

TXHawk55 10 years, 8 months ago

Current following? No. TCU has recent success to keep their "flavor of the month" following.

SMU will be added to a BCS conference and it will be a really nice pick-up. The problem with SMU attendance is who they play. It's hard to get a big following when you're playing UAB and UTEP (and operate in a city like Dallas, many choices).

TCU will be a nice win for the 'Hawks!

justinryman 10 years, 8 months ago

I like the TCU add, now go get BYU and Boise St to get to 12.

If Mizzu leaves, which I can't see them getting an invite as they run their mouth like a sewer treatment plant. Then go get Louisville to keep it at 12.

chalmers08 10 years, 8 months ago

SMU is rumored to be going to the Big East, if there still is a Big East. But that was rumored a couple of days ago when it was thought TCU was still joining.

Richard Payton 10 years, 8 months ago

The Missouri Board of Curators received over 200 emails from Missouri fans according to the Missouri Columbia Tribune. All 200 emails encouraged Missouri to join the SEC. I heard Bob Fescoe on 610 sports yesterday call a sports program in Nashville to get the feeling of SEC members. That person thought Missouri would be welcomed from what he heard.

Robert Brock 10 years, 8 months ago

Baylor, TCU, the conference going for private religious schools in the hopes of luring Notre Usedtobesomething?

captku 10 years, 8 months ago

I have said jokingly to add those 3 + ND and SMU to get those REALLY old school rivalry juices flowing. God can sort it all out I guess! That plus ahperse's comment below about calling the conf "Big Bible" gave me a pretty good chuckle. Rock Chalk, and Amen!

justinryman 10 years, 8 months ago

And you know all of this how?

Who would be your first addition, if not TCU?

And why hasn't Boise or why will they never be in serious consideration? Where is your proof/opinions?

jaymar74 10 years, 8 months ago

Does anyone know if the Big 12 can kick MU out? Based on their comments I think we should and then the Tigers would be without a conference. Big 10 doesn't want them, SEC now doesn't want them after it was reported that they were second on MU's want list. Kick out MU and get TCU and one or three others.

justinryman 10 years, 8 months ago

Very true, if Big10 was their #1 choice and then the SEC, where does that put the Big12? Behind the ACC and Big East???

ltownatrain 10 years, 8 months ago

I don't want to kick them out because the only thing probably keeping the SEC from taking them immediately is litigation so lets make them stay and sweat it out.

Steve Brown 10 years, 8 months ago

we want the exit fees, be patient grasshopper.

Micah Mandy Haase 10 years, 8 months ago

"SEC is whats left" wow now if you go to the SEC your going to be headhunted by every team there. Hell LSU, Alabama and so forth may even give some recruits to Vandy so they can kick Mizzou around also. Why does Mizzou continue to make themselves a joke? BTW I think we need to get past 10 teams and more than a 6 year contract. If your going to show stability we need to go 15-20 year contract.

lifetimeJay 10 years, 8 months ago

You must be forgetting about inflation. If we signed a 15-20 year contract we'd be making diddly squat compared to the other leagues by the end of that contract

Micah Mandy Haase 10 years, 8 months ago

I mean 15-20 year contract on all the money goes to the big 12. They can still renegotiate TV contracts but if you leave the money still goes to the conference for 15-20 years

actorman 10 years, 8 months ago

It is amazing how stupid the Misuse boosters are -- but then that's kind of redundant, isn't it? For all the people who have been criticizing our chancellor and AD for staying silent during most of the process, I give you Exhibit A -- the tigger follower who was idiotic enough to say publicly that the SEC was "what's left." I mean, seriously, it's hard to believe that anyone, even a Misuse fan, can be that brain-dead.

Hammertoe 10 years, 8 months ago

Mizzou only stated they are looking at conference options, just like OU, Texas, Tech and OSU stated. IF they received a PAC 16 invite, they would be out of here.... Every team that has received an official invitation to join another conferencer has left the Big 12. What Mizzou has to offer: AAU school, 40 wins in football over the last 4 years, and 6 million people.

JayDocMD 10 years, 8 months ago

Can't believe Boise St is still being mentioned. People do realize its in Idaho, right? I know Kansas is no tourist destination, but Idaho St. brings nothing to the table from a TV market and academic standpoint. It represents major travel for athletes and fans. Can we please quit mentioning Boise?

Brian Skelly 10 years, 8 months ago

Beyond the obvious small scale (and distance) of Boise, and few TV sets... Boise State was (feel free to research and correct me) a community college 10-15 years ago. It's academic ratings wouldnt just be the lowest in the Big 12... they'd be the biggest in Big 12 by far. I cant even envision the minuscule research budget theyd have... and thats assuming they actually have one.

Yes, this IS about football. But even the boundaries for all of this expansion insanity have to be held at some point. Boise State has ZERO shot of being included in this mess.

texashawk10 10 years, 8 months ago

Boise St. was founded by the Episcopal church in 1932 as Boise Junior College and dropped their affiliation with the Episcopal church two years later. In 1940, they moved to their current location and in 1965 became a 4 year school. In 1969, Boise joined the Idaho state system of higher learning and became Boise State College and in 1974, gained university status and became Boise State University and now grants associates, bachelors, masters, and doctorate degrees.

You're a little off on when Boise became a 4 year school by about 35 years. From what I've read about BSU, they are working on building their academic reputation, but that's something that takes years and years to do.

If the Big 12 is seriously considering Louisville, Cincinnati, or West Virginia, then clearly the Big 12 isn't placing a high priority on academics so why not consider adding BSU as well. They are working on $100 plan to expand Bronco Stadium to 55,000+ by adding a grandstand to their north endzone, removing the track and lowering the field, and closing in their horseshoe.

bayareajhawk 10 years, 8 months ago

They can do all that for just $100? Money goes a long way in Boise!

texashawk10 10 years, 8 months ago

Sorry, $100 million to expand Bronco Stadium. A similar plan for KU would be a little cheaper because KU wouldn't be building offices or new weight room.

justinryman 10 years, 8 months ago

They travel well, just look at their bowl games. they may not have a tv footprint in Idaho, but they do have a large fan base that is growing across the country. ESPN loves them as well.

Sure it's out of the way, but BYU isn't all that close either. The two schools are less than 400 miles apart. Boise ID is 1387 miles from Lawrence while Provo UT is 1046 miles from Lawrence. Sure its close to twice the distance to Austin TX, but the University of Arizona makes the 1526 mile trip to the University of Washington.

Boise_Jayhawk 10 years, 8 months ago

Boise itself is a city/market that will continue to grow in the future. Climate and natural attractions are excellent. In my opinion these are overlooked reasons for Boise State's success in football, i.e. that it's a great place to live, work and go to school. Area population has probably grown tenfold in the past 40 years.

This is a part of the country likely to grow and prosper in the years ahead. My guess is that if (yes it's a big IF) Boise State were to be included in the Big 12, it would be based on anticipated growth/improvement, not just on the current status of academics, overall athletics programs, population in the area, etc.

In evaluating expansion options, should the Big 12 look solely to the past or present, or consider anticipated growth trends?

Jeff Coffman 10 years, 8 months ago

Have you been to Idaho in November/December, this does not equal a good climate.

The population is lackluster.

They travel to a bowl game once a year, I don't think they have been known to travel while in the WAC and soon to be the MWC.

Not a good fit academically either.

Mike Nicco 10 years, 8 months ago

"Texas has agreed to equal revenue sharing of Tier I and II television rights to football and men’s basketball games and has agreed to forego its desire to show any high school football games or even highlights on its new Longhorn Network. In exchange, the league will allow Texas to show two or three football games on the network."

I believe that satisfies all the demands we know about...

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago


Matt Gauntt 10 years, 8 months ago

Love adding TCU.

Adding BYU and Louisville would be great. I would go farther and add Cincinnati and WVU. Add those four schools, along with TCU and we can legitimately say that we are the best basketball conference in the nation. Here are their records from last year:

Louisville: 25-10 Cincinnati: 26-9 West Virginia: 21-12 BYU: 32-5 TCU: 11-22 (OK, they take Nebraska's place)

Ben Kane 10 years, 8 months ago

wvu would be a great add if mizery leaves

Rob Keeney 10 years, 8 months ago

Agreed. I always considered them MU-East....toothless hillbillies all dolled up in black and gold.

jaymar74 10 years, 8 months ago

BTW, KU does great on tier III revenue. I guess Basketball does bring something, over 6 million a year for us.

Brian Skelly 10 years, 8 months ago

If im correct, KU just signed an a deal to bring in 8.6 million per year on Third Tier stuff (presumably basketball) for the next 10 years.

Thats not UT money mind you, but its not horrible.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 8 months ago

Maybe we could form the "All Anagram Conference":


Tony Bandle 10 years, 8 months ago

Of course, they would all be capitalized!!

Travis Clementsmith 10 years, 8 months ago

I think its an attempt to avoid the appearance of people shouting on caps.

actorman 10 years, 8 months ago

Never thought I'd see myself write this, mangino, but I'm with you on that one. It's frustrating to be making one of my brilliant points and emphasize something, only to see the caps disappear on the posting and thus render my point less impressive.

ahpersecoachingexperience 10 years, 8 months ago

New conference name

Big Bible

If we add byu we will need to add unlv or tulane just to balance things out

DallasJayhawk1 10 years, 8 months ago

A good add--I'm sure more will be announced soon.

Brian Skelly 10 years, 8 months ago

I actually do have a question for MATT if he's around...

Does TCU's inclusion represent some 'thawing' of UT's clout, or its simply wanting to throw a bone to the rest of the conference in regards to this expansion stuff.

It seemed UT was interested in expanding to anyone... except TCU. Personally that strikes me as silly... TCU is essentially Baylor (size and scale -- alumni base), with a stronger football program.

Just curious on your thoughts, or if you've heard anything in reference to this. Even your educated gut feeling would be good.

Once again, great work. You've been a great source, if not the best source with all this conference expansion stuff. Continued good works!!!

