Originally published June 18, 2012 at 02:25p.m., updated June 19, 2012 at 12:00a.m.

KU announces addition of Milton Doyle to basketball team

Chicago Marshall High guard enrolled in summer school

Kansas newcomer Milton Doyle works out with the Jayhawks for the first time on Monday, June 18, 2012, at  Horejsi Center during Bill Self's basketball camp.

Kansas newcomer Milton Doyle works out with the Jayhawks for the first time on Monday, June 18, 2012, at Horejsi Center during Bill Self's basketball camp.


Lanky Milton Doyle, the latest addition to Kansas University’s basketball team, exhibited a soft shooting touch from beyond the three-point arc during a high-energy drill Monday at Bill Self’s basketball camp in Horejsi Center.

“He’s got length and reminds me so much of Tyshawn (Taylor), including recruiting in that he committed to FIU (Florida International), and they had a coaching change, and we were fortunate enough to recruit him after that,” KU coach Self said, officially announcing the 6-foot-4, 175-pound Chicagoan’s signing of a grant-in-aid agreement.

Taylor, who committed to Marquette before a coaching change then switched to KU where he was a four-year starter, had a similar 6-3, 185 pound frame.

“He’s got a lot of upside,” Self said of Doyle, who averaged 19.0 points, 7.0 rebounds, 5.0 assists and 5.0 steals per game his senior season at Chicago’s Marshall High. “He’s a combo guard that can certainly play on the ball. He’s also big enough and skilled enough to play off the ball and a very good athlete. I think he’ll give us great depth in our backcourt.”

Doyle becomes the fifth Jayhawk from Chicago signed by Self at KU. Those include 2010 All-American Sherron Collins, Julian Wright, Mario Little and current freshman Jamari Traylor.

“I’m so appreciative of his family trusting us throughout the recruiting process because it was so quick after the situation at Florida International,” Self said. Doyle decommitted after coach Isiah Thomas’ firing at FIU in April.

“I have known coach (Henry) Cotton (at Marshall) for a long, long time, and he sings Milton’s praises on his talent. Milton would have been a very highly recruited kid had he played AAU last summer, but he didn’t because he was injured (wrist), and a lot of people didn’t have the opportunity to see him.”

Another Chicago prospect: KU is one of 14 schools in the hunt for Chicagoan Jabari Parker, the No. 1-rated player in the recruiting class of 2013.

Parker, 6-7, 215 from Simeon High, told he has a list of KU, Duke, Michigan State, Kentucky, North Carolina, Ohio State, Illinois, DePaul, Louisville, Northwestern, Missouri, BYU, UConn and Washington. Some believe Duke, Michigan State and Kentucky are the heavy favorites.

Parker said he will cut the list to “about eight” sometime this summer. He plans to make campus visits in the fall and sign with a school in November.

“I’m on a setback not making as much progress as I should be (cutting his list), but I’m looking to making my choice in November. I want to do it for me because I want to get it over with before the season starts,” he told and zagsblog.

Parker, 17, is a devout Mormon who has not yet decided whether he will take a two-year mission when he turns 19.

Young leaves Puerto Rico camp: KU senior forward Kevin Young will not be playing for Puerto Rico’s national team in the Olympics.

Young, who has been at tryouts in Puerto Rico the past several weeks, was one of 12 players invited to compete in a tourney in Puerto Rico this week. However, he was told he was not yet guaranteed a spot on the national team because several pro players are expected to report to tryout camp soon.

“It was a fun experience, and I gained a lot from it, but I’d rather focus on summer school and Kansas basketball,” Young said Monday. He plans to return to Lawrence this week.

Bonnie honored: KU women’s basketball coach Bonnie Henrickson is a member of the Northern Sun Intercollegiate Conference Hall of Fame class of 2012. Henrickson competed in the conference from 1981-85 as a forward at St. Cloud (Minn.) State. Henrickson, who appeared in a program-record 122 games, is sixth-leading scorer in school history (1,731).


ukanjhox 10 years, 5 months ago

Have we reached double digits in terms of articles written about Doyle?

Welcome Milton! Keep your stapler close.

april28 10 years, 5 months ago

Are you convinced yet that he's really coming?

RJ King 10 years, 5 months ago

LOL. Let's set an over/under on article re Anrio. And are we any closer to being enlightened? Four years ago, here's what was said when Tyshawn signed:

newsreader (anonymous) says… "Hmmm... Not to put down our Jayhawks, but he averaged 10 pts and 5 assists and he's joining our team??? Someone must know something about him that I dont."

OldEnuf2BYurDad (anonymous) says… "Hmmm. Coach must see something we don't see."

Write2Know (anonymous) says… "I'm happy that Coach Self is getting the guys that he wants.I haven't seen a picture of Tyshawn yet, but at 6-3, 160 lbs, he has got to be stick."

It's funny. The names and faces change, but the opinions keep regurgitating. Self keeps churning out a good product, and the world keeps spinning around the sun.

