/ ISU vs Kansas
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Mangino had his chances this year to deliver on a Big 12 North Championship, the closest that we've ever been to having the personnel to win one. We led Colorado in the 4th quarter and lost. We lead Kansas State, Missouri, Texas Tech, and Nebraska all in the fourth quarter and lost those games. Either a personnel change has to take place on defense(new coordinator) or Mangino has got to go. If we had a defense, the record would be 10-2 with a Big 12 North title, and maybe even 11-1, because with a defense, we could have beaten OU. This is all on top of what I see as mishandling of the recruited personnel that we had this season. MacDougal was a running back in high school. Sands saw no playing time, and Lewis made a couple of big plays against Mizzou, and I hadn't seen him since early early in the season. We recruited 2 4 star defensive ends, and we didn't even put them on the field to allow them to develop, so next year, entirely new offense, entireley new defense. We're back to square one. I mean, if we're going to recruit these guys for the future.
This is the exact opposite of what Bill Self is doing. We have tons of Freshman this year getting significant PT. <<<<Ranked Number 1.
Mangino mismanaged the recruited personnel, and now we're back to 2006 again. If you think about it, one or two stops in each of those games that we lost, except for Texas Tech out of the teams listed above, and we're no worse than 9-3, should be 10-2. 5-7? That is probably the worst coaching job in the country in 2009.
Even if Mangino goes, recruiting is going to be tough. Regardless of how he treated those players, other coaches are going to use that against him, but Mangino can earn that trust back, especially if he isn't fired, and then almost immediately announces a change in the defensive coaching staff.
I think Mangino should stay. He's the best coach we've had and he seems to do okay recruiting. Also, I think he's our best bet for winning in the short-term. Except for OU and TTU, we played well enough to win the rest. On paper, I thought KU would win the North. A couple years ago on paper KU looked terrible, but won the Orange Bowl. Funny thing about sports, the other teams, not fans, always have something to say about the outcomes.
Mangino is a football coach, not a priest. This is D1, Big 12 football, not seminary. Are these players really so fragile that a big fat guy yelling at them and using profanity causes them to become functionally incompetent football players? If the team had won a couple more games and we were going bowling, would anyone be talking about his use of profanity? How is the AD fact checking the accusations made by the coach's detractors?
How many of these players grow up with daddy living vicariously through them, with people whispering in their ear, "you're going to Canton someday" only to wake up from the fantasy with a large fat man yelling and cursing at them. It's never their lack of talent that smashed the dream; it's got to be someone else's fault. How about the coach, he does yell, cusses and, gasp, pokes me in the chest (w/shoulder pads on).
This investigation is a shame. If they fire Mangino b/c he yelled and cursed then they better pull out all the stops and try to bring Turner Gill in b/c he's the only coach in America that doesn't curse at the players, he could yell. Worse still, he may pray in front of them (shutter).
the best coach we have had are you kidding Pepper Rodgers-glen mason-to name better ones-hcmm has bought his wins mostly againts sorry azz teams he schedule in early season games mangino is a joke look at his big 12 record he has
and if you take away that 07 year when we went 7 and 1
now u tell me how and were he gets his wins--thats right he buys them againts chumps what a joke--he needs to go
Apparently Mangino has the "fat blogger" sympathy vote all wrapped up!!!
PInkle double dog dared us to throw instead of run the ball on last series, his anti run defense formation worked in letting MU not Kansas call the plays.
Briscoe, whatever you decide we humbly thank you for your outstanding play and dedication. If you come back, we'd LOVE to have you, as you build your draft stock, a nice investment, do the math with your advisors.
if it is your time to go pro, we wish you well always. THANK YOU>
Unfortunately this last example of overcoaching, and disregard for football coaching fundamentals is the last straw. When Mangino came he stressed that we would win by doing the fundamental things consistently well. Now we are back to not doing hardly any of them well. You run the ball in the situation at the end of the game, because you do not want a safety, and you want to reduce the amount of time Missouri has to the minimum. You might even luck out and get a first down. And yes, you show the world that you are solid as a football staff.
I believe that next year will be 5-7 at best. It could be brutally worse. Look at our roster, who is really going to replace the people we lost. As I said on an earlier post, if appears we are willing to settle for mediocrity. We have met the enemy and it is us.
