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Realignment Today: What the Maryland/Rutgers to the Big Ten news means for the Big 12 and the rest of college athletics — if anything

Remember when things happened in college athletics without the rest of the world following them up with panic, hysteria and unnecessary — sometimes even awful — reactions?

OK, me neither, but if you stretch your brain really far, you might be able to remember a time when a school or conference anywhere in the country could make a move of any kind and that would be that.

Unfortunately that’s not the case any longer. As soon as the news broke that Maryland and Rutgers were involved in serious talks with the Big Ten, fans and officials in conferences throughout the country stood up and screamed, “We’re next!”

But, why?

Just because the Terps and Scarlet Knights are willing to leave what could (and perhaps should) be considered dying conferences does not mean that the rest of the country should jump back in and cause a third round of reckless realignment in three years.

It sure sounded to me like all of this mess was behind us when the Big 12 steadfastly proved it was happy at 10 teams — even as others laughed and rolled their eyes insisting that just couldn’t be the case. If that wasn’t enough, it seemed like the nail in the coffin when the ACC bumped its buyout to a whopping $50 million.

Oops. I guess that wasn’t high enough — somehow.

It’s been known for quite some time that Maryland was one of those schools the Big Ten would consider grabbing should it choose to expand. I can remember hearing talk about the Terps to the Ten during the initial round of realignment three summers ago, when Colorado and Nebraska bolted the Big 12. So the move itself, when taken only as a single move in a vacuum immune from the impact of past, present and future moves around it, actually makes some sense.

But it’s a crying shame that officials within the Big Ten and at Maryland chose now as the time to make this move. It does nothing but confirm the hard truth we already know — that money is king in all walks of life, but most certainly in college athletics.

Some reports have indicated that the Big Ten has been dying to reopen its expansion eyes ever since Notre Dame moved its non-football sports to the ACC several months back. Go figure; jealousy and envy played a role here, too.

Can someone, or perhaps some people, please just get it over with and buy out the NCAA and turn it into what it is sadly becoming anyway — a training ground professional sports league driven by dollars?

For goodness sake, it sounds as if Maryland may get out of the $50 million early exit penalty by, first, negotiating it down and, second, having the Big Ten pick up the bulk of the tab. A tip of the cap goes to the Terps for some savvy business moves there, but a slap on the wrist should head the way of the Big Ten, ACC and NCAA for letting that happen if it does, in fact, go down that way.

I know most out there think these moves are the spark that will start another conference realignment wildfire, but I’m not one of them.

For starters, I don’t think this changes anything for the Big 12 Conference. The conference was happy with 10 members before and it will be happy with 10 members after, too.

I know there is some strong interest in adding Florida State if the opportunity presents itself, but, (1) I don’t see the Big 12 footing the bill for the buyout the way the Big Ten may with Maryland, and (2) the league has said all along that any expansion moves would have to be made up of a couple of knock-your-socks-off schools. Florida State certainly is in that category but I don’t think there’s a 12th team out there on that level — not BYU, not Boise State, not Louisville. Who?

The best guess here, particularly because this Maryland/Rutgers thing moved so quickly, is that this will be a big splash for a few days and then the realignment waters will be still again.

The ACC will move on, perhaps by poaching a team like UConn (a willing mover) from the Big East, forcing the Big East to take yet another step toward becoming an all-basketball league, with its football schools playing independent schedules. That’s the only way for that conference to maintain relevance in the changing landscape of college athletics. And who knows if even that will do it?

I’ve already talked to a couple of people about this latest mess and I’ve got a few more calls out there, so if anything interesting or noteworthy pops up regarding the Big 12, you know where to find it.

Until then, we’re back to our old tried and true catch phrase:  Stay tuned...

Here are a few links to peruse for those who might be interested in reading more about what’s going on:

Here are some of the specifics on the Maryland/Rutgers news:
http://espn.go.com/new-york/story/_/id/8651934/maryland-terrapins-accept-invitation-join-big-ten-sources-say

Here’s a blog that includes a take on the Big 12:
http://outkickthecoverage.com/reports-maryland-and-rutgers-to-the-big-ten.php

And here’s a good read about the ramifications and money ruling everything:
http://www.sbnation.com/college-football/2012/11/19/3664686/maryland-rutgers-big-ten-expansion-conference-realignment

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Comments

Ben Kane 1 year, 11 months ago

Matt,

thanks for your ongoing coverage of this!

do you see any action being taken by the likes of virgnia tech and miami in addition to possibly fsu?

ku1otaku 1 year, 11 months ago

What about Clemson? I thought they were interested when the whole FSU thing first came up.

Ben Kane 1 year, 11 months ago

i have no interest in seeing clemson in the big12

ku1otaku 1 year, 11 months ago

Why not? They are a better option than Miami.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

This has to be a move to bring in more revenue to the Big 10 network. I know a lot of KU people has had a long term dream of KU ending up eventually in the Big 10, this would effective shut the door on this ever happening. I think the new Big 12 contract pretty much made this an unrealistic possibility.

It seems like a 14 team league results in scheduling problems. For example, in the SEC, Missouri will only get to host teams in their opposite division (besides permanent rival), once every 12 years.

I don't think this will break up the ACC unless the SEC decides to make a move. So far, the demise of conferences has been predicted and it hasn't happened, unless you are talking about the WAC. The Big East looks the most vulnerable especially if UConn leaves.

Kyle Sybesma 1 year, 11 months ago

The Big 12 contract means nothing. The ACC signed a new contract and raised the exit fee to $50 million and it didn't stop Maryland.

Ron Prichard 1 year, 11 months ago

I think it is a different approach. The Big XII contract may scare off other leagues if they believe the Big XII MAY retain the TV revenue rights to a school if they leave the Big XII. Why would someone want KU if they couldn't generate any TV revenue for their new league for seven years? Not that it is iron clad, but the possibility might be enough to deter another conference. Also, with the Big XII contracts worth more than the current Big 10 contracts, why would any of the schools want to leave right now? Maybe that is part of what HouTex was referring to.

Finally, even if KU had wanted to go to the Big 10, now that they will have 14 teams, that possibility is pretty much out the window for the forseeable future.

Kyle Sybesma 1 year, 11 months ago

The Big 10 has gone from 11 schools to 14 schools and the Big 12 from 12 to 10. Where is your logic? The Big 10 has its own network and their future contract will blow out the Big 12's. The Big 10 also has better academics. They also don't have one school calling all the shots like Texas in the Big 12.

Clarence Haynes 1 year, 11 months ago

do not think that big ten country is dying

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

You are obviously not talking to enough people. I bet if we took a poll and asked people which conference they would prefer KU to be in with the choices being the Pac-12, Big 10, SEC, or stay in Big 12 that the Big 10 would win easily.

Dale Stringer 1 year, 11 months ago

I say stay B-12. But if I had to pick another conference, then that would be the Big 10. I don't like the SEC football superiority complexthat every fan has to have. The PAC 12's negative is that most of the schools are 1 time zone too far away.

rawheadrex 1 year, 11 months ago

KU is already in the Big XII minus four plus two So-So 10.

Sam Constance 1 year, 11 months ago

IF you are correct--and I'm skeptical--those people would be stupid.

The ideal place for KU is the Big 12, because we should be playing in our geographical footprint against other teams within our footprint.

The entire "realignment" garbage is a money grab that primarily benefits power brokers in the conference administration--not fans, not players, not coaches, not students, not ANYONE except the proverbial "1%" of college athletics.

The sooner the fans realize that this sh-t is all taking place AT THEIR EXPENSE, and not to their benefit, the better off we will all be.

Michael Pannacciulli 1 year, 11 months ago

Sure. No one would dare want to be in a league with Michigan or Ohio State...crazy talk man. You should have tuned into 60 minutes last night.

Maximus140 1 year, 11 months ago

The Big 10 would never allow KU to join because you have to have a varsity Wrestling program, which Kansas does not.

Stephan123 1 year, 11 months ago

Florida State must be reviewing their options in light of the ACC's declining football prospects/status.

