Advertisement

Thursday, February 4, 2016

Keegan

Tom Keegan: My fake outrage over Bill Self’s slip

Kansas head coach Bill Self looks for a foul from an official during the second half, Saturday, Jan. 23, 2016 at Allen Fieldhouse.

Kansas head coach Bill Self looks for a foul from an official during the second half, Saturday, Jan. 23, 2016 at Allen Fieldhouse.

Advertisement

Fake outrage rages louder than ever in sports, so let me share some phony fury with you. Pretend all the letters are upper case, so you can hear me shout.

I am beside myself that Kansas University basketball coach Bill Self used a slang word in front of the word move in sharing his thoughts during his post-game interview with his shadow, Greg Gurley, regarding Brannen Greene’s dunk with two seconds remaining in Wednesday night’s game. Self was talking to a friend honestly about a play that incensed him and the word slipped out on the radio. Outraged, I tell you, I am outraged. How could this happen?

Greene’s virgin ears ought not ever have to hear such a word, the first definition of which on dictionary.com is, “a detective.” Just thinking about such language makes me blush.

Never mind that after Wichita State bounced Kansas from the NCAA tournament last March, Greene told a friendly, respected reporter who attempted to interview him to “Get the (bleep) out of my face!”

Still, the young man is only 21. Please, let’s all watch our language around him.

I could manufacture more indignation and claim I am deeply offended by a player dunking to pad his stats when the proper etiquette in today’s game is to dribble out the clock. Completely beside the point. I don’t control Greene’s playing time, so it’s irrelevant whether you, me, or the man on the moon was offended by Greene’s untimely and timeless dunk. It only matters what Self thinks and he thinks it’s “classless” and bad sportsmanship to rub it in. Greene knew it would infuriate his coach and he did it anyway. What’s a coach supposed to do, fist-bump him and tell him, “Nice move, B.G., let me light your victory cigar for you.”

No need to fake anything when voicing this disappointment: Greene’s a blast to watch play basketball but just can’t seem to figure out how to get out of his own way, which limits the time we can see him rise up and swish another three.

Comments

Austin Lopez 6 years, 3 months ago

Well maybe people in todays generation should play until the final buzzer sounds, how about that classy move.... don't leave the court before the final horn sounds, thats disrespectful to the game, the game was ment to be played all the way through, point blank period....

Lonnie Ross Dillon 6 years, 3 months ago

Great argument...except KU "Stopped playing" first by trying to dribble out the clock. That sir is called sportsmanship...right up until BG decided to take advantage and pad his stats. Where I grew up that was called bush league.

Brian Aubry 6 years, 3 months ago

Agreed Lonnie. I don't think anyone would be having this conversation at all if he had waited another 3 seconds and did it for the fans.

Dale Rogers 6 years, 3 months ago

I think it would still have been tacky even after the buzzer sounded. And I think Austin's comment was fully tongue-in-cheek. It's sometimes hard to tell simply from reading a comment.

Glen Miller 6 years, 3 months ago

Uhhhh... our players were walking off the court too. It amazes me that some of you seem to come on here and spout off some rant about our team, when it's clear that you yourself obviously weren't paying much attention.

Marius Rowlanski 6 years, 3 months ago

Wow... Talk about spouting off on some rant. Get off the soapbox before you fall and hurt yourself.

Tim Parks 6 years, 3 months ago

You're dead on Lonnie, and I'm quite certain we don't want to see Perry Ellis tear his Achilles (or any other Jayhawk) when they're up 16 with 10 seconds left.

John Boyle 6 years, 3 months ago

Perry shouldn't be on the court if we are up by 16 with 10 seconds left. Not that excuses any poor behavior by Greene.

Jared Reeves 6 years, 3 months ago

If you watch the replay it appears that Greene wasn’t aware there was still time on the clock when he dunked the ball. The players stopped playing, the coaches had just shaken hands, there were 2 seconds left on the clock, and his demeanor wasn’t that of a person who was trying to make a statement or pad his stats. I have seen players take an extra shot after a foul, and after halftime numerous times. It looked like he was just going through the motion, like it was a warm-up. I think this is a situation borne out of Greene’s inattention, rather than his malice or greed to pad his stats.

