Monday, November 10, 2014

Bill Self not a fan of ‘secret scrimmages’


The NCAA allows schools to play two exhibition games or up to two “secret scrimmages,” in which no fans or media are allowed. Texas played Gonzaga over the weekend in Arizona as it has the past few preseasons.

Self said on his radio show the Jayhawks will always play the two exhibitions with fans.

“We do it because we have to make budget. Financially, it’s part of our season-ticket package,” Self said. “I think it’d be beneficial to play one game and one scrimmage. Regardless of who you (secret) scrimmage, somebody of comparable talent, you can play three 20-minute scrimmages working on all man-to-man, play one 10-minute scrimmage working all zone. You could have special situations for one 20-minute scrimmage, down six (points) with five (minutes) left; side out of bounds, short clock. There’s a lot of things you could do that would be better for the team.

“There are some benefits playing under the lights. I don’t know which is best. It’s seemed to work out for us, playing exhibition games. Plus, it’s good to help those guys out,” he added of coaches from Div. II schools such as Washburn, Pittsburg State, Fort Hays State and Emporia State. “Chip (Bob Chipman, Washburn) and those guys support our program. They recruit to that,” he added of telling recruits they play the Jayhawks every two years.


Bryce Landon 6 years, 11 months ago

Isn't there another D2 school in Kansas - Newman, I think it is? Couldn't we add them to the rotation of exhibition games?

Also, I saw where Kansas State had only one exhibition, against Washburn. Does that mean they also had a "secret scrimmage"?

Finally, as long as we're keeping money in-state by playing D2 schools as exhibitions, we should keep the money in-state by getting Wichita State back on the schedule. It's an in-state rivalry that fans of both schools would love, and when we beat the Shox it would shut them up about us being "scared" to play them.

Joe Ross 6 years, 11 months ago

Im not worried about shutting anyone up, but I think you have a point. If you add Wichita State to the non-con schedule, you get a team that has worked itself into respectability over the last two or three years. Significantly, that respectability lies within the minds of the Selection Committee for the NCAA tournament, among other places. But Wichita State is probably not going to accept a one-game deal in Allen Fieldhouse without a return game in Wichita, however. Im guessing they would want a home-and-home. I think it makes sense to schedule NOW, because as they stand currently they are not cupcakes. A win helps and a loss does not hurt as bad, so long as WSU performs at a high level. Scheduling a home-and-home only commits you for two years so if the Shockers have some drop-off, it won't affect Kansas for long. We have certainly scheduled weaker teams in our non-con, so I see it as a positive for the program. I do agree with Self about never scheduling Mizzou, but WSU is a different set of circumstances to my way of thinking.

Rodney Crain 6 years, 11 months ago

Bryce, Joe, there is no reason to play WSU. They have only been relvant for a few years and their coach has basically called our program chicken twice for not scheduling them. In addition their local state reps. tried to pull a Northern IA deal by proposing to pull our state money if we did not play the shockers. Northern IA forces IA to play them every year or they will lose state funding.

Coach has repeatedly stated we schedule who is in the best interest for our program.

So lets recap:

a) They have called us chicken to play them. We still have more MV conference championships then they have and we left that conference in 1928. Before their recent final four their only other one was 1965.
b) Their local state reps. tried to force KU to play WSU by law. Willing to hold significant funds from us if we did not. I do not like a gun pointed at my head while being called chicken

c) Our coach sees no relevance to playing them unless they want to visit AFH like other non conf. teams do. They beleive they deserve to be treated as an equal, even though they are clearly not.

d) Keeping the money in state is a weak aurgument. Washburn got 20k, which is nothing.
e) Their football team ceased to exhist in 1986 due to poor attendance, financial red ink, NCAA recruiting violations, and the state of disrepair of Cessna Stadium. In 1970 there was a horrible plane crash and they could not pull together to support their program as well. I am not sure they are strong athletic school.

If their coach leaves, if they keep winning for more than 5 years, if they start respecting us instead of calling us out, if they stop threatening to require us legally to play them, then maybe we can talk to them.

Other than that WSU does not deserve to be on our schedule.

RPI, SOS lol Who cares.

