Originally published December 13, 2010 at 10:36a.m., updated December 14, 2010 at 12:00a.m.

Off the bench? Bill Self leaning toward not starting Josh Selby against USC

Kansas guard Josh Selby smiles as he hears the student section chant "Free Selby" during the second half, Monday, Nov. 15, 2010 at Allen Fieldhouse. Selby is still waiting to be cleared to play by the NCAA.

Kansas guard Josh Selby smiles as he hears the student section chant "Free Selby" during the second half, Monday, Nov. 15, 2010 at Allen Fieldhouse. Selby is still waiting to be cleared to play by the NCAA.


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As head coach of Kansas University’s men’s basketball team, Bill Self has the right to change his mind at any time.

As of Monday, however, Self said he was leaning toward not starting prize freshman combo guard Josh Selby, but bringing him off the bench in Saturday’s nonconference clash against USC (11 a.m., Allen Fieldhouse).

It’s Selby’s first game following an NCAA-mandated nine-game suspension.

“He’s getting all the reps with the first group now (at practice),” Self said, adding, “I don’t think I’m going to start him, even though I don’t have a ‘made-decision’ positively. I don’t think I will, because he has to beat somebody out. He needs to perform well in the games, and not just practice, but he’s going to give us some scoring punch.

“He’s certainly a threat when he catches the ball. He has to figure how to play to our other guys’ strengths, and they have to figure out where to get him the ball in certain situations and play to his strengths. It’ll take a little bit of time.”

Selby said he’ll embrace any role.

“I don’t mind not starting right away because I missed nine games. There’s players who played very well over those nine games who play the same position,” Selby said Monday. “I’m not worried at all. I just hope I can bring a lot of energy off the bench.

“I don’t look into all that,” Selby added, asked of the possibility of someday starting. “That’s a coach’s decision. I’m not concerned about that at all.”

Self said the 6-foot-2 Baltimore native likely would be used at off guard instead of lead guard.

“If he and Tyshawn (Taylor) are in the game at the same time, I’ll play Tyshawn on the ball the majority of the time,” Self said. “We tried to make Mario (Chalmers) a point guard from Day One, and then we moved him off the ball and let Russell (Robinson) do it. It was so much easier for him (Chalmers).

“Josh is going to be a point guard for us. He will end up being a true point guard in time. It’s a lot to throw at a guy, ‘OK, you are not only responsible for yourself, you are responsible for every single possession, and if we don’t have a good one, it’s going to basically be your fault.’ I’d rather put that on Tyshawn right now than Josh.”

Selby said he’ll embrace his role as combo guard.

“Whoever gets the ball just brings it up in our offense,” Selby said. “I think it’d be easy to adjust to (shooting guard). The coaching staff did a great job teaching me to play off the ball and giving me some good pointers along with my teammates. I think it’d be easy for me because me and Tyshawn have got a great chemistry together in practice.”

Selby is too busy this week — finals week — to be stressing over Saturday’s much-anticipated debut.’s No. 1-rated recruit has three final exams and five papers to complete in addition to hoops practice responsibilities.

“The only thing I would like to do,” Selby said of his debut, “is just don’t mess up the chemistry my team already has because they have a great chemistry out there. You can see it when you watch the games, so that’s the only thing I want to do besides winning.

“The toughest thing I think I’ll have to adjust to is the game speed. The college level is much faster than the high school level. That and just the fans because the fans here are crazy.”

He said he has appreciated the fans chanting his name and carrying “Free Selby” signs.

“I think we were ranked the No. 1 toughest place here,” he said of Allen Fieldhouse, “so just the cheering and acknowledgment is going to put butterflies in my stomach.”

He said he appreciated his teammates’ support.

“They were sending me text messages (on road trips), letting me know there was a missing piece and they were missing me with them, so I was OK. I was cool. They kept me going,” Selby said.

He said his teammates have expectations.

“From what they have been saying in my ear, just somebody who can create their own shot and (bring) toughness,” Selby said.

“The only thing I see for myself ... our offense runs through the (Morris) twins. You can see they are great guys. They are great scorers, great players. I take a back seat regardless, but whatever my team and coaching staff need me to do, I’ll do for them to win.”

Self said Selby figures to have his ups and downs.

“We may not play great all the time. I don’t know of any freshman with the exception of maybe (Kevin) Durant or (Michael) Beasley who does look great all the time,” Self said. “We are certainly excited about it. I know he’s excited. I think expectations should be tempered somewhat, not from a talent standpoint, just from the role we’ll have him play. He will be one of five. He will not be ‘the guy,’ just like we won’t have ‘the guy’ this year. We haven’t really had ‘the guy’ when we’ve had our best teams here.”

Interactive Timeline

Josh Selby Timeline

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Ben Kane 11 years, 8 months ago

i agree... he should definitely not be starting in this game... by conference time though he will be.

hawk316 11 years, 8 months ago

Coach Self is handling this extremely well and showing a lot of wisdom. He is showing proper respect for his current players by requiring Selby to earn a starting spot. At the same time, he's taking some pressure off the freshman.

One more reason why we have one of the best coaches in college basketball. As I recall, Self had some critics during and after his first year at KU because the team did not seem to perform up to expectations or as well as it did under the previous coach.

I wonder if there are some lessons here with respect to our current football coach?

Jacobpaul81 11 years, 7 months ago

He's showing recognition of previous errors on his part which I'm very impressed with. After the past 2 years, we needed him to demonstrate some of that recognition. While his win loss record has been phenomenal, his errors in judgement, particularly in "leadership" have been questionable. He made mistakes by pressuring Robinson and then turned everything over to Collins. It's good to see HCBS finally admitting that leadership of the team begins with him and not in relying on someone on the court.

The most important thing here to note is that Taylor has been to this team what Robinson was to those 2006-2008 teams and he clearly must remain on the ball. The players are accustomed to it and he's clearly playing like a mature PG now that he is being allowed to run the game and not follow the lead of someone who should not be calling the shots. Taylor is doing a great job of taking what HCBS gives him and translating it to the game. That is something that's clearly been missing since Robinson.

I'm anxious to see what Selby can do defensively. Reed, Little, and Releford are all solid contributors on the offensive end but none has impressed with their defensive feet. They can't break the press like Taylor or Johnson but neither could Brandon Rush (I have nightmares of all the times Brandon dribbled off his feet), but the three can score. Brady has been in the game for his passing and his defense. Neither is SUPER impressive, but it's been good enough to hold down his spot in the starting line-up. It's on the defensive end and in offensive rebounding that we need Selby to really demonstrate his mettle. If he can contribute in those areas, he will eat other player's court time and maybe break into the starting lineup.

Right now, I'm still not convinced HCBS knows what works. We've played a lot of cupcakes where we had size on the opponent. In the few games where teams had a big man, our Forwards couldn't cut it defensively and wound up in foul trouble. If we catch a team with height at the 3 & 4-5 spots, the morningstar - morris twins combination is not going to work. Those are the kind of teams with a good chance of burning us (See Baylor, A&M). Because of that issue, I wouldn't be surprised to see Releford or Little playing more minutes in Big XII play when size becomes more important than foot speed. This may end up being HCBS's oddest rotation with only the core three players guaranteed to start (Morris x2, Taylor). I could be wrong, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Little or Releford start against teams with size while Selby, Reed and Morningstar battle for the 2 spot in those situations. In games where we clearly have a height advantage, then Selby and Reed might start alongside the core. We'll have to see, but someone has gotta be able to defend against and box out a 5'4" -5'7" 3 guard.

