Saturday, November 26, 2011


KU’s next move must be bold one

Kansas head coach Turner Gill leaves the field after KU's loss to Missouri in the Border War on Saturday, Nov. 26, 2011 at Arrowhead Stadium.

Kansas head coach Turner Gill leaves the field after KU's loss to Missouri in the Border War on Saturday, Nov. 26, 2011 at Arrowhead Stadium.


Podcast episode

Press Conferences & Post-Game Interviews

KU coach Turner Gill

Kansas coach Turner Gill talks to reporters following the Jayhawks' 24-10 loss to Missouri on Nov. 26, 2011.

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KU coach Turner Gill press conference

KU coach Turner Gill talks to reporters following the Jayhawks' 24-10 loss to Missouri on Nov. 26, 2011.

— Two years ago, after Mark Mangino had just coached his final game for Kansas University with a loss to Missouri and a seven-game losing streak, he spoke into a microphone on the table in front of him. His last words after eight years on the job: “I will tell you that I may be one of the more pleasant people to deal with in college football. Trust me.”

Turner Gill sat in the same seat Saturday in Arrowhead Stadium after his team battled the same opponent and extended its losing streak to nine games. His final words, like his two-year reign, weren’t as interesting as Mangino’s.

“I think we can be competitive next year,” Gill said after Saturday’s fall-from-ahead 24-10 loss to Missouri. “I think we have some players in here. We’ve got to put together good things and continue to recruit, and we’ll be ready to roll next year.”

Surely, he had to know that it’s over, but what’s he supposed to say? “It’s not my problem anymore. I’m out of here, and within 90 days I’ll be $6 million richer.” No way he would even think that, much less say it. Gill will learn officially, possibly as soon as Sunday, that he’s not coming back. And it won’t be the end of the world for him.

It cost Kansas $3 million to buy out Mangino, and Gill has $6 million coming to him. Those figures don’t include the assistant coaches’ guarantees. The temptation is to stand atop the mountain and scream, “This must stop. Settle on a coach, and leave it at that.”

Ideally, of course, the next coach will not do anything to inspire anyone to make an issue of his treatment of the players, will win and won’t want to coach anywhere but in Lawrence. Ideally.

Now let’s talk reality. This can’t be a defensive hire, a safe hire. This situation calls for an aggressive, bold if necessary, move, one that awakens a fan base lulled into apathy. After two years of going 1-16 in Big 12 play, getting blown out by the upper-division schools, leading at halftime only to get owned in the second half against some others, this won’t be an easy fix.

Mike Leach has multiple lawsuits in play, including one against Texas Tech, a Big 12 member and his former employer. He’s also suing ESPN, which some believe is the reason Maryland didn’t hire him. Maryland’s failure or unwillingness to work through those issues doesn’t have to apply to Kansas. Clearly, Leach has an uncanny knack for identifying quarterback prospects and developing them. He’s a proven winner. His name alone would energize ticket sales.

Even so, if things can’t be worked out with Leach, Kansas athletic director Sheahon Zenger can’t cave to the pressure of having to name a big name and shouldn’t necessarily restrict himself to someone with experience as a head coach. Mark Stoops, the youngest of four brothers from Youngstown, Ohio, is Florida State’s defensive coordinator. No. 1 LSU and No. 2 Alabama are the only BCS schools with defenses that have given up fewer points per game than Florida State’s 15.2. Stoops didn’t make the transition from coordinator to boss at Arizona, you say? Bob Stoops did, I say. Each brother deserves to be judged individually.

Either hire gives Kansas a better football coach than it had the past two seasons.


pepper_bar 10 years, 5 months ago

Mr. Keegan must think KU's athletic department is printing money. Dude, KU is canceling its Border War series for emotional reasons, leaving seven figures on the table every year. The incompetent suits at KUAC are the problem, and no experienced coach with other options will come anywhere close to taking this job and the unrealistic expectations that come with it.

Joe Ross 10 years, 5 months ago

Ok. This is a dumb post. Calling a spade a spade and sparing no feelings. On the contrary, Kansas is a perfect opportunity to come in, resurrect a program, and easily build a name for yourself. Unrealistic expectations? What, you mean like winning more than two games? Like ultimately being bowl eligible? Yeah...who do KU fans think they are with these expectations, anyway?

pepper_bar 10 years, 5 months ago

Nobody believes Kansas football is a "perfect opportunity" for anything.

Joe Ross 10 years, 5 months ago

If you canvass Jayhawks everywhere you will find a lot of them disagreeing with this perspective.

AaronHawk19 10 years, 5 months ago

Sorry, but I disagree. For Mike Leach, he wants to coach and coaching in the Big 12 makes it easy to keep his recruiting ties to Texas and Oklahoma. We have a small stadium, but great facilities and a brand name basketball program that keeps the pressure off the football coach. Plus, basketball schools want high scoring entertaining football teams.

Sorry pepper, but you sir are wrong.

Nick Cole 10 years, 5 months ago

So Mizzou didn't leave the conference? Now I'm confused...

Carter Patterson 10 years, 5 months ago

stupid post pepper....Mizzou left and they KNEW their would be ramifications. You are clueless to think otherwise. I'm sure there will be a time that we play again, but it won't be anytime soon.

WilburNether 10 years, 5 months ago

On what planet, pepper_bar? Have you been living in Timbuktu for the past year? No sports news? No Internet? No knowledge at all?

chrisgoode 10 years, 5 months ago

Mark Leach has actually worked with Zenger twice as assistant coaches.

Kent Kossoy 10 years, 5 months ago

Well maybe his brother "Mike" is available?? ;-)

WilburNether 10 years, 5 months ago

Last time I checked, Dude, it's Missouri that is leaving the Big 12, and thereby "canceling its Border War series."

pepper_bar 10 years, 5 months ago

Lots of posters here are believing what they want to believe. Folks, of course Missouri is leaving the Big 12, but they made it plain they'd like to continue the series as a non-con. KU said no.

pepper_bar 10 years, 5 months ago

I have no incentive to go dig up links for you. There have been numerous articles in the KC Star about this, though; I'd start looking there if I were you.

Ethan Berger 10 years, 5 months ago

So we should allow a rivalry to continue as they help with the destruction of a conf, whilst it could lead to our destruction? Hey Al-Qaeda, we know you blew up our buildings, but you guys want to come over to the states for a Christmas party? It will be in central park with alot of people...

Katie Bieber 10 years, 5 months ago

Before Mizzou left, KU made it clear that leaving the Big XII would end the rivalry. It's the only leverage we had in keeping them in the league. They left anyway. They're doing what they want; we are keeping our word.

Thomas Young 10 years, 5 months ago

47,000 people showed up. No one cares about the rivalry anymore. That game is not worth seven figures. Even if Mizzou were to stay, the days of it being in Arrowhead were numbered.

Overall, Arrowhead has been bad for the rivalry.

LAJayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

I would argue the lower attendance had much more to do with the fact that we stunk. Out loud.

Mizzou also only barely qualified for a bowl game, so it's not like they had a ton of excitement either, but if we were competitive (just simply playing for a bowl game), then the excitement and attendance would have been significantly higher.