Joe Ross 6 years, 11 months ago

Yes, Coach Self has said we will schedule based on whats in the best interest of our program. But saying that because of name-calling, not scheduling a team is in the best interest of your program is weak kool-aid. Worse than that, it's kindergartenish. The same for your point "b". What politicians are trying to do has no direct bearing (at least in this case) on whether or not WSU will help your RPI, SOS, or any of the factors taken into account by the Selection Committee. On your point "c", your premise is that if they are not equal they are not worth scheduling. One need only look at the record of opponents in Allen Fieldhouse to understand that most teams who walk in here are not equal to Kansas. For what it's worth, opponents are not even equal to Kansas in their own houses. And guess what: they get scheduled. As far as keeping money in state, I never made that argument. But as I look at it, it's a better reason for scheduling them than name-calling is for NOT scheduling them. But your point "e" is your most egregious by virtue of the fact that it is completely off topic. I, for one, am glad that a basketball team's success is not measured by the state of its university's football program. Jayhawk fans everywhere would find the world turned upside down if that were the case. Listen. The ONLY reason to schedule WSU in the non-con is because they would help your resume come seeding of the tournament field in early March. As it stands right now, a win against them would meet that goal. All of this other stuff is a horse-and-pony sideshow.

Rodney Crain 6 years, 11 months ago

Joe usually you have interesting thoughts. You are clearly off base today, feeling flu-ish or is just foolish? Every one of my points come from facts not emotion. To you someone who disrespects you, calls you scared to play them, and have only been relevant for a few years is someone you should rush to play, to HELP out, playing them certainly does not help us. Why you think we should give those clowns the time of day makes no sense. Your RPI, SOS argument is pointless. Look at our non con, do we need to play WSU to get a higher RPI? Nope we are just fine. Sports is only important to WSU when they start winning see football. We still support all of our sports no matter how terrible they are. WSU is like a little kid crying that its not fair the highly successful elite team with all the tradition in our state, that have more MV championships then we do does not like us. Waaaaa Who cares what they think.

It disappoints me when our fans clearly have no understanding of how a state bill forcing us to play a team by withholding millions in state funding to our school is "legal" blackmail plain and simple. No direct bearing what a joke. You do not understand my post so why don't you sit this one out and try to save the whales or something you might know something about. Where did you get your education, did you even go to class? If they want to play us in AFH without a return trip that is acceptable. Anything else is a waste of our time. It is not in our best interest of our program to play WSU. Don't take me word for it Joe, ask Self I think he has been clear on this subject.

Listen your a nice guy but you are obviously out of your league with this one.

Joe Ross 6 years, 11 months ago

I got my education at the University of Kansas School of Medicine. But that is off topic. You're right: I dont understand your argument. Nothing personal. But for what it's worth, I think the attempts of the legislature to force scheduling are stupid. But that is not a reason not to schedule WSU. Respectfully disagree.

Rodney Crain 6 years, 11 months ago

We have a great brand with our basketball department. WSU knows this, the way they have approached us on this is not how you work with someone to build a home and home basketball series.
What concerns me about the legislature trying to do this is that it costs Uof IA aprx 500k a year to play N IA, so they get to keep the funding that was theirs to begin with.

Jack Jones 6 years, 11 months ago

Agree! Not playing someone (WSU) because of the 'perception' that they called us "chicken" is a juvenile, grade-school playground reaction. There may be other, more legitimate reasons for the decision ~ but, frankly, I don't buy any of the one's I've seen offered. A home-and-home series with the Shockers would seem a perfectly logical decision ~ especially since their basketball program has regained the national status it had previously. Plenty of top-level D-1 programs schedule in-state schools with strong programs.

Rodney Crain 6 years, 11 months ago

Jack I would love to have you as a customer... talk about an easy sale.

WSU does not add anything to our schedule or program. It does not make sense to think that this would be benifical to us.

Rodney Crain 6 years, 11 months ago

Guys one last thing - disrespect is what locker room bulletin boards are made up of. One of the best ways to motivate your team. If they can not even act like adults before you sit down and talk about it what makes you think they will afterwards? Let them play Missouri and start a new rivarly with them. They should be able to beat them now.

Their coach said it, so its not perception Jack.

Jacob Zutterman 6 years, 11 months ago

There is no reason for us to schedule WSU. They have had a good run but they're only here for a couple of years. Their schedule allows them to win 30+ games a season not because they are a great team. I see no reason Kansas should add them to the schedule. We already own the recruits in the Wichita area so it can only improve WSU's recruiting. Really, what's in it for us?

Joe Ross 6 years, 11 months ago

RPI, SOS,...

Youre not being fair either to what WSU has accomplished in the last few years or to the state of their program today. For example you speak of their soft schedule. There is no question that the Jayhawks, by virtue of the level of competition in the Big 12, face a more difficult slate of opponents. But to say they are not a great team because of their schedule is belied by their Final Four run in which they knocked off several nationally highly-ranked opponents en route to the semi-finals. Furthermore, if WSU's recruiting experiences some benefit from the series, then that only makes head-to-head matchups more feasible in the future. What's in it for us? RPI, SOS, and fan interest in the game.

Todd Jones 6 years, 11 months ago

Coach Marshall has said numerous times that the Shockers would play KU anytime, anyplace....

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