Ron Prichard 1 year, 11 months ago

That's exactly what I was thinking. It might be a few months, but I think we'll see major movement again in the near future. I'm sorry, but the TV contracts for the ACC just can't be that lucrative, especially when schools are jumping ship. I don't recall the exact deal for the ACC, but the Big XII, SEC and Big 10 contracts have to provide their schools with much more annual revenue.

Michael Pannacciulli 1 year, 11 months ago

They would be a dream fit for the SEC. I would be a happy camper if they were in th B12

Dirk Medema 1 year, 11 months ago

Florida, Georgia, and USC don't want the other state school (FSU, GT, Clemson). That sort of makes them all the perfect fit for the Big12. Just adds to the backdrop of the Champions Bowl.

LVCHawk 1 year, 11 months ago

I think that now that a charter member has left the ACC, that the league will begin to implode. What that means to the Big 12, I dont know, but it has to move this time.

"Florida State certainly is in that category but I don’t think there’s a 12th team out there on that level — not BYU, not Boise State, not Louisville. Who?"

I know this isn't about basketball, but Louisville is good in football, while being very good at basketball. Overall they strengthen the conference in both sports.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

If you can get Florida State, you can probably make a play for Georgia Tech or Clemson. It is hard to believe that Maryland leaving will lead to the downfall of the ACC. Virginia, Virginia Tech, UNC, NC-State, Florida, Clemson, and Georgia Tech are all state universities in growing populated states and as such form a strong foundation for the conference.

Tony Bushard 1 year, 11 months ago

The Big 12 may be happy with ten teams, but I can't imagine they'll sit around much longer without a marquee conference championship football game. Thanks for the reporting Matt.

Kyle Sybesma 1 year, 11 months ago

You're right but there is only one legitimate school out there and that's Louisville. Memphis, SMU, Houston, Air Force and others of that caliber make us the Big East. If we're not capable of poaching a Big 10, PAC 12, SEC or ACC school then that means we will get poached. Get on the phone Zenger and don't allow us to be dragged down by creating a package deal with KSU.

Ron Prichard 1 year, 11 months ago

I totally disagree with your point of view, here. KU won't be leaving the Big XII. Further, I don't think the Big XII is going to be in any trouble right now. I do agree with BHerrman that the Big XII needs to get back t 12 teams. I do think the Big XII is fully capable of poaching two teams from the ACC if they want them. Based on what has just happened, I think FSU and Clemson would both be willing to move to the Big XII if invited. I think the ACC would then devour the rest of the quality/semi-quality teams from the Big East and we will be set for another few years. I don't believe the Big XII will go to any more than 12 teams.

wtfusa 1 year, 11 months ago

Unfortunately it isn't up to Zenger as much as it is up to the Kansas Board of Regents who would the KSU deadweight to our ankles.

coloradojayhawk 1 year, 11 months ago

KSU was a couple of games away from the football national championship game. I realize without Snyder they may wind up playing second fiddle to KU again, but that's not a certainty and that's not something for KU to bank on. Personally, I think KU should stick by its little brother.

jhawkrulz 1 year, 11 months ago

And when they lost, no one notices except for KState fans.

The TV companies were looking at their contracts to see if there was an out, because they knew that KState wouldn't draw the needed revenue.

Sam Constance 1 year, 11 months ago

I love to pick on our little brother from across the state as much as the next guy, but saying they wouldn't draw revenue is completely incorrect.

I guarantee that TV ratings would be higher for KSU vs. Team X than they would be for the SEC v. SEC showdown like we had last year.

I think you'd get a fair chunk of Big 12 school fans watching, as well as the fact that your casual no-skin-in-the-game fan would be more intrigued by a game between teams from different conferences than teams from the same conference.

Plus, that ignores the fact that the television ratings for any individual year doesn't have a direct impact on the revenue for the televising of a specific game. I don't believe they re-negotiate the deal based on who is in the title game, and the negotiating power of televising the National Championship comes primarily from the fact that it's the National Championship, not from the names of the teams involved.

Stan Unruh 1 year, 11 months ago

Agreed.. The Big 12 really needs conference championship football game and I believe that a move to at least 12 teams is going to happen soon. Florida State and Clemson are the top prospects. Thanks Matt for great coverage !

Kyle Sybesma 1 year, 11 months ago

If it works to get FSU and Clemson (which the Maryland buyout will say alot about if that's possible) then the Big 12 should go after Georgia Tech and Virginia Tech and maybe just be the leader to 16 teams and get Boston College and North Carolina. (NC State & Virginia to SEC, Duke to Big 10)

This could be an East Coast 8 team conference of West Virginia, Clemson, FSU, Georgia Tech, Virginia Tech, Boston College, UNC, Iowa State

Midwest 8 team conference of KU, KSU, OU, OSU, Texas, Texas Tech, Baylor, TCU.

Wishfull thinking but I don't hold hope for the Big 12.

Kyle Sybesma 1 year, 11 months ago

I agree with Matt that the waters will settle but eventually the end result of all this realignment is to create four 16-team power conferences. We already have a 4 team playoff set for 2014 and an 8 team playoff could easily be expanded by having four conference championship games.

The ACC, Big 10, SEC and PAC 12 have solidified their confereces better than the Big 12. The Texas Longhorn Network will be the downfall of the Big 12. I have to believe that Zenger, the quite business guy he is, has been on the phone solidifying KU's spot somwhere WHEN the Big 12 falls apart.

Vernon Riggs 1 year, 11 months ago

The ACC will be the loser. B1G, SEC, PAC12 and the Big12 will come out as winners. You don't leave the Big12 with $22-28million per team TV payout to join the ACC at $12 million and your basketball Tier III money. ACC Football schools (Clemson, GA Tech, VA Tech, FSU, NCState) in the ACC are looking at their options right now. Will the SEC grow to 16? Will the Big12 take us now? NC and Duke are calling the B1G to see if they want 16 too.

Ron Prichard 1 year, 11 months ago

I think you are right on here. The ACC is the league in trouble. When they signed their new deal and it was so much less than the Big XII's new deal the writing had to be on the wall. FSU could make a fortune in the Big XII keeping it's Tier 3 money.

Duke should really be worried. They have a great basketball school, but their football is in even worse shape than KU. Academics may ultimately be their saviour.

I have to think the Big 10 is going to stop at 14 for now. Once you get to 14 teams, there's not that much more money in the pot to divide between two more teams. As some point, the law of diminishing returns starts kicking in.

Kyle Sybesma 1 year, 11 months ago

The ACC contract is more backloaded than FSU and Clemson first realized but if Maryland can negotiate a low buy out then it is a small possibility that they start discussions with the Big 12.

And according to the article above the SEC is interested in NC State and Virginia. I don't understand that one. I'm assuming more TV's. Someone help me out.

I have my doubts about the future of the Big 12 but if FSU and Clemson are on board I'm on board. I don't like the expansion suggestions of SMU, Houston, Air Force or Memphis. Those are desperate moves like the Big East has been making.

Ron Prichard 1 year, 11 months ago

I think the Big XII made a really bold statement by staying at 10 teams last year and not just grabbing up some lesser schools. If Expansion 3.0 really does kick in, I think they will be in good shape to take FSU and Clemson. I think the Big XII may have played everyone (see my post below) and may come through this in better shape than just about anyone.

Dirk Medema 1 year, 11 months ago

If the SEC takes NCSU & UVA, that would set up perfectly for the Big12 to take FSU (FU), Clemson (USC), UNC (NCSU), VT (UVA), GT (UGA), L-ville (UK).

Ying to the Yang

Dirk Medema 1 year, 11 months ago

Duke is bowl eligible.

I think you are recalling Duke from afew years ago, just before KU played them and David Cutcliffe began rebuilding the program.