NJHAWK 11 years, 8 months ago

It does not matter if he starts now or later. The important thing to see is what kind of defensive intensity he brings to the team. We have heard a lot about his ball handling and scoring ability. Lately, it seems as though Brady and Reed are a step slower than previous years and are not helping our bigs on screens resuting in a lot of fouls (especially Kieff). I was at the Memphis game and watched HCBS ripping in to Brady for blowing off defensive assignments on consecutive possesions. On one of those possesions, Kieff had to pick up a foul. As our bigs pick up fouls, their defensive intensity decreases. We are not very deep at the 4s and 5s (Mario in not a 4 and Withey is lost out there). To protect Twins and TRob from foul trouble, guards have to switch on screens very quickly (Rush, Chalmers and Robinson did it very well in 2008).

kranny 11 years, 8 months ago

Not to mention the freakin' roof will blow off the top of AFH when he does come into the game. Should be an awesome situation. Any bets on when he comes into the game? I'll bet it isn't during a timeout.

1jhawk2 11 years, 8 months ago

Allen is going to be awesomely loud when he comes in, and I don't care if that's not a word so back off right now. If Selby hasn't beat out Brady by now then he's not that good. I will say that Bill is not starting Selby this game since it is his first, but after this the starting line up should be:

Taylor - sub Elijah Selby - sub Brady Reed - sub T Reliford Mc. Morris - sub twin Thomas Robinson - sub Litte/Withey

For super fast line up Taylor Selby Elijah T-Rob Mc Morris

honk_for_hawks 11 years, 8 months ago

T-Rob isn't starting over kief. His ceiling might be higher but he isn't better RIGHT NOW. and on top of that, the twins just play better when the other twin is in.

1jhawk2 11 years, 8 months ago

Why not me be the coach? The twins appear to be sluggish a lot especially on defense and I feel that my comments about that several weeks ago were vindicated when last week Dave Armstrong called both of them lazy. He said they practice they same way they play. T-Rob is a high energy guy who adds the hustle dimesion to a solid starting group. If Mk. Morris is playing so well, then why not have him in while the starters get subbed. We've seen that line up already in games, didn't start that way, but certainly has played that way before.

You must be saying that since I said Brady should come off the bench, come on Mr. Morningstar. I know you want to enjoy your son's last year, but we want to enjoy our year as well.

Tony Bandle 11 years, 8 months ago

Actually, the roof will blow off when he comes onto the floor in uniform for his first warm-up as a Jayhawk!!

AsadZ 11 years, 8 months ago

My feeling - He would come in after the 1st TV timeout.

NJHAWK 11 years, 8 months ago

The game is on ESPN. It will be nice if he does not enter the game during a timeout. Let the viewers listen to AFH crowd (going wild) when he enters the game.

JayhawkRock 11 years, 8 months ago

I dont think he should start him...I like the idea of him coming off the bench in the first game at least because the roof might come off Allen Fieldhouse when he comes into the game...I would imagine he comes into the game around the 16 minute mark.

Jonathan Allison 11 years, 7 months ago

my guess is he's in more like the 18 minute mark. I don't think that Self waits very long at all before throwing him out there.

Jacobpaul81 11 years, 8 months ago

"We haven’t really had ‘the guy’ when we’ve had our best teams here." After listening to two years of talk about "the guy" who really wasn't all that great, I'm happy to hear this from the coach.

focojayhawk 11 years, 8 months ago

I haven't been this excited about anything in a while. Whether he is rated or overrated, starts or doesn't start, I just can't wait to see him play.

On another note, I noticed Tyshawn is leading the Big 12 in assists, not surprising, and he continues to get better. Does anyone get the feeling he will keep to improving and could possibly end up similar to Rajon Rondo? Just a thought.

honk_for_hawks 11 years, 8 months ago

obviously its kind of crazy to predict his career to that point since Rondo is arguably a top 3 point guard in the league, but I made this same point after the first 2 or 3 games. They have similar abilities in terms of style, speed, and athleticism. The big difference though is that Rondo is a physical freak (based on DaVinci's Petruvian (sp?)man, Rondo has the hands of a man almost 8 ft tall and has something ridiculous like a 7 foot wingspan or something like that) so that makes the things he does a little easier. Also Tyshawn doesn't all. While Rondo has had that 18 rebound game in the playoffs last year and regularly gets between 5-8 boards many games. That being said, Rondo got put in a good situation for him because he has 3 career 20+ ppg scorers around him and doesn't have to worry about defenses focusing on him. Taylor isn't going to have any where close to the success rondo is having unless he ends up on a team like that where he can focus on passing and defense.

Michael Bratisax 11 years, 8 months ago

I remember when Rondo was being called a bust in his first year after starting only 25 games. Next year he helped lead the Celtics to a championship and was 5th in 'The Most Improved Player' award. What a difference a year makes and you can clearly see that in TRob and EJ.

Martin Shupert 11 years, 8 months ago

Rondo? Good luck with that one. TT will always be a project.

waywardJay 11 years, 7 months ago

NOt that this is really saying much, But Tyshawn's already got a better Jumper than Rajon.... He doesn't have the intensity yet though... he's got the capability though.......

R2D2 11 years, 8 months ago

Tyshawn reminds me of Rondo also, although Rondo is a great rebounder, they have a similar game.

Tysahwn is very fun to watch this year and I think not having to defer to Sherrron all the time has helped his game.

He is very much the "glue" of this team!

kranny 11 years, 8 months ago

I agree with the comparison and I dare say that like Rondo the pro game is probably more suited for Tyshawn as it is for Rondo. I never thought Rondo would thrive in the NBA but the game allows him to use his athleticism and be a bit more free wheeling. Tyshawn's game seems a bit more suited for that also.

Chris Shaw 11 years, 8 months ago

Man I hate the defensive 3 second rule.

KU_FanSince75 11 years, 8 months ago

Kind of had a feeling HCBS would not start Selby. I used to coach and I was guessing "coming off the bench." I hate it when I'm right----LOL!

Too bad I will not be able to watch the game---will be traveling on the road---bummer!

KU_alum_2001 11 years, 8 months ago

Yes, let's hear more about you. It's riveting information.

KUFan90 11 years, 7 months ago

Yes, no need for the harshness 2001.

However, 75, have you heard of this new technology that allows you to actually "record" a televised event when you aren't able to watch it live, and then you can watch it later when you have time? You should really look into's pretty cool.

KU_alum_2001 11 years, 7 months ago

Pot calling the kettle black, KUFan90?

And that's fair, funkitect. Probably was a d!ck comment. Having said that, it was also probably fairly accurate.

100 11 years, 8 months ago

Since the roof will blow off no matter what he does when he comes out on the floor, why not go all out, Coach Self?

And since the US historian named Selby & Josh (Swade) had so much to do with the 4.3 million dollar purchase by the Booth family...

How about as the roof is beginning to fight gravity & rise inches over the fieldhouse, Josh Selby (Selby, Josh) jogs out onto the floor with the original 13 rules of basketball, grins & tacks them up beside the court so, "the boys could understand the rules."

Oh since this is not a crazy idea... The other part of this, is, since "Selby lost his jersey" he will be wearing a jersey that "accidentally" has Naismith's name on the back..... Maybe he'd get a couple T's out of this & he might get thrown out of the game before he even touches the ball, but man what a sensible way to get some press from ESPN... Perhaps it might even force ESPN to admit that Selby actually was the overall #1 recruit by a recruiting service (Rivals) that doesn't make all of it's money off the east coast TV schedule?

"Oh my will you looky there, Vitale, seeing Selby out there making an a'ss of himself has made me double check some facts here.. Apparently he was even higher ranked than Brandon Knight!!!"