KANSTUCKY 10 years, 5 months ago

Not sure about the thing with the sun but I can count on Bill.

chi_town24 10 years, 5 months ago

I knew coach self couldn't help but recognize my brothers skills very quickly. Where are the naysayers (H.E.M)!

chi_town24 10 years, 5 months ago

The reason I post on here is the same reason u are. Its all opinions at the end of the day so I can post as I feel. U guys call out each other all the time but when I do it its a problem? I originally start posting yo give u guys insight but I see that's not appreciated. U won't hear from me anymore. Brother or not its interesting seeing these posts but I will let u finish giving your much needed opinion without any input.

Chris Bailey 10 years, 5 months ago

Man don't stop posting because ONE guy said something you didn't like. Your opinion is welcome here and will give much better insight as your brothers career continues. Just don't say anything that will make you or him look bad. So don't be suckered into some "talk". Welcome to Lawrence! Rock Chalk!

Chris Bailey 10 years, 5 months ago

Man don't stop posting because ONE guy said something you didn't like. Your opinion is welcome here and will give much better insight as your brothers career continues. Just don't say anything that will make you or him look bad. So don't be suckered into some "talk". Welcome to Lawrence! Rock Chalk!

april28 10 years, 5 months ago

I speak for everyone on this board when I tell you that Milton is a welcomed addition to this team, deserving of his opportunity and now a part of the Phog.

I also speak for everyone when I tell you to ignore ukanjhox - absolutely the weakest poster on this board.

REHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Keep posting, man. Don't let that HEM poster get in your head. He is sometimes a very contrary individual; but he does know lots about Jayhawk hoops. This board is a forum for a wide range of viewpoints. Bill Self would be the first to tell you to let the criticism roll off your back like a gentle April shower.

bradynsdad 10 years, 5 months ago

As appreciative as we are that your brother is here I think it best you stay clear of the comments on here. I love our hawks and will always back them but there are many negative posters on here. I am excited to have your brother here and I know thousands of other jayhawks are too. Remember the posters on here are just posters, more often than not they will talk bad about the players and criticize how they should play and coach but in the end this is just a public forum. Thank you for keeping us up to date on your brother and don't think all ku fans are like the ones on here.

JayHawkFanToo 10 years, 5 months ago

Why the comparison to Seth Curry? As I recall Seth Curry was not heavily recruited by any big school; in fact, he started college at the basketball powerhouse that Liberty University is. I believe that Milton Doyle has a much higher upside than Set Curry. Maybe you were talking about his older brother Stephen Curry..

Jack Wilson 10 years, 5 months ago

Chi_town24: Read KongDong's post .. I do appreciate his correct summary of my position on this. It is the concept, not the detail. I am a naysayer on this type of signing (concept), but not on Milton personally (detail). Perhaps you can note difference (some posters here can't). It truly has nothing to do with your brother personally. I'm sure your brother is an excellent person, and by all accounts, an excellent basketball player.

Unfortunately, we have experience with this stuff -- here's some examples for comparison:

April 16, 2008 - Tyrone: “Tyrone is a do-everything guard,” Self said. “He’s a good shooter. He’s a good handler. He can play the one (guard) or the two (guard). He will fit in well with the way we play with our interchangeable parts on the perimeter. Tyrone has won big at the junior college level and certainly has sacrificed individual stats for the betterment of his team,” Self said. “We were sold on Tyrone when we first came in contact with him. He’s going to be a terrific addition to a young basketball team from a talent standpoint but most importantly from a leadership standpoint.”

June 22, 2011 - Merv: “We are excited to have Merv join our team,” Self said. “He has great potential and has the ability to help us this season. He is a very athletic wing who is a good shooter. Like all the incoming freshmen we have, as Merv gets stronger, he will continue to develop.”

June 18, 2012 - Milton: “He’s got a lot of upside,” Self said. “He’s a combo guard that can certainly play on the ball. He’s also big enough and skilled enough to play off the ball and a very good athlete. I think he’ll give us great depth in our backcourt.”

And I would note the conservative nature of Self's comments on Milton .. code words. "upside"; "good athlete"; "depth".

The difference between Milton and Merv is that Self noted that Doyle would have been more recruited, if not for the injury. So on that note, we'd have to say advantage Doyle over Lindsay. However, Self noted that Merv could help in the upcoming year, but didn't mention Milton in that regard.

Time certainly will tell.

I will gladly eat crow should the circumstance present itself.

Best of luck to you and your family.

jaybate 10 years, 5 months ago

You nailed it pretty well this time. If anyone doesn't get your point here, they are not trying. You are not down on Milton Doyle. You are against adding guys to help the team with depth that are later cut and lose a year of eligibility as a result.

You also accurately identified the code words Self seemed to use.

But, HEM, we both need to notice that Self did say one thing conspicuously different about Milton, than he said about Tyrone and Merv.

He said, "Milton would have been a very highly recruited kid had he played AAU last summer but he didn’t because he was injured and a lot of people didn’t have the opportunity to see him."