Vernon Riggs 1 year, 11 months ago

Why stop at 12? If the ACC implodes where does FSU AND Clemson AND GA Tec, Pitt, VA Tech, NC State go? The ACC will never win another NCAA football championship. FSU, an one-loss team is behind all of the one-loss SEC teams and even one two-loss SEC team. If the ACC reaches out to UConn to replace Maryland, it will be a clear statement that Football is second to Basketball in the ACC.

ljmhawk 1 year, 11 months ago

i'm all in for louisville and florida state, both are good in basketball and football. plus adding fsu is a good tv market. i could easily see louisville being our rival in basketball

wtfusa 1 year, 11 months ago

Any word on whether KU will still be playing Rutgers in non-conference football?

Ron Prichard 1 year, 11 months ago

We're kind of more interested in our theories on how this will/may/could/won't/will possibly effect KU when/if/never they move to a new conference or how this might/absolutely will/not impact the Big XII when they expand/don't expand/saber rattle/pick their nose/pick the ACC's nose. Why would you want to know something so rational when we are all (I am most definitely included in this category) throwing out our pie in the sky theories on what could/will/won't happen? :-)

jhox 1 year, 11 months ago

I just heard from a friend who has a pretty reliable Big 10 source that Texas has contacted the Big 10 with an interest. I don't know how they can get out of the contract they signed with the Big 12 recently, which seems to be incredibly punitive toward any school that wants to leave, but given that it is Texas, I shouldn't be surprised to find out they're trying.

Kevin Huffman 1 year, 11 months ago

All the more reason for the Big XII to express interest in Louisville or others.

Ron Prichard 1 year, 11 months ago

And give up their Longhorn Network? I don't think so. I don't see Texas being interested in the Big 10 at all. Texas just earned $20+ million for their share of the Big XII's new contracts and they keep $15+ million a year from the Longhorn Network. They can't get anywhere near that much in the Big 10.

JhawkalumJB 1 year, 11 months ago

If Texas wanted to make it happen they could easily make it happen financially. Two reasons it won't happen are 1) the Longhorn Network, The BIG10 would never allow it in their conference, and 2) Texas doesn't make geographic sense to the BIG10, they prefer to include schools with neighboring states to existing members. Maryland and Rutgers both fit into this criteria (Pennsylvania).

Kyle Sybesma 1 year, 11 months ago

Agreed. I don't think the Big 10 wants to deal with Texas BS. If they did they'd have Notre Dame.

Dirk Medema 1 year, 11 months ago

Wouldn't that just really piss off the Huskers!?!

jhox 1 year, 11 months ago

My understanding is that the Big 10's next contract may equate to $50 million per year per school, so it is potentially more lucrative than what Texas has even with the LHN.

I obviously can't vouch for this rumor, but what I do know is that my acquaintance most definitely has solid connections within the Big 10 offices, so I feel pretty confident that there's probably some validity to the rumor. What I don't feel confident is how likely it is Texas is really serious about doing something like this. I think Texas just wants to make headlines and feel important.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

That seems very high because no one is even saying the SEC contract will come close to that number. The SEC may bring in close to $30M per school on the high end. I read where the Big 10 network distributes $100M per year which is about $8M per school. I think that is roughly equivalent to what KU brings in for its 3rd tier rights which is negotiates separately. Currently the difference between what KU will pull in and what Nebraska will get by moving to the Big 10 is not a huge difference. And for the next 2 years, without taking into account exit fees, Missouri will probably bring in less money in the SEC than had it stayed in the Big 12.

jhox 1 year, 11 months ago

Pepper_bar, you're not hurting my feelings a bit saying that because I'm not sure I believe all of this myself. I'm just the messenger, nothing more. I've never stated any of this as fact, and I won't.

As I said, the only thing I know for absolute certain is that my friend has a well connected source within the Big 10. During all of the past reallignment "episodes" concerning the Big 10 (and even some not concerning the Big 10) he's been right on target with information in advance of the press releases. You can believe what you want to believe.

Personally, I doubt Texas can afford to leave the conference unless they've not signed off on the new TV contract. I also wouldn't put it past them to at least investigate something like this if there is a contract potentially that lucrative.

jhox 1 year, 11 months ago

My reply to pepper_bar doesn't show up unless you click on it but I essentially indicated I'm not sure whether to believe it or not myself, so don't shoot the messenger. However I do find it interesting that Maryland is now confirmed by both the school and the big 10. Why not the same news from Rutgers? Is there perhaps really another behind the scene player in this? We will probably only know for sure if another school is confirmed other than Rutgers. If Texas is interested would it not be hush-hush?

My friend's source has been on the money more than I care to admit. Nobody hopes this is wrong more than me.

Kevin Huffman 1 year, 11 months ago

I'm fine w/ Louisville & Florida State....I think they used to be in the same Conference (the Metro?) before Louisville was in varying other conferences & before FSU was added to the ACC. I think VCU used to be in that conference. Both schools are good in more than football, but both ARE, in fact, good in football as well as cotinue the eastward expansion already begun with WVU. Brings a nat'l rival back for WVU and there's some OU connections in FSU I believe - or at least there was.

Would seem to lend itself back to North & South again (North = Iowa State, WVU, KU, K-State, Louisville & I bet they would send TCU northward over TTech or OSU) & (South = OU, OSU, TTech, UT, Baylor & FSU)

ozhawk4 1 year, 11 months ago

Alright, so here's my question. If the SEC finally goes after Virginia tech and NC State to get to 16 forcing the Big Ten to grab two more, what are the possibilities of an ACC/Big XII Merger where the two divisions are ACC Division and Big XII division of some sorts. It could be interesting, but I'm not sure if that would work or not. I'm just curious to hear your opinions.

average 1 year, 11 months ago

On the long-long-term picture, that's the eventual default "what will happen if nothing else happens" when there are 6-8 smaller-majors left in the ACC sphere and a 6-8 left of the Big XII. It's what's left if the SEC, Big Ten, and Pac all go to 14 or 16. KU/KSU/ISU/Baylor/TTU/OSU?/TCU? as the "Ag College Conference" ACC West, NC/NCS/Duke/Wake/VT/Cuse/Pitt/etc as the ACC East. Two geographically separate conferences with a scheduling agreement. Obviously a fourth-runner to the big three in football, but a solid step above the rump Big East and Mountain West.

JhawkalumJB 1 year, 11 months ago

Thanks for the update Tait.

I see and understand the appeal of Florida State, but I don't see the lack of appeal for Louisville... As stated in earlier comments they are a well known player in b-ball and consistently compete in football (yea I know in the Big Least, but still).. Are they terrible in academics? What's not to like about Louisville? Small TV market? What is it? Honestly, I thought they made more geographic sense than West Virginia did.. help me out here..

Ron Prichard 1 year, 11 months ago

For whatever reason, I don't think they bring in the TV dollars like some of the other schools. I'm guessing a smaller market.

Foster Coburn 1 year, 11 months ago

Yes, they are terrible in academics. Plus they don't offer enough eyeballs for television contracts.

ltownatrain 1 year, 11 months ago

It has everything to do with market. They are in the same boat as K-state in that while they have a very passionate fan base they play second fiddle to their "Big Brother" that is University of Kentucky. Most people who live in Kentucky are UK fans with the UL fan base residing around Louisville.

jgkojak 1 year, 11 months ago

Problem with Louisville is academics-

I am guessing once MD gets out of its $50 million payment, FSU and Clemson will take that opportunity-- I'd also go after Ga Tech (Atlanta). That way you could go after Louisville.

I could see an East/new B12 members division: FSU, GT, Clem, WVU, Louisville, TCU, Baylor

ISU, KU, KSU, OU, OSU, Texas, TTU

That's about even as far as football and basketball.

Ron Prichard 1 year, 11 months ago

In response to ozhawk above, the ACC doesn't make enough financially to make that attractive to the Big XII, so I don't see that happening. More than likely, if the SEC goes to 16, the Big XII goes after FSU and Clemson to get back to 12. I also don't see the Big XII having any interest in Louisville as they had their opportunity but already passed them over.