People tend not to follow God-awful football teams. I know it's hard to believe, but it's true....

texashawk10 10 years, 5 months ago

If you were to leave your job by giving your boss the finger and making a huge spectacle of it, would you expect to get any help from anyone in that company in the future? That's what Missouri did and nobody in the Big 12 is going to anything to help them out and why should they?

jlw53 10 years, 5 months ago

No kidding. Classless pushing for this coaching change for months.

Just report the news, NOT TRY TO CREATE it for your own selfish reasons.

May be time to cancel subscription if this continues

Maybe Dolph needs to reconsider your contract for irresponsible (non)journalism

pepper_bar 10 years, 5 months ago

+1. Keegan and Tait have been pushing this waaaay too hard, riling up the townsfolk. Good sports reporters would understand it takes more than two years to build a football program.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

He's a columnist, not a reporter. It's his job to express opinions, you need to at least get that right.

pepper_bar 10 years, 5 months ago

You're partially right. Keegan is the head sports editor, and is responsible for more than his own column. LJW's sports department has been leading the charge with the assumption and expectation that Gill is gone, even with the penalty buyout. Not like Keegan has to pay it.

Funhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Get a nice severance package, then take a nice winter vacation at some far away place. Maybe there will be a new sports editor within 90 days.

Trying every day to get the coaches fired got old real quick. There has been a black cloud over this newspaper every day since Turner Gill was hired; and even before that. And, no ..... no college coach in America can turn around a football program in just two years. Its impossible. Where are some journalists we can read who like KU sports?

Chad Dexter 10 years, 5 months ago

Turn around a program in 2 years? Hell, this program was not that bad, having been to 4 bowls (including a BCS) in the 8 years prior. There was no turning around to be done. Continuing the progress, yes.

Instead, Gill took the program in a downward spiral. This program got historically bad under Gill the past 2 seasons. Get a clue.

LAJayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Setting aside feedback71's point that the program didn't need to be turned around for a moment, you are correct that no one can do it in 2 years. What one can do, however, is sink it much, much lower into a squad that clearly lacked the fundamentals of even an below-average-coached team.

I didn't expect BCS bowl games by year two, by any means. But I did expect him not to create an atrocious team that consistently misses assignments and fundamental breakdowns and also continually lacks any in game adjustments that cause blowouts in the second half of almost every game. That I do blame him for. And that is why he needs to be let go.

I do understand your point about the negativity, and I think it is valid. However, Gill still needs to be let go for the sake of the program.

Micky Baker 10 years, 5 months ago

To build one? The program went backwards the past two years!

Dirk Medema 10 years, 5 months ago

The program has been going backwards for 4 years.

Cmill1221 10 years, 5 months ago

It may take more than 3 to build one but Gill proved you can tear one apart in 2. Hell, really it only took him one game!

kansaspike 10 years, 5 months ago

Whhhhaattt? Go read Mellinger's article.....bye bye Gill is obvious. Dumb post.

Joe Ross 10 years, 5 months ago

jlw53....dumb post. it is not classless at all. it's completely sensible for a journalist to express an opinion that Gill needs to go. Are you nuts?

Brian Conrad 10 years, 5 months ago

have several friends very close to the football program for decades. they all say this program is completly out of control. boosters will make up the millions thrown away by Lew.. word is the money has already been raised. you think the big money donations worry about what Tom Keagan writes? the pain of watching this team needed no words. any football fan can notice a horrible coaching job..heck most fans they endured this season would gladly donate $50 price of one more game to see a win. KU wins 4 more games a year and the money will be made up fast! millions more a year will roll in when KU goes back to a bowl.

Jared Grillot 10 years, 5 months ago

Agreed. There have to be plenty of people out there in Jayhawk land pushing for this to happen that are way more powerful than poor old Tom Keegan.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Gill will lose his job primarily because he allowed Chuck Long to lose it for him. Not burning clock in the Baylor game, not trying a back-up or alternative quarterback virtually all season, going away from Matthews today when he clearly was superior in moving the offense, etc., etc. These are really bad coaching decisions. Will they improve next year? Shouldn't the coach be making better decisions than this?

A loss to NDSU, all-time record losses over the past two seasons, coaching ineptitude in key parts of games this season.....those are the things that will require a coaching change.

In answer to Keegan, Stoops wouldn't touch this job with a 10-foot pole. June Jones is the best choice - he's shown that he'll take a risk and he's proven that he can turn programs around. Give him some of the offensive talent we now have, and we might go to a bowl next year.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Again....this is where opinions are posted. Do you know what he would do? If you can't predict the future then I suppose you shouldn't comment either.

Joe Ross 10 years, 5 months ago

Neither of us can predict the future, but you are the only one of the two of us saying what Stoops will or won't do. You can have your opinion, but that doesn't make you clairvoyant.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Again....this is where opinions are posted. Seems like a simple concept.

DallasJayhawk1 10 years, 5 months ago

June Jones is not leaving SMU--he has it too good here in Dallas and SMU is slowly turning around it's football program. SMU Alum have deep pockets--Jones is getting paid big time--we cannot afford him.

texashawk10 10 years, 5 months ago

His salary is $2 million which is why it would be a bad idea to pursue him. Past success does not guarantee future performance and considering it would take close to making him one of the 10 highest paid coaches to come here, that's why June Jones or Mike Leach would be bad ideas for KU.

okiedave 10 years, 5 months ago

Gill needs to recruit and get some quality assistants around him. I believe Gill can recurit. I do not think his assistants are getting the job done for him on the practice field. Gill needs to hire some quality assistants and continue to recruit.

Joe Ross 10 years, 5 months ago

Ridiculous posts, both of them. Keegan has it right on. Gill needs to go, and while everyone realizes it sucks to give Gill more money that he didn't earn (on top of two seasons spent frittering away any shred of respectability in the program), NOT doing so to keep him around would be the greater evil.

Get a clue! Duh.

Curtis Stutz 10 years, 5 months ago

I wonder if Charlie Weis would be a possible hire?

I'm actually pretty happy with Vic Shealy and would have had no problems with Gill being fired a few games ago and Shealy given an opportunity to prove himself as interim coach

Craig Lang 10 years, 5 months ago

I couldn't disagree more. Weiss is not being sought by a lot of schools, but he is a good coach and he is particularly strong on offense. He's also familiar with the KC area, so that might be a draw for him.

texashawk10 10 years, 5 months ago

Charlie Weiss is a great OC but he's a terrible HC.

Gregor Southard 10 years, 5 months ago

People on here have been begging LJW to ask the hard questions for 2 months now and now that they're stepping out they're irresponsible journalists? I like the fact that Keegan isn't afraid to call it like he sees it. Doesn't mean he's right all the time, although he is exactly right on this one. Time to show the fan base KU cares about football and hire a proven winner.

Alex Berger 10 years, 5 months ago

"Mark Stoops, the youngest of four brothers from Youngstown, Ohio, is Florida State’s defensive coordinator." Did you even read it?

Alex Berger 10 years, 5 months ago

Ok, I see what you are saying. When he referenced "Stoops," he should have said Mike to distinguish from Mark and Bob.

Joe Ross 10 years, 5 months ago

Keegan is NOT talking about Mike Stoops! Jesus!

