Photo by Mike Yoder

Bill Self reacts to the Jayhawks play in second-half action of the Jayhawks 62-55 loss to Texas Christian University, Wednesday at TCU in Ft. Worth, TX.

Photo by Mike Yoder

Mike Yoder

Bill Self reacts to the Jayhawks play in second-half action of the Jayhawks 62-55 loss to Texas Christian University, Wednesday at TCU in Ft. Worth, TX.

Bill Self isn’t going to throw Kansas University’s basketball playbook out the window and start diagramming new offensive and defensive sets.

KU’s 10th-year coach isn’t going to toss the names of his 15 players in a hat and pick five to form a new, radical starting lineup.

Self, in a Thursday interview with the Journal-World, said he does not plan to overreact in the wake of consecutive losses to Oklahoma State and TCU. He says he’ll stay the course with his Jayhawks (19-3, 7-2), who following Wednesday’s 62-55 loss at TCU remain tied for first place with Kansas State in the Big 12 race.

“I don’t know what else you do. This team has won. It is 19-3,” Self said. “We would take 19-3 before the season. Everybody would with the schedule we play. We’d take 19-3 right now. The problem is, we’ve played really poorly the last five days.

“We’ll get it back. We’ve got good players. We haven’t played as well as we should. We haven’t gotten them as prepared as we should the past week. Hopefully we’ll do a better job of getting a little mojo back going to Norman (for 3 p.m. game Saturday versus Oklahoma).”

The Sooners will take a 14-7, 5-4 mark into the rematch of a 67-54 KU victory on Jan. 26 in Allen Fieldhouse.

“Every team goes through a funk. That was a bad funk we went through in Fort Worth, obviously,” Self said. “I haven’t had a team that hasn’t had games where they didn’t play well. That was magnified and looked so bad because obviously we couldn’t score the ball.”

The Jayhawks, in compliance with NCAA rules on practice time, took their regularly scheduled day off Thursday — a day after opening 1-for-17 shooting and scoring just 13 first-half points versus the Horned Frogs (10-12, 1-8).

“The thing is,” Self said, “if we were going to have changes, we would have done that over Christmas break. You can’t change when you have one day of practice or two days of practice. You can tweak something or put something in that can help you a bit. The meat and potatoes ... that’s done.

“This is who we are. This is how we play. We do need to develop more of an identity we can hang our hat on,” added Self, who has complained about lack of toughness of late. “Still a lot of teams would like to be where we are at right now, although we are not happy at all where we are at because everything has happened negative in the last five days.”

Self has said a team does not truly become a team until it goes through adversity. Back-to-back losses for the first time since the 2005-06 season (KU hasn’t lost three in a row since 2004-05 to Texas Tech, Iowa State, OU) would classify as adversity.

“This has been such a non-stressful-type year so far, in large part because the guys have won,” Self said. “You go 85 days without losing a game (80 days between the Michigan State loss on Nov. 13 and the Okie State loss on Feb. 2) you probably get a little bit too much of a comfort zone. We haven’t become a team yet the way we hopefully can become a team, because you can’t do that until you go through some stuff.

“All coaches will tell you that. I think we’ll learn from it. I’ll tell you this: The reason we played poorly is not from a lack of effort. The reason we played poorly is we just played poorly. It’s a fine line. We’ve had two of our better practices of the year Monday and Tuesday. We had a really good shoot-around on Wednesday. None of our practices translated to the games. We have to keep practicing hard, well and tough, and over time it’ll certainly translate.”

Self remembers instances in which the 2008 NCAA title team and last year’s NCAA runner-up squad became a true team.

“Were we a team because everything was so easy losing to Davidson and at Missouri?” Self said of last year. “Were we a team because everything was so easy after we lost three of five in the national title season (3-4 in seven-game stretch)?” Self added. “We lost to Michigan State, and there was a built-in excuse (so early in season). I’d rather go through crap and win. We need to go through some stuff. I hope this is the turning point we can look at and say, ‘Hey, we became a team.’ Who knows? If we can grow from it, we might become pretty good.”