This brings me to another thought...If the SEC takes two more ACC teams and the Big XII takes FSU and Clemson, the remaining schools will scramble to join a major conference. UNC could head to the Big 10 with Virginia. With the ACC out of the picture and the Big Least becoming more and more irrelevant, there would only be four major conferences. The Big XII could comfortably sit at 12 teams and keep a larger share of their respective TV revenues than the schools in the SEC and any other 16 school mega-conference. With UT, OU, WVU, OSU, FSU, TCU, and Clemson as major football powers, the Big XII would still command major TV dollars, likely on par with any other conference. Plus, with only four major conferences remaining, there wouldn't be the possibility of schools being picked off or having any league instability. The Big XII may just come through this entire thing looking like the smartest kid on the block: Mega-money and less teams to share it with and less teams to compete against to get to the NC game.

Kyle Sybesma 1 year, 11 months ago

I wish I could share your optimism. I would love to see this scenario play out. All of it depends on the final buy out Maryland pays.

coloradojayhawk 1 year, 11 months ago

I thought KU was going to be a football power in another year or two after Weis' recruits got to be upperclassmen.

wildjayhawk 1 year, 11 months ago

Ku will stay when they are, they don't want any part of the big 10.

JhawkalumJB 1 year, 11 months ago

If the B1G had offered a spot to us at anytime in the past, you better believe we would've jumped all over it. They didn't want us, it was never us not wanting to join them.

ltownatrain 1 year, 11 months ago

Actually, the Big 10 explored adding KU and Missouri back in 1994 before the Big 8 merged with the Southwest conference to form the Big 12.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

They actually looked at NU, MU and KU. I have never been able to figure out whether this was exploratory of whether there was an actual offer that was turned down by the three schools.

ltownatrain 1 year, 11 months ago

From what I remember what stopped the Big 10 from doing it was the fact that the Big 12 officially came into existence in 1994 and thus all three schools basically gave the thanks but no thanks before an offer ever came as they were happy with the new merger. This and Penn State decided to give up independence so the Big 10 decided they were content with just Penn State.

Travis Clementsmith 1 year, 11 months ago

Matt, just from what I have read:

The B1G isn't footing the possible penalty bill, Rumor is that the president of Under Armor, a Maryland grad, has put an account into escrow to help with the legal fees. Its worth it to him to market his brand in the B1G.

The timing, I believe, is to strengthen its legal challenge. The ACC changed its exit fee within a negotiated school year, which usually, entities are not allowed to, and since Maryland was one of the two universities that voted against this change (with FSU), announcing their intentions within that same academic year strengthen their argument to have the exit penalty reduced, probably the 20 million figure originally agreed on.

FSU is a one loss team whose strength of conference has dragged it down to #10 in the BCS. They cannot be happy about this, and so they are probably watching the Maryland challenge to the 50 million exit fee. Legally, an exit fee cannot be punitive, it can only be mitigative, and the ACC is going to have a difficult time proving it isn't a punitive measure. That is what is sparking the FSU interest.

Finally, the SEC wants their own network, and they want to get into the VA-NC markets. Any time someone leaves, it creates unrest and uncertainty, and I wouldn't be surprised, at least unofficially, to see the SEC try to prod some fruit from the ACC tree.

clevelandjayhawker 1 year, 11 months ago

I kinda hope in ten years there are 4 super conferences and that the conferences are broken up and teams are placed by geographic location/rivals. Would be great to bring back the old border war rivalry

Ethan Berger 1 year, 11 months ago

I like the 10 team conference. We play everyone, so you know it's what conferences were intended to be.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

In theory I like it too. Unfortunately, for KU, it hurts in football because the conference is so competitive and KU is so bad.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

I am not sure why many think the loss of Maryland will lead to the break up of the ACC. The loss of Maryland is akin the Big 12 losing Missouri. Maryland has a stronger basketball tradition, but has largely been irrelevent for ten years. With Syracuse and Pitt joining next year, the Maryland is at best a mid-pack ACC basketball school. In football, when has Maryland ever been relevent? It is a blow, but the departure of Maryland will not cause irrepairable damage. If the SEC decides to poach a North Carolina and Virginia school, the league will still have 11 members (easily moved to 12 by adding UConn) plus the arrangement with Notre Dame. The conference may be a bit weaker, but really not critical.

This is not about improving performance on the field. This is about expanding the Big 10 network and both Rutgers and Maryland and located in large populations centers not served by the Big 10.

It is hard to see where any of this affects the Big 12. No need to grab Louisville, but if FSU is back in play along with Ga Tech or Clemson, then expansion can be justified.

rrwisecup 1 year, 11 months ago

I always thought we would go to twelve teams anyway , heck were the big twelve not ten, I thought Louisville would be good and may be Cincy, but what if we could steal Arkansas? Louisville and Arkansas to the big twelve would be perfect, then we could be the Big Twelve again

Chris Shaw 1 year, 11 months ago

Arkansas will never come to the Big 12! They want nothing to do with Texas!

Chris Shaw 1 year, 11 months ago

It does have to do with the SEC because No school from the Big 10 or SEC is going to leave it's conference. And...Arkansas' ties have everything to do with Texas because it dates back to the bad relationship that they both had in the old Southwest Conference.

ku11 1 year, 11 months ago

i totally agree with you on Louisville and Cincy. I've thought they would be perfect for getting us back to 12 teams. Plus it makes sense geographically. I hate these conferences with teams spread out across the country. But geography does not matter anymore I guess. I don't know, maybe I'm just old school.

Kyle Sybesma 1 year, 11 months ago

Expanding for the sake of expanding does nothing for the conference but weaken it. If the Big 12 is going to have a serious shot at surviving it has to poach teams from the ACC otherwise were just the next sitting duck.

Chris Shaw 1 year, 11 months ago

Matt, love the updates, but when Florida State is right there wanting to leave, you have to jump on that opportunity. You are right, Florida State is a grand slam if you get them to come to the Big 12. Outside of Notre Dame, Florida State is the only school that increases and makes money for the conference in the long-run and also expands the Big 12 footprint.

Come on Big 12! Don't sit on your hands! Go get Florida State!!!!!!! You know what, where is David Booth? Let's get him on a private jet, do a documentary, and show the world how he saved the Big 12 conference and the University of Conference! LOL! Go get Florida State!

mahkmood 1 year, 11 months ago

I agree, when the B12 talks about not expanding because there aren't any "available" teams, it means the B12 is #5 behind B1G/SEC/P10/ACC. I think everyone knows what is happening, and the B12 better make a move now, or consider itself vulture food. If KU could jump to the PAC-12 that seems to be our best option, but I don't see much reason for the PAC-12 caring about KU because our football program is awful (thanks again Lew Perkins!). If KU doesn't find another home soon I'm thinking that we're going to get shafted by UT and OU who WILL eventually jump ship when they've eaten up the profits and see that the B12 ship is no longer good enough food for them. I can see OU going to the SEC, and UT to the B1G, or both to the ACC, or some combination thereof. People can pretend that this thing isn't real, but it is... either the ACC or the B12 is going down because they are the ones being poached. The B12 must expand now, or it will die a slow death. The ACC knows the same thing. The ACC is going to poach B12 teams, or die in their "academic superiority", and I don't care what people say about the fees, rights, etc. That isn't stopping Maryland, and it won't stop T Boone, or others. "Competitive market forces" (greed) is driving this thing, not tradition, not logic, not concern for schools. Eat or be eaten B12! KU, Zenger, do everything possible to get into the PAC-12 or ACC ASAP if the B12 doesn't start poaching the ACC, because OU and UT are in no hurry because they can move pretty easily at 5 minutes to midnight, and KU cannot. The Big East is virtually dead. Next will be the B12 or ACC. Who will it be? I think the B12 should go all out and seek to destroy the ACC by going after a package deal of 6 teams from this list: FSU, GT, Miami, Clemson, UNC, NCST, UVA, and VT. This will prompt the SEC to grab its top choices from the ACC. The remaining ACC will become a basketball conference similar to the old Big East. If the B12 wants to be good ole boys and feel bad about busting the ACC apart, then OU and UT will eventually be absorbed by P12, SEC, B1G, and ACC. I'd love to see KU announce its departure for the P-12, and let the ACC and B12 sort out their own problems. Too bad the P-12 doesn't want KU, nor do any other of the Super-conferences. I still see the B12 imploding if they don't destroy the ACC, and believe it will begin with OU departing for the SEC. UT may go to the B1G, ACC, or P12. It's a matter of time, so why not get this over with. Please.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

I think your outlook is a little too gloomy. Yeah, UT could bolt, but that seems unlikely now that the TV contracts have been signed. The Longhorn Network is also a problem for any other conference. It is all about money and the Big 12 currently looks pretty good. I don't see how losing Maryland causes the ACC to implode.