Self completely overreacted to an event he probably didn’t even see, since he had just shaken hands with Webber and was around mid-court. Self doesn’t like Greene, and his bias showed. Tom’s argument that Greene has virgin ears is a straw-man argument. Greene isn't the only audience. Self is an adult and the head coach, and should know better than to overreact publicly to something he probably didn’t see in real-time.

Marius Rowlanski 6 years, 3 months ago

Exactly what my wife said. I'm not so sure but it wasn't the type of dunk to show disrespect. Looked to me as an afterthought though he should have thought about it for 3 more seconds.

Tom Jones 6 years, 3 months ago

He knew. He said he just "lost his mind" for a second.

Greene gonna Greene.

Jared Reeves 6 years, 3 months ago

Tom,

Do you have a source for the quote? I am not sure how one can "know" simultaneous with "losing one's mind" (not knowing).

Henry Joseph Hofmeister 6 years, 3 months ago

If you can, when would you pass up a dunk in allen fieldhouse? any of you? time doesn't matter, i'd do it just to fly.

Gerry Butler 6 years, 3 months ago

If Coach didn't like Brannen he would of been off this team ALONG TIME AGO, he wasn't off after the 1st time, OR the 2nd time OR this time the 3rd time, that statement is so comical. are you SERIOUS? Brannen just goes brain dead. Won't have to worry, he just put himself deeper on the bench. Good player, responsible timing? ummmm not so much

RJ King 6 years, 3 months ago

Your first paragraph articulates my thoughts exactly. It was almost like, for Greene, practice just ended. Greene struggles mightily with focus. It's not an excuse, but I don't think it's fair to label it Richard behavior.

Self's reaction was in the moment. I agree he overacted, and think in a week or two he'll probably wish he'd handled it differently - a simple apology without the other details.

I would disagree that Self "doesn't like" Greene. Parenting four kids/stepkids over the last 28 years have provided instances beyond infuriating. It's even more frustrating and disappointing because we DO like/love them.

To me, Keegan was all over the place in just a few short paragraphs. If anyone seems to not like Greene, it's Keegan. He made an attempt at comedy and (to me) it fell flat. In the end, just like BG, he couldn't get out of his own way.

Glen Miller 6 years, 3 months ago

All I have to do is read the posts from so many to understand the spoiled rotten and coddled nature of the youth today. It's a wonder that these kids can even walk and speak for themselves. I mean as long as they have grown adults making excuses for them all the time, they can and will continue to just do whatever they want to. Even at the expense of going against your coach. I for one, don't much care WHAT Greene thought at the time. It was a bad play, didn't need to be done and he should have been heading to the handshake line if he thought the game was over.

Jared Reeves 6 years, 3 months ago

Glen, if you watch the replay, Greene was on the opposite side of the court. His dunk brought him closer to the handshake line. So, he was going to the handshake line.

Greene isn't perfect, but in this case, I am not convinced it was intentional. An excuse would be saying that it was intentional, but was justified or forgivable.

Marius Rowlanski 6 years, 3 months ago

Didn't realize you could break down the "spoiled rotten and coddled nature of the youth today" from such a few comments...even if at the expense of going against your coach. At least now we know the cause of all that is wrong with the youth of today and can now go out and find a solution.

I think HCBS should no longer allow his players to talk to the media. You never know when they might accidentally use profanity on a live microphone.

Andy Hess 6 years, 3 months ago

Virgin ears? If that word is harmless, why not use it in your column? Why would someone's comment get deleted if they used it in the manner Self did that night? Because it's offensive. Self didn't make this big of a stink when Elijah and McLemore did the same things on another team's floor, but all of a sudden he blasts Greene about it. It seems to me that Greene has been punished more harshly than past players for bigger infractions since he's been on campus, and Coach Self's ongoing vendetta against Brannen Greene has become more of an embarrassment to this university than anything Greene has done thus far.

Michael Leiker 6 years, 3 months ago

Exactly right...if you're recruiting against KU, here's your pitch..."do you want to go to KS and take the chance that you're the one guy every year whose career Self randomly decides to destroy?"

MaryAnn Caldwell 6 years, 3 months ago

Totally agree Andy! Greene can't seem to do anything right. I've watched the video of McLemore's dunk at OK State and don't recall a thing being said by the coach! Why doesn't Self just cut Greene loose - let him go play somewhere that he doesn't offend by everything he does? Maybe that team can come back and beat KU in the finals!