As far as the technical aspects of Wednesday’s horrific start ...

“We had some open looks. We rushed our shots. We played sped-up after we missed our first several shots,” Self said. KU hit three of 22 shots overall the first half, 18 of 61 shots total (29.5 percent) and three of 22 threes for the game. “We didn’t go strong to the hole. We just didn’t play very well, which is evident. It wasn’t from lack of effort. I thought we tried. We just didn’t play very well.

“Even though we didn’t make shots and didn’t play well offensively, what probably should have been the case is we should have been down four or five points instead of nine (22-13 at half). We didn’t close the first half out right defensively — 18-13 or 17-13 wouldn’t have been a good score, but we would have been better off, because in a game like that, nine points is a lot. They controlled the ball most of the possessions.”

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okiedave 3 months, 1 week ago

Not giving up on this team at all, but just in case, thank goodness football season is just around the corner.

nuleafjhawk 3 months, 1 week ago

lol - not many fans of 1-11 teams can say that !!

PismoBeachKansasUSA 3 months, 1 week ago

Tharpe needs to shoot less. He's not a bad shooter, but he takes 3's early in the clock and forces some things. We've obviously got to get more shots for Ben and Travis. Those shots should come at Tharpe's expense.

jhawk7782 3 months, 1 week ago

Definitely the first and probably the last time I will ever quote Obama "staying the course is not a plan, it's a slogan"

If I flubbed that up, I will apologize up front.

COJHawk 3 months, 1 week ago

Couple thoughts...

--With no PG who can break down a defense and create shots for himself or others...and without someone down low who can score with their back to the basket...this team will struggle to score. Can anyone remember the last time KU didn't have either one of these, much less both of them?

--Their best offense is scoring in transition and defense feeds that. TCU didn't allow transition baskets and kansas' defense didn't create many chances to score that way. If they defend well and get out in transition, they're offense will improve.

--Kansas isn't playing their best but I'm with HCBS here...before the season, I think most of us would have taken 19-3 and I'll take it now

Phoggy_Notion 3 months, 1 week ago

Well we've certainly had a PG like the one you described for the past 6 season (Tyshawn and Sherron), so i'd have to say the last time was 05-06 without the 'break the defense down'-type of PG. Guards from 05-06: RussRob didn't break defense down, but rather provided ball security and defense. Chalmers operated more from the perimeter. But if you recall, even though he wasn't a PG, B-Rush was a beast at getting into the lane and scoring with that pull-up, or floater shot.

-This current group doesn't have a 'determined' scorer who, if his outside shot isn't falling, will mix it up in the paint without hesitation. I really enjoy watching the Oladipo kid from IU; defense aside, his offensive game is undeniable simply because the bulk of his shot attempts come from a location on the floor where offensive production improves dramatically; near and around the basket!

With this style of play in mind, unless one's shooting slump is resolved swiftly with a couple of made set-shots, a 'slump' isn't being addressed appropriately until the shooter focuses his scoring attention on the type(s) of shots that will result in trips to the free throw line. -Keep working, EJ. Jayhawk Nation is still behind you!

diegohawk 3 months, 1 week ago

Wayne Selden will provide this next year. Wish he was on this years team.

Phoggy_Notion 3 months, 1 week ago

I love what i've seen so far. When he attacks the basket he isn't thinking about tossing a lob pass to someone else, but rather going up strong without any hesitation. I hope that he can settle in quickly next year.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