Cmill1221 10 years, 5 months ago

"Boss at Arizona" implies Mike Stoops, the only stoops brother to be head coach at Arizona.

Joe Ross 10 years, 5 months ago

No it does NOT imply Mike! When Mike was fired, Mark could have been promoted from DC at Arizona, which he WAS, to head coach, or...for the kids in the back of the class..."boss at Arizona".

Saguaro_Jayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Not possible as Mark Stoops left brother Mike's UA staff after their 2009 season to become FSU's DC/DBs coach.

So impossible for him to be promoted to UA's head coach this season.

Benjamin Clay Jones 10 years, 5 months ago

As a former newspaper writer, I've had my copy f---ed up plenty by moronic copy editors. It's entirely possible that Keegan's copy originally read "Mike Stoops," and that a brain-dead copy editor removed the "Mike," thinking Keegan had meant to type "Mark" again as in the previous reference, and just left it as "Stoops" based on what the copy editor thought was a second reference to Mark Stoops. As often as not, when a writer looks bad in print, it's the result of Stoopidity (excuse the pun) on the part of the copy desk.

Ethan Berger 10 years, 5 months ago

What scares me about Leach is defense and recruiting. You don't hire guys so soon after allegations like his. We have a great group of running backs. We need to find a guy who will run a balanced offense. If we go strait for the crazy spread, it might be two more years before we find success. I don't trust these receivers.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

My impression of Zenger leads me to believe that he wouldn't go the Leach route unless he had a lot of assurances that Leach would change some things, drop the lawsuits, etc. I agree with you....I could see Zenger looking for a guy who believes in running the ball and playing defense.

Joe Ross 10 years, 5 months ago

He was specific. He was talking about Mark Stoops, and saying that even though Mark wasn't promoted to the HC job at Arizona (in which case he would have succeeded his brother), he could be promoted from DC at FSU to head coach here. Just as Bob Stoops did. Mentioning Mike is not necessary to make his point.

Clarence Glasse 10 years, 5 months ago

No new coach is going to give us six wins next year. The current coaching staff won't either without more talented young men coming to KU to play football. Our starters are just about as good as any other team's (top 15 teams being excluded). Our game plans are, too. That's why we've been competitive in first halves. Maybe the trouble is that our depth chart talent is low, compared to the top teams we've played, so that in second halves our best players are gassed from having to play long minutes and their substitutes can't maintain the effort because of the big talent drop that is apparent when its their time to play.

I'm no football expert - I just like to watch and enjoy seeing my team play with success. If we hitch our wagon to a quick fix-next year bowl-big name coach dream, it'll turn into a nightmare. Whomever coaches our Jayhawks next year-be prepared to still be patient.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Remember that the non-con next year should provide 3 wins. This would mean that we'd need 3 more in conference. I agree that this would not be easy for any coach but I do think it's possible.

100% agree that the hire can't be a quick-fix or a pendulum hire. Right guy....right reasons. It's the only way to build.

minipman 10 years, 5 months ago

ok.. heres the thing.. some of you have it right and some of you dont. turner is not a proven winner and never was. the only reason he got this job was because he was friends with lew perkins. turners daughter worked in the athletic department before turner was hired here. how do u think she got that job? because of turner and lews friendship. the second thing. the only coaches that should stay are mitchell(rb) and beaty(wr). mainly because they are amazing recruiters. we desperatley need a new strength coach as well. i dont care how good of a guy turner is. he's paid to win football games not be a good person. and he's not winning. i guess they could keep him around to be the team preacher or something. thirdly, there has been no seen improvement this entire year until this last game. and really it wasnt much. horrible play calling and no adjustments. sure they put mathews at Qb but then they took him out after he got a couple first downs. thats just idiot coaching. turner will not be around next year and hopefully neither will most of this staff. if KU wants to get fans back in the seats and keep donors happy then they MUST get a big name coach. even an assistant for a winning SEC program.

MinnesotaJay 10 years, 5 months ago

This isn't even about Turner Gill anymore. Zenger has no choice but to show him the door; otherwise, it's his own job that'll he'll be placing in jeopardy.

Gill. Gone. Good!

Lanny Welch 10 years, 5 months ago

Firing Turner Gill will be one of Dr. Z's easiest decisions and finding the right guy to replace him probably the toughest he'll make at KU. Our fanbase is ready for a coach who will make us competitive and no longer the laughingstock of the Big 12. We don't expect Big 12 championships every year - just a team that will fight hard and go to bowl games more often than not. The KU job is much better than some seem to think, thankfully Dr. Z understands that and is the right guy to find our next coach. Rock Chalk!!

Marc Frey 10 years, 5 months ago

"Our fanbase is ready for a coach who will make us competitive and no longer the laughingstock of the Big 12." We have been saying that everytime a coaching change happens. Here we go again, same song, different verse.

squawkhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

I think you meant to say "laughing stock oh the country", not the Big 12.

NebraskaJayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

While we're at the task of hiring a new coach (assuming this is the case), let's also spend some money on Memorial Stadium. Get rid of that stupid track and lower the field so that we can increase the number of fans and get them closer to the field. There's no reason to build a new stadium. People out of state that visit the campus and the football field in particular think the layout is's location & the nostalgia. So don't rennovate it...just put more people in the dang place!

Nick Cole 10 years, 5 months ago

I would take it one step further with the stadium. I say on top of removing the track and all, there are a few things that need to be done. Put a new, limestone facade on the outside of the stadium. Our stadium looks like crap from the outside. Second, get rid of the bleachers, except maybe in the student section and/or visitors section, and install blue seats. This way when the stadium isn't full, it won't look quite as bad, plus, everyone will get a backrest and a drink holder. Third, get rid of that ugly chain link fence behind the scoreboard in the south endzone and put in an iron and limestone gate. These renovations wouldn't cost too much money and could all be done in one off season.

Why hasn't the KUAD hired me to help with this project? I would gladly go to donors to raise money and help with the design (even though I have no experience doing either of these things).

Scott Smetana 10 years, 5 months ago

Fantastic Ideas.
Hire Leach and you and we'll be set!

Mike Nicco 10 years, 5 months ago

Nice ideas.
I was at the OU game. The house was not as full as it appeared on tv because of the blue temporary seat backs. At least half near the student section were never occupied!! That was also my first game in nearly 20 years and I loved the atmosphere and new traditions. I can't even imagine what it was like from 2006-2009. Must have been an awesome experience.

Nick Cole 10 years, 5 months ago

I'll add that to my proposal, and be sure to make it number 1 on the list.

VaJay 10 years, 5 months ago

  1. Urban Meyer (sure its a reach, but why not?)
  2. Leach
  3. Stoops
  4. Anyone, just someone new.

VaJay 10 years, 5 months ago

I prefer the dream to this reality...

Dyrk Dugan 10 years, 5 months ago

top guys (if we do show Gill the door).

Mark Stoops. a great coaching family, plenty of recruiting base knowledge...probably ready to be a head coach.

Brent Venables. would we embrace a KSU player and alum? would he embrace us? his alma mater turned him down twice....why give them a 3rd chance? or does he want to be a career asst. all of his life?