Tom Jones 6 years, 3 months ago

"Coach Self's ongoing vendetta against Brannen Greene has become more of an embarrassment to this university than anything Greene has done thus far."

Vendetta? You can't be serious. Greene has a track record of bad behavior, poor judgment, poor effort and lack of focus.

But you're going with the theory that Self just doesn't like the guy so he's made it all up and he actually hasn't deserved the suspensions and benchings? Have fun with that.

A quick scan of the interwebs brought up no record of BMac's offense, but I'll take your word for it. He and EJ had nothing like BG's record of missteps, though, and EJ immediately apologized, so...not surprising they frustrated Self less than this.

Joe Ross 6 years, 3 months ago

There's a danger here in letting this story walk too long. In fact, I'm surprised how it's grown legs at all. The danger is that the more days this story gets under it, the more people will ask if it's worth all the attention it's gotten--and people will start to sympathize with Brannen over the disproportionality asking themselves, "All of this pomp and circumstance over an extra dunk?" Some, like me, thought that very thing when the story first broke. In any case, this story dragging on won't add to Coach's defenders; but it will certainly add to Brannen's.

Micky Baker 6 years, 3 months ago

I questioned it when it first came out about the level of criticism Greene is getting over it. But, here's why they do it. People read it and then respond to it. Generates ad revenues.

Marius Rowlanski 6 years, 3 months ago

Actually a very good point. Media driven articles are famous for turning minor events into major controversies. It was a dumb move but if you saw the dunk, it was hard an 'in-your-face' slam.

I'm sure Kansas State will make the most of this bulletin board material.

Ron Prichard 6 years, 3 months ago

For all those apologizing for Greene saying he might not have known there was still time on the clock, here's a thought....Just don't dunk it! Problem solved! Whatever way you try to spin it, it was a bad choice on Brannen's part.

Joe Ross 6 years, 3 months ago

Few people are saying it wasn't a bad choice on Brannen's part. Most of us are saying it's just not worthy of a Crusade or World War III.

Ron Prichard 6 years, 3 months ago

I actually agree with you, Joe. But I also don't think we should try to make excuses for Brannen. Him putting himself above the team is becoming a pattern. I think he can be a huge part of this team going forward and I want to see him continue to be a valued member of the team. I would love it if everybody just moved on, but I don't like hearing people make excuses for him because it was clearly a dumb move.

Janet Olin 6 years, 3 months ago

Agree, Joe. PTI's Wilbon said yesterday he thought Self caught the dunk out the corner of his eye across the gym while he was walking to the hand-shake line; he was shocked/embarrassed as the KSU players and coaches howled about it. Coach doesn't lose his poise very often, but it was right to apologize and say he wouldn't let it happen again. However, I think he could have kept the vitriol for the locker room; can't see that bashing Greene in public is going to improve his attitude or maturity. It is also true that Greene's a junior and had disciplinary issues every year, none more than this year. Maybe the locker room chats aren't working. Hope he's not JR Giddens 2.0 .

Henry Joseph Hofmeister 6 years, 3 months ago

Brannen, you should've made it flashier. a crowd pleaser.

Robert Brock 6 years, 3 months ago

Brannen Greene will never grow up. Call him Peter Pan.

Joe Ross 6 years, 3 months ago

I, on the other hand, think that Brannen Greene--despite his poor defense and social miscues--at least has swag. And Im more upset at the team for not having this swagger than Greene's waning-seconds dunk. After all, we're a veteran team that just won the WUGs and got a head start on the college field. But any trace of that accomplishment is no where to be found on this Kansas squad currently. Call it childish, but if the whole team had Brannen's attitude about the game ("I just wanna PLAY!") then we'd be playing 50% better. What color is MONEY? Greene! Hashtag Swag.

Out.

Marius Rowlanski 6 years, 3 months ago

Only when Peter Pan can start nailing 3s in front of 16,000 fans. Until then, Brannen Greene will have to do.

Lance Cheney 6 years, 3 months ago

I'm more worried about the way the whole damn team played. This team has a lot bigger problems to worry about right now than that dunk.

Joe Ross 6 years, 3 months ago

Thank you, Jesus, for giving at least one poster a little thing called "perspective".