Vitale: "And look at that Fran... Harrison Barnes!!! What trash is that your reading? Rivals!!!! Hahahahahahaha"

(Not to put too much pressure on him, but seriously, in my mind Josh Selby is kind of like James Naismith, Wilt Chamberlain, Danny Manning, Paul Pierce, Darnell Valentine, Mario Chalmers, Jo Jo White, Clyde Lovellete & Jacque Vaughn all rolled into one, so a moment like this where he symbolically tacks up the rules & gets thrown out of the game for wearing Naismith's jersey could really cement the James Naismith Jayhawk side of his person.... I'm thinking, he'll get the Naismith side out first.... From there for the rest of the year, game by game, he can methodically break out the Wilt side of his person, the Manning side etc until we win the whole thing in April).

Questions? Comments?

100 11 years, 8 months ago

Somebody woke up on the wrong side of the bed today. Wouldn't want anyone to laugh, my apologies to a person (you) who knows so much about herself she is willing to put her own expectations of who she is onto someone else.

92Jhawk 11 years, 8 months ago

You're an angry little Jayhawker, aren't you?...why the venom? If you don't like what someone has to say either try to be civil or move on to a post you enjoy.

Dean Huggins 11 years, 8 months ago

100~ I regularly read your posts and typically enjoy & respect them. This one made me think of John Stewart from Half Baked, however: 'You ever posted a comment?...'You ever posted on a comment...on WEEEED??' Please know I post this for nothing more than crimson & blue [ball] busting purposes. RJCH.

100 11 years, 8 months ago

Funny huggybear. No offense taken, thanks for the nice comments. Haven't seen that movie but I'm sure my kids & my older grandkids probably have.

No the point of this post was stupidity really. Stupidity about how "big" this has become (and I am every bit as much a part of this Selby excitement as the next guy).

And at the same time how awesome it is that we are #3 in the nation & at times looking like the #1 team & we haven't even played our best player (the implicit point being we don't need Selby yet ---yet being the key word----- but what the heck, let's have some fun along the way since this has been such a buildup).

Not something as stupid as I outlined.... But you get the point.... The overkill on hype is nuts!

The point of this post wasn't too deep, in fact calling it stupid might give it too much credit, considering I'm in the middle of getting new tires put on my car, that gives you an idea of where this post was coming from.

I do like the hype around Selby it's good for the program. And it also is just really strange the two names which garnered big headlines in regards to the purchase of the rules (historian Selby & Josh Swade).

Considering it's Kansas's first game at Allen/Naismith Fieldhouse since the rules purchase, why not get "even more hype out of it?"

Again, thanks for the comment. But that post was as stupid as it was meant to be.

That said.... Hopefully our PR guys have their ducks in a row on a rock because this is a chance, if worked properly to make a splash with recruits who will be watching every second of this coverage all over the nation.

KU_alum_2001 11 years, 8 months ago

Do you not value your time at all? If you have that much down time while your tires are being changed, read a book as opposed to posting "stupid" (your term) thoughts just for the sake of it.

Second, would you like to remind the rest of us when KU has looked like a #1 team? I think the games against UCLA, CSU, Memphis, and Arizona would suggest otherwise, not to mention Coach Self's own commentary. And don't suggest that huge victories over the likes of Longwood or North Texas count as evidence of a #1 ranking.

Finally, I'd hardly say it's stupid (you do like that word, don't you?) how hyped Selby is. Past evidence would suggest that when a player is hyped, it is "often" for good cause. You can place as much relevance on it as you desire but I assure you that you will find a strong correlation between end of the season rankings and the rankings of the draft classes the years leading up to that season.

College basketball is a massive industry and if you don't think there are a thousand guys out there watching these kids from the age of 10 and analyzing their skill level, you're clearly mistaken. Rivals rankings (or whatever the publication) are closely followed because they tend to be a great proxy for talent, so if Selby is viewed as the #1 (or even just a top 10) recruit, it's because he "likely" is. And as the only #1-recruit to ever come to KU, I'd hardly say it's stupid for fans to get hyped up about it. By all means, look at the #1 listed recruit by over the last 7 years and tell me that shouldn't make KU fans excited about the "potential" of Selby.

100 11 years, 8 months ago

You have proven my point. And yes you are correct, what a mistake for a person to waste his or her time posting on a KU website while getting the aforementioned person's car's tires changed. Thanks for the advice & your insight. You've really changed a lot of Jayhawk's fans outlooks on this issue I'm sure.

Listen if you didn't like an attempt at a little levity on this ridiculous media circus, who cares? If you thought it was a bad attempt at humor, fine, I don't care. 99.9% of other Jayhawk fans probably agree with you.

No one is as excited to see Selby on the court as I...

Selby will be special. Didn't mean to ruffle your feathers, that's why I like you have noticed he's the overall number 1 recruit by a lesser biased service while ESPN rating system which is tied to TV contracts continues to hype him as the #5 player.

JHWK 11 years, 8 months ago

If you're going to be such a little jerk, go onto another website. I'm tired of the supposed 'fans' who post here and do nothing but put other posters down.

If you are truly a Jayhawk fan, that makes me a little sad that our reputation is likely soured when you also open your mouth in public.

jaybate 11 years, 8 months ago


Having Josh jog on the floor with "The Rules" is one of the greatest ideas I have ever read related to KU hoops!!!

Booths, don't miss this opp. It will probably double the value of The Rules!!!

The East Coasters are not the only ones that know how to market.

Rock Chalk!

100 11 years, 8 months ago

Thanks Jaybate, well the vote is 2-4 right now, we're losing big so far.

There's a few posters above, I'm not sure if my humor was that bad, but man I've ruffled feathers with this idea.

What the he'll, do we really need him against USC? Why not T him up a couple times as he jogs around with the rules and make a real media circus out of it?

It'll give the rest of the team a chance to gel some more!

Robert Murphy 11 years, 7 months ago

He might as well jog out with the rules of Rugby since they are closer to what is currently being played.

dynamitehawk 11 years, 8 months ago

It took me about 5 years before I set up an ID here. I just read the posts. You are in the top 5 all time in my book.

100 11 years, 8 months ago

Thanks dynamite. Nice to hear some friendly words after an attempt to make fellow Jayhawk fans chuckle turned a few select fans into Mr. & Mrs. Grumpypants.

I'm excited about Selby too..... And I hope at some point ESPN will come down from their high horse & realize he was undoubtedly "the" #1 recruit & that the ESPN rankings system that keeps bragging about him being the #5 recruit are influenced by TV deals.

In my book where Rivals couldn't avoid the truth at the end and had to give Selby the nod as the #1, ESPN rankings leaned back after seeing Selby dominate like no other his senior year and left him at number 5.

Definite agenda going on here. We always seem to rise above, but he was undoubtedly the overall #1 recruit.

100 11 years, 8 months ago

That's actually a realistic idea that just might work.... I like it.

It's just too strange that Selby & Josh (Swade) were two of the big names out of four during this process....

Seems like a sign... Your idea is legal, classy & no one gets T'd up...,

However, maybe I'm alone on this impossible idea, but I still have an affinity for someone getting T'd up, it just seems so much more dramatic & ironic considering Selby would be holding the rules, jogging around the court....

There I go again... Just kidding for crying out loud!

Tim Bingaman 11 years, 7 months ago

Good stuff 100!

A little pushpin hole shouldn't lower the value that much!

Then we play the game with ALL of the original rules. Since we can't shoot Free Throws, the "3 personal fouls = a basket" should work to our advantage.

Next, how will he honor Wilt? hmmm... you can't get to 20,000 without a jump start... so maybe he could invite a dozen or 2 ladies back to the Towers for an after game party?

DocBean 11 years, 8 months ago

I can't wait to see Taylor and Selby in there at the same time. Two PGs that can break down their defender at any second and dish it off or finish strong will be fun to watch, and hard for a lot of teams to defend.

100 11 years, 8 months ago

Thanks I'll let my mom know. She's been dead for 70 years now, but I'll try my best to give her this important message from you, a fellow Jayhawk fan.