Matt Tait 10 years, 8 months ago

From what I'm hearing, this is kind of a double move by Texas.

On one hand, they are giving in to something they've been against for a long time. That has to be considered good news in terms of the rest of the league leveraging UT's power.

On the other hand, it's believed by some that UT changed its mind regarding TCU — and was very vocal about it — in order to ensure that TCU got in so they could go to TCU and say, "Hey, we helped you get in. Vote with us."

It's hard to say for sure which is more correct as they're both likely true.

That said, adding TCU is an overall solid move for the conference and should help add some serious stability, which I think may have been the third part of the equation for UT here. As much as they're the big dogs and will always be fine, they want to stay in the Big 12 and don't want to see the league go through this every year. This should help.

jgkojak 10 years, 8 months ago

Or... Texas realized they were actually being pretty dumb opposing TCU.

Yes, they have Texas TV money locked up. But from a recruiting standpoint, its nice to tell Dallas/FW kids (a HUGE number of their targets) that their families will get to see them play every year LOCALLY. Could make the difference for a 2nd string player to decide they'll go to UT if their family gets to see them w/out a trip, instead of TCU or somewhere else.

I understand why they don't need UTEP or Houston, but never understood why it didn't make sense to guarantee a Dallas trip.

lama 10 years, 8 months ago

It also screws A&M. We'll see if Texas kids would rather play in Lexington and Nashville or Austin and Fort Worth.

AlecRaenos 10 years, 8 months ago

Boise State was a junior college 12 years ago and their academics are terrible. Football wise, they are a great team but they bring no markets and nothing else to the table. Couple that with extreme distance and Boise State is a last move IMO.

TCU would have been a good 11th or 12th team but BYU should have been the first IMO. The TCU move sounds more to me like the other schools are sticking it to Texas for all their BS the last few years.

manginodrh00lz 10 years, 8 months ago

Stop saying things that make us look bad.

Marcia Parsons 10 years, 8 months ago

Maybe TCU was the only one that said yes. Since all the Big12 officials aren't from Missouri, they didn't give out a list of first, second, and third choices.

texashawk10 10 years, 8 months ago

Boise St. hasn't been a JuCo in 45 years. Seriously, is everyone here too lazy to even Wiki Boise's history?

nb4ku 10 years, 8 months ago

I personally like the move, as long as we get L'ville and BYU to get to 12.

Travis Clementsmith 10 years, 8 months ago

I read an interview with Dodds, and if we are to believe his honesty, he was very concerned about the prospect of flying teams all across the country and parents not having the opportunity to go see their kids play as often. So, maybe keeping a midwest identity was important and TCU made too much sense since the conference really didn't have a Dallas based team.

There was also an opinion piece on Yahoo Sports about TCU as a dark horse candidate to the SEC. Obviously, that wouldn't happen if they stop at 14, but who knows if they go to 16? Perhaps the remote possibility of the SEC gaining to schools in Texas was also in the back of their mind.

If you believe the report on Tiger Board about Missouri's demands to go back to 12 and not be in the same division as OU and Texas, then perhaps BYU and Louisville will be next. If they go, then who knows? The fact that we have invited someone does seem to speak about a strong intent to move forward as a conference.

jgkojak 10 years, 8 months ago

Boise State is not coming. They rank below Oral Roberts academically.

That said:

TCU makes for some nice travel and going to Dallas/FW every year is great for recruiting.

If they're in a major conf. my bet is they turn in to a Top 40 team pretty fast in basketball.

ja3hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

This should have happened before everyone started to leave our conf 2 years ago. Still think our problems go back to Dan BB and it being too easy to leave...

Phoghorn 10 years, 8 months ago

Funniest. Icon. Ever. (Big 36, with Missouri squished in case it gets changed later).

stuck88 10 years, 8 months ago

I need conference realignment to hurry up and get over with already so I can make the necessary adjustments to my NCAA football 12 online dynasty.

jep 10 years, 8 months ago

810 WHB just announced it's official, TCU is in.

KCHawk81 10 years, 8 months ago

The comments on that AI article are an amusing read. Seems most SEC fans are underwhelmed by mu, and the few that like them do so on a mostly pro-slavery basis. Seems about right.

KU_alum_2001 10 years, 8 months ago

I'm very opposed to adding TCU over the likes of BYU, Louisville, West Virginia, Memphis, etc. The addition of TCU does 3 things. It makes the conference:

  1. more Texas-focused
  2. more religious-based (part of the reason nobody ever wanted Baylor)
  3. weaker relative to any of the teams we lost.

I don't think this makes the conference better from KU's perspective aside from creating a 10th (soon to be 9th) member and thus providing some stability.

KU_alum_2001 10 years, 8 months ago

Tell me about it. I see some posts on here that almost make it hard to read at times. Whether it's hating on Mark Mangino or Josh Selby or thinking that additions like TCU or UTEP or Lawrence High School to the conference are "great news", the site certainly doesn't lack "entertainment".

ja3hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

Easy... easy... I think TCU was the quickest get. It was probably necessary to go on the offensive in order to stay alive and maybe Mizery will reconsider. Let's face it, we all really want them to stay. Then there is no reason the expansion committee couldn't continue to pursue these guys: BYU, Louisville, West Virginia, Memphis, etc

KU_alum_2001 10 years, 8 months ago

I don't see this move as helping us to convince Mizzou to stay. Part of the reason everyone is leaving is because of the massive Texas weighting. Yes, 98% of this is due to UT and not the other Texas schools but... again, TCU makes the conference even more Texas-weighted (especially if Mizzou leaves), it doesn't add more revenue or tv sets, and it doesn't bring anything outside of football (i.e. basketball, academics, etc. are not supportive of this invitation).

Reacting quickly is how you make mistakes. Simply throwing out invitations to someone you know will accept in the hopes that another person at the party will keep Mizzou from walking isn't good long-term judgement... in my opinion.

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

With A&M leaving this does not increase the state of Texas weight, it only maintains it as far as # of members, but at a slightly lesser level (A&M has a lot more influence in state than TCU).

Having said that, it will give MU something to consider -- another team that can beat them in FB more often than not is joining the conference, making the Big 12 even less attractive to them.

Travis Clementsmith 10 years, 8 months ago

Unless the conference goes to 12 eventually and Mizzou is in an opposite division, presumably adding BYU and Louisville to the North.

KU_alum_2001 10 years, 8 months ago

First of all, A&M has already announced their departure so that's officially a past event. The Big 12 is currently at 9 members so adding TCU does increase the Texas-presence, which is then even more amplified if/when Mizzou leaves. So we're now possibly looking at 4 of 9 programs being Texas-based (the highest portion since the inception of the Big 12).

And Mizzou isn't going to fear TCU when they're other choice is the SEC. If fearing losing in football was a top concern, Mizzou would stay where it is.

I disagree with both your points.

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

That's okay, I've already noted that I disagree with your comments.

Technically A&M is still a member until this season is over. You are correct that they no longer vote, but A&M's weight was being felt up to the point that the SEC accepted A&M's application. That point was a mere matter of weeks ago, so adding TCU does not add any state of Texas weight that the conference isn't used to dealing with -- and as I pointed out, it will be even less than before when A&M was at the decision table.

The difference between your perspective and mine is a matter of splitting hairs, but the reality is that adding TCU is a great deal for the Big 12 because it gives the conference another good nationally recognized FB program in a reasonable travel distance and is a sign - especially in conjunction with other news today -- that Texas is having to back down to the rest of the conference in order to keep the ship afloat.

And I didn't write that MU feared TCU, I wrote that adding TCU would make the Big 12 even less attractive for MU than it is now. I would add that unlike TCU, adding Louisville or Cincinnati first would have made the Big 12 more attractive to MU.

But you are right that MU doesn't care about winning FB games. MU's desire to leave is about conference stability and getting away from Austin if at all possible. I understand the desire, but do not like the way they have managed their process.

HawksWin 10 years, 8 months ago

I am sorry but what the *ell is wrong with religious-based schools? Hopefully, they add character & some moral grounds that have been evaporating faster than our society can add, not to mention higher academic achievements - hopefully.

KU_alum_2001 10 years, 8 months ago

"Jesus Chr*st, Harris, let's not start a holy war!" Ha ha.

HawksWin 10 years, 8 months ago

You obviously have not been to one. Ivy schools are now adding "ethics" to their MBA program. Why do you think that is?

HawksWin 10 years, 8 months ago

You obviously don't read much do you? Indeed, ethics has been a part of overall MBA program, but it was NOT as a REQUIRED course to graduate - until recently.

Say, are your brain cells still maturing or simply have dead brain cells & relying on archaic knowledge claiming to know everything? Why not just shut it & let others express their thoughts w/o you adding your cheap two cents?

Brak 10 years, 8 months ago

Thanks for laugh, I needed that. Maybe if you could contradict yourself more that would be better. I mean adding BYU instead of TCU because TCU is "more religious-based". Oh and the fact that you insinuate that Colorado has a better football program than TCU is laughable and overall they are probably on par with A&M. I understand what you are saying though about KU, I mean why would we want a guaranteed two basketball wins a year and a possible winnable FB game against a top ranked program, nothing for KU to gain fo sho!

rob4lb 10 years, 8 months ago

I don't like the TCU add. It probably hurts KU as it now has to compete with another school for Texas talent. However the move is proactive which is good.

Maybe MU stays. The internet has picked up the story of the unnamed source and you see headlines like "Mizzou hopes to join SEC; Wanted Big 10". That can't help. If they don't get into the SEC, they will have again misplayed its hand.

I do hope that the conference has a plan to get to 12 members.

texashawk10 10 years, 8 months ago

TCU is already outrecruiting KU and KSU in Kansas (evidenced by 4 star QB Tyler Matthews) and has outrecruited KU in Texas for years. This will hurt Texas and OU more than it hurts KU. Just going through TCU's list of commitments for 2012, there were 4 players committed to TCU that KU also recruited, not much overlap in between TCU and KU. when it comes to recruiting.

stuck88 10 years, 8 months ago

I dont think that adding TCU will hurt KU in recruiting, it offers the kids from Texas that come to KU another chance to play a game in their home state.

jgkojak 10 years, 8 months ago

Adding TCU does not hurt and if you stick w/10, it makes the travel nice and compact and gives KU inroads into Dallas by visiting every year.