Coach Cotton has made this case, which as you and others have rightly pointed out, is not unusual for a high school coach to do, and so not terribly reassuring.

But hearing Self use the same rationale gives it a bit more significance.

Self may lay it on thick sometimes. He may use code words sometimes. But he doesn't have a history of laying on out and out whoppers suggesting a marginal player would have been a highly recruited player, had he not been injured.

I know that wording still leaves room to drive a truck through. For instance, had Milton played AAU last summer, maybe he would have been more highly recruited by mid majors. :-)

Or alternatively, maybe his injury has turned Milton into a player who is only good enough to be a practice player for a year, and who then will have to transfer to get any PT.

But if Miltion would have been much more highly recruited by majors, then perhaps Self has landed a sleeper.

Have you given this distinction any thought yet?

Frankly, it just occurred to me.

I raise it, but as I pointed out above, it could go either way.

I side strongly with you on not liking marginal players being brought in and then having them lose a year of eligibility, when they have to transfer, because they the competing talent level is too high.

AsadZ 10 years, 5 months ago

Bate, Self said something else about Doyle that is of interest - he reminds him of Tyshawn.

Jack Wilson 10 years, 5 months ago

JB: I did see the reference to Milton possibly being more recruited by majors but for the injury .... I mentioned it in my post as an "advantage" to Milton in the comparison. And I think you're right. Self's comments on that topic may be code words for "sleeper."

I'll be interested to see how he compares to Adams.

But I can see top teams (and rivals) missing a kid from, say western Kansas, if he didn't play AAU ball. Or if he wasn't recruited. But from Chicago? And a kid that was recruited by D-1s.

jaybate 10 years, 5 months ago

But Milton seems to be a peculiar case that may not be well-suited to defending our broader principle.

First, Milton was tied up with Isiah Thomas and I have gotten the feeling over the years that Isiah Thomas can complicate situations just by the way he does things. It may have been that not a lot of persons were willing to cross Isiah regarding a Chicago player, if they hoped to keep recruiting in Chicago.

Second, Milton had an injury and injuries often make recruiters blow cold on a player regardless of what city he plays in.

Third, by not playing for the AAU meat markets the summer before his senior year, having an injury, and being connected to Isiah, it seems plausible that his stock might have fallen significantly.

But why a first team all city player in Chicago would not move back on recruiters lists during the winter stumps me.

And therein lies the enigma of Milton's case to me.

But then why guys who choose KU early drop so far in the recruiting ratings also is not easy for me to explain fully, either.

So: it may be best to uncouple the principle from Milton, because of special circumstances surrounding Milton.

Though if I had to bet money on this situation today, I would suspect Coach Self is taking on a player potentially in need of a nurturing environment for a year due to circumstances beyond his control, while a better long term solution can be created for the young man, whether here, or elsewhere.

Coach Cotton obviously believes in the young man.

Coach Cotton obviously thinks what Milton Doyle needs most right now is to fall in with the right kind of people for a year, whether or not he gets any PT, at least until a more permanent circumstance can be found for him.

In taking on Milton Doyle, Bill Self is at best taking on a sleeper, and at worst, perhaps helping out an old coaching colleague who later might put in a good word for Self recruiting in coming years in Chicago.

What I am trying to say here is that Milton may be better than we think, or there may be other virtuous principles involved countervailing our POV on not burning up a year of players eligibilities just to use them for practice fodder.

Just trying to see it from all sides, while realizing that when looking at all sides one can confuse oneself regarding the most obvious side.

Jack Wilson 10 years, 5 months ago

I did a premature reply above .. but your statement --

"But why a first team all city player in Chicago would not move back on recruiters lists during the winter stumps me."

Bingo. As I mentioned above, ok, if he was all-Trailblazer league in western Kansas. I get that. All city in Chicago? I don't get that.

Entertaining topic.

Tad Shurtz 10 years, 5 months ago

Hey, Chi. I've got all love for your brother. His game's real, real nice. Question for you-have you ever measured his wingspan? Kid looks like he's got some serious reach! Perfect for playing those passing lanes.

Steve Yeakel 10 years, 5 months ago

Dear chi - welcome to you and Milton, we are so glad to have you as Jayhawks! And don't worry about the naysayers, there are negative people on just about every site you will ever go to. Don't let them ruin that for you. They are wrong, plain and simple.

Billy Derringer 10 years, 5 months ago

chi_....chill man its all coach speak, every kid gets his fair praise..dude if your going to be living on all coach speak an some opinionated comments from fans the next four years, i say good luck with that, buddy thats too much stress for anyone. relax

an plz stop saying the phase "my brother" we get you know his name iv never heard you use for what its worth you being in his close circle you probley shouldnt be posting that your closly tied to him..possibly some your action could or may even bring him negative attention.

Michael Bratisax 10 years, 5 months ago

HEM surely wants your brother to do well. He just goes with the percentages when signing recruits that aren't ranked in the top 100.

Just look at previous recruits to KU with similar rankings. Very few have made any major contributions to the team and end up transferring.