Dave Seefeldt 11 years, 8 months ago

best comment I've seen on here in a long time

hawk_of_ages 11 years, 8 months ago

Yes, if there's anything the Internet needs more of, it's mean-spirited, half-assed snark at the expense of college athletes.

Kurt Eskilson 11 years, 8 months ago

Thanks, hawk_of_ages. Mr. Hinrich would be embarrassed to see his name attached to such classless attacks.

Dave Seefeldt 11 years, 7 months ago

Hey guys... better get onto ESPN quick and defend Mario Little's honor...

Hank Cross 11 years, 8 months ago

"He said eventually Selby's position would be point guard." = TT will sit as Brady keeps his minutes.

hawk_of_ages 11 years, 8 months ago

I know, right? This whole season has been such an unmitigated disaster with Brady in the lineup. I don't think I'd be able to endure it without you guys here to explain to us on a daily basis how terrible he is.

Chris Shaw 11 years, 8 months ago

My apologies hawk_of_ages. After I read your post the second time, I got your sarcasm. Please disregard as I misinterpreted. In other words, I guess my post is directed at Elite. Again, my apologies Hawk_of_ages.

Hank Cross 11 years, 8 months ago

You know who else went 9-0 to start? Last year's team. How did their last game work out for you? In case you forgot, KU lost to Northern Iowa in the second round because they couldn't get a spark on offense and no one could lock down Ali-freakin-Faroukmanesh. It was also the team that gotten taken into OT by Colorado at CU and almost got beat at home by Cornell.

What is being done to prevent that from happening again?

hawk_of_ages 11 years, 8 months ago

"What is being done to prevent that from happening again?"

Geez, it was a college basketball game, not Hurricane Katrina.

There are no guarantees in a single elimination tourney. We fell short in '97 with 4 NBA players in the lineup; we also won a title in '88 with Chris Piper and Jeff Gueldner in the starting 5.

It's not about having 5 scorers on the floor; there's only one ball to go around. It'll be interesting to see where Selby fits in. I'm looking forward to it, and I'm having trouble understanding where all the negativity on these message boards is coming from.

Hank Cross 11 years, 8 months ago

Glad to hear you won't be disapppointed if history repeats and we get upset early and Selby has declared for the NBA within 24 hours of the loss.

BTW Piper and Gueldner started because the only ones left on the bench were Scooter Barry and Clint Normore. That certainly wasn't the lineup that Brown envisioned at the begining of the season.

Although it smarted at the time, looking back the AZ loss - there's no shame in losing to a team that went on to win the champinsionship by beating UK.

hawk_of_ages 11 years, 8 months ago

I won't be disappointed at another early exit? Pretty sure I didn't say that. It's not really a relevant comparison, in my view. This is a totally different team, for better or worse.

Self may not be envisioning Brady as a starter for the full season. Considering that he lost his starting job to X last season, I don't know where you and the other haters get the idea that Brady's only playing because Self has some kind of bizarre personal attachment to the kid. You're insulting both the coach and the player by saying it.

I don't have a stake in who starts one way or another, I'm just sick of KU "fans" who spend all their time spewing online vitriol about certain KU players just because they aren't superstars.

Chris Shaw 11 years, 8 months ago

See Elite! An example of a poster not seeing the "Big Picture". God, I love disasters! It sucks being 9-0 and Josh Selby is about to be integrated into the system without much tweaking of the lineup. I freakin love disasters.

Joe Baker 11 years, 7 months ago

Why? What difference does it make in the overall game plan. I love Selby and think he'll be great at KU. I like the plan to bring him off the bench, get adjusted and get his feet wet a little at a time. I think starting will be too much for him now. I think most have the expectation of Selby starting at the conference opener.

Also, he's smart to focus on this week's finals/papers. I wouldn't be thinking about the game anymore than the media is forcing him to. This is a bad time for him to concentrate on finals and his first game. He needs to finish with finals and papers strong, just like he'll finish at the rim!! He'll start, but just not this game nor the Cal game. He'll be fine. I've been impressed at how well he's taking on this stuff, pretty mature. If he plays the way he handles life, we are in for a special treat! Rock Chalk

Not that it matters, but LJW should post that poll: Should Selby Start against USC? (it's all HCBS's final decision- I'll respect it either way!)

Layne Pierce 11 years, 8 months ago

I don't think he should start, but in a game or so, he will beat somebody out, or everything we have heard about him is wrong.

I would love occasionally to have Selby, Johnson and Taylor on the court at the same time along with the Twins, and sometimes Withey and Trob.

Withey just is not up to snuff yet, I still believe he has great potential, and we will see it still this year.

Marcia Parsons 11 years, 8 months ago

It seems to me that Withey is trying to hurry too much to keep up with the faster game we are playing this year. I wish he'd try going back to playing his game, which was pretty good in spots last year.

KULA 11 years, 8 months ago

Selby will be a starter, but not his first game--you don't take that away from Reed, your loyal senior.

But, about 5 minutes in, after the first TV timeout, when the crowd has settled down, Bill stands up, looks down the bench, pauses, and then points to Selby, who pops up off the end of the bench and rips off his warmups while the crowd, who's been waiting, longing, yearning for this moment for Oh So Long, worked into a frenzy of anticipative rapture, is finally granted that for which it has seemingly waited forever, and erupts in a thunderous ejaculatory ovation of gratitude and relief, like a fire hydrant that's been shut off for too long.

Take it from KULA, boys, this is how it will go down. You let Selby make an entrance and milk the crowd for all it's worth. That's SHOWBIZ, baby!!!

Btw, this is also how I treat my ladies.

Tony Bandle 11 years, 8 months ago offense, but the last line of your post implies you run a strip joint!!

Maybe you could reword it, unless, of course, you do own a strip joint.

Redlandsjhawk 11 years, 8 months ago

A classic day on the boards. Selby with the Naismith rules and a thunderous ejaculatory ovation of gratitude and relief.

Greg Lux 11 years, 8 months ago

I also agree with Josh not starting ... but I bet if he plays well or semi-great he will start the next game and every game thereafter. Just my guess and hope ( I guess ) :)

Rock Chalk

Tony Bandle 11 years, 8 months ago

I kind of thought playing time was earned in practice.

Frankly, I say play the best five guys, period. If he is one of the best, start him!!

justanotherfan 11 years, 8 months ago

This is a tough situation. Everybody has been waiting for Josh to play. Josh has been itching to play. The crowd wants it. He wants it. The coaches want it.

But how do you do it effectively? If you start him, he gets the benefit of getting right in there, getting going right after warmups. The downside is that he might be so hyped up for the game that he is a little ragged after not playing in a full speed game since last April.

On the other hand, if he doesn't start, the whole crowd will be watching the bench to see him rise from his seat and display that #32 jersey as he makes his way to the scorers table. Even before he gets a chance to do anything, the crowd will be going nuts. A nice way to enter? Sure. But you want to talk about pressure? That's pressure. He may be trying to do something spectacular before he's even in the flow of the game, just because he wants to show everyone (and himself) the skillset he's had riding the pine all year.

Hopefully Josh can come in, get into the flow of the game, move the ball around a little bit, maybe get an easy bucket, or a simple assist fairly quickly to get himself involved. Maybe grab a rebound or something to let him get something positive going right away.

And then, off to the races...

Marcia Parsons 11 years, 7 months ago

He only had one turnover in the last game to go with his four steals. Boy, you are really out to get him, aren't you. How many slams have you made against him in just this one thread? You should check the year-to-date stats. He's far from being the one with the most turnovers.

KU_FanSince75 11 years, 8 months ago

Maybe the chemistry needs to be worked out amongst some of the KU fans on this post--------geeeeeeze------keep it positive for cryin' out loud!

100 11 years, 8 months ago

Nice comment....

And this issue of chemistry my friend is exactly why Selby should not start.... Yet.....

Did any of us really think he would?