Its academic rating is HIGHER than KUs, by the way. And A&M was quite the bastion of conservatism, so its not like the politics are all that different.

If we lose MU, adding BYU makes sense.

Best case - keep MU, add BYU and Louisville.

lama 10 years, 8 months ago

The Big 12 has never been that concerned with academics. It has no cooperative research agreements, like the Big 10/Univ. of Chicago consortium. It would be a big help to KU if the Big 12 moved in that direction.

lama 10 years, 8 months ago

I wouldn't look to Arizona as a model of anything, except for Michael Crow's ego.

lama 10 years, 8 months ago

I'll pass on the community college for 100,000.

KU_alum_2001 10 years, 8 months ago

Baylor, TCU, and BYU, huh? So we'll essentially be "God's Conference". Rather than the SEC or Big-10 or Pac-12, we can go by the GOD-10. I disagree with your assessment on this.

And yes, according to US News, TCU ranks four spots ahead of KU but let's not go and cheer their academic standing. I mean per US News, they have the 97th best national program, ranking behind A&M, Mizzou, SMU, BYU, and CU. And they're obviously not an AAU school. So let's not put too much value in their academic standing.

BewareOfThePhogOnTheWater 10 years, 8 months ago

Mizery needs to be forced out of the conference. Get rid of the drama Meth queens.

Travis Clementsmith 10 years, 8 months ago

Look, no matter our personal feelings, Missouri in the Big XII is the best situation. If they are going to leave, you want to collect the exit fees and you void that if you "kick them out". There are other factors that will hasten the Missouri problem. If the SEC wants them, they have to get scheduling in order. If the SEC doesn't, then the 2nd Tier contract will kick in and Missouri will have to pay higher exit fees than it is going to now. I'm just as frustrated with them, but let MU think they are in the driver's seat. Perhaps their posturing will make some difference like the equal sharing and future conference division line ups.

BewareOfThePhogOnTheWater 10 years, 8 months ago

Yes, but if the conference called the tv revenue sharing final vote, their hand would be forced to either go and pay their exit fees or commit to the Big 12. Then we could move beyond their "we need to feel important" attitude and drama queen behavior.

BewareOfThePhogOnTheWater 10 years, 8 months ago

Hate to say "I told you so," but I told you so. The Mizery dominoes are about to fall.

Travis Clementsmith 10 years, 8 months ago

I wasn't in favor of TCU, but I'm not totally opposed to it either. It does put a Big XII team in Dallas. They have become a national player in football and are one in baseball. I tend to agree Patterson was getting the kids he needed anyways, so while it doesn't help KU recruiting there, I don't think it retards it much either.

The biggest thing to help conference stability is championships, specifically football championships, and TCU helps in that regard. If we want Louisville, we better get workin' on that because the Big East is being a stickler on their 27 month notification. Perhaps BYU will stay independent for a few years, the Big XII will operate as a ten team conference during that time, and then expand to 12 in time for the 1st Tier contract?

AlecRaenos 10 years, 8 months ago

Sounds like a plan because there is no one we add that will cause ESPN to reasonably want to negotiate the Tier 1 rights anyway. 10 until the ESPN contract is up and then, we shop our Tier 1 around and get the best deal.

irunsowhat 10 years, 8 months ago


Shouldn't it "pour in" rather "poor in"?

Mike Joseph 10 years, 8 months ago

just read what he means, not what he types

Brian Skelly 10 years, 8 months ago

It strikes me that TCU is a good add. Probably the easiest really. Even by TCU standards, cutting a 5 mil check to the Big East for inconvenience of not playing there is nothing. The size of the school concerns me in the way that Baylor does. But its not that big of concern.

We do have to get to 12 though, weather Mizzou is around or not. I still think Louisville makes sense on tons of levels, and im a little surprised that hasnt bubbled up more. Maybe with TCU not joining, and UConn's open flirtations with leaving the Big East will make it easier for Louisville (and others maybe) to bolt. I dont know what think otherwise.

BYU is still floating out there, but I think unless we add a travel pairing out west (Air Force? I dunno) Unless we're going to 16 (which seems unlikely), id rather go East than West. More TVs and less travel.

Adding is better than losing, so at least we're going in the right direction.

Graczyk 10 years, 8 months ago

Does the size of Miami bother anyone? That school is tiny compared with other teams in the ACC. It's the brand that matters. TCU is building a strong brand.

joshar 10 years, 8 months ago

The only benefit of getting TCU and possibly Louisville, WVU and maybe Cincy, is that it shows the Big 12 is stronger than the Big East. So that way people will quit saying KU will go to the Big East. Instead of going there, the Big 12 is bringing them here.

100 10 years, 8 months ago

I think just to "make a statement" about our conference's real strength (as the nation seems to have quickly forgotten)...

UT needs to toss Arkansas a few million bucks & we steal Arkansas from the SEC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Any businessman down in Austin should know, it's just "an investment"... Which will make Austin Texas millions more down the road by strengthening the Big 12 to epic proportions with a tremendous business victory over the SEC!!!!!!!!!

Oklahoma State?

T Boone Pickens are you listening?

Plus, whether or not Pickens or UT's businessmen would make the purchase, the truth is Arkansas by all reports has not really been all that happy since losing their rivalries...

So... What's it gonna cost an Austinite?

$25 million?

It's worth it no matter the cost.

Buy an SEC team...

If Missouri leaves for the SEC, we get the better team & the SEC can be happy at 12.

If Missourah stays.... We look even better, as hard as that is to say about a state that doesn't exist in Grampa Simpson's mind...

For the record, TCU is one helluva steal. BCS bowl last year. Rose Bowl champs. They'll eat up A&M's recruiting. And the small amount of Mizzou recruiting in Texas if Mizzou really leaves. Hilarious.

Hey UT!!!!!!!

Let's buy an old SWC rival back & put the official stamp back down right on top of the SEC!!!!



The Razorbacks!!!!!!!!!

joshar 10 years, 8 months ago

I agree with you, Big 12 is a strong conference. Obviously stronger than the Big East, which the media thought KU was going to join at the beginning of Round 2 of Conference Realignment. For some reason I forgot about Arkansas but that is a really good point. I've heard Arkansas is not happy with the SEC and that would be a great pickup for the Big 12. I would say get TCU while Big 12 can, then go for BYU, WVU and Arkansas. That way if Mizzou leaves, they will still have 12 schools and options to push to 16.

justinryman 10 years, 8 months ago

We are still waiting for TCU to accept. They are voting on it as we all blow wind here and type our thoughts away.

Then if they say yes it will become official, that is if they can get out of the Big Least and the $5 million buy out.

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

If it were Notre Dame, you'd be jumping through hoops in excitement.

Oh, wait, this is all about CFB, so make that "you'd be penalized for excessive celebration in the end zone".

ltownatrain 10 years, 8 months ago

+1 (these celebrations rules are getting ridic)

kubball99 10 years, 8 months ago

I like. Think they will split the two divisions and name them "Heaven" and "Hell"? Much like the B!G divisions of Legends and Leaders....

justinryman 10 years, 8 months ago

Matt, maybe you know this, but if they go back to 12 teams, and I don't care who they are at this point, do they or will they vote on where they will have the Big12 Championship Football game?

I know living in NE that was one thing that was brought up when they left was that it was only going to be in Dallas at Jerry World, and no longer floating from North to South every other year.

IF they have to re-vote on that will they also re-vote on where they play the Big12 basketball tournament and have it leave the Candy Bowl known as the Sprint Center??

jgkojak 10 years, 8 months ago

The sad part is - if Beebe had any vision, we'd have made this announcement 2 years ago--

Adding TCU and BYU (back when both were making conference moves) to get to 14.

Would not have diluted anything/added a TV market in Utah.

And you almost wonder if given a choice of joining the B12 w/BYU as a partner or the Pac, Utah would have chosen the B12?

lama 10 years, 8 months ago

The Big 10 is a better option than the Pac 12 and the Big 12. Neither league is interested in Kansas right now.

Ron Prichard 10 years, 8 months ago

Please explain your love affair with the PAC. I has been your mantra for the last two months (or more). I am guessing you live out west somewhere? I'm just curious why this blind devotion to the PAC?

BigAl 10 years, 8 months ago

The PAC should be and hopefully will be our very last option. A revived Big12 and/or an offer from the Big10 would be far superior to anything the PAC could do for Kansas.

BigAl 10 years, 8 months ago

Oh yeah, playing in a conference two time zones away makes all the sense in the world.

That alone trumps just about anything you got.

ja3hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

lol.. wow. You wont be able to convince him.

Maracas 10 years, 8 months ago

TCU? What, exactly, does TCU bring to the conference except another mouth to feed? They have like 7,000 undergrads in a market the Big 12 already has? We add another Texas school so UT can hold sway again in a solid voting block? Is the conference just trying to destroy itself?

Randy Bombardier 10 years, 8 months ago

Surprised we added TCU but glad we did to keep up our football profile. We might have to add SMU and Houston, too and I will just change my icon to the State of Texas. But, better late than never. Get us up to 12 at least.

Travis Clementsmith 10 years, 8 months ago

I don't think so. It was tough for Texas to swallow TCU, I don't think another Texas school is on the charts.

Phoghorn 10 years, 8 months ago

Hey, is anybody having trouble getting some of the kusports(dot)com pages to load properly? My browser keeps getting forced into compatibility view. I post this on the forum because I suspect that an ad might be causing it.

Shelley Bock 10 years, 8 months ago

If this is about football, why doesn't the Big 12 invite the "Kansas City Chiefs" to become a member. They play at a university level, don't they? The Chiefs would have a fighting chance on any given weekend.

Hank Cross 10 years, 8 months ago

A real good pick up. TCU's been to two BCS games, which of course is two more than MU. The only reason for concern is that they will lower the BB RPI.