Dave Doeren. Bishop Miege High school....MM's first recruiting coordinator...led UNI to the MAC title game in his first year. knows the area, can recruit probably about anywhere.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Posted below, should have simply replied. Doeren might be the obvious, best choice. We don't need a "name", we need a good coach who can build a program and who might stick around. Defensive pedigree, exposure to big-time programs, experience at KU, local adds up. This seems like it would be a smart hire.

vd 10 years, 5 months ago

Dave Doeren? Lost to TG coached team.

jayhawkinATL 10 years, 5 months ago

Gill isn't going anywhere...just watch. If we don't make significant improvement next year (e.g., winning at least 5 games), then he's gone.

Robert Brock 10 years, 5 months ago

If Gill is retained, there will be an attendance and fundraising boycott of KU football. That would be unfortunate. Zenger knows that and will not allow that to happen. He will pay Gill and start the search process. It won't be difficult to find a better coach.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Doeren probably will be the next coach. Just read up on him on Wiki. Former DC at Wisconsin, coached at USC, successful this year at UNI and a small-school guy - just like our current AD. Defensive pedigree will help him. Coached here previously. From the area. Exposure at USC and Wisconsin to successful programs.

Seems sort of obvious when you look at it.

WilburNether 10 years, 5 months ago

Just one little problem with Leach: He's suing ESPN. And ESPN is the de facto owner of the KU Athletic Department.

BigAl 10 years, 5 months ago

ESPN is the "de facto" owner of all Athletic Depts. Not just KU.

Jack McEnaney 10 years, 5 months ago

KU really does need to make a splash hire. If you were a talented recruit what would make you want to pick kansas over any other school in the conferencerence? What would bring a good recruit is a great coach. Unfortunately ku does not have the respect in football that it does in basketball. So to get a top coach, kansas needs to accept a little baggage. After firing gil, KU should announce the new coach at halftime of the december tenth game against the ohio state university on natuonal tv espn. The new coach of your jayhawks... JIM TRESSEL!!! How appropriate. With this new big name coach will come major media coverage, relevance, recruiting, and money. How many people believe the jayhawks led by the sweater vest will be disciplined, smart, and play good football? He knows how to win and will save this program.

babyjay1 10 years, 5 months ago

Totally off subject but just looking at Gill wearing black (ummm... isn't that a little close to looking like Missery coach?) makes me crazy!! Wear all blue and red for goodness sakes!! Fire him today!

Jeff Coffman 10 years, 5 months ago

Personally, I thought the same thing, but then thought he was attending his own funeral, made me feel a little better.

Another reason to fire with cause, wearing the other team's colors to a rivalry game.

namder 10 years, 5 months ago

I get so tired of reading some of these starving journalists posts criticizing Keegan. The Jayhawk nation does extend outside Lawrence. Anyone that doesn't realize that sticking with Gill means empty stands and apathy next year has their head in the sand. I think it will be a tough hire but we must move on. The means to do so has been secured and the unwillingness to fire Gill will only alienate the deep pockets from which the funds were secured. It's time to move now.

Bville Hawk 10 years, 5 months ago

The football coach Zenger hired at SIU in 2008(?) has had reasonable success...

question4u 10 years, 5 months ago

It will be interesting to see who might want to take the risk at KU. Pressure to make significant improvement in two years is one thing, but the possibility of another round of conference realignments that leaves KU in the Mountain West is another. Only a short time ago that was a real possibility. Maybe enough money can make any head coaching job attractive, but how many big-name coaches would jump at the chance to come to KU? Even up-and-coming assistant coaches may think long and hard about making that career move. Leach might be desperate enough to take the job, but will a school that fired Mangino want to look hypocritical by hiring another coach with the same kind of baggage?

Maybe KU will pull off a miracle hire, but it seems more likely that another Turner Gill is in the works – just one with greater promise for a winning record. Both KU and anyone who is hired as head coach will have to take a risk.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

I don't think that Leach is hirable. Too much baggage with the lawsuits - doesn't seem like a Zenger kind of guy. KU is secure in the Big 12 for 6 years. The conference is stable enough to attract TCU and WVU, so I think that it is stable enough to attract a good coach to Kansas.

Benjamin Simon 10 years, 5 months ago

the circumstances between mangino and leach are totally different. mangino was fired after a witch hunt was instigated by perkins, partially because of some personal vandetta of perkins. leach was fired because of some fantastic ESPN yellow journalism (see: bernie fine).

kchuskerfan 10 years, 5 months ago

Wow. And I used to think KU people were only insane in basketball season. KU is not even close to a "destination job". You get a Stoops in here and he'll be gone at the first sign of success. Gill got in here late, recruited O-Line when he knew cupboard was bare. Tough sell post Mangino mess, but he got some. Then redshirt and take lumps. The next year he gets a full recruiting season, builds relationships, gets some good talent. Several 3 stars. REDSHIRTS them and plays this year. Then the Big 12 is a conference/isn't a conference BS plus rumor of Gill's firing has all but killed this years recruiting and somehow it's Gills fault that a team comprised 70% freshman and sophomores can't keep up yet? He probably thought he was building a program. Had no idea that KU people and sportswriters had an agenda for Mike Leach or so little foresight. You may as well fire him now. Without a committment, he can't get recruits. Good luck getting a coach or players in this environment when you've run two good coaches in a row out of here for non football reasons. 2 years? NO ONE could've done better in 2 years. Even with losing the def coordinator, the Colorado kid at qb having to leave? One thing is certain, KU fans are a consideration for a potential candidate coming here and the lack of reasonable expectation will be an issue. I watched a well coached team with marginal and thin talent that looked young and undersized. It wasn't going to stay that way. Pinkel, Snyder, Mangino, Gundy, Pellini. Give them only two years and where were they? Heck, that list would be huge. No one only gets 2. KU fans need to wake up. You've never won anything. Never won the big XII North even. You stole an orange bowl due to the acts of the same AD you apparently now villify? Even the proudest moment in the last 50 years of your program isn't much to be proud of. Its too bad we have a Christian man of ethics and morals that takes away the cell phones and stresses academics and being a man of responsibility that doesn't embarrass that team or school. You're right, Keegan. He's clearly gotta go now. Two more years and we may have never been able to get rid of him.

Bellator 10 years, 5 months ago

How come you're not spending time on the husker boards talking about how you will dominate the Big 10 and celebrating your Big 10 title this year?

troutsee 10 years, 5 months ago

You are absolutely wrong in my opinion. Our team have not been prepared to play in many of the games, just as the Huskers were embarrassing under Callahan. Coaching makes a huge difference, Pellini vs. Callahan. We KU fans are very much awake, and it does not take a genious to figure out that Callahan was terrible for NU football and Gill is terrible for KU FB, and the tradition of the sport at a particular university makes little difference. Yes, you have to have the Jimmys and the Joes but the executive abilities, the aura, and recruitiing abilities of the head coach are much more important. The executive abilities means the ability to direct assisstant coaches effectively, judge talent, place talent where it best fits, mold a team around its strenghts, know how to delicate authority, manage the delicate balance between love, hate, and respect, and know how to game plan ( to name only a few). Some coaches have it and others do not. Gill has been a head coach before so he was not in virgin territory at KU. Sticking with him would be a huge mistake. The writing is on the wall. He does not have what it takes. You gotta know when to hold them and when to fold them. It is time to cut our losses before they mount.