No way.... That's like Self shooting himself in the foot(he already has the #3 team in the nation).....

Let the starting Jayhawk machine run smoothly for the first five minutes...

When one of our guards starts looking winded, throw him in.

It really should be that simple.

jaybate 11 years, 8 months ago

"Monday iHawking During Virtual Finals"

~ESPN is recommending viewers wear special glasses to watch KU, once Selby starts playing. ESPN especially recommends viewers wear them when Tyshawn "Quantum T" Taylor and Josh "Light Speed" Selby are on the court simultaneously. The glasses solve the problem of Taylor and Selby being too fast to be seen by the naked eye. The glasses are being jointly developed by DARPA and ESPN. They transmute the invisible-to-the-naked-eye broadcast images of Taylor and Selby into virtual visibility. The Booth family gave the seed funding for the technology.

~When I was a student, the time between the start of the semester and the end seemed to take forever. There was so much of everything. So many lectures. So much reading. Mid terms to study for. Teachers to try to out guess. So many parties to go to. So many games to go to. So much beer to drink. So many girls to meet and try to bed. So many failures with the girls you really wanted. So many rocket sled rides of romance. So many broken hearts. All in one short semester. Now, at this late date in my life, the same time frame seems to fly by in the length of a twitter. I have beloved routines. I have breaks in those routines for vacations. I have my family to love and to live through. I have all of my activities that I pursue. I have about one life a death emotional experience each semester, instead of half a dozen, or a dozen. I read what I want, when I want. I have a car that always starts and always gets me there. I cook great meals with the best ingredients I can find. I go out to restaurants and don't worry about ordering the cheapest thing on the menu. But I don't have those walks down Jayhawk Boulevard contemplating the universe with my best friend. I don't have Allen Field House. I don't have the next great book that radically changes everything I thought before. Life is gain...and loss.

jaybate 11 years, 8 months ago

~A week or so ago, I said I hoped Bill Self did not start Josh Selby. I said that partly because I did not want him to have to face the "ridiculous" expectations out of the box, because I too think a player has to beat some one for his minutes. And I said it, because I thought Self was still pursuing the 2-unit strategy. But against CSU it seemed he had junked the 2-unit strategy. There were too many players not playing the second half that should have been, were he still building toward a 2-unit strategy. So: while I still hope he does not start Selby, I wouldn't mind now, if he were to do so.

~Self is a player. He is purposely discussing in public the issue of whether, or not, he will start Selby for two reasons:

a) to stimulate as much media hype as possible for the program to help Josh Selby assume the role, that Duke's Kyrie "I'm the #2 recruit" Williams falsely held for a month or so; and

b) so that the USC coach has to prepare for two potential starters.

I love it.

~And who knows? Maybe Self has not given up entirely on the 2-unit strategy. He is still talking about units. He did just say Selby has been getting all the reps with the first unit. First unit implies a second unit, not second stringers. Go for it, Bill! The 2-unit strategy with each team playing different tempos can pay huge dividends. It means coaches have to prepare for two teams every time. It means everyone on the team is going to be happy and working harder than they would, if you shut the door on 3-4 of the players. If anyone can pull this off, it is you, Coach Self. Strike a blow for "team." Make team include everyone for a change. You will be glad you did, when the Saturday-Monday conference grind rolls around, and then again when the two games in three days rounds of the conference tourneys and Madness arrive. These guys want to contribute, Coach. They want to change the convention of Okie Ball. They want to take Okie Ball to the next the Kansas Level. Use them all, Coach. Keep playing them all till the rough edges are off in mid February, and the team storms the gates of the Madness, kicks them down, and brings home a ring for the masses.

Tony Bandle 11 years, 8 months ago

The real competition shifts to Tyrel and Brady because that's where Josh's minutes will come from.

Actually, I think lessened minutes for both will improve each of their games, thus allowing quick bursts of offense or defense depending on the game situation. Coming from the #3 slot along with working in Mario or Travis, would give HCBS a real set of floor options.

Taylor, Selby, Morris, Morris, ___, fill in the blank based on what you need. TRob-Muscle, Tyrel-Trifectas, Brady-Lockdown "D", Mario-Mid-range, Elijah-Attack Speed, Travis-Transition, Jeff-Tall Tree, Royce-Mop Up.

Hank Cross 11 years, 7 months ago

What are the intagibles Brady brings? Letting quicker guards go past, fouling a jump shooter and letting him convert, 0 assists in 25 minutes (CSU game)? Oh, I forget he is the "lockdown" defender that completely shut down Ali Faroukmanesh. You are right though, Brady will be keeping his minutes.

100 11 years, 8 months ago

Indeed, the two unit strategy is great too because the other team is forced to get winded. I really believe we will see a lot of this strategy this year, especially against teams that aren't very deep.

dynamitehawk 11 years, 8 months ago

Bill Self on Josh Selby: “I don’t think I’m going to start him … ”

Dynamite’s translation of Bill Self on Josh Selby: "I'm not going to start him, but I'm going to run the $hit out of that thoroughbred within minutes of the start. The roof will come off the barn. He’s the best I’ve ever seen, and I recruited Deron Williams. And those board rats are crazy if they don’t incorporate midgets into their Founding Rules suggestions.”

jaybate 11 years, 7 months ago

Yup! That's a pretty fair translation. He has Selby for a short time. Selby is probably the best player he has ever recruited. He has a third ranked team that is undefeated. He describes Selby as someone that can "give them a lot of juice." He wants to create situations where Selby can create the biggest impact possible.

That is why I have been saying for several days before Self came out and said same that coming off the bench might optimize Selby's impact without taking away from playing through the bigs for 4 minutes to get a lead. Next, bring Selby in fresh against a first stringer, who is already winded and green light Selby to take him to the rim and create on him the first 4-5 trips, to possibly break the game open early. Next, have Selby fit into the flow of playing through the bigs for a couple more minutes. Next bring in the second unit, but leave Josh on the floor for another 6 minutes, when he will be playing against a second stringer, or a by then exhausted first stringer. Green light Selby to take over the game for 4-5 trips. Then have Selby fit into the second unit flow, which will be very fast and up and down--a flow he will thrive in--a flow that with Selby could well add to the lead rather than lose it as has been the case recently with the second unit. Next, rest Selby 3 minutes. Next bring him with the first string for the rest of the half. Repeat.

If Selby were able to operate effectively this role, it would mean KU would simply demolish most teams.

But some players cannot do perform well coming off the bench. They need to be in the game awhile to get into the flow of it. Those guys can only start, or collect splinters. They are not psychologically flexible, or in some cases not dominant, enough to fill this role.

Sherron Collins was a rare, rare, rare player, something many board rats here just cannot grasp. He could be instant offense coming off the bench. He could run a team and put it on his back and carry it for a season. There have only been a handful of guys with the talent and the psychology to be able to do this and really take a team to the next level in either role.

Selby could be one of these guys, but he could also be the kind of huge talent that can only take a team to the next level in a starting role. Time will tell.

Either way, KU will be better eventually with him playing than without him. And he will play a lot regardless of how he enters games. Else why recruit him, right?

Martin Rosenblum 11 years, 8 months ago

Here are some ideas:

Promotional headbands with the "13 Rules" on them should be given to all attending the game Saturday. Players, to wear them during the game, of course as well.

A drawing for a free tattoo of the "13 Rules" could be held.

A new banner should be unveiled to rival the "..Beware of the Phog" one, and should read "Play by the Rules".

Jared Grillot 11 years, 7 months ago

I want one of those headbands. Where is Joe College when you need them? Oh, wait...

Alohahawk 11 years, 8 months ago

Josh will most likely be the first off the bench. Question is, how long will HCBS wait to send him in? The betting starts here. Winner gets... bragging rights the rest of the season. My guess - 3 minutes 17 seconds. (16:43 mark of the first half.)