If Mangino is paid 2.3 million a year for mediocrity, then that is a sad statement. One great year out of 10 is not good enough for that amount of money. To do nothing, is to resign ourselves to failure. Either we can get a good coach for 2.3 million, or we should be paying less. Which is it Lew?
I also think that the harm done to Mangino by the AD, coupled with the harm MM has done to himself by this miserable dissapointment of a season, is too great for him to continue.
The way this "investigation" has been handled is disgusting, but it does not change the facts of Mangino's overall record minus the "great year", nor the obvious inefficiencies of our coaching staff.
please say yes everybody
Anyone that thinks we should keep Mangino is clueless. How many games does he have to lose against good competition before you figure out he's not any good? He ranks 9th in KU history in conference winning percentage. 9th; not 1st or 2nd. He has a losing record against D1 competition. The one great season was amazing, but it's deluded everyone into thinking he's some great coach. He just lost out the season with a team widely picked to win the division. Last place in the weak Big XII North. And all for the 15th highest paid coach in the country. There's some really low standards around here is all I've got to stay if you think Mangino should stay.
Of course he should stay!
I don't understand how we keep Mangino. We were picked to be first or second in the north we finish last. Mangino goes into the season knowing his defense was going to be horrible, and he does nothing about it. Mangino has done miracles at KU but unfortanatly this is a business. Not only did the team underachieve, but the coaching staff let them down. Thank for everything coach, but it is time to part ways.
You Mangino apologists are pathetic. While it is a shame the school is going out of their way on this witchhunt to find reasons to fire him (mistreatment...that's a joke), they need look no further than yesterday's game as evidence he's out of touch with how to win a game. I've been saying this since after the CU game...there's something going on and it doesn't look like we'd get another win...especially the way the D was simply giving up at the end of games.
Well, on Saturday, it was the last offensive series that left me scratching my noodle. Not sure why, when you need the clock to run, Mangino decided to start passing the ball from inside the 5. (When all season, we ran on 1st down??? WTF is he thinking??? Terrible decision and terrible clock management.) Then cap it off with a safety, which ultimately lost the game for us. Without that, we would have at least taken it to OT. As Mangino did all season, he found a way to take the game out of the players' hands, out-think himself and lose the game. Briscoe may have also cost us the game, BUT, he was a big reason we were even in it. The D was bad, again, giving up big play after big play and missing tackle after tackle, especially late in the game. Time for Bowen to go, too.
I can't wait until we can get a big boy offense...I'm tired of watching all of the skill position players look back at the sidelines....it does nothing but disrupt the timing of the offense, kill any momentum you may have and not to mention it DOESN"T WORK, especially with a defense as suspect as ours. Neither our D nor the O have progressed...if anything it's regressed and no sign of getting better. Thanks for making us relevent Mangino, but it's time to clean house. Maybe you'll be better off in a D-II school where the 'spread' offense hasn't been implemented and termed.
The entire coaching staff is a mess, as evidenced by the bad play all year. Never have I seen a staff do less with more talent. There are simply no leaders on the staff or the team and if the program is to be relevent again, Lew needs to gut this thing and start over. It may be painful, but I'm not sure I can handle another season of player mis-management, bad play calling and not understanding how to put guys in a position to actually succeed.
Good riddance to you all.
Get rid of Lew as well.
Hawkfan all of those coaches you say are ahead of Mangino in conference wins coached in the Big eight not the big 12. No Texas, no Texas Tech, No Texas A & M, horrendous K-state and I-state teams, so-so MU teams up and down colorado and O-state teams and very good OU and Nebraska teams You guys are over rating the talent. Everyone talks about Briscoe and Meier but there are 4 or 5 receivers in the conference that are better than either one of them and I love them both. I also love jake but my god he is about 10th or less as a running back. Stuckey had a very mediocore season. We had no speed on defense and no speed on special teams..