LogicMan 10 years, 8 months ago

I'm sure they are smart people, and will immediately launch efforts to improve their BB program. A pilgrimage this weekend to Allen Fieldhouse and Naismith's grave would be a great start.

getserious 10 years, 8 months ago

Welcome aboard TCU. Now lets get BYU, Houston and SMU and kick Mizzou to the curb. I like the Texas schools more than adding Louisville and West Va. Just too far of a drive, and to get there you have to drive through the crap hole that we call Missouri. My dream is that we get up to 13, kick Mizzou out and then the SEC says no to them as well. Enjoy Conference USA jerks!

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

Distance to Louisville is not a issue, it is closer to Lawrence than: Boulder Lubbock Waco Austin College Station

As for having to drive through MO -- gas up before leaving KS, refuel once in Illinois (it's just 300 miles from Lawrence to East St Louis), and limit any stops in MO to bathroom stops at I-70 rest stops. Those are pretty good, but then MO knows outhouses, so it's to be expected.

Michael Maris 10 years, 8 months ago

FYI, you might want to actually fuel up in Missouri and avoid fueling up in Illinois. I live in St. Louis Metro area. Fuel prices in Illinois are still very high. Gas here in St. Charles is anywhere from $2.99 to $2.89 a gallon.

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

Thanks for the info, but sometimes you have to pay for your principles. This would seem to be one of those times. :-)

rob4lb 10 years, 8 months ago

To me this is a panic move by the Big 12. I have to trust that Neinas did his homework and this move doesn't dilute the media payout per school. In the best year, it will ever have, TCU averaged only 42.000 per game in it's 44,000 seat stadium so I'm not sure how the numbers come out.

What's done is done. Let's hope MU stays and two more teams are added. It's possible that by TCU accepting the offer, other schools might be more willing to join the conference. BYU is still a good candidate, but very isolated geographically.

ltownatrain 10 years, 8 months ago

Well Baylor doesn't average a lot of people and their stadium is only like 46000 so the stadium size and attendance shouldn't mater.

hawk1nation 10 years, 8 months ago

I have read reports that Alabama is not thrilled with adding Missouri to the SEC. The University of Alabama believes that it's in the best interest of the SEC to head East instead of West. If this is in fact true, Perhaps Missouri could take the open spot in the Big East from TCU? Then again, a third rejection would definitely not due a program well.

hawk1nation 10 years, 8 months ago

Excuse me, "do" not "due". Gotta love auto-correct

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

Matt, I've always felt in the past that the Big 12 would be better with MU, but I've frankly gotten tired with their staying simply because they haven't been able to get a ahem "better" offer.

Two years in a row now they've made themselves -- and by association, the conference (which doesn't need the "help") -- something of a joke. They better hope that 9th SEC president can be swayed to change his vote, or the egg on their faces will make last year's look miniscule in comparison.

MU wants to leave so badly, I'm holding the door open for them until they are all gone -- and I won't let it hit them in the rear on their way out because I'm gonna lock it so they can't come back once they realize what they've lost.

Hammertoe 10 years, 8 months ago

All Mizzou stated was they were looking at conference options. Just like OU, Texas, Tech and OSU stated . If they received an offer from the Pac 12 they would have all left. Every school that has received an offer to join another conference, has left! Reality check time.... The Big 12 needs Mizzou. Without Mizzou, no big 12 championships in the KC area. Texas will own the Big 12. 2.8 million people in Kansas divided up amoung 2 schools = little power...

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

I'm well aware of what has been said and what is being done by all parties, and disagree with your assessment.

As usual, MU's timing stinks. MU had plenty of time to explore while the others were doing the same. This late ploy is (1) a serious look at the SEC -- finally! -- only because the B1G remains on the sidelines uninterested in MU -- and (2) an attention grab that serves to further the uneasy conference situation instead of helping move the conference forward by either already having MU with the rest or already on their way out. Maybe -- and given MU's track record of embarrassing itself, that is one huge maybe -- MU's leadership is using this dalliance to squeeze more concessions out of Texas, but IMO that is only a beneficial side effect that the rest of the conference will enjoy. It will serve MU if they don't leave, BUT -- and that's another huge qualifier -- from all I've read/heard, they are seriously interested in the SEC now, and if the SEC had 9 votes for MU yesterday, I have no doubt that MU would have jumped at the opportunity. So, this more than dalliance may just end up being MU with more egg on its face since reports are that some university presidents in the SEC believe they "can do better than Missouri".

Yes, the Big 12 would be better economically (especially KCMO), academically and athletically with MU in the conference, but do not kid yourself. MU is not Texas or Oklahoma. The conference does not need MU to survive and thrive.

And also don't delude yourself about this reality: Texas already owns the Big 12. That's been the whole bloody problem -- at least according to all those who have bailed, and most who haven't, but only because they didn't have an option to grab that was better than staying with Texas. Kansas & KSU have and will have little power in the conference regardless of whether MU stays or goes. Their influence will come only in trying to form voting blocs to stop future Texas excesses.

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago

Question for the legal beagles .... Can the Big 12 kick out mizzery? If so, how soon could that happen? I have followed KU since 1961 and have hated mizzery since then. I would welcome the opportunity to have them booted from the Big 12 and never play them again. KC media would cease covering them and they would become non existent .

PS mizzery GTFO!!!!!

AlecRaenos 10 years, 8 months ago

I believe they can. The bylaws state that with approval of 75% of the members, suspension of membership can ensue if said member has failed to pay annual dues, or comply with Section 4 of the bylaws (concerning members) or violate any of the bylaws of the conference. In section it states: Encourage collaboration in areas beyond athletics that builds good-will between institutions and promotes the overall missions of the universities.

That part about building good-will between institutions could be enacted as grounds for termination or suspension of membership in Missouri's case.

I could be wrong but that's how I read it.

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago

That is great news ..... get on with it ..........kick their a$$E$ OUT

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

@ejlumus: As much as I understand and agree with the sentiment, No. MU has to leave on its own -- make it pay the exit fees to leave.

Of course, it would be sweet if the Big12 did vote MU out and then the SEC never got the needed 9 votes to offer MU membership (the SEC is currently stuck on 8 of 12 "For"). What would MU do then?

Oh, that would be so embarrassing... LOL

Brak 10 years, 8 months ago

I think this could be a great opportunity for Kstate to develop a real rivalry against someone. They could call their yearly showdown, "The Purple Palooza" or " The Stupid Purple Mascott Showdown". Instant classic.

actorman 10 years, 8 months ago

I appreciate the sentiment but it's not really fair to lump TCU in with the kitties. After all, at least the Horned Frogs is a fun, original nickname, not just another one of the thousands of generic Wildcat mascots.

FreddyinLA 10 years, 8 months ago

TCU is a good add. Dallas-FtWorth 4th ranked metro area by population.

6th place is Houston with 6M. Houston should be next.

In 29th place is KC. No. 30 is Vegas. Vegas baby. Who doesn't like going to Vegas and watching your team play.

Graczyk 10 years, 8 months ago

And if your team does play in Vegas, no body will know the score. You know, what happens in Vegas...

FreddyinLA 10 years, 8 months ago

B12 roadies. Ames, Columbia, Lubuck, Waco, (Little)Manhattan, Stillwater, Norman and my suggestion Vegas. Which trip do you take?

WestNEHawk 10 years, 8 months ago

Mizery: 2010 - We want the Big10. 2011 -We'll accept the SEC, as a 2nd choice. 2011 - We're equal to everyone in the Big12. 2012 - Headline: Big12 removes mizery as a member. 2012 - We're pleased to be a strong member of any conference that will accept us.

Phoghorn 10 years, 8 months ago

Boot out Mizzou - take Missouri State. Note...Missouri State hates the tiggers ever more that KU does - hard to imagine, but true.

LogicMan 10 years, 8 months ago

2012 - We're going independent! 2013 - Why won't anyone schedule us?

rob4lb 10 years, 8 months ago

Matt and all- I bring up this point at the risk of being totally trashed for supporting MU's approach. I think MU had to take the action of 'exploring options' even if they choose to stay. There is a very vocal (I don't know how large) fan base imploring MU to move from the Big 12. This fanbase needs to be appeased. If MU decided to pledge support to the Big 12 when they clearly were being courted by another conference, this fan base would be furious. I have to assume that the curators and adminstrators are being barraged with emails from fans and alums. This happened with A&M last year. I have to think other university administrators understand this.

I think it makes sense for MU to take some time, make the right decision, and if they always wanted to stay in the Big 12, they can announce the reasons why and again be welcomed with open arms. If the SEC indicated they wanted to strengthen their basketball and were targeting KU to form a 1-2 punch with Kentucky, a small but very vocal fanbase would expect KU to explore the option and would be furious if the university pledged support to the Big 12 without at least doing some due dilligence.

That said, everyone can now trash me for sympathizing with the enemy!

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago


BigAl 10 years, 8 months ago

A clown has some class. This guy doesn't measure up.

Brian Skelly 10 years, 8 months ago

I've said all along, if Mizzou has a standing offer (which is now starting to come in to question -- dejavu all over again), then they should feel free to go. I dont blame them for leaving if they think the stabler pastures of the SEC is the way to go.

Part of the instability however is in large part because of them. Maybe not as much as UT, or even OU. But dont forget Mizzou was showing a little leg towards the Big 10, well before the talk of CU and Nebraska leaving and being unhappy was made public to the level it was. They conveniently ignore this part. They're just as bad as the others leaving in my mind.

Personally, Id like them to stay. Even with all this. To me Mizzou is the schizophrenic cousin we all look at with a jaundiced eye simply to make sure our money is still in our wallet. But they still show up for Thanksgiving and Christmas regardless. Its family. Even if they're living in a van down by the river.

The level of psychotherapy needed if the Tiggers stay in the Big 12 for their fans could help put a dent in the federal deficit. Stay tuned.

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

There comes a point in your life when you realize you just don't need certain people and their negative bs*. Bye, bye, moosters.