I happen to agree but recognize this is a generalization. You cannot go from the generalization to the specific (did I get that backwards?) and hopefully your brother is one of those players that flew under the radar of most coaches and turns out to be an impact player at KU if he stays all four years.

Isaiah Thomas thought so and he would know.

Anyways..welcome to Jayhawk basketball Milton!

jayhawks911 10 years, 5 months ago

Can hardly wait for late night and beyond. Welcome to the team Milton

nuleafjhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Sheeeeeeesh - what does Self know about basketball talent anyway?

Gregor Southard 10 years, 5 months ago

Too early for naysaying (and over praising). Josh Selby or Russell Robinson anyone?

ParisHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Interesting words from Coach Self:

"Great depth" = not expected to get minutes at this time.

"Lot of upside / would have been highly recruited" = you never know, might develop into someone who gets on the floor.

Keep your expectations down and your hopes up.

I searched for the word "defense" in the three articles that mention Doyle, and in chi_town24's comments. Didn't find it a single time. Not a good sign.

Dustin Engelken 10 years, 5 months ago

Did you see the part where he averaged five steals a game? I don't care where you play, that's tough to do and should tell you all you need to know about the guy's D.

jaybate 10 years, 5 months ago

Good point.

Milton is 6-4 at the point. Rare.

Milton gets 5 strips a game in Chicago competition. Very good.

Milton is good enough for Isiah. Isiah is a lot of things, but its safe to say he understands the guard position.

Milton was gutsy enough to hang in for Self's recruiting situation to clarify and not jump into Marquette's fold.

Coach Cotton is an old friend of Self's in Chicago and you can never have enough old friends in Chicago in a position to steer future recruits your way.

And Self had one more scholie collecting dust.

Milton's parent put their trust in Bill Self to guide their son who has gotten into a pickle, because of circumstances beyond his control--an injury and Isiah getting fired.

Self has a starting point guard still recovering from a knee scope who played an entire year on an injured knee.

Self has sophomore point guard, Naadir, who proved he could distribute, but didn't prove he could guard.

Self has another hotshot point guard recruit in qualification limbo.

All of these drivers converged to make Self offer Milton Doyle a ride.

Wisconsin2Kansas 10 years, 5 months ago

It is very sad to read so many negative comments about Milton. I don't think anybody has seem him play, which may be the problem, but nobody can judge if he is good or bad yet. Besides, I'm sure Milton is a step up from having to give Connor Teahan significant minutes! I hope Milton proves a lot of people wrong.

gchawk 10 years, 5 months ago

I agree with you, but in all actuality, there are only a few individual posters who are making negative comments, but, as usual, they seem to take up the most space.

bradh 10 years, 5 months ago

It's sad to see any negative comments about our players, including Milton and Conner.

ku_foaf 10 years, 5 months ago

Agreed. Gee, Conner only helped get us to the $$%$% Finals, for goodness sake! I just don't see how people can criticize guys who were significant contributors on history making teams.

If Self and Isiah Thomas say the guy is good and see potential, I believe them.

Michael Bratisax 10 years, 5 months ago

It's a comment board..peoples opinions vary. I seriously doubt that any regular poster doesn't want to see him do well.

Self happens to be pretty damn good when it comes to evaluating talent. But he has signed players in the past (like every other coach also has) that just didn't make the transition from high school to college. And Kansas is not the easiest place to make that transition.

Also, this is a position where we lacked depth and missed out on a lot of highly ranked talent during the spring signing period. I think he is simply taking a chance with a player at a position we need depth.

Karen Mansfield-Stewart 10 years, 5 months ago

Welcome! We're glad you are here and hope you excel in your career. Rock Chalk!

Tony Bandle 10 years, 5 months ago

Please tell me you're kidding, because if you're not, the KUAD Dept. needs to have someone start twittering Chris 24/7 for the next several months.

[ I truly can't believe it's come down to this in my lifetime. I thought surely America had a few more decades before out society deteriorated completely.]

I guess I was wrong.

Alohahawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Actually, the book "1984", written before there was any true knowledge of the internet, computers and these kind of websites(and Facebook and twitter), summed up a lot of what has transpired over the past couple of generations. Lots of privacy lost, but lots of communication advantages. Too bad there wasn't a book entitled "911", because who knows how that might have altered history.

Aah, for the good old days!

Tony Bandle 10 years, 5 months ago

I guess you're right..does a twitter take one stamp or two????

wrwlumpy 10 years, 5 months ago

Like Jimmy Kimmel, I thought a "Tweet" was something Barbara Walters gave her dog.

Clarence Haynes 10 years, 5 months ago

The heat (not Miami) must be getting to a lot of folks here today! Welcome to KU Milton. Hope that you enjoy the University as many of us did! Rock Chalk!

Jory Collins 10 years, 5 months ago

This kid can flat out play, period. Forget rankings, stars, and where he was committed before. We just got a late gift that's as good as you can ask for in June. Milton is a 4 year player that will play a signifcant role over the course of his career.