phoggy, Brandon Rush was harped on for 3yrs to penetrate, but he rarely did, and if he did he always went right until his final season. He was seen knifing in alot to finish a play most of the time off-ball, meaning he would cut in and be receiving a pass for an easy 2 or a lob dunk to him off the baseline, remember? The slight knock against Rush was that he was "too passive", remember? Chalmers would penetrate more. RussRob did penetrate and dish more also than is recalled. But true slashers under Self were Langford, frosh RussRob, Sherron, Tyshawn. EJ can do it, as evidenced by his killer-cross on Rodriguez at the top of the key at KSU late game, and he finished at the rim with his high-glass layup. Tharpe can do it too, but they like to pull up for jumpers (maybe to avoid the charge calls Tyshawn got?) But, this isnt And1 Basketball. Rare is it that such is needed with good ball movement. But having a Sherron or Tyshawn in a late shot clock setting is a luxury...while others would argue it is a necessity. Realize we have had either Sherron or Tyshawn, or both since 2006-07 season-->until this season.

Phoggy_Notion 3 months, 1 week ago

Ralster, we will have to agree to disagree. Rush most certainly was aggressive offensively his freshman year, scoring both off the ball and off the dribble. The two years following his frosh season is when Rush was 'harped on to penetrate'. Russ-Rob was a manager of the game, but never a 'break-you-down' off the dribble kind of guard. Chalmers would penetrate SOME, but did the bulk of his damage from 3, and transition scoring. As for EJ being a slasher, YES, he does demonstrate about 1-2x/game a dribble move to the basket, but that is about it. Would love to see him attempt those types of shots, rather than his usual 6-8 3pt attempts/game. Regarding having a late shot clock scorer, I would argue it is both a luxury and a necessity. Because KU doesn't have a go to post scorer(i.e T-Rob, Morrisx2, Arthur), the necessity for a guard on this team to be able to attack the basket at the end of a shot clock is invaluable because this group's shot of choice in this scenario is primarily a pull up 3. Settling for a guarded 3 @ the end of the shot clock is exactly what the opposition wants, whereas attacking the basket provides opportunity for a foul, or an increased chanced of an offensive rebound. THere will be charge calls that will result out of this, but also more chances for free throws. And I am aware that we've had Sherron or Tyshawn since 06, as noted in my previous post.
'

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

phoggy, I dont disagree with much of what you said at all. We can talk the nuances of past fave players, which is still all fun, since I love Self and his system & type of usual recruit. I recently watched one of Rush's frosh ku games, and he was everywhere, until people figured out he couldnt go left. Finally, in the Champ game, he blew by CDR twice to the rim, both goin left. Russell Robinson I watched closely his frosh year as he was one of the first high-ranked Self recruits, and recall distinctly several times he went knifing into the paint and finishing at the rim very, very much like Tyshawn did a few yrs later. I actually told my KU alum brother in law that RussRob was a "mini-Langford". You recall the story of why he almost transferred away, as Self really forced him into a different role, and the 2 had a serious battle of wills in practice, at one point Self calling him out with an oklahoma term, which had a totally different connotation to NewYorker Russell, who promptly pulled off his own jersey and was trying to go at Self physically (all this in Russell's own words). You can say that Self changing a #30 ranked PG/SG who avg'd 22ppg in highschool into a "distributive" point-combo cost Russell a better shot at the NBA, and maybe Russell knew that. He is now a NBA range 3pt bomber, making $400K+ in Europe, but how can he change the perception of the NBA GM's now? My "realize" comment was simply meaning to illustrate that Sherron/Tyshawn gone and both of them had that attack mentality, while EJ has some degree "less" of it. I just think there is a lot of pressure on EJ this year because of the current team's dynamics and personalities. Hope he gets out of his shooting slump soon--we need EJ. Take care, RCJH.