If the Big 10 were to pull in Virginia and UNC, then we may be talking about a big shuffle, but in that scenario, the Big 12 would be the hunters and not the hunted.

Vernon Riggs 1 year, 11 months ago

You are right, the Big12 is hunting this go around and NOT the hunted. The weak link is the ACC. Their TV Contract with $12 million per team but them in the crosshairs of the SEC, B1G and Big12.

The B1G mad the first move. Let the SEC make the next by grabbing VA Tech and NC State. This moves Methzoo to the West and expands the TV footprint into key markets for them. The ACC remaining members panic. The Big12 takes Pitt, FSU, Clemson, Ga Tech. Duke and UNC beg the B1G to grow to 16. That leaves SEC and B1G at 16 teams and the Big12 at 14. We can stay there or add two more from 'Cuse, Wake Forrest, Miami, L-Ville or BC. Then we are at 4 Super Conference for football: SEC, B1G, Big12 and Pac12. ACC and Big East merge to make a decent basketball-first league.

jaybate 1 year, 11 months ago

Duh, you flipping iDope.

Why don't you say something that board rats haven't known since before you were macroed. :-)

JhawkalumJB 1 year, 11 months ago

Unfortunately I think your analysis is biased. KU has no options but to stay put in the BIG12. That was painfully obvious during the last few rounds of re-alignment. Honestly, the only schools in the BIG12 with options/leverage are Texas and Oklahoma, sad but true.

tailgater 1 year, 11 months ago

Charlie Weis???? And his 1 win are going to get us in a better conference... sure.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

Truly posted with a KU bias. Not sure most of the rest of the country believes Charlie Weis is a positive. Maybe KU is the third most attractive program in the Big 12 after UT and OU, but that is because of basketball which as we all know is not relevent in conference realignment. Also, the AAU membership helps, but academics are trending downward looking at something like the US News Rankings which is often cited when comparing a school's academics.

Tech and OSU have some leverage in that they are tied to UT and OU. WV has some value. K-State and I-State are probably in the same boat. The private schools are in the weakest position.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

I don't think Yahoo does anything to boost the brand. People look at 1-10. I did look up the ARWU rankings and they are really not much different than US News. They lump the 200th through 300th school together and do not ranking them. KU is in that category along with the following other schools: Missouri, Florida State, Alabama, Cincinnati, Buffalo, LSU, Kentucky, Central Florida, South Florida, Houston, Oregon, and South Carolina. None of those schools scream 'great academics'. They are more 'good' academics which is why they are ranked among the Top 300 schools in the world.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

Let's not get personal. I guess I do not agree with your point. I am not even sure I understand it. You think KU should try to bolt the Big 12 even though no other conference wants them. You think Charlie Weis, our basketball and our strong academics give us a position of strength, even though our football team has not won one of it's last 32 conference games. That's a 1-31 record in conference games. Our academics are not so great that it trumps the pathetic football performance and the fact that we are located in a low populated state. Given all of these disadvantages and the history of realignment the last two years, you think KU can cut a deal to improve its current situation. I respectfully disagree.

mahkmood 1 year, 11 months ago

The B12 is basically at the tipping point. All schools that could jump ship already have (CU, NU, TAMU, MU) apart from OU and UT. The next jump will be OU and UT near the same time. KU's hope is to be a "filler" team to get the PAC or ACC to 16. I think we're going to see OU jump really soon. Look for it.

clevelandjayhawker 1 year, 11 months ago

THE_REAL_DEAL_WITH_BILL_MCNEIL = Jaybate

Just my opinion

blindrabbit 1 year, 11 months ago

KU, swallow your pride and in-state bias about K-State. Both schools should pitch for a 2-school addition to the PAC12. Population shift is to the left coast. Academics might be a problem, I don't known how we stack up against Utah, Colorado, Oregon State, Washington State, Arizona and Arizona State and USC. Pretty sure we would be on a second tier behind Stanford, California, UCLA, Oregon and Washington. In my opinion, recruiting would be helped, KU should be able to out-compete most of these schools for West Coast basketball prospects, K-State would love the shot at all of the JuCo football prospects. Being a Westerner myself, I admit I'm biased.

pepper_bar 1 year, 11 months ago

Can't see why the Pac 12 would expand its footprint to Kansas.

Long road trips like the ones the Big 12 requires to far-flung places like West Virginia are not cheap, and are not justifiable for the numerous money-pit Title IX sports.

WindmillGIANT 1 year, 11 months ago

I don't really have anything insightful to say, but will say it anyways. Realignment is stupid. I don't care about the money - it really doesn't make that big of a difference for anybody outside of the athletic department. If it does make that big of a difference, then these decisions, at least for public universities, should not be made by athletic directors. This is symptomatic of American obsessions with being the biggest and the best and the richest. It's stupid. Like the real-world, the vast majority of programs are never going to be powerhouse programs and are never going to win national titles. Conference titles and rivalries should be the centerpiece of athletics. Every aspect of our lives is ran on the logic of capitalism and is turning everything into bland homogeneous corporate mass productions - history and tradition and regional culture are all being swallowed into the corporate athletics model. The super conference model is like wal-mart, instead of thousands of small, distinct business ran by small-business owners specializing in all manner of services and goods, we have a giant box that replaces everything and is replicated in every location in the entire country.

WindmillGIANT 1 year, 11 months ago

It's not a bong - it's called economics and history and cultural studies. Some people who are fans of college sports actually attended college. Some fans of college sports actually are concerned with issues other than just college football. But yes, technically, others are involved in making these decisions, but if these decisions have meaningful impact on the university's academics and finances as a whole, then for the universities that are publicly-funded, these issues should be up for public debate and tax-payers and their representatives should be involved.

WindmillGIANT 1 year, 11 months ago

Ok, uh, you drink Bud Light in a can and probably like hunting - is that an equivalent insult? By the way, just because I don't particularly care for the principles driving college athletics, that doesn't mean that I can't be "realistic" about how it works, which is why I prefaced my statement with "I don't have anything insightful to say" because I was mostly ranting.

Sam Constance 1 year, 11 months ago

Don't sell yourself short. I think you've said the most insightful thing about realignment on the entire thread here.

Realignment absolutely IS stupid and makes no sense unless the only thing that matters to you is bottom line. Sorry, but I, as a fan of college athletics find myself dozing off and my eyes rolling back up into my head when talk turns to things like TV contract revenues and "super" conferences.

Because while I understand that the revenue generated is what helps college athletics run, I also understand that you can't generate that revenue at the EXPENSE of what makes college athletics fun, or else what the f___ is the point?

I'm pi$$ed at Nebraska, Texas A&M, Colorado and Missouri, because their decision-makers valued being a "mover and shaker" over things like "how will this negatively impact our fans and alumni?" Just look at Missouri--not only did this move make it more difficult for fans/alumni to get to road games, but they used the new SEC home as a way to jack up ticket prices and monetary demands from their fanbase. Because you have to grow that athletic department budget if you are going to compete in the SEC.

I don't want Kansas to compete in some geographically-stupid league like the Pac-whatever or some East coast conference. If that's the way of the future, then I'll learn to live with it, but I will never stop believing that the place for KU to compete is in the Midwest.