7 losses in a row...yeah you should keep him hahahahahahahahahaha
I am in favor of Mangino leaving. He has too much talent and has done too little with it. Honestly next year could be really great. The people thinking that we are losing all this talent are not really looking very clearly. Reesing was a great talent and has done a lot for us but the other teams figured him out. He is not that great of a loss. Kerry is someone I will miss, and also Briscoe, but we still return McDougald, Wilson, Omigie, Ingram, McGriff, and if we can keep them a couple of outstanding recruits. Losing Sharp will almost be a blessing. I love the kid I really do but he is just not that great of a running back. Opurum will be outstanding and Lewis gave us a glimpse of what he is capable of. On defense I will miss Stuckey very much for his performance on the field and on the sideline, but we have a TON of young talent at safety. Losing Thorton and Wright is nothing at all we may not improve but we wont take a hit from their replacements. If you look at what we have coming back it includes our entire offensive line, quite a few receivers, a great tight end, and a few good running backs. At QB is could be between either Pick or Webb either will be fine and anyone who thinks you cannot be led by an inexperienced young QB should think back to 07 when Todd was only a sophomore and at his first season as a starter. On defense our line is coming back with Laptad a year of experience for Woods and an improved John Williams. LB will have Tharp, Dudley, Springer, and Foster, not to mention recruits. Our secondary will include a year of experience for Calvin Rubles, and experience and coaching for Beshears, Davis, Patterson, Smith and others. We also have a lot of talent redshirting. This team is actually loaded to come back next year and take some people by surprise. I would not be surprised to see us take the North next year. Right now that statement is laughable, but next year people will see what I'm talking about. This team with some good coaching will show some of the outstanding recruiting that we have been having in the last few years. I'm glad the season is over and am now looking forward and hopeful for next. No matter who our coach is. Let get ready and start supporting our hawks. Rock Chalk.
Mangino needs to go. He underachieved and now he is an even bigger target with rival coaches and recruits, with the recent allegations. Frankly 50- 48 in 8 seasons is not going to cut it. I say we bring in Venables from OU, a defensive minded winner.
Mangino needs to go he was a good coach he did good things for the ku football program but costing us 2 games that we could of one that is the last straw in my book the first game he cost us was the colorado game i think it was all we had 2 do was kick the field goal and we would win but no mangino decides that we need 2 go 4 the td and we didnt get it and the mizu game we should of won that game 2 im not saying the 7 loses in a row r all mangino fault im just saying a couple of them r . And i know if we would of had a repeat of the 07 season there would be no investiagtion but he needs 2 go but investigation or not mangino needs 2 go.
nebhawk77, you took the words right out of my mouth. I agree with you 100%.
IF these allegations are true, Mangino has to go. I don't care if he's turned our football program around, hell even if he won us a national championship I don't care. Those kids don't deserve this type of abuse. We don't need someone like that representing our school, IF those allegations are true.
With regards to our play on the field, this season has been a huge disappointment, but I would still give him another year to try to turn things around. Considering how well we did in 07 & 08, he deserves another chance. And that's IF these allegations are not true, and you are judging him strictly on his performance as a coach on the field.
The only way KU is ever going to compete and be a top 25 team is to get better recruits. The recruits we have had are 3 star at best, and generally 2 star players. Oklahoma and Texas average 4 to 5 star recruits, as do Florida, Ohio State, USC, etc.
Mangino wasn't able to get good recruits, he got average recruits, and that is the best he will ever do. We need a coach who is extremely charismatic and has a strong track record in turning recruits into NFL caliber players. The only way to get a coach like that is to pay big.
Lew isn't stupid, at least I don't think he is stupid. He knows that college football generates more money than college basketball. For example, KU was worth 21.7 million last year according to Forbes, while Nebraska football is worth 49 million, and Texas is worth more than 70 million. North Carolina was the top grossing basketball program last year and made almost 30 million, no where close to even mediocre football programs.
KU needs a well known coach, a coach that no one would expect, not a Callahan, but more along the lines of a Pete Carrol. Callahan and Charley Weis are NFL coaches that have no charisma and weren't that great in the NFL. Pete Carrol on the other hand was a decent coach and has a lot of charisma, add him to USC, palm trees, and Hollywood and you've got a dangerous mix.
Mangino is currently being paid 2.3 million per year. The highest paid college football coach is Pete Carrol at 4.4 million. Most NFL coaches make 2 - 4 million, with the heavy hitters making 5 or more. My first thought was Cowher, but he's wanting 10 million a year from the Chicago Bears currently, so he's out of the picture. However, another former NFL coach that is currently unemployed comes to mind, and no it's not Herm, is Jon Gruden. Gruden made 4 million at Tampa Bay and was a quarterbacks coach at Southeast Missouri State from 87-88. Mike Shanahan is another possibility, however he's being heavily pursued by several NFL teams. Gruden's father was an assistant coach at Notre Dame, and with their current coaching vacancy he might be offered the job. I can't see him turning it down either.