Sam Constance 10 years, 8 months ago

When is the MU fanbase not furious about something?

Side note: any university administrator that is cow-towing to the demands of the fanbase rabble is doing his/her university absolutely no favors. Fans want things based on irrational, emotional investment. The majority of fans can't see the most obvious things about their own teams (which they follow religiously), let alone how something like a conference switch would impact all aspects of the university and it's fans, students, athletes, employees, etc. Do you really think that Joe Misery, who thinks MU is a "football school" and (in the words of MizzouForLife) has the greatest potential out of any team to dominate in the SEC besides Alabama and Florida, can grasp complex ramifications of conference realignment? I don't.

MU fans want out for the sake of wanting out. They want to feel important--like they're one of the movers and shakers in the college athletics world. They haven't really been able to do it on the field/court, save for several years in the last decade, so why not do it by whoring themselves out to every conference except the one that accepts them for the unlovable losers they are.

Fans are fans. They want things to get excited about, root for and cheer. Again, MU is having a somewhat down year in football, they're about to have a down-and-out year in basketball... the fans just want something to beat their collective chests about. Nevermind the fact that they make themselves look completely idiotic by demanding something that really serves no purpose other than a change for the sake of change.

Jayhawk444 10 years, 8 months ago

I'll be laughing my ass off if Mizzou stays. And I do want them to stay. It's just that this is so Mizzou-like in the way it is unfolding. They got embarrassed last year when they hiked their skirt to the Big10 and got spurned, but this would be so much more embarrassing. I completely agree with Matt that when they come back now, it will be with their heads held in shame...which will make it all that much more enjoyable to me.

All those people who have been clamoring all along for statements from SZ and BGL need to look no further than Columbia to see why often it is best to keep your mouth shut.

FLJHK 10 years, 8 months ago

I want Mizzou to stay, not just for the rivalry and tradition and for having someone to hate, but mainly because of geography. In the best of worlds, having a conference of geographically contiguous states is somewhat important. I like the concept of being able to drive to any other conference school without travelling through a non-conference state. If MU goes, Iowa State becomes geographically isolated. Too, because Missouri borders so many states, having them on-board makes adding such schools as Louisville more sensible.

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

I really understand and agree with your argument, but I'm sick of them, so I'll be quite content to see them go.

Having said that, I did find myself ROTFLMAO when I read today that 4 SEC schools think the SEC can do better than to add Moo.

142466 10 years, 8 months ago

Agree. Contiguous States are very important for long term stability. If Missouri leaves, then the addition of Louisville, Cincinatti, and/or WVU becomes less attractive. With Mizzou gone, any new member(s) east of Missouri would be easier targets for poaching by eastern conferences.

Travis Alexander 10 years, 8 months ago

Will Kansas please speak up and get involved more. I hate how silent our administration and coaches have been (I do like what Self said about Missouri recently though). Texas and Oklahoma get their two cents in all the time. Its time for Kansas to show that its strong and has an opinion as well.

Robert Brock 10 years, 8 months ago

All I want to know about the Kansas administrators is that they are repeatedly calling the Big Ten offices and begging them to consider us.

Bville Hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

Do you know that for a fact or are you just blowing smoke?

stuck88 10 years, 8 months ago

No, they are committed to the BIG XII

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

As Jayhawk444 wrote just above your post:

"All those people who have been clamoring all along for statements from SZ and BGL need to look no further than Columbia to see why often it is best to keep your mouth shut."

I much prefer them to continue emulating ducks -- placid and calm on the surface, paddling like mad underwater out of our sight.

Hank Cross 10 years, 8 months ago

Been reading about MU's antics. As bad as they misplayed their hand last year, they really screwed the pooch this year. Even if they go, they're not going to be welcomed with open arms.

If they go, add BYU, Boise, and AFA. In regard to Boise, they add more marquee FB match-ups than would any team from the BE. OU/Boise would be a definite Tier 1 Saturday Night game. Boise v. UT or TCU are also great match-ups that will draw good ratings. Of course Boise's academics are an issue, but AFA makes up for them and they bring the AFN.

jgkojak 10 years, 8 months ago


Tony Bandle 10 years, 8 months ago

The Big Faith Conference

Baylor = Southern Baptists Brigham Young = Mormons Texas Christian = Protestants Notre Dame = Catholics Southern Methodists = Methodists UCLA = Sun Worshippers Duke = Devil Worshipers Kansas = Hedonists Missouri = Voodoo Practitioners Kentucky = Sodomites

AzNHawk 10 years, 8 months ago

LMAO! I'm sorry. I couldnt help, but laugh at this post.

rob4lb 10 years, 8 months ago

You forgot K-State and of course, UT worships the almighty dollar.

Sam Constance 10 years, 8 months ago

Dude. Kansas as Hedonists?

In the words of Keyshawn Johnson, "COME ON MAN!"

The University of Kansas worships at the Church of Roundball, under the protective watch of the Father (Naismith) The Son (Forrest C. Allen) and The Holy Ghost (The Phog).


ahpersecoachingexperience 10 years, 8 months ago

Sharing tier 1 and 2 revenue, adding Tcu and a couple of other schools to add tv revenue are both great moves...Too bad they should of been made 3 years ago!

stuck88 10 years, 8 months ago

for once I have to agree with you, btw did you see that bowling took 15 last week!!! pretty awesome!!!

ja3hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

The approval by the Board was unanimous; however the University of Missouri did not participate in the vote on the advice of legal counsel.

Matt, is this an indication that the MU to SEC deal is more likely. Why is their legal counsel advising this?

ahpersecoachingexperience 10 years, 8 months ago

Conference realignment sucks! We should all be united in our criticism towards Turner but instead we are discussing where/will/if we go somewhere. Or Sheahorn and how being money whipped by Texas is allowing them to expand tln and add to conference instability while making texas' pockets fatter.

Now I'm going to copy and paste this so we can all get back to normal.

Dyrk Dugan 10 years, 8 months ago

huge news! Neinas is gettin 'er done...kicking tail and taking names. TCU, would seem to be a natural fit...despite their commitment prior to the Big East. playing UT, OU, TTech and O-State, instead of Cincy, Louisville and West's just a no brainer.

KU playing them once in awhile in Dallas would help us in recruiting in Texas just that much more.

what an interesting time for our friends (not) at ol' Moo. always wannabes....and they've never been. it's all hype all the time...and if they come back to the Big 12, it will be with their tail between their legs. rejected by two major conferences in two years....ouch, has to hurt. it would be unbelievably funny.

let's see what else unfolds....we start adding schools, who knows who will come? and then it becomes truly, good riddance Tiggers.

escaped_labrat 10 years, 8 months ago

Can they please just kick Mizzou out? They are like the Jan Brady of the conference....or Meg from Family Guy

Tuck 10 years, 8 months ago

From just purely a football perspective: here's the problem.....TCU, Louisville, Cinn., or any other team that's not an already guaranteed "product" is going to get slaughtered in the BIG12.

If the BIG12 fills its slots with teams like this (who may be decent right now) in 5 years time these teams are going to be horrible! What do you think the TV renegotiation is going to be like when these teams are pulling off 5-7, 4-8 type records? The TV networks are going to say that our "product" is weaker than its ever been and we're going to lose out.

I can understand TCU, they can replace Colorado but come on, Cinn, or Louisville replacing A&M and Nebraska? I say sure if we are going to 16 teams but not for 12. Are they any better than Houston or Rice?

Jabberhawky 10 years, 8 months ago

In the eleven seasons since Gary Patterson took over as head coach in 2000, TCU has posted a record of 101-30.

TCU has ended play ranked in the Top 25 (both in the AP and Coaches' polls) 8 out of those 11 seasons.

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

My kind of flash. Patterson is the real deal.

Tuck 10 years, 8 months ago

what conference are they getting those wins in again?

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

MWC -- which, before all the realignment it's gone through, has been a much better FB conference than AQ Big East has been in recent years, and would have been a lock to get AQ status in the next BCS eval except for the aforementioned membership shakeup.

And in the "give credit where it is due" department: TCU beat the B1G champion Wisconsin in the last Rose Bowl. You know Wisconsin -- the program that sent 3,000 Husker fanatics home very unhappy -- and even a bit embarrassed -- last weekend.

rob4lb 10 years, 8 months ago

The only available schools that can come close to replacing the schools who have left are BYU and West Virginia.

Tuck 10 years, 8 months ago

yeah, I'm honestly surprised nobody's mention Tulsa yet!

Tuck 10 years, 8 months ago

why not? they're mentioning Cinn and Louisville!

ja3hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

Wow you are giving A&M and Nebraska way too much credit.

Tuck 10 years, 8 months ago

A&M has some clout and Nebraska is a traditional power.Both have bigger attendance and fan bases than those teams mentioned.

Sam Constance 10 years, 8 months ago

Um, if your concern is the "product", then I can absolutely say that TCU, Louisville and Cincy are better than Houston or Rice.

I will listen to arguments about Houston and Rice being a better overall fit, due to things like academics, geography, etc... but if you're going to argue that Cincy and L'Ville aren't up to par on the field, don't come back with Houston and Rice.

That's ridiculous.

Tuck 10 years, 8 months ago

LOL, no you misunderstood.....I was saying the Cinn and Louisville are basically the same as Houston and Rice!!! I am arguing that TCU, CINN, Loisville, Houston, Rice, BYU, WVU, Rice, SMU and on are not better then A&M and Nebraska.

The only way to replace those schools are to steal good teams away from other conferences like Arkansas and Iowa or Notre Dame but that's not going to happen.

Graczyk 10 years, 8 months ago

I love this. The more that the league gets accomplished the harder it will be for Missouri to come back while saving face. They are now in a position where they must agree to the terms (because of all the votes) or find a new home. I hope they end up in the Big East, only to later be annexed by the Big 12 when that league collapses. That would be hilarious. Or they can go to the SEC and be as relevant as the Mississippi schools.