DanR 10 years, 5 months ago

I watched that the other day and thought he looked like Tyshawn in the open court and driving the paint... long, fast and fearless. I guess Bill Self saw the same video!

JHawk06 10 years, 5 months ago

I am looking forward to him being on the team!

Thanks for posting that video

mikehawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Chi, take a close read from bradynsdad. It contains good advice. Even better, and one I would give any player and his family...don't read the blogs. They will make you crazy. Only the most extreme fans who desperately need a life, and who don't really play the game, spend time on them (yes...that would be me). They are akin to "drive by shootings," all power and blast, all in the absence of taking any of the responsibility. It is easy to be smart and witty, and negative, when you don't have to do it to someone's face or, better yet, when you don't have to put on a uni and get your butt out there. Remind your brother this isn't high school, the basketball stage is huge at KU, and the only opinions that matter are yours, your teammates, and the coaches. Actually, the latter one is the only one that REALLY matters. Tell your brother to relax, have fun, and enjoy the best basketball program in the country.

bradynsdad 10 years, 5 months ago

Thanks mikehawk. I am an alum and huge fan but even these boards drive me nuts. Sometimes I stop reading the for weeks at a time just to remember that we as KU fans are spoiled. I couldn't imagine being an 18 year old kid and reading some of the comments that are posted on here. Anyway win or lose I enjoy watching these guys grow up. I was just thinking how lucky we were to have a run like last years, a group noone expected more than 20 wins out of. Thanks again!!

Dan Cook 10 years, 5 months ago

He's like Tyshawn in that he is long and quick and energetic. Also that he was signed by another school, then became available due to a coaching change. I know most people know this, but Milton was injured and if you don't play summer ball, the gurus don't rank you highly. Ask Zach Peters. I can tell you that Peters is far batter than his ranking, as is Doyle. This is not a mercy signing. This is a kid we need for backcourt depth and one that our coaching staff feels has significant upside compared to what the ranking services claim. I am very happy he is at KU. This is not Tyrone Appleton or Merv Lindsay. This kid will be able to play at KU and could become a significant contributer as he gets older.

eastTXjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

I welcome Milton and hope he is like Tyshawn....perhaps less the (oft discussed today) Twitter account ;-)

I hope HEM doesn't come to East Texas and critique my "old guys wednesday night hoops for fun" game. I am taking up a valuable space that many other old guys would love to have, but being the only person wearing Hawk gear amongst all the longhorn, baylor, and arkansas stuff, that might sway my grade just enough to be deemed defense certainly wouldn't!

Dyrk Dugan 10 years, 5 months ago

once HCBS makes the announcement, i'm all in on the recruits. he said he was lookng to upgrade the PG position...and it appears he has.

if he is good enough for our current head coach to pursue...that's good enough for me.

Welcome Milton! enjoy your time in Lawrence getting ready for the should be fun.

Hopefully now, our roster is set. Go Jayhawks!

Ryan Martin 10 years, 5 months ago

Welcome to Jayhawk nation Milton. Chicagoans are always hard core ball players.

Philip Atkinson 10 years, 5 months ago

How come no one reported on future Jayhawk, Conner Frankamp being selected for the USA National Develepment Team U17? That's big news. Congratulations Conner. Can't wait to see you in a KU uniform!

Alohahawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Actually, I did mention it yesterday. Under the "High school coach... Doyle great fit" article. But it does merit mentioning it again. Congrats to Mr. Frankamp. I referenced it to the website. They've cut to 14, but will still have 2 left to cut to bring it down to 12 players maximum.

gchawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Actually Alohahawk did post that yesterday, and you're right, that is BIG news.

Tad Shurtz 10 years, 5 months ago

Excellent post! Only qualm: Tyshawn was ranked toward the back end of the top 100 --somewhere around 75 -- and I think he turned out okay. And like TT, Doyle's backstory and highlights have me extremely intrigued. Where TT flew under the radar because he had so many talented teammates at St. Anthony's, Doyle lost exposure due to an injury at the most critical period of a high school kid's recruitment.

You don't make all-city Chicago and drop 20 in the all star game unless you've got skills. All that after essentially a year and a half off basketball. Sign me up.

Jack Wilson 10 years, 5 months ago

Ralster: While I have always had respect for your posts, I am a bit puzzled by your position here.

You say very clearly "No, I don't know Milts game yet .."

Yet you then go on to basically act as if you do. You follow the path of many before you.

Your post above regarding Doyle is really the type of post that triggered my responses. I guess if Doyle is going to be a star as a Tyshawn-clone, and everyone missed this guy playing right there in big time Chicago, and simply because he's from Chicago he just must be tough, and he broke his wrist because he must be a high-flier, and Self surely didn't bring him into be a bench warmer -- I am not sure how can anyone refute that logic.

Like you said, you "don't know Milts game yet .. "

But as you demonstrate, you are more than willing to attack without even acknowledging the premise.