Brian Skelly 1 year, 11 months ago

Quite frankly, for the academics and dollars there is no conference that compares to the Big 10. For the athletics and dollars none likely compares to the SEC. The ACC has the academics down, the athletics, but not the dollars. The Big 12 has the dollars, the athletics, but not the academics. The Pac 12 has "lite" all of those. As much as I'd love to go to the Big 10 -- sorry, I dont trust UT, and to some extent OU -- its just not happening. If it was we'd be on the first train to the Big 10 'west' with Nebraska, Iowa, Minnesota.

The Big 12's (OU and UT especially) reluctance with the football championship game shows who's really calling the shots still. Officially, maybe less so than before -- with the Granting of Rights for T1/T2 media stuff -- but its still obvious the Big 12 wont do anything unless UT agrees to it.

We'd better hope that the ACC "football first" schools are amenable to moving (or not getting picked up by the SEC) and open to joining the Big 12. Otherwise, its going to continue to be a bumpy ride.

Just the reality of the situation. I dont think the Big 12 has any leverage at all. Unless UT decides it does.

BCRavenJHawkfan 1 year, 11 months ago

Story on 60 Minutes last night sketches out the general picture to all these conference rumblings. FOOTBALL controls the dollars for nearly every Division I school. I know that's no surprise to most.

But what was a surprise to me was, out of an I can't remember number of Division I schools only 12 (I think that's the stated number) have athletic departments that are running in the black. All others are in THE RED. (The story focused on Michigan & Alabama and yes they are in the black).

Think about that a moment. With more Div I schools athletic dept. in the red than in the black how do you change the balance sheet? As was pointed out in the story, schools not in BCS conferences now look to schedule with teams in BCS conferences just to get the dollars. The example of Towson University going to LSU was one example and the Towson athletic director admitted as much, saying they have no problem going on the road to get pummeled, they want, correction, they need the money.

The other problem in all this is all the other sports that are a drain on athletic department budgets. The AD of Michigan even indicated they have to have a money rich football enterprise to sustain some of the other sports.

Kyle Sybesma 1 year, 11 months ago

The unfortunate part and the unpopular truth to this is that Title IX hurts the financials of college athletics. Schools are forced to fund programs with small demand in order to keep programs that have higher revenue.

pepper_bar 1 year, 11 months ago

Florida State's fan base will howl in protest if it can't tailgate at conference games anymore. And their fans won't be excited about autumn drives to Lubbock, Lawrence, and Ames.

FSU has zero chance of moving to the Big 12, folks.

JhawkalumJB 1 year, 11 months ago

Funny thing is NONE of this is about the fans or 'fan base'... It's all about the BENJAMIN$$$$$

If it makes sense financially they'll join our conference, not for geographic benefits.

pepper_bar 1 year, 11 months ago

Spoken like someone who didn't attend a football school. This will all make sense to you soon.

JhawkalumJB 1 year, 11 months ago

Your right, that's why San Diego State and Boise State joined the BIG EAST, for the convenient tailgating commutes... Nothing to do with positioning their schools or $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$... Hello!?

Same with West Virginia to the BIG12..

Tony Bandle 1 year, 11 months ago

I find it somewhat amusing that any of you posters actually think Kansas is a truly player in all of this.

The two most important items that drive these realignments are a football program with a prestigious cache and a widespread TV viewing marketshare, both of which Kansas is sorely lacking.

Our best strategy is simple...do whatever it takes to partner up, keep the Big 12 viable and grow the league into one of the inevitable superconferences. We have geographic and time zone broadcast advantages that TV cannot ignore.

To think that we belong anywhere else or that anywhere else would actually want us is pure folly. It hurts me to say that..I wish we were a national foortball power..but we're not or likely to be one in the near future...if at all.

JhawkalumJB 1 year, 11 months ago

I agree with your take (OakvilleJHawk). My thoughts as well... We have no oar or paddle in the sea of conference re-alignment, hopefully the ripples of change don't carry us to far from relevance.

As a KU alum it stinks to care so much and yet have no voice or influence in the outcome.

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

I totally agree with you,. It is hard for some to believe that KU does not add value to another conference. It has too much going against it and has made out as best as can be expected through conference realignment: the Big 12 appears stable and is on par with the other major conferences when it comes to media rights payments. It maintains some of its traditional rivalries as 5 of the original Big 8 are still together. Given the disaster scenarios of the last two years, things have turned out pretty well.

Dale Stringer 1 year, 11 months ago

If I got to pick, then I would push for Louisville and Notre Dame. ND would get to keep it's 3rd tier rights in the Big 12 so why not offer to them. Louisville makes better since geographically than FSU, especially with WVU and hopefully ND.

And if we ever do get back to 12 (and no more), I don't want to see static divisions. I think that every 4 years, the two schools with the least total wins in football, MBB and WBB get to pick their 5 division mates for the next for years. Sell the view right to the select day to ESPM/CBS/Fox.

kujayhawk 1 year, 11 months ago

I'd love to add ND and FSU and call it a day.

poet008 1 year, 11 months ago

If any Louisville fans come across this board in their thirst for any tidbit regarding realignment, here is my suggestion:

Contact your administration and ask them to offer to pay Florida State's $50 million exit fee provided you, Louisville, are the 12th team added to the Big XII.

It may take 5 years or so, but eventually you would get that money back just from the higher revenue in the Big XII.

danmoore 1 year, 11 months ago

Delaney is one greedy mother f###ing bastard. I hope he has a heart attack and dies (not really, but I do dislike him a lot). Tradition and history mean nothing today. Universities are behaving like wall street corporations. Might as well get rid of the student-athletes and start hiring them out of college with pay and no academic standards so we can eliminate all the hypocrisy in college sports.

danmoore 1 year, 11 months ago

You mean the one where Delaney dies of a heart attack or making college sports professional?

Dirk Medema 1 year, 11 months ago

Not Wall Street, but KUAC and all the rest ARE multi-million dollar corporations.

Jeff Kilgore 1 year, 11 months ago

Who is sure that B12 is safe long term? If Texas can find a greener pasture for Bevo, it will. The best way to get secure is to get bigger, seriously bigger. Any AU school that's available should be added ASAP. FSU looks good to me. Louisville as well. I'm not sure why we haven't gone courting BYU heavily. Help me out here. This is not the time for smugness.

jaybate 1 year, 11 months ago

Who can ever be certain about such things, but it probably means the Obama won the election. :-)

New Jersey and Maryland went Obama blue.

So: Rutgers, which is essentially the University of New Jersey, and the University of Maryland and their states are joining the coalition of northern states coinciding with The Big Ten Conference member schools and states and political economies, and they are probably putting a fire wall across the proposed Northeast extention of the Super Corridor promoted by Team Super Corridor.

It probably means Virginia, which circumscribes West Virginia's southern and southeaster boundaries, went Obama Blue and so Virginia's politics are probably sufficiently divided that Virginia isn't jumping to the Big Ten, but it is also now at least until the 2016 election a political no-man's land that the Northeast Super Corridor extension cannot cross to reach the Atlantic.

It probably means that the northeast extension of the Super Corridor is dead in its tracks at least until the next presidential election and that major driving force behind expanding the Big 12 into a two division conference with broadcast footprints in the eastern and midwestern time zones is also dead in its tracks.

It makes imminently good strategic sense for the Big 12 to expand to the eastern time zone. The Big Ten has done it. And the SEC has done it. Of course, the Big 12 should do it. But the Real Politik and the Real Economik of the forces struggling for control of the North American distribution infrastructure mean the Big 12 is stalemated until 2016. There may be some flanking additions to the Big 12 the next four years in preparation for yet another push to the Atlantic, but the creation of an honest to goodness eastern time zone division of teams in the Big 12 can't happen till Team Super Corridor finds a way to pry another path open to the Atlantic. And it may never succeed now.

It probably means a lot more than all of this, judging from the electoral map's lay out of blue and red states, but this is probably enough for now.

jaybate 1 year, 11 months ago

Neil McDeal (created 11.18.2012),

Welcome to Talking Points 101.

Big Ten accepted Rutgers and Maryland two weeks after elections. Just a coincidence. Check.