AlecRaenos 10 years, 8 months ago

Matt, since Missouri is still a member of this conference they abstained from voting on this grant of rights, does that mean that should they choose to leave, that they give up their TV rights for 6 years now? Or are they exempt? Obviously A&M is exempt because their actual acceptance to another conference pre-dates this move but Missouri has not accepted nor applied anywhere for all we know.

ParisHawk 10 years, 8 months ago

There is no grant of rights yet. There still has to be "formal assignment of rights by all institutions". If Mizzou wants to leave they will not assign rights, simple as that.

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago

"Grant of Rights" may be a requirement as of a certain date to be a member of the "new" Big 12.

mizzery may end up in conference USA. That would be special & fitting for a bunch of losers.

Mizzery GTFO

ja3hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

I'm probably the minority when it comes to this but I think the league should pursue 14-16 institutions. Assuming MU ends up staying we could snag these schools:

AFA - Colorado Springs, CO - 4,500 undergrads - 47k seat stadium (solid academics) BYU - Provo, UT (suburb Salt Lake) - 28,000 undergrads - 64k seat stadium (huge fanbase) UofL - Louisville, KY - 15,000 undergrads - 55k seat stadium Cincy - Cincinnati, OH - 31,000 undergrads - 35k seat stadium

Reach to get to 16+

WVU - Morgantown, WV - 22,000 undergrads - 60k seat stadium Notre Dame - South Bend, 8,000 undergrads - 81k seat stadium USF - Tampa, FL - 36,000 undergrads - 65k seat stadium

I can dream... and its possible with everything else that has been going on. This is my shortlist if I were on the B12 expansion committee

Pbbut 10 years, 8 months ago

I'm ready to go with you. Let's not be stupid with who we pursue, but I'm ready to do the blowing up rather than be the victim in this. Schools like KU didn't start this, but I say the Big12/16 be aggressive in settling it. If 16 team conferences are inevitable, regardless of how little sense it makes, why not be first.

ja3hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

I also meant to add Houston, SMU, Rice and Tulane. There are quite a few possibilities, we shouldn't just sit on our hands but make some smart decisions about moving forward. I hate water things down but if we're talking 16 team conferences, then every conf will get watered down a little bit.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 8 months ago

Missouri is proving to be about as good at moving to new conferences as they are about choosing new basketball coaches!!!

milwaukeeJAYHAWK 10 years, 8 months ago

Someone on 610 sports radio in KC today said that perhaps the anonymous Mizzou official who said "SEC is second choice behind Big 10" could have likely been leaking a comment like that on purpose....i.e.....they want Mizzou to stay in the Big 12 and are trying to rock the boat a bit and upset the SEC, therefore screwing up Mizzou's chances with them.

Who knows, but would be quite sneaky and funny if true.

Brak 10 years, 8 months ago

You know I initially thought that as well especially since it makes Mizzou look really bad, but maybe I missed it but I haven't heard one peep out of Mizzou denying this. Plus with their unwillingness to vote in the recent conference issues due to advice from their attorney makes me thing otherwise. I mean think about it, is it really beyond Mizzou to be this stupid...of course not.

Marcia Parsons 10 years, 8 months ago

A Missouri contributor to the comments on one of the sites Matt linked, has the theory that it was leaked by one of the other Big12 members trying to make MU look bad (as if they needed help) or make the SEC mad. And it was reported out of Topeka and by ESPN, two places he figured had an axe to grind. From his style of writing, I have serious suspicions that it was Fijitiger or whatever his name is from the Tiger board.

justinryman 10 years, 8 months ago

If and when the conference gets back to 12 schools, what 12 I don't know just like the rest, but can they get a new logo/design????

BigAl 10 years, 8 months ago

ESPN just reported that Missouri doesn't have enough votes from the SEC universities to even get an invite from the SEC. Whoops.......

rob4lb 10 years, 8 months ago

This article is a good perspective. It looks like if the commissioner wants MU, he will get the votes

Sam Constance 10 years, 8 months ago

If I had been drinking milk when I read this, I would have snorted it out my nose after reading Mike DeArmond get high and mighty about all the reports out there right now having an agenda.

He might be right, but his report had just as much of an agenda as any out there.

What a windbag.

Eric Dawson 10 years, 8 months ago

DeArmond = windbag insults true windbags everywhere.

Brian Skelly 10 years, 8 months ago

In fairness, at this point ESPN is spinning (and has been) spinning anything UT tells them... so id take that with a grain of salt.

That said, there is a link above, and ive seen other links as well (of course, they all could just be recycling information -- likely) that they seem to be short on votes in the SEC to approve the Tigers for membership.

rockchalkjjjhawk 10 years, 8 months ago

Absolutely the worst possible move to make. Horrendous decision. 8500 enrollment! Are you kidding me? There are a few NAIA schools that big. Absolutely a non-entity outside of football. Waters down the Big12 drastically. I have no idea what folks are thinking, but one thing is for certain and that is the powers down in Texas are still calling the shots. Loose A&M but gain TCU? What a powerplay....and joke.

tecuani 10 years, 8 months ago

"TCU has made nine appearances in the NCAA Baseball Tournament: 1956, 1994, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008,2009, and 2010.[18][19] TCU has 23 All-Americans, six Freshman All-Americans, three players of the year awards, two pitchers of the year, and numerous All-Conference selections. The TCU Baseball Team makes its home in Lupton Stadium, with a capacity of 3,500."

Not saying they are a huge gain sports wise, but it does prove you wrong.

pgittemeier09 10 years, 8 months ago

o i didnt know conference realignment was about improving your baseball identity... Rice come on down

AlecRaenos 10 years, 8 months ago

Its not but dude above is saying "absolute non-entity outside of football" which tecuani's post disproves.

And this is ONLY about football. TCU replaces A&M easily.

Bville Hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

It's not ONLY about football, but it is MOSTLY about football. Everything else is a distant second.

Bville Hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

What are you smoking? Your perception of reality is clinically interesting...

Jeff Coffman 10 years, 8 months ago

I must say I was wrong...I thought with MU leaving OU/OSU would leave as well... this proves that piece wrong. However, I won't be wrong about this. The Big XII and other conferences will seek to break up the Big East now from a football perspective. The idea is so that the 27 month waiting period won't be enforced and neither will the $5MM dollar exit fee.

The idea is to break the football conference to under five members. Currently there are eight members (nine if you count TCU). Already Pitt and Syracuse have announced they are leaving for the ACC. TCU now to the Big XII. This leaves six. If the Big XII goes after two additional members that breaks the Big East.

TCU was the logical choice for the tenth team, the whole notion of breaking the Big East has been the plan and TCU created the least litigation risk.

If Missouri bolts, you add BYU and two Big East teams to get down to 4 Big East teams remaining.
If Missouri stays, you add two Big East teams and BYU is out, not because they aren't the target, but you have to make sure the Big East fails else the football schools sue.

The basketball contract was not that big "yet" for the Big East and the buyout ($5MM will be negotiated to about $1-2MM) and no waiting period.

rob4lb 10 years, 8 months ago

Breaking up the Big East may force Notre Dame's hand to join a conference.

Jeff Coffman 10 years, 8 months ago

Although I would love that, Breaking the Big East was really about football, there are still like 10 basketball only teams that would remain, and that will not create the leverage for ND to find another Basketball conference.

LogicMan 10 years, 8 months ago

Hopefully the Big East will survive as a really good BB conference.

And likely the Big 12 will agree to play a lot of BB games with them if we grab some of their current FB members.

And we'll take ND in all sports, if they apply for Big 12 membership quickly. Get it while it's hot, ND!

Eric Harrison 10 years, 8 months ago

This^^^ man is making sense. TCU doesn't have to wait 3 years (neither does BYU), so it made sense to get us to 10 and some semblance of 'more powerful' than the BEast.
I would tell BYU that the plan is to add them once they determine who their best playing partner would be (Boise St, AFA, CSU, UNLV, etc.) While in actuality we are figuring out if we want to move to 12, 14, or 16 and seeing which teams fit them. If we want BYU I think AFA is it's 'buddy'. (14 teams) That gets us to 12, but I like the BEast schools better for individual markets and Cincy/Louis seem to partner well (16 teams).

Eric Harrison 10 years, 8 months ago

Of course my math was way off. TCU =10 BYU/AFA + Louis/Cincy=14 (in 2014)

Possibly: WVU & ? = 16 With the ? being Memphis, Tulane, S Miss, SMU, CSU, Houston, Boise

rockchalkjjjhawk 10 years, 8 months ago

BGL, it's time to get out now! before it's recommended that the remaining schools to get back to 12 must be two Texas high school teams. Folks, from 1960 to when GWB took office, TCU was never ranked in any polls. Since then, they have been ranked pretty much every year. Question. What happens if TCU becomes an also-ran in football again? Excited are we to watch KU play TCU in basketball? Might be a tough ticket to find considering their 'arena' seats 7000 people. I am now completely convinced that there just isn't a whole lot of brain power in the room in any of these decisions anymore. I suppose the only good thing from a KU perspective is if TCU goes back to being an average football program, at least KU will not be overmatched in every conference game.

ja3hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

There are a lot of places to play basketball in the Dallas Ft Worth area that seats more than 7000... chill out. You sound stressed.

BigAl 10 years, 8 months ago

Get out and go where? Right now, a revitalized Big12 with the way it is going is absolutely the very best place for KU to be.

THEPIC 10 years, 8 months ago

Why is everyone bashing MU? they are the only ones left with options. Dont think for a minute if the BIG 10 called tomorrow that KU would not be gone in a second. Lets see in 6 years the LHN will be 6 years older and who knows what TX will want to do then - since they still call the shots. Me thinks that some of us schools are signing our own death sentence by agreeing to this. I hope I am wrong, and I guess we will know in 6 years.

ja3hawk 10 years, 8 months ago

Yeah... I don't disagree with you. I know it's pipe dreams but it would be cool to join the B1G along with MU and ND...