Jack Brooks 10 years, 5 months ago

"Its too bad we have a Christian man of ethics and morals that takes away the cell phones and stresses academics and being a man of responsibility that doesn't embarrass that team or school."

1: We didn't hire Turner Gill to be a pastor/youth mentor. We hired him to coach a football team and win football games.

2: He HAS embarrassed MY university with the absolute atrocity of play by the football team he's supposed to coach to victories.

Nobody gives two sh-ts about his religion. He didn't just not win here, he lost games in record-setting fashion.

justajoe 10 years, 5 months ago

I'd suggest you've just made the case for firing your own coach and replacing him with Gill. If these ethics and morals you preach are that important to you, why aren't you leading the charge to fire Pelini? Name another current coach who can top Pelini for sideline tirades and boorish behavior. He's an embarrassment without equal.

Character and class should certainly count for something. Unfortunately, they just don't count for a guaranteed $10 million when it comes to college football.

Now, with no disrespect intended, please do what you must to get the Husker house in order before meddling further in our affairs. And by the way, I'm not sure anyone with Husker in their name should be lecturing anyone else about 'reasonable expectations.'

d2psugrad 10 years, 5 months ago

It seems painfuly obvious that youth and inexperience is not the main issue here. Total disorganization, horrendous in game decision making, and failure for coach acronym and his word for the week gameplan to show any indication that a team led by him could compete in the Big 12 is justification for firing. He should have got the ax after the NDSU debacle. Allowing TG to continue to pile up losses will do nothing but hurt KU and Turner as well. Turner does not need time, he needs to be coaching at a Christian High School. He has never proven he can win, and two years at KU has proven he won't win in a BCS conference. He did not have a winning record in the MAC and should have not been hired.

lama 10 years, 5 months ago

How's Pelini working out for you? Been more than a decade since Nebraska has won a league title...

mikehawk 10 years, 5 months ago

It really hurts to say this, but this Husker dude speaketh the sobering truth. Take a hard look at his post, because it contains a dose of reality which describes the situation. Get down on the next coach like we did Gill and no recruit (or coach) wants to come to KU. The next hire better be a good one because we will have to give them the full 5 before making a change.

jmsuther 10 years, 5 months ago

Anyone who thinks Gill should stay either doesn't watch the games or doesn't care about the outcomes. I don't understand why we aren't pushing for jim levitt he is the best coach for us to get out there

Jim Baker 10 years, 5 months ago

...obviously you've never been to Lawrence...

squawkhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Yeah, it's just like manhattan, so what is your point?

babyjay1 10 years, 5 months ago

This is the funniest and stupidest post I have seen seen the oklahoma guy and his horrible vocabulary!! Keep it coming... Trolls make me laugh!! Lawrence, KS rocks and everyone knows it!!

Jack Hoover 10 years, 5 months ago

It does NOT take two years to build a program. Gene Chizik failed at ISU and won a National championship the very next year at Auburn. That mindset is pure BS. A coach can make a difference the very 1st year....... See ISU. PLUS, we are paying our coach 800,000 less than your guy. You could of hired Gill for much less as he was only making 400,000. Lew stuck it in your gullet its as simple as that. This is gonna be a tough road for you hiring a new Coach. You are 6,000,000 upside down minimal and where is the money coming from to get a guy like Leach? You have a real mess brothers. Get out the pail and start mopping.

pepper_bar 10 years, 5 months ago

Kansas and Auburn are really not comparable football programs.

Jayhawk1958 10 years, 5 months ago

+1 That is exactly right. Look what Bill Snyder did his second time. There is so much parity in college football today that coaching makes a HUGE difference. Just look at the upsets in the conference this year. Less talented teams beat more talented teams based on intangibiles and coaching. Look at Texas and their talent. They are 6-6.

squawkhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Agree. Every team KSU beat this year has way more talent. Even KU is at least on par with KSU talent wise. Coaching is the difference.

namder 10 years, 5 months ago

If you were watching a "well coached team" then you were certainly not watching our crimson and blue. I beleive in separation of church and state. That dialogue has no place here, this is football not Sunday school.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

As many of us have told our kids, the right choice isn't always the popular choice. Big names mean nothing. Hiring the right guy for the KU job is paramount. Gary Pinkel was not a big name, neither was Bill Snyder, neither was Roy Williams and neither were many other successful coaches. We need someone who is hungry, experienced and competent. Flash is just that...flash. We need substance.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

I think that Mangino was fired more for being a pain in the rear than for being tough with players - that was all a smokescreen. I remember when he got kicked out of his son's high school game for screaming at the refs. He was a little unbalanced.

Mangino may have been the most overrated coach in history - though he was excellent in coaching bowl games. He rode Reesing to some great seasons and really did nothing else.

I agree with you, though, that toughness is a big part of football. Touchy-feely just doesn't work. I respect the heck out of Turner Gill as a man. I just don't think that he's the right guy to lead a BCS conference football program.

kureignman 10 years, 5 months ago

I said this yesterday, but I find it incredibly sad that we are so desperate for a coach that we actually want Leach. He is flat out a nutjob!

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Agreed. That would really be the equivalent of a gadget play. Besides, people forget that Leach was a little ahead of his time with his more..... everyone in the country is running it now. This, by the way, is also true of KU's success a few years ago.

We need the real deal.

kureignman 10 years, 5 months ago

Seasons? I'm pretty sure that Leach had one 11 win season in 10 years at Tech. If you wanted to be more accurate you should have said "yea 8-4 seasons suck" because that is what he averaged. I'm not saying that wouldn't be an upgrade, I'm just sick of everyone making him out to be Jim Tressel when he seems to be an adolescent obsessed with pirates.

DallasJayhawk1 10 years, 5 months ago

What about bringing back Glen Mason ? When I was at KU he started to put KU on the football map and was a good coach.

kuilander 10 years, 5 months ago

i certainly dont want to bring a coach back who chose minnefingsota over us.

troutsee 10 years, 5 months ago

Acutally I would not be opposed to this. Mason's teams were tough minded and tough physically. He was a great practice coach and a good recruiter. However, he had some terrible moments at KU and at Minn in game coaching. He is also 60 years old. However, I think he has been the best overall KU FB coach in the last 20 years, especially considering that the football office was in Allen Field House and the practice facilities were horrible and his pay was aquite low. He also had some very good and some very tough teams at Minnesota. I like your idea and have thought about Mason as a possibility as well.