Hawk90 3 months, 1 week ago

The keys I think to getting back into December basketball

T Rel needs to be the 2nd scoring option. 1 shot vs TCU. 1 and he passed up some open ones. I've been saying this for about a month now, he should be a 15ppg guy. He came to KU known only as a slasher, now he is a great shooter. If he just believed in himself, he would easily be averaging 15. He needs to start to look to drive or shoot before forcing a pass.
B Mac needs to improve his ball handling a whole bunch, esp if he wants to be an NBA star. He shows that he can make any shot, but can he do it under pressure? He had a couple of nice drives, but if he can tighten that handle, he shoots up to 18ppg. If he doesn't fix this by season end, I'm afraid he will be a good NBA player but not a great one like he should be. NBA isn't known for helping you develop your skills. Look for an explosion of 3 point makes against OU after missing all of them.
Tharpe/EJ hitting pressured bunnies. I'm not mad at either of them because when they drive, they are taking good shots. I don't mind the lay ups, problem is they can't hit them. Just have Jeff stand in the middle and have them drive and take contested lay ups.
Feed Jeff the Ball every poss, doesn't have to shoot but he needs to be the center piece of the O.

Luckily for us, I'm not Bill Self and I'm sure Bill will have this team winning again Saturday. When you hit the bottom, only direction is up.

PikesPeakSmitty 3 months, 1 week ago

Great Post.

krazyjhawk 3 months, 1 week ago

I agree with 80% on this. Points 1-3 are spot on, but Jeff is an asset on defense but a liability on offense. He has very soft hands and still has the habit of bringing the ball down to his waist when he catches a pass. He just doesnt seem to "get it" on the offensive side of the ball. He lacks any real kind of power and gets stripped or bumped out of his comfort zone way too easily. Your point #1 is the key to KU moving forward. Travis needs to realize that this team needs to be his. We need him desperately to take shots. He (much like everybody on our team) seems perfectly content passing the ball off. Team play is nice and vital, but it seems that only Ben wants to shoot. When you have 4 passers and one shooter you are easy to defend.

Hawk90 3 months, 1 week ago

The reason I think Jeff should be used more is because of possible attention given. Look at last year with T Rob, when you have a low post guy to fear some, then it spreads out the defense. Even a simple pass to Withey down low opens up the rest of the court.

twocoach44 3 months, 1 week ago

BMac needs to fix his ball handling THIS YEAR or his NBA career will not develop into it's potential? That's ridiculous. Name one talented player in the HISTORY of the NBA that didn't improve over time.

BM<ac needs to improve his ball handling THIS YEAR so that the team he plays on THIS YEAR benefits. The progression of this skill this year has ZERO bearing on his ceiling in the NBA.

Phoggy_Notion 3 months, 1 week ago

I agree with all 4 points. Nailed it

globaljaybird 3 months, 1 week ago

4-Jeff has to move to get angles from the passer to reach him. It's just not happening for that precise reasoning. Admittedly our passers look krappy some of the time too, but you have to "meet the pass" to get the pass. Also, those who think BMac is an all-answer to these and other offensive struggles, he is a freshman who's most recent live game competition was from HS kids before this season.You can't depend on him to be the guy at this level yet-he was not a PG in HS and is not a facilitator now. I don't think Ray Allen has ever been. Just a shooter moving without the ball. These guys are simply standing around waiting for someone to take over & it isn't going to happen with this team except for too few & far between streaky shooters. If they play team, Okie ball, then they look like they did at OSU or vs Colo. If they want to play bullshirt bb then they should have gone to misery or kensucky where they could get a decent paycheck. Mostly fiction-but not all.

nuleafjhawk 3 months, 1 week ago

Thanks globaljay ! Now I can sit way back from my computer and don't even need my glasses !!!

trojanhawk 3 months, 1 week ago

Keep passing and passing until you have the perfect shot. Poor ball movement has been one of the biggest issues I've seen since the start of Big 12 play after missing open jumpers. The best way to neutralize our below average dribblers is to move the ball around constantly. I would tell them to not hold the ball for more than a couple seconds.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

But the opponents know now that it is either a pass-pass around to Ben or Relef, then it is easier to scout. Our tendency to kick out pass to a shooter is well known by now. Post game not threatening like last year, so there is a TON of pressure on EJ. Sorry to go contrary to the popular bash-EJ movement, but he was very active on both ends of the court. CLEARLY, Self wants him to keep shooting (shooters gotta shoot). He just missed, like BMac missed alot. Naa missed alot also. Sometimes that gets contagious--team psyche thing like what happened vs UNI.

trojanhawk 3 months, 1 week ago

EJ has to play. I'm not one of those idiots who finds an individual scapegoat for an entire team.