BigAl 10 years, 8 months ago

I don't necessarily disagree with you but why all of a sudden should we believe that Missouri has options? Remember when they claimed they had options from the Big10? Now the SEC? Problem is, there are just as many reports out there saying that MU can't get the votes needed to join the SEC. In all fairness, MU may or may not go but I am definitely not convinced that they have options. I highly doubt if they have any options that are better than what they have in the Big12. Like before, IMHO they are going to look like a whipped pup again when and if they come "back" to the Big12.

Lance Hobson 10 years, 8 months ago

Forget Mizzou, they are incredibly unloyal and are just looking for a better deal, I hope they get left in the cold. I say give them an ultimatum, take it or leave it. If they leave, then good luck not getting rejected by the SEC.

Then we've got to get BYU, that would be a great choice. Excellent academics, hugely growing fan base, and it's also a good basketball school.

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago

mizzery does not have options. I would buy a put under these embiciles and collect a lot of $$$$$$$$$$. If you play options you will understand this comment.

mizzery GTFO!!!!!!!!!!

Michael Maris 10 years, 8 months ago

Living here in STL. All of the Missouri fans that I have to work with are so for Missouri moving to the SEC (now). They can't stand to wait (any longer). I asked a couple if they would be pissed off if Missouri doesn't leave, will they be pissed off. And, their answer was an adamant YES.

If BYU gets added to the Big XII, does that mean that KU, K-State and other schools get better access to the football players in Somoa? After seeing the segment on 60 minutes (months ago now), perhaps, we can find our DT that we need in the Somoa territory. Tell them, that they won't have to serve 2 years on a mission if they come to KU (instead of BYU).

kureader 10 years, 8 months ago

Interesting, but I don't get their rationale. The money's not better.
They complained about lack of stability in the conference, and yet they're the ones who are making it unstable ... last year they were the first to start rumors that they were moving to the Big 10. This year, they're talking about the SEC, even after the other teams have re-upped to the Big 12.

JayDocMD 10 years, 8 months ago

I wonder what the delay is in TCU formally accepting the offer and stating they are applying for membership? I know these things take time, but didn't their Board meet today? You have to think Chuck "Norris" Neinas (who is kicking some tail I must say) had assurance behind the scenes that a quick "yes" would follow the invite. While unlikely, how embarrassing would it be if TCU drug this out or even worse said "thanks but no thanks."

ltownatrain 10 years, 8 months ago

What I love about this is Mizzou all along has played the stability and texas has too much power card but with all the things happening now if they leave that card is null and void and they look like the a**holes who started this mess in the first it.

texashawk10 10 years, 8 months ago

What do you mean look like? They are the ones who started it by opening their mouths about the Big 12 last year and that triggered the mad dash for everyone else to find a home outside the Big 12.

Hammertoe 10 years, 8 months ago

Jealous is an ugly emotion. 40 wins in 4 years for Mizzou. If Mizzou leaves, you will never see another Big 12 Championship game in any sport in Kansas City, MISSOURI. The Power of the Big 12 will shift to Texas along with all the championship games. Be careful what you wish for. All Mizzou said was they were looking at options. Same as OU, texas, tech and OSU. KU is holding firm on the Big 12 as the best option as it it the only option!

Sam Constance 10 years, 8 months ago

Ha ha ha hahaha haha ha ha ha ha ha hah a haha hah ha hahahaha ha haha ha.

Are you seriously implying that it was Misery's "bold" presence that prevented Texas from running the league?

Oh my lord, you really are quite delusional, huh?

I also find it amusing that you would bring up jealousy. Because it's pretty clear that MU is jealous of Nebraska, for getting an invite to the B1G. Depending on how this plays out, they might end up being jealous of A&M. And the way you rant about Texas and all their power, MU seems jealous of that too.

Meanwhile, KU fights to keep and stay in the Big 12, which makes the most sense for all the teams that were ALREADY IN the Big 12, if you look at it logically, rather than irrationally and emotionally. KU isn't jealous. KU wants to keep what it already has while Grass is Greener fools like Missouri spread their legs.

rob4lb 10 years, 8 months ago

I agree with THEPIC's assessment but you have to be pragmatic. We have no other option so we need to make the best of this situation. Equal revenue sharing doesn't really get KU that much more money (we may lose a little), but it sounds good. Since KU doesn't compete for recruits with UT, the LHN content really doesn't affect us until we start to lose basketball recruits. Maybe we buy six years of stability which is better than the six months of stability we currently have.

The positive spin from the statement from the Chancellor and AD are predictable. They come across as more of a sigh of relief than any sense of accomplishment. If MU ends up staying in the Big 12, I think the end result will be slight positive. If they leave, the end result of this will have been negative. KU will certainly be perceived as holders-on and put in the same category as Iowa State, Kansas State and Baylor.

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago

mizzery leaving will not be negative...................... the sooner they leave the better.

142466 10 years, 8 months ago

TCU would have been OK as #16, maybe OK as #14. As #10 (#9 if Mizzou departs) their addition does little to improve the B12's image. Makes it appear like the league is even more Texas dominated. I realize that several sources report that UT didn't want the league to add TCU. But the message the addition of TCU, as our very first pick-up, sends to other potential strong entrants is that the league is still Texas dominated. #10 (#9) should have been someone more impressive and not a Texas school (like BYU, Air Force, or Louisville). That would have enabled the league to more easily attract additional strong entrants to get back to 12.

After all the music stops, we may end up with something that closely resembles the old Southwest Conference, plus half of the old Big 8. The exact oppisite of what we thought we were getting into when the B12 was formed. Do any of us northerners like that?

Finally, it's fun to go on a binge and bash Mizzou. I participate, too. But we better sober up and understand that Mizzou's inclusion makes the league stronger, and even more importantly, enhances the stature and bargaining power of the north schools against the Okla and Texas schools. We've already lost Neb and Colo. If Mizzou bolts, there won't be very many of us left.

jgkojak 10 years, 8 months ago

Even if ND remains an Indy in football - getting their other sports would be a coup-

here's a suggestion-

Get 12 teams, and add ND and DePaul for basketball and non-football sports - gets you ND's nat. audience and Chicago (for DePaul).

That would be a nice conference.

Andy Tweedy 10 years, 8 months ago

You've got that right! If you read the arguments as to why the Big East fails, one of the main reasons is the football and non-football school couldn't agree on anything.

Michael Bowden 10 years, 8 months ago

Some of you make me sick, your bashing MU when your no bettertalking about how TCU was the dumbest and we can do better your down right dumb, I dunno where you get your better than everybody attitude were terrible at football, you should just be happy we have a home for six years, seriously your saying we have better options because apparently we haven't had any other options what so ever get over the better than the next attitude and look at the glass this way we have a home for six years, so we have six years to make better options likea football team that will win four games, whatever teams are being added are in the best interest for the next six years

Hank Cross 10 years, 8 months ago

If MU leaves, how about inviting LVille, Cincy, and WVa - thus triggering the end of the BE. Then add ND, Marquette, DePaul, and another BB school to make a 16 team BB league and a 12 team FB league.

ahpersecoachingexperience 10 years, 8 months ago

Remember this for a few days ago We have lost 3 million fans (4 if Mizzou goes) and replacing them with 400,000. Not I'm not a math major but this can't be good.

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago

The better option for everyone is mizzery gone.

KC media will concentrate on KU & KSU. Do you hear much about the corn anymore? NO.

Recruiting will be better along the border and in Texas. Mizzery recruiting in Texas will tail off same as Arkansas when they moved to the SEC. Mizzery media and fan support will increase in east mo and decrease in west mo.

Possibly a new multi purpose building will be built in Wyandotte County therby eliminating the Sprint Center as an option for the Big 12 tournament.

No more negativeness about looking elsewhere.

mizzery leaving all positives for KU, KSU and the Big 12 conference.

Big 12 needs to boot them out .... sonner the better.

rob4lb 10 years, 8 months ago

I'm sure you are not serious. If MU leaves, no more Big 12 basketball tournament in KC. It will probably be semi-permanent in Dallas with an occasion turn in OKC. The KC area does not need another large arena. Kansas City is a big loser if MU leaves. There is no way the SEC has any events there.

MU is by far the second biggest state by population in Big 12 territory. That is a huge negative. Since it is the only major university in the state, the entire state follows the team. We can argue that KU, KSU and Illinois take parts of the KC and StL metro area, but there is still a large captive audience throughout the state for MU.

Sure TCU has fielded a great team the last few years. Now that they are in a real conference, don't expect such a glossy record. They also do not add alot of new fans in Fort Worth. They have a small alumni and at best TCU is the 4th most popular college sports team in Fort Worth- after UT, A&M and Tech.

It may feel good to trash talk, but MU leaving is a big loss.

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago

i would agree with that statement. It would be more positive without the diva bs! AND we just might catch a big fish in the expansion.

142466 10 years, 8 months ago

Right. If Mizzou leaves, we're headed towards the resurrection of the old Southwest Conference, with UT as the Chairman of the Board, OU as Vice Chairman, and the other league members as wholly owned subsidiaries. The addition of TCU does virtually nothing to increase the chances of the B12 attracting truely worthy entrants. With TCU, the two parent companies added another subsidiary. That's all.

Recall the days when the Big 8 was a powerful FB conference. How do think the sports world would have reacted if CU, NU, and Mizzou departed and were replaced with the likes of TCU, as the first addition, and Louisville being regarded as the upper limit of other potential replacements. At best, TCU should have been considered as #14. Sad state of affairs for folks north of Oklahoma City.

I know this comment isn't going to please many readers, but it's relavent: I think Mizzou is still pissed, really pissed, that KU got the BCS bowl invite instead of them.

Sam Constance 10 years, 8 months ago

If this has anything to do with the BCS bowl invite, then I've been giving MU far too much credit.

They're really much, much, much stupider than I thought.

Martin Rosenblum 10 years, 8 months ago

How did TCU end up as the Horned Frogs anyway?