Ashwin Rao 10 years, 5 months ago

What I expected from Zenger after the mid-season comment by him: 1) Develop a good understanding of what the stakeholders (fans, donors, staff, students etc (Did I mention KUSports staff?)) of his program expect… no, not an outcome (“Fire Gil”), but the “real” need (e.g. better communication from the program, current expectations about competition within the conference (no, not win it all, but be competitive, show some spark, show some improvement) etc) 2) Evaluate current situation… a. Contract with Gill & his asst. b. Available coaching options (new HCs (both folks looking for jobs, or those that can be lured away from a job), upgrading of Asst, etc) c. Available funding options to align with the best coaching option 3) Work with the coach(s) to come up with a better, more measurable contract. a. Granted, Gill will be a fool to walk away from this cool deal, but can we not restructure it to make it less cool now and cooler (much cooler) at the end once progress is shown? Gill would love to be given a chance to prove himself, and we will be taking a smaller risk. b. Look at alternatives if the (a) does not materialize. 4) Keep the stakeholders updated on progress… but at this point in time you don’t want to alienate them in the process… He needs to get the stakeholders to buy into what he is doing so there is less of this negativity in the process. I believe the time is NOW to start with (4) as it has not been done before.

kchuskerfan 10 years, 5 months ago

Just curious Iowaboy. Was Chizik a failure at Iowa St and only learn to coach by going to Auburn? He was viewed as making good progress at Iowa St. After how many years there? 2? ummmm. no. And at Auburn, the cupboard was hardly bare and he had a much bigger budget to buy players, or players dad's that shopped them around. Ironic as Gill was a finalist for that job, too. I do not think Chizik is more or less coach than Gill. Gill was offered the Offensive coordinator job for OU when Stoops got there, Btw. Insiders do not feel he's a bad coach. One other point, I'll use the Washington Redskins to make the point. They had Scottenheimer as a coach. Smashmouth, run the ball guy. They fired him, got Steve Spurrier to replace him. Spurrier threw it all over the place. Took two years to get the line, rb's and decent wr's in and then after yr 3 they fired him. Replaced him with?? Joe Gibbs. took three years to go back to getting the guys to again focus on running the ball. A decade of bad. At KU, you had Mangino with Todd Reising throwing all over. Gill prefers to run it, needed to get different type of talent in here vs what little was here. Takes a few years for freshman 3 and 4 star O-line guys to bulk up and get experience. Not a lot of dominant freshman off lineman. And now you hope to go to Leach? Bet he gets more than 2 years, but he will need it and probably get beat badly for a while. Or where you getting Leach for his defensive focus on things? As to the Nebraska thing. Wish we'd of hired Gill or kept Pellini when we could have vs chasing the name, Callahan nearly destroyed us and did long lasting harm. We may never again be what we were. I can be fans of both. And KU wishes they had Nebraska's issues. But chasing off Solich and Pellini because they weren't TOM and unreasonable expectations is where it started.

Jayhawk1958 10 years, 5 months ago

Letting go of Solich is one of the biggest mistakes in NU football history. But the Nebraska back in the day will never be the same again. Pellini hasn't really brought NU back to that level, and doesn't seem he can take it the the next level. He hasn't had a decent offense since he's been there. And he loses games he is suppose to win like Northwestern who I believe had a losting record.

johnnyhrdwd 10 years, 5 months ago

You're an idiot if you wish you'd hired gill

babyjay1 10 years, 5 months ago

Good one... Wow... You are a middle school troll on top of all else! I'm so sorry for you that you haven't had the experience yet of attending college and finding a team to support. Hope that happens for you someday.

Jayhawk1958 10 years, 5 months ago

Your experience at KU must of been a bad one. Which is of the exception for most KU students and players. I feel sorry for you.

Jayhawk1958 10 years, 5 months ago

Why blast Keegan? The writing has been on the wall for how long now? He was hired and paid to write editorials and not report news.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

He writes columns - he does not report. That makes him a columnist. Just like Woodling before him. Give it up...please.

pepper_bar 10 years, 5 months ago

So a newspaper's sports editor is responsible solely for his own column. Got it.

kchuskerfan 10 years, 5 months ago

Few teams have 70% freshman and sophomores. his best returning rb was converted to LB. A qb was made a wr. If you look closely you'd probably see duct tape on the uniforms as KU tried to put it's best talent on the field, which wasn't as much as others. Still, they made young mistakes. Yesterday was not bad coaching that had the qb have a tipped ball or the punter muffing a snap. But honestly, Pinkel's been there several years. He's got his program in place. didn't people expect MU to win? I'll stop making excuses for Gill. I'd feel the same about any coach actually. 2 years>? only one full recruiting year, and he had great success getting guys off a 3-8 season. Go back and look at what he signed last year. Better than anything Mangino had. Shoot, wasn't this supposed to be the massive talent year that was gleaned from the Orange Bowl season? That some want to bring Mangino back is pretty funny, actually. Can we just bring Reising back? That's really what most of you are really saying and miss. Gill did fail to get a QB. Still has. I really wasn't expecting much out of this year. Surprised to see that so many of you did. I do agree that coaches can step in and win quickly. If they step into certain programs like Auburn, Oklahoma, USC. But look around.. Tennessee, Florida, UCLA, AZ all more attractive than KU for a football coach and they have similar issues. In fact, look hard at Tenn as they have been through 2 coaches as KU is about to be. Even their name and legacy can't recruit a name coach. Bill Self? C'mon. He was a final four coach with Illinois when we offered him. It's not even close to the same. And KU is a destination Basketball Job. You cannot compare KU basketball and it's prominant place in it's sport, vs KU football and it's place. Exactly to the point of the expectations being a bit too high.

blackhawkjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

No doubt that much of what you say is true. What I can't get over is the NDSU loss, the enormity of the blowouts, the poor coaching and clock management vs. Baylor, the idiotic decision to keep Webb in yesterday. These are coaching decisions - and bad ones.

The fact that he can recruit is fairly clear - credit where credit is due.

A better coach, though, would have finished off TTU, Baylor and ISU - not to mention Missouri.

Jeff Coffman 10 years, 5 months ago

I see most of your points; however, a muffed punt was coaching. In practices when a KU punt returner muffed a punt, Turner Gill laughed and tossed the ball back to the player. Giving a QB an opportunity to throw through paths, usually is associated with Coaching schemes. Turner Gill runs one basic upfront line, and is very predictable. The guy can't coach and it is plain and simple. I'm surprised when people talk about how good his recruiting is. Last time I checked he has about 15 scholarships available. Of which only 7 commits (remember 2 have decommitted) and only 1 is associated with the defense. Sorry to inform you, a new coach always gets spike in recruiting, but after a year or two you see how he really recruits...not looking good.

The guy is incompentent as the KU Coach, and should be fired for cause as outlined in his contract.

patkindle 10 years, 5 months ago

I figure zengler has two options,

Wait until after church today to fire gill. Or let gill work off another 2 mill, And keep him for a year to see what happens

As far as the next mu/ku game, it wont be important Until ku decides they need a million bucks To feed the kitty

squawkhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Yesterday should have been a blow out like most other games this year. MU tried giving the game away. Franklin threw 3 picks that were awful throws and should not have been thrown. MU acted like they didn't even want to be there in the first half. That changed in the second half though when MU decided to show up. Even with 3 turnovers KU could only muster field goal on offense. KU was lucky MU only played half a game.

kchuskerfan 10 years, 5 months ago

Gill can certainly be held to recruiting, and coach selection. Play calling also drove me nuts, but that's Chuck Long deciding personnel groups and several plays actually had holes blocked but they are just too slow and indecisive to hit the holes created. That's youth. The blocking schemes being coached are pretty good it appears. Also, they are thin at most positions so depth is a problem, why they wear down. I think the first half of games is more telling and with some time and depth, they can take that to the 2nd half too. I even saw the ole option into the short side for 5 yards... LOL. Have to ask Iowaboy to defend Chuck Long and I sincerely hope they can successfully recruit some defensive talent. But most know, people start by focus on the Offensive side because offense puts butts in the seats first.

rockchalkjjjhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

I find it sort of pathetic that in this day and age no one has to own up to anything. Just pass the buck and move on. It seems to me that if Lew was the one who made the bad hire, he should have been on the hook for a percentage of any buyout. As it is, Lew left with a pile of cash given to him basically from the pockets of a bunch of hard working alumni/businessmen/businesswomen all the while not having any consequence in his departure when he knowingly hired a suspect coach who had had an average track record at best. As it is, it isn't someone like Lew who now has to once again dig deep in his own pockets to help out the university. Instead it's the donors who were already ponying up and will now have to do so even more because of their love for KU. And the money for Gill's buyout, if it occurs, will also go to the entities (lawyers, etc) who set up such a high-rate-of-return deal. It's to their advantage now for Gill to be fired. The payout-to-investment ratio vs time is what the keen eyes will be on. Besides, it's not out of their pockets that the money has to come from.

What I've always found interesting to watch are the leeches who have come in from out of the area who didn't pay a dime to the university either through tuition, fees, dues, funds but who are successful in wringing what ever they can out of the system not because of the success of some over-the-top talent they have but instead because of the success of KU. One could go down the line: From directors all the way down to book authors, etc. Tom Brokaw's reports not that long ago on "the fleecing of America" could easily have been renamed "the fleecing of universities".

Scott Perlmutter 10 years, 5 months ago

After all the scandals at Ohio State, Jim Tressel will have a hard time finding another BCS school taking a chance on him immediately. He will need to restore his name someplace and has said that he wants to coach now. Kansas is the perfect place for him. He brings a business mentality to the program and has won a national title everywhere he has been (Youngstown State and Ohio State).

Some people say that we can't afford to fire Gill. That is non-sense as we can't afford to keep him. The lost revenue of ticket sales, merchandise and bowl games easily makes it worth it to fire Turner Gill. Coaches don't get paid $2 mil a year because they are coach, they get paid $2 mil a year because they bring in more than $2 mil in revenue for the program. Jim Tressel would bring KU Football a ton of money and that can't be ignored.

kubballgal 10 years, 5 months ago

If Turner Gill takes the 6 million he has no integrity at all. He will be fired because he is a BAD COACH. He should bow out gracefully and leave the money for the next coaches hire.

patkindle 10 years, 5 months ago

turner gill would be stupider than i think if he turns down the 6 mill. hardly anyone is that stupid except the ones that suggest it bow out gracefully , what a crock

lama 10 years, 5 months ago

Probably a few more wins than you'll have against Florida, Georgia and Tennessee. And with Mizzou's proud history of taking 10 fans to road games, enjoy the travel you clown.

babyjay1 10 years, 5 months ago

I will tell you what I tell other trolls... It's very pathetic that you don't have anything better to do than come read our board. I am always amazed by that. Seems like you would want to stick to your own boards and chat with other Missery fans but whatever.... Real KU fans don't generally go trolling on other boards.. What's the real point? Although, I always get a good laugh out of you all so "welcome" and continue to make me laugh!

Maracas 10 years, 5 months ago

Why is Gill not fired yet? Zenger has had plenty of time to evaluate him. Should take all of 30 minutes or less.

Bville Hawk 10 years, 5 months ago

How about Frank Solich? I never see his name mentioned when head coaching positions open up.

texashawk10 10 years, 5 months ago

Frank Solich is a very good coach, but he's also in his late 60's so because of his age he's probably not the best hire for a place like KU.

JayDocMD 10 years, 5 months ago

Gill has lost the support of the vast majority of fans and boosters. Even looking through the rosiest of rose-tinted glasses, there is no indication that this ship is going anywhere but down. I used to think only a change in coordinator(s) was a possibility, but now I see that's the equivalent of rearranging a sinking ship's deck chairs.

I liked the Gill hire and was willing to give him 3-4 years to implement his plan. However, another year of these weekly humiliations would effect the schools reputation, relationship with fans/boosters and ultimately KU's bottom line by so much more than the ~6 million owed to Gill. The buyout will be big and certainly a hard pill to swallow, but big picture: KU simply cannot afford another season like this one.

Robert Brown 10 years, 5 months ago

If Gill stays this will be reasons we will hear: 1) 2 years isn't enough time to determine if he can build a competitive program. 2) This year's roster was the youngest in a Big 12. 3) This year's team played one of the toughest schedules in the nation. 4) DC leaving before season for medical reasons created problems with the defense, but saw some improvement toward the end of the year (MU, Baylor, Iowa State).

Firing Gill is easy. Finding a replacement is hard. There are alot people in crimson colored glasses that think this is great job. There will be alot of other jobs where the school:

1) Only gave the previous football coach 2 years before firing him 2) Are in stable conferences 3) Has a better recruiting base (I can't think of a BCS school with a worse recruiting base than KU's- small state, better in-state rival, etc.

I'm not thrilled with the direction of the program, but I am concerned that whoever replaces Gill will not be any better which will further set back the program.

Those of you who say that hiring one of the Muppets would be better than Gill don't know what you are talking about. I have followed KU football since the late 60s and I can't say any coach has ever achieved sustained success. The closest were Mangino and Mason. I don't know if that speaks to how badly we hire of how difficult the job is:

  • Pepper Rodgers moved to UCLA and was probably considered a good coach -Fambrough never left KU -Whatever happened to Bud Moore (who was coach while I was in school) -Gottfried left for Pitt, but became more successful in the broadcast booth -Valesente- what happened to him- he is compared to Gill -Mason- was decent at Minnesota -Allen is back in the MVC, not all that successful

Jack Wilson 10 years, 5 months ago

Bold move. Read Mellinger's column in the KC Star. Mike Leach.

And I will be surprised if BGL permits Zenger to can Gill after two seasons. Common discussions are that 2 years is not enough to give a coach to develop a program.

It can go unspoken, or avoided, or ignored. But the racial element is clearly there ... will BGL permit the firing of a black man whom she so clearly advocated hiring? More precisely, will she permit it after just two seasons?

Year after year we hear about blacks not getting enough chances, and the constant whining and complaining about that garbage. So it will be at least interesting to see. I doubt if the racial side of this will be overcome to permit the firing.

The fact is, as JayDocMD said right above, "Gill has lost the support of the vast majority of fans and boosters." This football program is a joke with Gill at the helm. As Mellinger said in his column, pretty much everyone that is around college football sees what Snyder is doing right now at K-State with roughly the same talent.

A master in Manhattan; a laughing stock in Lawrence.

justinryman 10 years, 5 months ago

Leach is NOT the answer. Ron Zook just got fired from Illinois, not the answer.

Look there has to be a coach that is a good person, and a great coach that will take this KU job. Phillip Fulmer has been out of coaching a few years,, you just never know.

But it doesn't have to be a big name head coach that has been there and done that. There are a few assistants listed above that would be nice to have in the KU colors. What about NFL assistants or Coordinators???

I jsut do't want to have Mike Leach on our sidelines. His frivolous lawsuits his antics and his behavior are not what KU is about.