Big Ten preferred adding Rutgers and Maryland to adding Oklahoma, Texas, and Notre Dame. For football TV revenues. Check.

Universities are Fortune 500 size corporations that operate independently of politics. Elections have no affect on their decisions. Check.

Football TV revenues of private not-for-profit athletic departments matter more than university budgets and state and Federal political economies. Check.

Earth is flat. Check.

Sun orbits earth. Check.

Next.

:-)

jaybate 1 year, 11 months ago

Oh, no, not a serial alias with dim wit.

"Bro" and "Lift" ????

How naught decade, you insipid, virtually simpering serial alias hole. :-)

Time for your work out!

Repeat after me:

~Forum sliding

~consensus cracking

~topic dilution

~information collection

~anger trolling

~gaining full control

"Its a fine day in the neighborhood/ Its a fine day in the neighborhood..."

troutsee 1 year, 11 months ago

Your arguments and talking points are waaaaaaaaaay out there. In fact, creepy. You need to go back to looking for Obama's birth certificate like you were doing up until the election.

Rick Arnoldy 1 year, 11 months ago

Talk on 700WLW in Cincinnati is that Louisville has been trying to position itself for a B12 spot for several years.

blindrabbit 1 year, 11 months ago

McNeil: Must have a strong ego or a false sense of self importance with your ramblings and use of attention getting blog capitalization. Tune it down!

Justin Lindsley 1 year, 11 months ago

Football is the leader in all of this. Some on here are saying that the ACC or the Big 12 are going to die. Why on earth would Texas leave th big 12 for the ACC. The ACC sucks at football as a whole. The big 12 needs to get FSU and maybe Louisville. One last shot at ND too. Then buckle down and go with it. We would have the central time zone locked and we would be pushing the eastern time zone with WVU,FSU (hopefully) and ND(longshot). The Big 12 would have every bit as good of a football conference as the sec,big 10 and the PAC.

Pitthawk34 1 year, 11 months ago

Lets just ge to 4-18 conferences and put a fork in it. We are at a point where all of these conferences need to get together and have a draft. Hell, have it in New York with ESPN coverage. Lets just get it done and over so we can enjoy our sports without worry or panic.

Matt Tait 1 year, 11 months ago

Brilliant! The television/marketing revenue from that kind of event alone would more than make it worth it. Love it!

texashawk10 1 year, 11 months ago

Hey Matt, what impact does the news that Boise, SDSU want to stay in the MWC and BYU wanting to rejoin the MWC have on the Big East as a football conference and if those three end up back in the MWC, will Houston, SMU, UCF, and Navy still want to join the Big East now that they'll have the same access to an "Access Bowl" as the Big East or will the stay in CUSA/Independant?

jaybate 1 year, 11 months ago

texashawk10,

This here seems obvious-amente.

Boise State, SDSU and BYU are trying to optimize their Orwellian "football TV revenues."

Haven't you heard? Optimizing "Football TV revenues" explains global warming, the aurora borealis, H.A.A.R.P., irregularity and urge incontinence all at the same time!!!

Whooo weeeee!!!

Optimizin' football TeeeVeee revenues just does a whole heap of explainin'!!!!

Why optimizing "football TV revenues" is why MU left what insiders knowed wuz gonna be uh bigger football TV revenue check in the Big12 for what insiders knowed was gonna be uh smaller check in the SEC.

Optimizing "football TV revenues" is why KU and MU turned down a reputed offer to join the Big Ten and its larger football TV revenue check in order to stay in the Big 12 and take its smaller football TV renevues check.

Optimizing "football TV revenues" is why Texas and Oklahoma took less money to stay in the Big 12 than to go to the highest bidder among the Big Ten, the SEC and the Pac 12.

And well, you know that Notre Dame parked its non football sports in the ACC and still ain't made up their minds about where to park their lil'football bidness (until sometime after the eeeeeelections, because all Notre Dame is interested in is just football TV revenues. Why there's no way in heck that a university in Indiana, a single red state in a Big Ten conferenece full of blue states, could have any danged interest in any danged political economic type issues. All they be carein' 'bout is just optimizing football TV revenues!!!!!!

Optimizing "football TV revenues" is why Colorado joined the Pac 12 for less football TV revenue than what it would have gotten to stay in the Big 12.

Optimizing "football TV revenues" is way more important to Dr. Tom and Warren Buffet than is controlling oil, gas, and tar sands movement via a proposed pipeline across the state of Nebraska.

Etc., etc., etc.

And, of course, Boise State joined the Big East to optimize football TV revenues, because the Big East is such a mighty powerful football conference, when it could have joined the Pac 12, or the Big 12 and have made more football TV revenues.

And, of course, BYU has now decided not to join the Big 12 in order to optimize "football TV revenues."

Haven't you heard?

Optimizing "football TV revenues" are like Al Qaeda. They explain everything that don't make no danged sense no other way no how.

Yeeeee hawwwww, yeeeeeee hawwwwww, there ain't nothing like optimizin' "football TV revenues!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

And don't even get me started a-talkin' about how Houston, SMU, UCF and Navy figure in to all of this. :-)

jaybate 1 year, 11 months ago

Yet another dweeb from Camp Online Destabiliziation.

Forum sliding

consensus cracking

topic dilution

information collection

anger trolling

gaining full control

jaybate 1 year, 11 months ago

😱

Save me, save me, save me, from InternetToughTwit!!!

He used the "bra" word.

What are you 70 years old?

😊

troutsee 1 year, 11 months ago

Please no. You have already done enough talking and made a fool of yourself. Spare us anymore of your warped paranormal nacississtic views of alignment.

Jeff Kilgore 1 year, 11 months ago

I'm not the first to think this, but . . . does it make more sense to stay in a "poached" conference or to move to a "poacher" conference?

jaybate 1 year, 11 months ago

jkilgore,

You want to be both the poached and the poacher.

In any business, you not only try to attract new clients and customers, but you try to fire old clients and customers that are keeping you less efficient than you might otherwise be.

This is a rule that dates back to the beginning of human beings tending gardens.

Introduce the good seeds.

Cull out the bad.

Constantly cultivate your garden.

Out goes the old.

In comes the new.

Water and fertilize to make it grow.

Then prune and weed to make it grow efficiently and robustly.

Next.

JayDocMD 1 year, 11 months ago

THE_REAL_DEAL_WITH_BILL_MCNEIL = Manginorhoolz

Tulane rhoolz, right "Bill?"

James Kirk 1 year, 11 months ago

I thought Manginodrhoolz as well. He's annoying as hell and still has a stiff one for the Pac. Glad I haven't been around here for a while. Reading his posts is pointless. Except for his reply to Jaybate. It also looks like drhoolz has a sock.

jaybate 1 year, 11 months ago

JayDocMD,

I knowz you ain't always pure fond of some of the things ah writes, but one thing we can sure have us some fun laughin' at tuhgether is that not one but two serial type aliases maybe struck from macro keys was sicked onto you at the same danged time.

I ain't seen'em, do that to nobody else but me lately. So I wanna welcome you to the club. It means ya got spunk of some kind. And well, even if ah didn't already like ya, which ah does, well, the enemy of my enemy would still be my friend. :-)

Meet Serial AliasHole McNeil created 11.16.12, er somethin' close to that.

And meet Serial AliasHole InternetToughTwit created 11.19.12.

Ah just knew all it would take to bring out the serial aliases again was some open diiiiscussion about reeeeeeeeeeeealignment.

That there talk about reeeeeeeeeeealignment...that kinda talk is the kinda public discoursin' that's plumb gotta be given the old Camp Online Deeeeeeestabilization treatment.

You know the drill.

~Forum sliding

~consensus cracking

~topic dilution

~information collection

~anger trolling

~gaining full control

Hey, all uh ewe macro keyed, serial alias hole type aliases, how about we all go down and git us sum t-shirts and bumper stickers printed up that read:

"My moron son is a graduate of Camp Online Destabilization ".