Like I will admit, I don't know Milt's game yet. But the difference is, I have never once professed to know, nor have I made that a premise of any of my posts .. that is, speculation on his true abilities.

I have disputed the concept and reaction, which appears very difficult for you and many to comprehend and understand. It is something I was consistent on last season with the Lindsay/Traylor/Anderson baloney. It just seems very difficult for many folks to differentiate "possibilities" with "probabilities."

But, simplistically, it is much easier to claim someone is trashing a player, as opposed to taking some time to actually read and comprehend.

The thing is .. and this may be the best way to understand it. We have a much better chance at Perry Ellis maturing and developing than Landen Lucas. Why is that? Why is there a better chance? Why would you bet your $100 on Ellis over Lucas, if you had to bet one way or the other? Could Lucas end up as a better player in the long run? Sure. But no one would bet their hard earned money that way vs. Ellis .. unless ... unless what? Unless they got better odds making the bet. But the Lindsay/Traylor/Anderson trio seems like a good example too .. 1 out 3 are here. And it is 1 out 3 that even has a possibility to be successful here --- Traylor has done nothing yet.So the best it could end is 1 out of 3 succeed here.

Unranked or low level signees that are signed/added late to fill roster spots. What are the odds of success?

That's the premise. And Milton Doyle .. his talent or lack thereof .. has nothing to do with the premise. But I know that's not understood by most.

gchawk 10 years, 5 months ago

He declared for the draft in 2010, wasn't picked up by anyone, and has gone into obscurity since then. Like you, I hope he's doing ok..

texashawk10 10 years, 5 months ago

I was friends with him on facebook for a while and from what I could tell by his posts, after he left KU he was looking at schools to transfer to and seemed to be leaning towards Texas Tech for his final season of eligibility (he was a JuCo player and came to KU as a junior). He didn't end up at Texas Tech however, I don't know why whether it be academics or Tech just not having the scholarship room, but he ended up staying at KU and graduated in 2010 and now lives in the KC area.

DanR 10 years, 5 months ago

I think Tyshawn was ranked in the 70s... regardless, ralster, it's nice to hear a voice of reason. I wonder if HEM formerly post as "jonas"? Seems possible--same ho-hum naysayer purity recruit attitude.

Who knows, Milton might transfer out in a year to Bradley or NIU, or maybe he'll work, develop, continue to grow as a person and team member, and contribute to another wild ride to a championship sometime in the next 4 years. I hope it all works out.

Rock chalk, kid. Glad to have you here. Play that relentless Self-style defense and you'll do well.

DanR 10 years, 5 months ago

Oops. OldEnuf2BYurDad or newsreader were the purity recruiters back in 2008, not jonas. Jonas, sorry!

REHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Here's another factor regarding the likes of Royce, Merv, Quintrell. They (naturally) were impatient to get in games to play. If they had stayed aboard, quite likely they would have seen considerable playing minutes by their junior years. However, their playing time looked bleak going into year two; so rather than lose a second year of eligibility sitting on the pine, they went shopping. Barring injury or mayhem to one of our returning guards, Milt might not see much action this season. But if he stays the course and continues to develop and tweak that "upside," he definitely has the size and h.s. senior credentials to be a major contributor going forward. If he is self motivated to show the tenacity of Ben McLemore or Conner Teahan, we quite possibly will view him as a major cog in the championship machinery at KU some day. I admire the lofty h.s. rankings, too, although I have become aware that Bill Self has developed a program which works miracles with kids who have slipped through the cracks of Top 50 projections, yet possess the bodies and upsides to fill slots on winning Jayhawk squads. For whatever combination of reasons, Self saw fit to offer Milt the one late remining scholarship. I hope that Milton Doyle will apply himself to the task of becoming a Jayhawk player whom all of us will enjoy supporting, evenually idolizing. At the very least he will add firepower to practice sessions this schoolyear. Like Moody, Lee, Reed, Morningstar and Teahan, Milton Doyle is in place to become essential to future Jayhawk Basketball. He quite possibly has more immediate upside than any of those fine players.

Jonathan Allison 10 years, 5 months ago

excellent point to note that Tyshawn was ranked in the 70's and was a surprise starter in his freshman season.

Easily the lowest ranked freshman starter in Self's tenure at KU.

Self reiterated that Milton is likely highly underrated due to time lost while recovering from injury.

It's plausible, though not probable, that Milton Doyle could have a large impact on the court sooner rather than later.

Rock Chalk MD!

Alohahawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Nice post Ralster. You've covered and match my thoughts almost to a T. It's too early to throw any of the newbies under the bus. Give them a chance to prove (or disprove) themselves. Self saw something he thought worthwhile to his system in each of them, or they wouldn't have received a scholarship. (In Self we trust, or most of us do anyway. Hence, debating about it is one thing, but argueing about it is useless.) And I'm sure Self has already given them the harsh realities of what he expects from them. And each in turn has made their own choice to take up that challenge. As you stated, " will be a battle between Doyle, Tharpe, Adams for backup mpg." While all of us are posting our preconceived notions about the merits, or non-merits, of the rookies, the true battles will be fought during practices for those cherished spots, the top 8 or 10 rotation spots in Self's lineup. And four and a half months of debating (read argueing) will only make enemies of each of us on this board, when we're supposed to all (minus the trolls) be one big Jayhawk Nation/Brotherhood.