Oh, and please, Josh. Don't get so excited you forget to check in at the scorer's table. RCJH - Hawks by 27 over USC.

KU_FanSince75 11 years, 8 months ago

@ Aloha---Ha, ha---forget to check in at the scorer's table----that's a real good one---but you know, that could happen because of all the excitement & hype.

KU_FanSince75 11 years, 8 months ago

Somebody said this earlier---my guess would be sometime after the first media timeout---Selby will come in then.

REHawk 11 years, 8 months ago

It might take the opinion of a brilliant sports therapist to assess the adrenalin drain on Josh while he rides the pine, waiting. I predict that Self will call his number not far from 3 minutes into the game.

REHawk 11 years, 8 months ago

It might take the opinion of a brilliant sports therapist to assess the adrenalin drain on Josh while he rides the pine, waiting. I predict that Self will call his number not far from 3 minutes into the game.

AncientJay 11 years, 7 months ago

Does this rank as #3 in Most Anticipated Debuts of a KU Hoops player? Right behind Wilt the Stilt and Danny the Man?

kerbyd 11 years, 7 months ago

I am kinda torn between the 2 unit rotation that Jaybate espouses and Self's more conservative rotations. I remember how Roy Williams used to substitute a whole second team (unit) when he ran his run and gun style of offense. Of course, Roy never really focused on defense the way Bill does. I would like to see Self get away from the 8 or 9 guy rotation in favor of a 10 or 11 guy rotation to use more of our depth. Would be interesting to see if we could incorporate Naismith's name onto the uniform somehow. Kinda the way Marquette uses "AL" on theirs.

Kye Clark 11 years, 7 months ago

Just a tad late getting in on this subject, but here is my two cents:

  • I'd start him. He's going to be a starter eventually right? Coach Self is already 9 games behind figuring out the chemistry of this team, substitution patterns, and how certain line-ups mesh with his full roster available to him. If Josh is going to be a starter, why put that process off yet another game by bringing him off the bench?

  • I think that even though he has an out with Josh missing 9 games and he can blame it on game conditioning or needing to earn it in games, I think bringing in the #1 recruit and not starting him is potentially damaging to future recruiting. We saw last year Coach Self basically handed X a starting position and in doing so almost forced redshirts upon Travis and Mario. While some fans didn't like X or the decisions made last year, the way Self handled it surely helped lure Selby here. Now you've got 2 years in a row bringing in a top 10 recruit, but if you were on the outside looking in I'd say it looks bad having the #1 recruit sub in off the bench. I can definitely imagine the speech Calisleazy would use out on the recruiting trail. "why risk going to Kansas and starting out on the bench? Would anybody in their right mind argue that Josh Selby wasn't better than Tyrel Reed or Brady Morningstar? At Kentucky the best 5 players start."

  • To the fans that say bring him off the bench because it will just blow the roof off of the you not think the same thing would happen hearing him announced in the starting line-up? And even if I was to concede that bringing him off the bench was guaranteed to incite more cheering and applause...why is that a factor? Just saying, you can cater to the sensational and do things for the pageantry of the game, but that's not always what's in the best interest of the team.

Anyway, that's my take on it. Not saying I'm right by any means, just how I see it.

4jhawks4ku 11 years, 7 months ago

Are you coaching to please the one and doners or to win champioships? Winning is the best recruiter, not feeding em full of bs and promises just to sway em over. Self tells it like it is.

Kye Clark 11 years, 7 months ago

Is winning really the best recruiter? I agree you don't coach to "please the one and doners", but think about that statement. I agree you have to have a winning program, but who is considered the best recruiter in college basketball? Calisleazy. Has he ever won anything other than a bunch of conference USA titles? What about Memphis and Josh Pastner? Have they ever won anything? Yet both had higher rated recruiting classes than Bill Self. Or take the case of Harrison Barnes. UNC is coming off of an NIT season and yet he choose to go there. I like Self telling it like it is, but aren't we all happy that Selby is here? Would we like to keep landing kids of Selby's caliber?

That being said I think the best way to win is by playing the best players and establishing team chemistry to get the most out of those players. Would anyone argue that Selby will start? That he is one of our best players? So again why delay what something that is already behind schedule?

hawk_of_ages 11 years, 7 months ago

We don't want the kind of players who would make starting on Day 1 a condition of their recruitment.

Hank Cross 11 years, 7 months ago

How do you know those promises aren't being made? If not expressly, through some other subtler understandings.

Kye Clark 11 years, 7 months ago

I agree. And I'm not saying that Self has or will ever make those promises, at least not explicitly. You're missing the point and that is the perception. Every college kid would love to start. That is obvious. But the fact of the matter is that probably every top 10 recruit deserves to start from day 1, because with early entrants into the NBA draft teams are very seldom loaded with talent to the point that a top 10 high school player isn't one of the 5 best players on any given team the moment he signs his LOI. Now obviously players look at teams rosters and the potential for playing time and opportunities to start when deciding where to go to school. Top 10 talent always have NBA aspirations, so they want to go where they can showcase their talents. So while I wouldn't say these players mandate a starting position during recruitment, it's foolish to think that all of them don't have some level of expectation to start. You can bet Selby did. The number 1 player in the country surely expects to start. He alluded to this during his recruitment by mentioning the fact that Sherron was leaving and he was ready to step in. So, are you saying "we" don't want a player like Josh Selby?

At any rate, given these set of circumstances, the expectations of starting, the fact that they should be starting because they one of the best players on the team, and the fact that there are other top flight programs that would definitely start these you really think that wouldn't be used against KU out on the recruiting trail? That is my point regarding recruitment. That kids that we do want might opt for another school if they feel it is less likely they'll start, particularly if it is over lesser talent.

All that being said, if I didn't think he was already better than Reed or Morningstar I wouldn't lobby for him to start. Of course, if he wasn't better than those two he wouldn't be the #1 player coming out of high school.

Hank Cross 11 years, 7 months ago

I agree with you ict. My comment was aimed at HOA who said we shouldn't want players who made starting on Day 1 a condition. I say start Selby now. He's going to be starting anyway after a couple of games and we are already about 1/3 through the season.

Tim Bingaman 11 years, 7 months ago

For a second, I thought that Selby was taking Chemistry, the class. Whew! Hopefully he is taking Unusual Weather, Jazz, etc. like I did!

Good luck Josh!

Gil Ek 11 years, 7 months ago

Talked with one of the coaches recently and confirmed Selby won't start right away. Pressure would be too much. How soon did X get his first start? Probably be a similar timeframe. Maybe even a road game for the first start. The place will rock when he comes in!!!

Tony Bandle 11 years, 7 months ago

I thought Xavier started right away.......and that was part of the problem.

Hank Cross 11 years, 7 months ago

Start, don't start. It's whether he's in at crunch time that matters. Personally I think this whole idea of "pressure" is a bit overrated. Had there not been a 1 year rule, Selby would've probably already have been starting on an NBA team. Secondly, players of his caliber and standing usually have enough confidence/ego not to be intimidated. Finally, there's many 19 year olds "starting" on our team in Afganistan and Iraq and the pressure they face is light-years beyond a basketball game.

jaybate 11 years, 7 months ago

Can't believe no one has asked this: how many points will Selby score is first game?

My guess is 11.

jgh 11 years, 7 months ago

He will average 15+ on the season.

Tony Bandle 11 years, 7 months ago

"Leaning toward not starting him"

Implies he is also has been thinking of starting him. Can you guys and gals imagine all the nights that HCBS sat at the kitchen table late into the night coming up with various line-ups and player combinations with Josh available.

Cindy probably called from the bedroom, "Coach Self, please report to the bedroom immediately..I have a new play for you.!"

Posted with total respect for the sanctity of marriage and a married couples privacy.