Whooooooo weeeeee, there ain't nothing more fun than watchin' moron sons what graduated magna cum dummy from Camp Online Destabilization trying to run their macro-keyed, serial-type alias holes hither thither and dim bulb yond every danged time the blue states expand in an eeeeeeelection, and the Super Corridor expansion takes it in the shorts. It just brings'em outta the eWoodwork like body lice stirred up on a fat rat fallen in deep sewerage.

All I can say is: thank heavens KU won the basketball game in the midst of all of this retrograde dumbness passing for serial alias hole posting.

Rock Chalk!

James Kirk 1 year, 11 months ago

Your'e right, I almost forgot to watch last nights game. The guys looked pretty good.

troutsee 1 year, 11 months ago

Yipes, narcissism to the point of psychosis. Time for you medicine.

Krohnutz 1 year, 11 months ago

I seem to recall questioning the legitimacy of stated $50 million buyout the first time Florida State flirted with us. I would imagine it will be massively less for Maryland based on the vote essentially holding them hostage at the time of the vote. Maryland did what they could, they voted "no" but they were already scheduled to participate for the next season. Picture it like this:

You are a member of a local bingo club composed of people that drive to different houses every week. The only problem is, it seems like certain people always are the hosts, and only those people seem to have any say in where games are played. Furthermore, you are not 100% sure, but you feel like they sure do get the right letters more often.

So you start checking out other bingo clubs, and naturally, some catch your eye. But the small town rumor mill starts circulating, mainly because you are not alone in your dissatisfaction and it comes to light that at least one other member has checked into other clubs.

So to dissuade anybody from looking, your club parlor has a meeting to "fix" the issues. But instead of really fixing much, they instead vote that anybody leaving their bingo club is forced to pay them $100 to leave. You and that other guy vote "no" but, as expected, the other scumbags vote "yes."

So who here feels like they would owe anybody that $100?

Brian Skelly 1 year, 11 months ago

I dont think we should assume FSU would come to the Big 12. But I dont think we should rule it out. My guess is they wouldnt come alone either. And quite frankly, id almost let them pick the partner school.

All that said, I DONT think the Big 12 would go to 12. My guess is 14 or 16.

Reality is the floodgates were NOT open yesterday with Maryland and Rutgers. If FSU walks though, suddenly the 'football first' ACC schools are on high alert. Hard to not see serious movement at that point.

Otherwise, I dont see us expanding. Even though id still think we should.

Kevin Huffman 1 year, 11 months ago

The statement from the conference officials has been "we're not looking." But they've also said that they would have interest if the right universities were to come knocking. They made no secret that tthey would welcome FSU and for the short-term would want to get to 12. Louisville, BYU, Cincinnati....from what I hear, they'd be turned down. Clemson, Georgia Tech, Virginia Tech....I think any or all would be welcomed.

So, let's say the Big XII went to 14....with the 4 noted above. I think you'd end with an East of:

TCU, ISU, WVU, FSU, Clemson, Va. Tech & Ga. Tech

& a West of:

KU, KSU, OU, OSU, TTech, Baylor & UT.............most of the pre-existing Big XII rivalries in tact w/ the exception of Iowa State.

James Kirk 1 year, 11 months ago

Let's say Kansas wants in the B1G. Who has the money to buy back the Tier 1/2 media rights?

jhawkrulz 1 year, 11 months ago

I still think this is the unintended result of legislation. Title IX was passed and items were put in place to enforce it. This basically forced all universities to comply. As noted above many of the schools have had to shut down programs to basically comply (even Maryland cited 9 programs that would be reinstated because of this move). I would argue that KU is an Addidas school because of Title IX. I would also mention that many of the sports have been cut at KU as well.

Football has to drive the talk, but it is also a compliance with the law that caused much of this. Ironically, the very law that was to create equality is in the long run reducing the ability for all to receive scholarships to universities.

I'm not saying whether Title IX was good or not. I'm not even saying whether universities shouldn't have been forced into things like this. What I am saying is when governments legislate certain events, unintended consequences occur and many times they ripple on for years.

I've always been curious how the four superconferences would be shaped. The PAC 12 is running out of real estate to get to 16. The ACC has been banking on its basketball schools too much. The Big Ten and the SEC are poised to handle any instability. I would love to see the ACC fall apart and those teams spread throughout; however, I could see Iowa State, Baylor, Okie State, K-State all sweating a little as this gets heated up again.

I still think if the conferences go to 64, KU is sitting pretty good. If they stop at 14 (56 total), I get nervous.

James Kirk 1 year, 11 months ago

Oh, they're now talking about 20 team conferences. Kantexahoma 8 goes to the Pac to get it done. drhoolz and his sock gets their wish.

Kevin Huffman 1 year, 11 months ago

I think the only Big XII schools in real jeopardy would be (in order):

  • Baylor
  • TCU
  • Iowa State
  • Kansas State
  • us....even though it seems like it should be Texas Tech.....hate how they get to hitch a ride with Texas. Anyone think Tech's worth a da8n?!?!?!

Robert Brown 1 year, 11 months ago

Before realignment hit, the Pac 10 and Big 12 were discussion an 'alliance' agreement where the alliance essentially owned everything west of the Mississippi. I could see something like that evolving. I think West Virginia is out of place in this scenario and I have never been a fan of Baylor and TCU even being in the conference. An alliance could be a way to generate more money without having schools switch conferences.

jgkojak 1 year, 11 months ago

Here are the dominoes -

1) Maryland and Rutgers to the B10

2) FSU and Clemson to the B12

3) NC State and Va Tech to the SEC (making the SEC 16)

4) UNC and Va to the B10

All of this happens in time for the B10 to negotiate their 2015 deal

5) B12 can stay at 12, or accept Ga Tech and Louisville to go to 14

In this scenario-

B12 EAST WVU, Louisville, Ga Tech, FSU, Clemson, TCU, Baylor

B12WEST ISU, KU, KSU, OU, OSU, Texas, TTU

That wouldn't be bad.

James Kirk 1 year, 11 months ago

Exchange numbers 2 and 3, and then exchange 3 for 4.

Clemson and FSU will try for the SEC first.

Rumors are FSU will wait to see what Maryland's settlement with the ACC will be before jumping to the Twelve.

The Twelve gets to pick third in this nonsense.

Kevin Huffman 1 year, 11 months ago

I don't know about that. I think FSU's probably the most "antsy" to get out of the ACC of all of the schools there. The most well-known to be a "football school" of ALL of the ACC schools & other than Miami (who noone wants right now), doesn't really identify with the others. Would be a major coup to be able to get FSU & Va. Tech. Something tells me we either get one or neither though....not fortunate enough to get both. And yes, with regards to us I keep hearing FSU and EITHER Clemson (most likely) or Georgia Tech (less likley, but a possibility).

Terry N Tom Denner 1 year, 11 months ago

Texas AD Dobbs would never ever let that happen along with OU. They would get there butts whipped on a yearly bases by the east and never get to go to any of the BCS bowl games. The Big Texas 1+9 conference will be thrown under the bus because of Texas & OU !!!

danmoore 1 year, 11 months ago

From Mark Schlabach

"Might he (Delaney) now decide to expand the Big Ten's footprint even more into the Southeast or farther West? Georgia Tech, Kansas and North Carolina, which are members of the prestigious Association of American Universities, like every Big Ten member except Nebraska, might be the next targets on Delany's radar."

Anyone can speculate. Look at all the different scenarios we saw a few years ago before Nebraska and Colorado left.

danmoore 1 year, 11 months ago

The only reason would be for survival. It's a mediocre football conference. Two national titles since 1970 and a 33% winning percentage in their coveted Rose Bowl. Big 8/12 has been far better. So has Pac 12 and SEC. The only thing they have going for them is demographics.

Terry N Tom Denner 1 year, 11 months ago

To me a 10 member conference sucks !!! The Big 12 will not get the respect ever at staying no more than 10 teams. AD Mr Dobbs of Texass has the Big 12 Commish lips sowed to his ass already. May as well just call this conference the Big Texas 1 + 9 conference. Jump to the Big Ten KU !!!

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