Caleb Wagner 6 years, 3 months ago

It was definitely classless, buuuuuuuuuuut here's where I try to defend Greene (this one time).

If you watched the closing minutes against UK you noticed Greene continually jumping up under the basket, the fake dunk type of thing. The guy was amped, the place was amped, he was in the game in crunch time after playing his way back into Self's graces.

Wednesday he was amped again. I think he lost focus of what was going on with the clock and was feeding off excitement and just kinda reacted the same way he was against UK, except this time he just happened to have the ball in his hands. Now, he's still very immature and I can't defend that.

Coach cracked me up with his comments and I think his harsh response was necessary, maybe not bringing up the fact that he's had to deal with a lot of Greene's crap in the past, but it looked respectful. The problem with this whole situation is what Joe said above, the story is getting coverage and continues to get coverage. I think if Greene would've stepped up and apologized moments after the game that would have alleviated the heat and this thing would not have been the story it is. Also I feel Self overstepped by commenting on Greene's past moments of immaturity, help the kid grow or send him home...don't cut him down though. To be clear I'm 100% a supporter of HCBS decisions and think the man is great, just not a fan of those couple of comments.

MaryAnn Caldwell 6 years, 3 months ago

In my mind, coach self has gone from a great coach to just a good one. This season being a big indicator - this team has no motivation and play as though tired. Then this happens with Greene (one of the consistent scorers) and the coach goes crazy. Not handled well, coach!

Gerry Butler 6 years, 3 months ago

You better hope to GOD these kids are not tired. don't try nd come up with the lame excuse of the WUG'S that ship has sailed. These are 17-18-19 yr old kids, they had ample time AFTER the WUG'S before the start of the season. If they are truly tired then that's on them for really poor conditioning, Coach Self shouldn't have to stand over these guys and spoon feed them saying ok time to condition, take them by the hand and walk them to HUDY they need to accept some of the responsibility for conditioning for theirselves if that's what your insinuating. If they can't get motivated to play a game that they surposedly love against top quality competition then maybe they need to find a different choice of future employment as everyone of these kids ultimate dream would be able to reach the N.B.A so you better get motoviated.

Clara Westphal 6 years, 3 months ago

I am embarrassed that Coach Self chose such language in an interview. That was classless.

Self has a bigger problem than Greene. Something is wrong when a team with as much talent as this one just doesn't play up to its potential. The conference season is going into the second half and Bragg and Diallo still aren't ;playing the minutes they were expected to play. Are they not getting the coaching they need?

How many games has it been since Mikelson has played? There are players on the bench that would certainly play with more enthusiasm than what we are seeing now.

Rick Meyer 6 years, 3 months ago

Agree. Something IS wrong with the team. The coaching has stagnated. When Dooley left the program, so did the energy and hustle. When Manning left the program, so did the development of the bigs. After one of the current coach's was busted for dope......he's still there?

Marius Rowlanski 6 years, 3 months ago

We don't have anyone named Mikelson playing on our team.

RJ King 6 years, 3 months ago

And for the umpteenth time, Hunter has been out with an ankle sprain.

Stephen Dobelbower 6 years, 3 months ago

Yeah, lets just lynch Bill Self like we did Mark Mangino. That's A GREAT IDEA!!

Gerry Butler 6 years, 3 months ago

Excellent Stephen exactly, Coach doesn't baby these kids just like Mark so lets run him out. I hear ya. just like Mark some parents of this golden spooned children have the mentality of OH you don't lay a hand on my kid or oh my goodness don't use that word like I'm sure they NEVER heard anything like that at their home I understand exactly where your coming from wiith that Stephen, Mark Mangino was the best Coach this school had seen in ages, BUT since he was rough not pamper, and or kater to these kids then we have to get rid of him roflmao. I hear ya

Bryce Landon 6 years, 3 months ago

Bill Self shouldn't be fired for the way he deals with his players. He should be fired for putting an underachieving product on the court that can't make it to the Sweet 16 in March Madness.

John Randall 6 years, 3 months ago

Now, there is a sarcastic comment with some zip to it!

William Dostert 6 years, 3 months ago

@Jared I said the same yesterday. He was just going through the motions. I really doubt he knew there was time on the clock. Run a few laps and forget it.