Marcia Parsons 10 years, 5 months ago

Me, too, ukan. It sounds like he didn't want to hang around just to be dumped later. It was handled rather badly, I think. They got all those kids there "just in case" and planned to dump them as soon as the pros showed up. I guess that's the way it works, and of course they want the best they can get, but it seems unfair to the kids to get their hopes up. I was hoping he'd make the team.

REHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

U.S.A. team did the same thing last Olympics. Kobe and Co. replaced the collegiate and lesser pros who had gotten our national team qualified in early rounds.

PurePierce 10 years, 5 months ago

Does anyone know the time of the alumni game Wednesday at the camp that is being held now?

Dan Cook 10 years, 5 months ago

3:30-3:40ish. They play the kids vs female counselors game about 3:15pm.

Danny Hernandez 10 years, 5 months ago

Welcome Chi_Town and Milton. Can't wait to see Milton run through the tunnel and onto the court. I'm really excited to have a guard with Milton's size and wingspan. Once Hudy gets him in the weight room, he'll only get stronger and bigger and be more of a plus. I don't put much stock into rankings. Steve Nash and John Stockton weren't ranked that high. It's all about skills and toughness and I can sense that in Mr. Doyle

Welcome to the Jayhawk Family and screw the negative nancy's which there are plenty of. Too Many for my liking

mikehawk 10 years, 5 months ago

The rankings are more and more measurement of the chances for One and Done. I don't think Coach will ever not consider a OAD, but really, we haven't had that much luck with them. Our pathway is high quality kids who are willing to take their lumps while they work on their games, minds (that would be school), and bodies, who are willing to learn the game and its nuances, who are willing to really work as part of a TEAM. They have to also be willing to sell out and learn defensive technique, and that ain't fun in the school yard. Your Top 10 are thinking OAD, and this pushes them psychologically into a self (the opposite of Self) mode. Actually, the comparison to Tyshawn is an interesting one. Anyone remember Tyshawn's homies were talking draft after his freshman year? Tyshawn not only needed to develop his game, but Tyshawn had a lot of maturing to do. And no matter what happens basketball wise, it will pay off for him long term.

Our journey at KU isn't OAD, it's player development built over the top of POTENTIAL for greatness in the context of great coaching. There is as much of that on this upcoming team than I can remember. Honestly, this year, I doubt this team can make it to the championship game, but the player/team development will be fascinating to watch. In two years, watch out. I am betting Coach can't wait, and guess what, we sick bloggers can't wait either.

REHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Good opening sentence to your final paragraph!

MBjayhawk24 10 years, 5 months ago

I'm interested to see how a lot of this incoming freshman and redshirted freshman work out this year. We all know that Ellis and mclemore should be immediate contributors to the team. Traylor was in the top 150 but at the low end but I have heard is just a slightly smaller version of T-rob. Peters is also on the low end of the top 150 on rivals but I've read that if he focused more on basketball this year could have been top 20, plus a 6'9" 235 lbs is big for an incoming guy and hopefully will give some good minutes. Adam is said to be better than his rank too. I believe he is somewhere in the 90's but could be higher if he had a clearly defined graduating year set earlier (he was planning on going to college next year for a time, not this year). Lucas is one that I haven't read too much about but it seems as if he will need to put some minutes in right away so improvement could come more quickly considering he may have to get on the court in games this year. Doyle is interesting too just because he is said to be good but couldn't play much because of injury. That all being said I don't take any list (rivals, espn) of the top recruits to be the gospel truth. But I am excited for the next few year with all the new guys coming in. And welcome to Kansas Milton Doyle. I hope you have a great career at ku

Hieronymous2012 10 years, 5 months ago

After having spent 19 years in Illinois, I have pretty high expectations of someone who was first team Chicago PL and second team all state Illinois.

KemDooKU 10 years, 5 months ago

Doyle has got skills that thrills - I can't wait tell he brings home another National Championship for KU this year - the only sad thing is he will only give us one year and then off to the NBA - another lottery pick for Bill. That man has Voodoo running through his veins.

REHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Here's hoping that some of that voodoo rubs off on Jeff Withey, so that teammates can cease pounding his chest in the locker room before games. And perhaps Justin could use a bit of it, to avoid breaking Markieff's Jayhawk record for fastfouling. I will probably stir HEM back into exercising his digits with the mention of Wesley. I swear sobriety and drugfree posting, HEM. Sometime this season or next I plan to call you to account re prognostications that Wesley won't count for wins in the grand scheme of things.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 5 months ago

I will reserve judgement but I must say, something about Milton convinces me he is a player.