These are a few names that came to mind while thinking about how to take KU to the next level. We need to make a statement with something big, otherwise we'll be stuck in mediocrity for a long, long time.
Way to post the same thing in different threads...if you look at current Big XII coaches and look at their record against Big XII teams with a .500 or better record, Brown and Stoops are the only ones with respectable records, even Snyder is well below .500...Look at what Mangino has done with this program, no one else has come close to doing that...competition is different now than with Pepper Rogers. And Glen Mason, SERIOUSLY
Well, it's way beyond win-loss, or how much better he was than Terry Alan. It's about the "controversy" that Mr. Perkins developed. As much as I adore Coach M, it's in his best interests and the KU community if he finds another job where he can have the respect he deserves. If he stays, he'd be a lame duck.
nettiepie, you ADORE Mangino????!!!!! Are you serious?! This defense of the fat a is UNBELIEVABLE!!!! His record says it all! One season does NOT make a good coach! If he was so great they would have won all those gamnes they should have won the last 6 years! Like the SF or NU games last year, or the Toledo, aTm, or BAYLOR!!!! games in '06! Or the ksu or CU game in "05! Or the TT (I will NEVER forget listening to the SHOCKING LOSS!), NU or ISU!!!!! How about Northwestern or CU in '03!!!!!!!!
THESE are the reasons he should be FIRED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I've had enough of this BULL**!!!!! I will not read any story or comments about this situation until he is fired and a new coach is hired! Goodbye!
How are people voting for Mangino to be retained as head coach? That is unbelievable. How could he even coach effectively now? How could he even recruit against schools who would use all the recent negativity against him, including the fact that he would be a dead man walking and sure to be gone in two years when his contract runs out? Just amazing that anyone thinks he should be retained now.
Dude, you guys are putting way too much on Mangino's shoulders concerning the recruits. I keep hearing that Mangino couldn't get the top recruits; all he could get was average recruits.
Well, damn, of course that's all he could get. That's probably all, or even more, than about anyone could get. Who the hell wants to come to Kansas as a 4 or a 5 star recruit and play and an average team? Who would pick Kansas over Florida, Texas, or any of a number of other teams that are competing for championships.
It takes time to build a program, and it takes time to get the good recruits. I am telling you, 8 years is not going to do it. You have to play with the people you have, and you have to ge the people you can get. Manging has done an awesome job from a recruiting standpoint, considering what he began with. Cut the guy some slack on recruiting. It is a vicious circle, you can't win without good recruits and you can't get good recruits without winning. Mangino can take us there.
While I am not sure that Mangino did anything any other coach has not done in the past (Google Frank Kush and read about the things he did at Arizona State), the fact that there is rampant speculation and reports on ESPN and other media venues has cost him his credibility with parents and some recruits. This will likely impact him (and then KU) for 2-3 seasons.
Because of this reason, he must be replaced (either voluntary or be reassigned/terminated) and very soon. We still have a positive upswing with the Orange Bowl win and the bowl game follow-up last year. Bringing in a solid recruiter or someone who has great credibility with high school coaches and a promise to respect the players it would allow for a quick rebuilding.
Mangino did build a program up so I like his success as a coach. The players need tough displine in division one sports. I also think Mangino crossed the line when he used his authority to belittle players and make them play injured. I realize football is a contact sport that requires players sometimes to play hurt but he went beyond a sprain ankle type of pain. Running on a broken foot is serious pain and should require a player to sideline until injury is healed. The bear crawl incident in which Manigino injured his own player was over the top! What good coach injurys his or her own players and then suggest to players that he will do it again. Now is the time to fire Mangino and build upon his success and get a better coach that can beat the South teams like Texas or Oklahoma. Lets get to the next level which is the top!
MM was the right guy at the time. The program can now move on and not have to live with these stories and a coach that tends to go overboard. Move on means we should be able to hire a young, talented, slim coach because our program has a good base.
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