Michael Bowden 10 years, 8 months ago

Now that my rant on thinking were better than everyone else is over my take on things. We go after BYU and not nice but get the two best schools from the big east and make a case to ND, that gets us to 14 which in all seriousness is the trend ex ACC is at 14 the SEC will soon be at 14, and we plead are case to stay a big time BCS contending conference.

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago

Lord help me we agree again....................


and a caveat ............ MU to Conference USA...............

Andy Tweedy 10 years, 8 months ago

The more I read, the more I think the Big XII is going to stay at 10. Of course, I've been wrong before...this one time, in 1986, I was completely wrong about something!!!

BigMitchin_ 10 years, 8 months ago

This is what the Big XII needs to do. @Matt you should check into what the possibilities of a scenario like this.

Big XII takes TCU - happening now

Big XII aggressively goes after Louisville and West Virginia for 11th and 12th members

As that happens, Uconn and Rutgers will be really pushing to get into the ACC

Big East is gone... Big XII now has leverage and ability to go after Notre Dame. I say this because now what the Big XII can do is say OK, we have 12 football teams and we are satisfied with that. Why don't we go after Notre Dame and allow them to keep football independent, then we can also add BYU and allow them to stay independent in football as well.

All of the sudden we have the ability to give certain teams what they want and need in order to really align themselves with a conference as well as having a solid set of schools.

Academics will improve, football will stay good, we look much more attractive in basketball, and it puts the Big XII on the map as the best conference to be in as well a certain powerhouse basketball conference.

On the other hand Missouri could leave... Then add Cincinatti as well. Yes it's a hit in academics, football, and a couple other areas. However, we gain a new market, another good basketball team, and another BigE team that will make the old BigE teams happy to still be together.

Just a thought that could be thrown around.

Andrew Holmes 10 years, 8 months ago

Very interesting perspective. With the BigEast schools being added in this scenario, KU would become competitive in football again. This would help recruiting for both football and basketball as well as make more money for the university as KU would be bowl bound most (if not every) year. Basketball would benefit greatly adding the likes of Louisville and WestVa along with the remaining Big XII schools.

Jeff Coffman 10 years, 8 months ago

As a lot of people mention Notre Dame now, I don't think it becomes a possibility with Revenue Sharing of Tier 1/Tier 2 TV rights.

When was the last time Notre Dame didn't have a football game on National TV, that means it is on Tier 1, sometimes going to ABC, which would be Tier 2, either way why would they ever share those revenues? Selling them on they can keep their Tier 3 revenues makes absolutely no sense now, they don't have any Tier 3, except maybe some non-revenue sports (e.g. swimming, track, etc.).

Playing Basketball might be a possibility, but I think it would just be scheduling purposes, not for in-conference play.

Brian Skelly 10 years, 8 months ago

It'll be an interesting next few weeks with all of this...

1) Is Mizzou gone or simply doing its annual vanity play? I for one think they're gone, but the thing with the SEC not having the votes strikes me as interesting. My guess is some teams simply need to be worked on before this goes through, but who knows.

2) Big East... what now? Does UConn push harder for the ACC now? Does it get Rutgers to go with them? Then what? Do we go get Louisville, Cincy, W.V., South Florida... or some combination of that? Clearly, the Big East is on life support at this point.

3) Notre Dame... I wont sit here and fantasize about them heading our way... BUT... the previous poster makes a good point about taking them in other sports, but allowing them to play independently. So I guess I am a little. They still belong in the Big 10 though.

I think the playing out of what happens with the Big East will be interesting to say the least. Far more interesting that whatever the hell Mizzou ends up doing.

trey 10 years, 8 months ago

I think adding TCU is absolutely the right first move by the Big12. Note the emphasis on "first" (if the Big12 stops at 9 or 10, it's continues to die a slow death). I would have far preferred KU going to the B1G or PAC, but obviously not happening either due to our leaders not pursuing, or pursued but no interest (I believe former). But I digress. Reason for good move by Big12...

For the Big12 to survive long-term, there has to be five conferences with 12-14 teams (vs 4 with 16). That means they have to kill-off the Big East.

The easiest first move is TCU as it takes the Big East to 6 football teams, and TCU can come next year (don't have to wait 27 months). Making BYU first add would not have hurt Big East.

And though TCU is relativiely small, they're in our geography, good academics, good football.

I would think following moves would be, in order...

  1. BYU (best available school on almost all fronts, and available).
  2. Louisville (decent football, good hoops, name brand).
  3. West Virginia (only if MU goes SEC; one or other is going to be #14 in SEC).
  4. Cinci (don't like it, but Louisville travel partner and decent football & hoops).

My bet, if MU stays, we get to 12 with TCU, BYU, Louisville. If MU goes, we get to 12 with TCU, BYU, Louisville, W Vga.


Part of Big12 problem is not a lot of big programs to invite (and no State schools). We wont offer W Vga unless and until MU leaves, because we'd prefer to keep MU and have the SEC add W Vga. We would never want to kick MU out; if we do we can't collect the 20M in exit fees. There are not enough good teams to have five conferences of 16, so 12-14 is the right number for Big12.
Stopping at 10 would be huge mistake, we need the football conference championship game that comes from two divisions.

jchief40 10 years, 8 months ago

You see I think if BYU comes along Boise St would be the travel partner and strengthen the football lineup as well. Boise St has been elite for quite awhile now. Fairly new school and on the up and up from the looks of it.

Sam Constance 10 years, 8 months ago

Why do people continue to treat the "superconferences" as a foregone conclusion?

There is absolutely no basis, other than some media-concocted story.

The idea that we are definitely headed towards fewer, larger conferences and that the only way the Big 12 can "survive" is to be one of those 5 is so farfetched and ludicrous to me.

It's like we think we know the end game, and everyone's in such a rush to find a way to get there without being left out, never realizing the entire time that it's become a self-fulfilling prophecy, being carried out because it's going to happen. No one seems to understand what a tragedy of reasoning that is. The superconferences are causing themselves.

Quite a paradox.

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago

Possibly Notre Dame would keep home games as Tier3, road games would be Tier1 & 2.

mizzery can GTFO ASAP.

Jeff Coffman 10 years, 8 months ago

If Notre Dame came to the Big XII, you are trying to tell me that OU at Notre Dame or UT at Notre Dame would be a Tier3 game?

If there was a game higher than Tier 1 like a Tier 0, those two games would fit in that category.

Those would be games that would grab 50% of the TV population around the country, there is no way that those games become Tier 2 let alone Tier 3 games.

ejlumus 10 years, 8 months ago

I believe their current contract with NBC is for home games therefore tier3. You win some you lose some. That maybe one way to recruit ND to the Big 12.

TwistedFish31 10 years, 8 months ago

The Big XII just needs to make a preemptive strike and get rid of missouri. I'm not sure how they could do it, but they have made it clear that they do not want to be part of our conference. So just like ejlumus said...mizzery can gtfo asap!

Josh Kuntz 10 years, 8 months ago

anyone thought of southern miss....good fball school and in sec country?

Ethan Berger 10 years, 8 months ago


Okay I've been reading the comments. And I want to clear something up. TCU is not a religious schools. They are as secular as you get.

2nd, why the hate on the religious schools? Who was the first to take a stand? That lil baptist school. And can we get away from "bible thumping" you don't have to believe it but it's just as annoying when something as the title of religious and its bible thumping. Your shoving your views down my throat too. School with Religion aren't all that bad. But trust me TCU is as far as you can get away from religion.

Sam Constance 10 years, 8 months ago

It's because people don't grasp the fact that most private universities in this country were founded by churches or religious organizations, even though their modern-day curriculum and focus may be completely secular.

A couple other BCS-conference schools with "religious" roots:

Duke (Methodist/Quaker) Northwestern (Methodist Episcopal)

No one really thinks of those schools as "religious" because they don't have CHRISTIAN right there in the name.

Josh Galler 10 years, 8 months ago

I think adding Boise State would be a huge mistake on other sports. if we want a travel partner for BYU, Air Force would be my #1 choice

here is what I prefer

1-TCU is added and Missouri Stays 2-Lets go to 14 to Become Big 14 in other sports but 12 for Football only.

Lets look at 2

For the next two Teams, I say add Air Force and Louisville. (SEC take WVU to be 14, UCONN and Rutgers to ACC for 16, Cincy and USF back to Conf USA/Merger with MTN West) then we add BYU and ND for other teams, and taking a book from someone else who mention this have the two teams play 3-4 games of BIg 12 and they still can play their games vs Mich USC for ND and BYU can still play Utah and Boise State.

Steve Brown 10 years, 8 months ago

  1. I've been advocating TCU for 3 weeks, done.

  2. ARKANSAS: find leverage points, award the Big12 football championship game to San Antonio unless Jerry Jones razorback can get Arkansas to move in and give naming rights to Wal.Mart Bowl almost free as they have to control Arkansas. Raxorbacks might just like getting back to playing all the Texas schools where they can recruit and away from cheating Auburn and Tide and LSU.

slipp them half the LHN $$ under the table and tell the BBall coach he won't have to return to COlumbia, ever. Whetehr MU stays or goes, we should go get Raxorbacks.

TXBBall55 10 years, 8 months ago

Big time report breaking right now (sounds credible). I'm guessing MU stays with Big 12...SEC in "serious talks" with SMU (to be "West Vandy"). Only way talks get serious with SMU is because MU staying put. SEC really wants in Dallas and West really wants small private school (aka "easy win" team). We'll see...

SMU Rivals Expert Twitter Feed!/EJSports4

Robert Howard 10 years, 8 months ago

Matt - I find myself this Monday morning yearning for some realignment news. It seems like an eternity since Missouri gave Deaton the ok to look around, and I haven't seen any news recently that indicates a decision is anywhere close. It also seems like Neinas & the Big 12 are in a wait-and-see mode regarding expansion until an MU decision is final.

While the Big 12 is waiting on MU, it seems the Big East is posturing to add teams, and the C-USA and MWC are trying to form an alliance. Lots of potential movements & developments, while we wait.... and wait.... and wait....

What are you hearing Matt? Is there a risk that we wait too long and potentially miss out on adding some higher profile schools?

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