Kenneth Johnson 6 years, 3 months ago

Com'on. BFD. Brannen's just a kid having fun. I'm sure it wasn't meant to be disrespectful, and perhaps he thought that the clock had run out.

Dale Koch 6 years, 3 months ago

The scary thing about this team to me is if they lose tomorrow at TCU what kind of fire and effort will they play with the rest of the year? And, enough already about the dunk!!! It's over!!!

Jerry Walker 6 years, 3 months ago

It was a richard move by an immature player who has repeatedly caused disruptions on the team. Scorching the seat of his pants was well justified.

He also burned the rearend of the alpha dog pretty good for his no-show performance...and also well justified.

Kent Richardson 6 years, 3 months ago

Self can really make a statement against TCU and he doesn't need to say anything except in the post game presser.

"I thought it was time for a change in the lineup." Our guards were pretty lackadaisical and our inside presence continued to be less that what we are needing. Perry was the only player I could rely on and he was okay with Greene, Svi, Carlton and Hunter starting."

"We squeaked out a win here, 80-70, but I was impressed with how we competed every play which was something we were lacking."

"I am not sure why Brannen had his shorts on backwards in the second half but it didn't hurt his stoke."

"Svi ran the offense pretty well and his at the rim finishes were something we had been lacking."

"Bragg's 11 boards and 14 points along with Hunter's 12 points and 6 blocks certainly had a positive impact on the outcome."

Our 16 turnovers were not for lack of effort but as we become more familiar with each other that will likely show a reduction."

"I know we are still in the running for the conference crown but I am looking for a team that can make a deep run in the NCAA's."

"I thought our uniforms actually looked pretty good against the court background, although Greg Gurley's tie clashed big time."

Freddie Garza 6 years, 3 months ago

Brannen Greene's dunk at the end of the game was the most bush league thing I've seen a Jayhawk do since...

...well, since Elijah Johnson did it to Iowa State a couple of years ago during the one good game he had that entire season.

Steve Hilker 6 years, 3 months ago

I think his comments are a culmination of Brannens continuous string of missteps. We don't know how many of them they've dealt with behind the scenes. That being said, I too think something isn't right within this team. It has got to be very frustrating from a coaching standpoint. But at least we're not having the seasons Kentucky and Duke are having to this point. I can't imagine the comments on here, if and when we ever drop out of the top 25!

Mike Nicco 6 years, 3 months ago

Tom, I'm not sure I understand why you and Matt are trying so hard to justify what coach said/did. You have Coach Self publicly called his student-athlete a "Richard'. How many times since he's been here has Coach Self stated that student-athletes should not be subjected to the same harsh treatment as pro athletes. Coach is supposed to be the class standard for his student-athletes. What would Coach Self expect from his player for this type of behavior, at the least an apology? Do we really want the highest profile employee of this university to react this way? I'm sorry Matt, trying to nullify what coach did based on the reactions of a known over-the-top sports radio host doesn't make sense. Even with this incident, Coach Self deserves better than to be compared to him.

Humpy Helsel 6 years, 3 months ago

Not a smart move. Classless move? Yes. And how about Elijah's dunk at ISU three or four years ago? Same. Or how did we feel when Marcus Smart brought his circus back flip to town? It took us awhile to get over that. For Brannen, it has the elements of a growing "pattern of behavior" which makes it stand out where it might not have if he didn't have a growing reputation as poor decision maker. I really think Coach is more concerned how it might affect the KSU players and crowd on the other half of our home and home at the Little Apple. His reaction could help a tiny bit to mitigate that. It does not represent our "blue blood" basketball national reputation. With all of that said, in the big scheme of life and sports, it wasn't that big of deal. Instead of the school writing an apology, Coach should have made Brannen write it and sign it before being posting it on the school website.

Bville Hawk 6 years, 3 months ago

Sorry Jared, to anyone else thinking of clicking on the link, don't waste your time - pretty lame and not really funny....

Bob Bailey 6 years, 3 months ago

Greene was recruited for the wrong reasons. He has never 'fit' the image the coaches had in mind. He would have been a 'perfect fit' for a coach who can/ wants to use some high class 3 pt shooters. Greene would have turned out to be a hell of a lot better player somewhere else.

Commenting has been disabled for this item.