I don't know if it's the look in his eyes or the general focus of his demeanor but I get this feeling that KU indeed just found a needle in the haystack and this kid is going to be great someday.

Very weird feeling because I rarely feel something this strong regarding Jayhawk prospects and I absolutely want them all to be All-Americans!!

We'll see.

FLJHK 10 years, 5 months ago

Oak: I have the same gut feeling about Doyle. Also about Peters. But I've no basis for it, and fully acknowledge that I'm not an avid recruit researcher. I actually think recruiting rankings matter a bit less at Kansas than at most other schools simply because of our coach and his system. He has uncanny abilities at exploiting individual strengths, concealing weaknesses and moldng a true team. I'm pretty content with deferring recruiting decisions to him.

ku_foaf 10 years, 5 months ago

Simeon HS was mentioned as school of Jabari Parker...stirred a memory.

Former player Rodney Hull went to Simeon HS.

John Boyle 10 years, 5 months ago

I'd like to see him go to BYU if he is a mormon.

Don't diss a guy for exploring all the major programs. He just wants to make the right decision for his future.

John Boyle 10 years, 5 months ago

Hope he is as good as the last Milton we had (Milton Newton, okay I'm not sure if his name was Milton or just Milt but he was pretty good).

FLJHK 10 years, 5 months ago

Greatly appreciate and respect the various posts of Ralster above. Also very much hope that Chi_town stays with us and keeps posting. I've much appreciated his candor and insights.

master16 10 years, 5 months ago

I will support any player that is recruited by HCBS and commits to play for KU. But as I have no idea whether he is legitimate or a bench warmer (I've seen his videos on youtube) I will reserve my judgement on him until I have seen him play in a game.

Ben Simonett 10 years, 5 months ago

Anybody want to play "guess the transfer date"?

$5 gets you in, you pick a date, who ever has the date closest to the day the "Doyle transers" article gets posted wins!

REHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

benny, I've a strong hunch that you are wrong about this kid. I fully expect to see another transfer next spring; but I don't think it will be Doyle. If he bears the persistence of Travis Releford, Doyle is going to be a key ingredient in future Kansas championships. Take a close look at that Nick Krug photo, above. No surprise that Coach Self sees some TT in that body. This recruit has the extension to become a super thief.

RockChalk26 10 years, 5 months ago

I like the addition of Doyle. If he can play D there is no doubt in my mind that he will get PT next year. Oh and it wouldn't hurt if he puts on 20 pounds this summer :)

Dan Cook 10 years, 5 months ago

I think the big question will become this -- Will Doyle or Adams be good enough defensively and able enough ball handlers as freshmen to keep Tharpe on the bench? If the answer is yes, then either/both are great pickups for KU.

Jack Wilson 10 years, 5 months ago

Hoping to get the last post on the Doyle page.

I, HEM, do solemnly swear: 1. Not to criticize a coach Self signing. 2. Not to be a negative Nancy. 3. Not to worry about rivals rankings. 4. Not to post while I'm "drunk." 5. Not to debate a player's brother. 6. Not to swim upsteam. 7. Not to rain on anyone's parade. 8. Not to consider any signing without my crimson and blue colored glasses. 9. Not to diminish the value of youtube video when evaluating a player. 10. Not to mock the speculative causes of a broken wrist. 11. Not to sneer at a comparison to a four year starter. 12. Not to prefer players with stars. 13. Not to be contrarian. 14. Not type more words in a day than jaybate. 15. Not to make lists like Oak. 16. Not to get cross-wise with Ralster .. I like him. 17. Not to piss off any poster with "hawk" in his name. 18. Not to doubt a player that really "looks like a player." 19. Not to mock anyone that relies on "feelings" to argue their point. 20. Not to attempt to debate those that don't care about logic. 21. Not to dispel the power of positive thinking as all of our dreams can really come true if we just try. 22. Not to try to make a point with a fictional conversation. 23. Not to mention the OAF stuff because coach Self never would think of that possibility when signing a player. 24. Not to try to make distinctions between a general approach, and a specific player. 25. Not to doubt that the "tough Chicago city league" and "first team all city" should be credentials enough to get a KU scholarship. 26. Not to forget that coach Self knows what he's doing when he brings a player in. 27. Not to use Merv Lindsay as an example. 28. Not to doubt the credibility of a high school coach's high praise. 29. Not to question why KU is the only smart elite program when it comes to an unranked player. 30. Not to use coach Self's quotes about prior recruits as a comparison.

And, finally, not to act surprised when Milton Doyle is starting this season, because everyone seems to have seen it coming except me.

RJ King 10 years, 5 months ago

Actually, HEM - that was really funny. Your best post IMHO. Welcome to our 30-step program. May you get in touch with your inner Yes Man, and find contentment and euphoria living among the Jayhawk Nation. Repeat the mantra: RCJH

REHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

I smell a contrarian at work here....

REHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

If HEM says he won't be surprised to see the kid starting this year, then I'm siding with HEM. He rarely dodges the essence of a Jayhawk hoops situation.

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