What happens in Lawrence, stays in Lawrence!!.

jaybate 11 years, 7 months ago


Do you recall a 2 unit team in d1 in which the first unit played half court through the bigs and had a second unit that played up tempo and through the wings?

I cannot.

It could really stress an opponent.

First, the speed ballers enter with a lead, so the opposing coach has to stay with his winded 1st stringers and the KU speed ballers are fresh.

Second, most teams are set up to play one game. They either ar half court teams, or up tempo pojpteams. Self tilts the minutes to which ever unit the opponent is least equipped to play.

Robert Murphy 11 years, 7 months ago

What a great smile. That smile is worth a thousand words, not to get Jaybate going. This season is going to be a real treat. Hang on to your computers

Jack Wilson 11 years, 7 months ago

I, for one, am 100% in Josh's corner. And I think he will match his top 5 ranking very soon.

You understand that you may be committing heresy here. Suggesting .. of all things .. that a freshman might actually be better than Brady or Reed the minute he sets foot on the floor? The fact is, Selby is better than Brady or Reed right now. Anybody that thinks otherwise is living in a fantasy land. There will be some bumps, of course, but is that really a discussion? The difference is a big-time player vs. a role player. An NBA starter vs. an accountant. And the interesting fallacy from multiple posters is that you have to have role players. Really. So Rose, Wade, Kobe, Duncan, and Dirk wouldn't wipe the floor with any other five on the face of the planet that includes a "role" player? The point is, you only need a role player if you don't have a stud. Now, a good role player can help maximize the potential of a stud. But the attitude side of it being equal, the value of the stud that would play in the place of the role player is clearly worth more as a combined value with the other stud, than vs. a stud and a role player. What the stud does to possibly detract from the value of the other stud is outweighed by the stud's contribution. Just what I believe to be generally true.

Look what the Heat have done to average NBA teams over the last 8 or so games. But vs. the Celtics .. who have studs of their own, it may be a different story. Studs rule this game. Not glue, not role players, not working the ball around the perimeter. Studs.

But, further, it is actually possible that the stud does everything better than the role player, including intangibles and instinct. Role players haven't cornered the market on intangibles or instinct. It is just all they have when they play 32 minutes and score 3 points, get 4 rebounds, etc. Role players have their value, but only if there isn't a "stud" alternative.

Kye Clark 11 years, 7 months ago

Agreed! Your example of the Miami heat is a great example of what I have been saying. The Heat look unstoppable now, but what about a dozen games ago? They looked like they didn't mesh to start the season, like it was a bad experiment, like there wasn't enough shots to go around for all of their studs. However, it was only a matter of time before talent won out. And my point is this team will also need time to mesh with the infusion of someone obviously more talented than Brady, Tyrel, and probably half a dozen other players on the team. So why delay that process of getting the studs to mesh their talents together by having Selby come off the bench for a game? And right now that's all that's being talked about, coming off the bench for one game. What if it's 2? Or stretches to 3? How many people will be saying "I love hearing AFH rock when Selby comes into the game!"?

To your point about role players...well we have seen USA Dream Teams flame out in the Olympics and other International competition against teams that were obviously less talented, that had less studs and a few role players. However, this could be traced back to possibly not having enough time to mesh as a team. I'm detecting a pattern here...

Hank Cross 11 years, 7 months ago

Agree completely and am also 100% in Selby's corner. This "glue" thing is merely a polite way of saying doesn't stand out in anything. And when people start talking about Rodman and Rambis being role players, they leave out the part that what they did actually showed up in the stat sheet. Further, they were power forwards so that was their job. Until the Brady Bunch came along, I never heard of a guard being a "glue" player.

ajhk 11 years, 7 months ago

All players are role players. If there is a "role" player out on the court that you think sucks, I'll tell you he's out there because he gives the team the best chance to win in the given coach's eye.
Self will ease Selby in for many reasons. Once rolling, Selby will be electrifying.

Jack Wilson 11 years, 7 months ago

But is it best to play the role player over a more talented player, simply because it may give you the best chance to win that particular game? Or is it better to play the player with the bigger upside, possibly sacrificing a game or two in the regular season (in theory) for more potential in March? The Releford vs. Brady debate .. noting of course that we beat UCLA by one point and Brady played 32 minutes and Releford 9. Not saying there is a correlation there. If Brady plays 9 minutes and Releford 32, and we lose, but we work to develop a better player in the 3 spot for March, isn't that the better tact?

ajhk 11 years, 7 months ago

I agree, I too would like to see the player that I think has the most potential be developed for late in the season. The problem is that coach Self should have a better idea than you or I and I for one believe in him enough to default to his opinion. Of course, if you felt strong enough about it, you could always pull a Tonya Harding on poor Morningstar!

hailtoku 11 years, 7 months ago

Anyone else think part of the reason why Self isn't starting Selby is for this:

"Ladies and Gentlemen, checking into the game for Tyshawn Taylor... number 32 Jooooooosssshhh Seeeeelllllbyyyyyy!!!!!!"

Can't wait.

Craig Colgin 11 years, 7 months ago

Ralster, I have previously made some comments to the tune of "Selby has never played D1 ball, and we don't know if he is worth all the hype yet". I admit that, but it's not because I'm not behind him, or that I am against him. However, Brady and Reed have both shown that they can do what they do pretty much night after night. I know their production isn't enough for some, and I'm not necessarily saying it's enough for me either. But, there is a reason why they are out there, in my opinion, and that reason is that they are the best we have right now. In the come weeks I can definitely see that shifting a different direction, but I can also see it not shifting. It all depends on if Selby can ball, and seriously ball, at this level, I don't see why he can't, but I prefer to have him prove he can. Until then, veteran experience is the best way to win games right now. On the same hand, to me, winning games right now isn't as important as march and april, so if that means we put some more athletic, less experienced personal, with higher potential on the court, and lose a few with growing pains, I can live with that. Im just not going to throw Brady and Tyrel under the bus like some of the people on here are doing(not you, you're always respectable with your comments and I value them). And Hey, did you see TT finally getting a little more respect, Im lovin it!!!! RCJH

Craig Colgin 11 years, 7 months ago

See, Highelite is what Im talking about, Havent seen the kid play against anybody but highschool kids thus far, and he is an NBA Starter? Maybe he is, but how on earth do you know that? It's a fact that Selby is better than Reed and Morningstar? It's only heresy because you have absolutely no proof of that at this point. You may get your proof really soon, and I may get mine too, but until then isn't it speculation and not FACT?

When or if Selby proves he is better on the court and not on this board, It will not be heresy to say that he is better. Until then I guess I will continue to live in fantasy land.

Not meant to sound nasty but some tell me I sometimes come across that way, so this is my preemptive apology if that is the case. :) RCJH!!!

Kye Clark 11 years, 7 months ago

Well, we have absolutely no proof that Reed and Morningstar are better than Selby either. And you can make that argument for tons of things really. We have no proof that Lebron James is a better basketball player than Brady Morningstar because we have never seen them competing at the same levels before.

Anything is possible. It's possible that every scouting and recruiting service missed the mark on Selby, that the people who select all of the high school all-star teams like McDonalds all-Americans and the Jordan Brand people totally over-estimated him. Possible, highly improbably.

Jared Grillot 11 years, 7 months ago

As a Brady supporter, I have to agree he may just not be the better player. In fact, he's likely not. He will likely sit. And when I was on campus in '96, Paul Pierce was the better player, in most aspects of the game, and was awesome to watch as he flew above the rim, but we loved Jerod Haase. Should game/coaching choices be based on the player who will help the team the most? Absolutely. But for fans, and players we "love", it's not always about the stat line. Should Brady get lots of minutes? Eh, maybe, maybe not, but for those fans that have a special place in their heart for him, his # of minutes won't change that. There, at least for some, is the difference - love of a particular player for whatever reason is not dictated by love of their stat production. Otherwise, who in the world would remember T.J. Whatley? But we do. I can't wait to see Selby play, and it is likely to be awesome, but just can't help liking Brady.