Then again what do I know? Just like all the other KU fans its guess and see, guess and see.

BillSelf4Prez 10 years, 5 months ago

Next year we need to start Mathews at QB or some good recruit. Webb is not going to get us W's. He is awful and we will be doomed the next two years with him. With Mathews he can run, looks like he can find running lanes, and looks like he can throw better than Webb. Every time Mathews was in the game yesterday a got 5-10 yards and then we would bring Webb back in and he would killl the drive and lose yards. Next year i wouldn't mind seeing Mathews in there and us run an offense like Georgia Tech or Navy. I mean the guy can run, finds holes, and we have 4 above average running backs. I think it would be a pretty good fit but that is just my opinion.

pcutjayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Can't hurt to ask Mason. What about Tommy Bowden? Or Skip Holtz? I agree we need someone with a little more fire in the belly. I was against the Mangino fire. Personally, some of the players gave up on him. Remember CU's old coach, "It's division one football!" Time to find a fighter, whether it's a no name or a proven name, we need a change.

BarkingHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

The only way this can be about race is if our Chancellor would make it about race by requiring retention of a coach with the same profile as Turner Gill who is not black. The one good thing about hiring Turner Gill is that it showed we would not allow race to be a factor in not hiring. Neither should it be a factor in firing. When it is not - both ways - we will know we have overcome the racial component and come a long way in doing so.

Any firing, a well-earned one, should be based on the merits. And anyone who has spent their hard cash on this program the last two years - and sat out in the wind, the damp and the cold of Arrowhead yesterday - knows exactly what I'm talking about.

Kevin Randell 10 years, 5 months ago

I think the majority of us would be in agreement that IF Coach Gill would have made a marginal degree of improvement then I can see giving this guy another year. But "facts" only support that this program is going in the wrong direction. You can only bail water out of a sinking ship so long before it goes under. Look, I like the guy and truly had hoped he could have turn it around, but this game of college football is all about winning and 5-19 shortens a coaches career. But whether he is let go tomorrow or next year he will be a millionaire and I truly wish him the best.

Now as far as all the negativity I have read about how KU sucks and our history of losing, etc all I have to say is would you all please pack your bags and move to the SEC with Mizzou and A&M. I don't give a crap about our history and where we came from. All I care about is where we go from here. We need to rally around our University and give whatever support we can and send a clear message that we want KU to have a winning program. Even if we go 0-12 next year, I will still buy my season tickets, I will make my 3.5 hour drive, and enjoy what I feel in my heart is the greatest sport there

Gary McCullough 10 years, 5 months ago

If KU gets on this coaching merry-go-round the program goes into the trash, again. The program's brief success under Mangino was an opportunity to move to the next level. What was his favorite thing to say after a game? "Keep sawing wood." But now the fans want the program to return to looking for a quick fix instead of patiently building and enduring less than satisfying seasons. This is the hallmark of a basketball school where a few highly regarded players can turn a program around in a few seasons (e.g., Kentucky's reliance on one-and-done players.)

The problem, my fellow alumni, is not in our coaches, but in ourselves.

FreddyinLA 10 years, 5 months ago

Nolan Cromwell Kansas High School Athlete of the Decade Big 8 Offensive Player of the Year at QB NFL All-Decade Team as a DB Played in 1 Super Bowl, coached in 3. Special Teams coach in NFL for Super Bowl winning Packers. Offensive Coordinator at A&M for 2 years.

Robert Brown 10 years, 5 months ago

What's your point? Turner Gill has just as impressive of a resume. Hiring an unknown is more risky than keeping the status quo.

142466 10 years, 5 months ago

I floated Cromwell a while back on one of these blogs. I didn't know what he is doing now. Thanks for the update. I was unaware that he had did any college coaching. Does anybody know the reason why he went to TexA&M, what years he was there, why he departed, and whether his 2 years at A&M were considered successful?

Robert Brown 10 years, 5 months ago

He and Mike Sherman coached together in Green Bay

kureignman 10 years, 5 months ago

I think it's a waste if we just fire Gill with a $6 mil going away gift. Can't he work in some other capacity at the University? If he's not willing to do that then maybe he'd be willing to buy out his contract at a lower price.

Randy Bombardier 10 years, 5 months ago

I think Gill and Co. should get at least one more year. But I doubt that is going to happen. I am done preaching. That being said, I like the idea of Cromwell as he was the BMOC during his KU years. I also like Houston Nutt or even Mike Leach. I like the Coach at NIU. I say give it to the one who is not afraid to go on a year to year contract. Period. If our young AD wants to gamble with a young, up and comer, this is the way. It would be a no-lose situation for him. I would rather pay more for year to year than to have to have a buyout. If the new coach is really confident of himself he would take that offer. That being said, Leach would never take it. Cromwell might, but I believe only an unknown would take such a deal.

142466 10 years, 5 months ago

KU's all time FB record has been gradually drifting downwards toward the .500 mark. Until Gill's tenure, during which we changed into a precipitous declining mode. Thanks to Gill the .500 mark is now in sight. That "coveted .500 mark" as KC Royals early years' broadcaster Buddy Blatner was fond of saying. Whenever people here in California attempt to disparage KU football I've always retorted, "KU's all-time FB record is above .500, and the Jayhawks are long-time members of the FB strong Big 6-7-8-12 Conference." Might not be able to use that rejoinder much longer.

In just two years Gill did more to contribute to that slide than most all his predecessors did in much longer tenures. The Huskers could not have given KU a greater departing insult than to have sent Huckster Gill our way.

Brian Skelly 10 years, 5 months ago

I dont understand those whom think firing Gill is difficult. He's gift wrapped this firing for the administration. He managed to smash through the bottom and keep going. KU's obscenely modest expectations (im being polite -- KU folks dont care about football -- unless we're the worst team amongst the BCS schools... which we are) werent even remotely approached. Which would seem like a damn near impossibility. Yet, give credit to Gill... he's done it.

I dont think we're going to get anyone of significance. I cant see why any coach of significance would want the job (other than money of course). I dont agree with Mellinger's take about the quality of this job. I'd love to see a name coach on their second (or third) go around -- I would have loved a shot at Rich Rod -- I just dont think we're going to see it. Some up and coming assistant or coordinator with Midwest ties quite frankly strikes me as the best shot we have and someone.

We'll see what happens. But people need to get real. There's nothing tough about firing Gill at all. Forget the $$$ issues. I have it on 3rd, 2nd, and 1st hand authority that the movement to raise money for the buyout has been going on in earnest since September. Regardless of the cost, its a sunk cost. Cut the check and move on.

Id agree that finding the replacement could be tough. Because lets face it... what happens with this next hire essentially will define Zengers tenure here. And likely limit it if he screws it up. Firing Gill will be the easiest decision he ever makes here though.

justinryman 10 years, 5 months ago

Bold? No!

Bold is for short term headlines. Sure it will get you on Sportscenter for a night or two, but will it breed success on the field or just the papers?

Good? Yes!

Kansas needs to make a good hire. Sure it may not bring the overnight headlines on Sportscenter right away, but it will bring the headlines for the long term when you are winning long term and not just the flavor of the month.

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