Hank Cross 11 years, 7 months ago

I can respect this opinion b/c it recognizes the objective reality that is being played out. Other Brady fans will continue to argue that he deserves all of these minutes.

KULA 11 years, 7 months ago

jaybate--Wow, you must have a lot of free time on your hands to spend so much of it thinking and writing about me. Either that, or you must be REALLY high! Get back to me if you ever want to debate basketball opinions I post--if you think you can, lol.

But thanks for the posts, anyway. I got a good laugh out of 'em. I don't know what's funnier--your lame attempts to rap, or the mental picture of an old man lamely attempting to rap. Either way, quite a hoot! And btw, contrary to your misguided assumption, I don't get any particular feeling of superiority simply because I live in LA. I get it from representing KU while I live in LA. I'm only here for the work I do.

ajhk 11 years, 7 months ago

It seems to me that coach is trying really hard to keep the lid on Selby in order to maintain team chemistry. I wonder, is he that good, if given the ball, and the starting job, that opposing teams will choose to send a representative to hang little white hankies on the fieldhouse rims as a gesture of respect and forfeiture? For scheduled away games the opposition will saw off their rims, pack them neatly in crimson and blue wrapping before sending them to Bill's house as a similar gesture? I think so. It would be a shame if Selby's greatness eclipses that of our program's entire history and sucks the life blood out of all that is to come. Everyone will know that the one great game and the one great player was, and will never be again. Why saunter into the gym at 5am to shoot a few thousand shots when his one will exponentially eclipse your lifetime's work by such a degree that if you're lucky it'll be less than noticeable. More likely your futile efforts will be like sending all that the game has suddenly accomplished in the Selby Era, back, a hundred years! Why even try! In fear of this very possible, high-level threat, I suggest that we make "Imprison Selby!" T-shirts.
Keep him locked up and help opposing centers from having his nuts dangled on their foreheads! His thunderous jams have been known to cause involuntary fetal abortions within a nine-block radius! Only God should be this great! Just not right for the Bible Belt! Better keep him on the island of Libby Lawrence or the God fear'n will have his gizzard! Wow. After thinking it through myself, I have to say once again, Bill you are correct! Better keep a lid on that! While I keep my lid off this!

ajhk 11 years, 7 months ago

I thought it was over-the-top enough to be "can't miss" sarcasm. No worries. I'm exited about Selby but just having fun with the absolute circus we've created. He's a great player but I hope people give him time to ease in. I think Bill is doing well with this. I'd hate to hear X. Henry comparisons if he doesn't come out and dominate right away. I'm not saying Henry was bad either, just that most posters didn't pay him much respect.

Craig Colgin 11 years, 7 months ago

Competition makes everybody better, in my opinion. It's a good problem to have. Has anyone thought of the possibility that everybody loses some minutes if Selby pans out? This is possible to me, only because we could go with a small speedy lineup from time to time, which might suggest that MC Morris wouldn't lose any minutes, but the other bigs might. Foood for thought. RCJH!!!

Jack Wilson 11 years, 7 months ago

Cragarhawk: I respect the fact that 1) you won't commit to who is better because you don't feel you have enough information, and 2) pointing out the overly definitive nature of my statement. I just feel I have enough information. Is there a 1 - 2% chance that Selby absolutely flames out? Sure. But I'll go with the 98+% chance. I will be interested in your opinion after watching the game Saturday.

The real issue (with all due respect to cragarhawk), is not if Selby is better; but rather, is Selby better for this team? Whether he meshes, whether he's selfish, whether he's a ball-hog, whether he actually plays defense, whether it's about KU or about Josh Selby, etc. What type of dynamic does Selby's insertion into this team create? That is the real issue.

Alohahawk 11 years, 7 months ago

It's not surprising that our fans are anxiously anticipating Selby's first game, and debating (arguing?) over whether he should start in his debut. It's always interesting to compare the number of comments on this board for each topic/article. Recently, this article generated almost one and a half times as many as the second place article. (150 to 95) Kudos to those Jayhawk fans who are so passionate about the team's success. We all deserve a huge pat on our backs.

IMHO Selby will be a starter, not against USC, but perhaps in his second game if the hype that surrounds him proves true. However, all the start/come off the bench debating seems to overlook the fact that we have gone undefeated over nine games, and are ranked third in the polls (Dickie V, eat your heart out). That ranking, itself debatable due to our lackluster schedule, is still something which the current starters have achieved. Nationally, they are ranked near or at the top of numerous statistical categories. Selby has constantly spoken out that he wants that success to continue. In old terminology, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." So, HCBS feels the current starters deserve the respect they have achieved and earned. Put yourself in their shoes. Wouldn't you feel a little bit unappreciated if you had performed admirably but were demoted at work, simply because a new hire came in with great, but unproven, credentials.

The debate is whether we install a Shelby engine into a fine tuned Vette which is competing on an even keel with the frontrunners. (I know, I know. The Shelby engine would be incompatible with the Vette.) In every race, you have to make a pitstop: for gas, new tires, or something else if disaster happens. We held our breaths when Mc Morris went done against the Rams. His flat tire was repaired and the team hardly missed a beat. We won the race. Now, we just acquired a brand new set of Michelins (Maybe you prefer Goodyear. Add your own favorite brand.)

Sure, it's a great honor to start for the Jayhawks. But in Selby's case, it's not about expected abilities. It's about proof in the pudding. Do you think for one moment that Selby wouldn't start if we had a losing record, or needed serious problems corrected? (Yah, I know. Our freethrows are abysmal. But that's a team problem, not something one player can correct by himself.)

For those who feel otherwise, I like kirkhinrichflow's comment from above: Let the PA announcer instill the fear of the Phog into USC's team when Josh Selby is announced as entering the game.

Robert Murphy 11 years, 7 months ago

Let's get one fact straight if we can. Selby was not the #1 rated player our of high school but the #1 rated point guard. There is a difference. It is also not generally known but his older brother is Chris Rock.

Craig Colgin 11 years, 7 months ago

HEM, I hope my opinion after saturday is "Put that kid out there and let him do what he does" , I really do, because while Im trying not to speculate just yet on who is better, and better for the team, I also have the opinion that this team is not a NC contender they way it is now. Sorry, I just don't think it is. I might get beat up for this, but that just my opinion. I have never disagreed with the fact that there isn't enough production from TReed and Bstar, as far as being NC caliber. Personally right now, I don't think we're number 3 in the nation either, but Im behind this team all the way no matter who is playing, and I really love to watch them play. I feel like they would rival the 08 team for chemistry, or better.

What about the guy that said "we don't know if Lebron is better that Bstar or Treed"? Im gonna go ahead and say that we can point out that it's a fact the Lebron is better. Whose with me? :)

Damn I love being a Jayhawk!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Robert Murphy 11 years, 7 months ago

The starting five will be the M@Ms, Johnson, Taylor and Selby. First off the bench Robinson then Reed, Releford and Morningstar. That is your eight man rotation. This is a team designed for speed and will also be good in a half court game.

Craig Colgin 11 years, 7 months ago

I totally agree with you Ralster, hopefully as the year goes on the conglomeration of players we have will get closer to their "ceiling" , then we will be legitimate title contenders in my opinion. I somewhat wish they would throw away early season rankings just because its so inconsistent and teams fall out and new ones in constantly as we find out what everybody is really made of. I pay more attention to CollegeRPI and Kenpom just for that very reason. ROCK CHALK!!!

Robert Murphy 11 years, 7 months ago

Remember ralstar, there are three kinds of people in the world those that can count and those who can't. Make that a nine man rotation.

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