The passing just has to be consistent. We're running the same few set plays that aren't working, and once we transition to the basic pick and roll offense for the remaining 20 seconds on the shot clock, one of our guards dribbles it for much of the remaining clock. What has made Self's teams so deadly since he arrived is elite defense and excellent ball movement. This year, at least since the start of Big 12 play, passing it around for the best shot has become a lost art.

dylans 3 months, 1 week ago

The ball sticks, no defense or defender can keep up with a ball that moves like it did in 2008. Go back and watch the ball movement and the players moving off ball also, that just doesn't happen now like it should.

drgnslayr 3 months, 1 week ago

Normally, that would be true.

When no one sets picks, the defense plays tighter and tighter and becomes energized to steal the ball. That is what we are doing so more passes means more turnovers because our opponents play tighter and tighter.

Our current "offense" philosophy is "every man for himself." If you stand back from your TV and squint your eyes while we have the ball you'll see 5 blue blobs rarely getting close to each other.

We used to call this offense "shake 'n bake" which is defined by 5 guys who don't help each other and each try their own luck at 1-on-1 against their man. That's the offense we are running. Problem is... BMac is the only one capable at this and he still is green at it. This is nothing more than street ball.

Did you see how tight TCU played us? You'd have thought they were challenging for the B12 title! We created that opportunity for them and if we do that on Saturday, we will suffer our 3rd B12 loss... that I will guarantee!

Phoggy_Notion 3 months, 1 week ago

Couldn't agree more with your 1st point.

Phoggy_Notion 3 months, 1 week ago

At a certain point--for a stagnant offense--the more passes you make results in a lower quality shot.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

I watched the first half again, from an analytical standpoint, and I must agree with Bill Self. We had many many good, open looks and just couldnt hit the shots. Later on, in the 2nd half, when TCU answered our run...the pucker-factor set in...But where's the D, let them score 40pts in the 2nd half. Of course, too many turnovers early killed our offensive chemistry, and contributed to us falling behind.

JoeHawk91 3 months, 1 week ago

You actually watched that first half again? Now THAT takes mental toughness!

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Yep. Each loss's answers lie in the gamefilm. I quickly understand UNI, VCU, OkieState, and TCU. Also realized quickly that the 08Champs getting beat by Beasley in Manhattan was mostly on Bill Self due to bad gameplan (which he admitted quickly post game), eventhough the Champs were running around very disciplined/athletic fashion trying to double Beasley (and let a young Pullen and other perimeter players get open 3s looks in their own gym...which they hit). Now understanding the reasons for the loss only lessons the "sting" of getting bounced out of the Tourney. I felt bad for Sherron after all his 3att misses vs UNI, but he was the most trusted "pure since a frosh" 3gun we had on that team. His looks were in rhythm. I was mad for a long time at Tyrel Reed, as the system is set up to go ahead and shoot the open-look 3. Poor Tyrel went 1-for-7. Same for EJ vs TCU. These types of losses will happen. There is NO perfect system, although ours is awesomely good. Most winningest. So would be kinda premature to question it unless we have a sub20-win season, or dont make the Madness as we have x 23yrs straight. System failure demands system analysis/overhaul, while game failure demands game(film) analysis. Remove emotion from the analysis (ya already know ku loses, now sit and watch why, if you can do so without yelling at a player. Try thinking 'what was EJ or Naa actually trying to do?'. Or ask if the pass hadnt been tipped outta bounds, was Withey in a good seal-his-man position? Could he have scored? Was the timing of the pass correct?). Even NFL teams dont execute 100% correctly all the time. But the proper timing between QB and WR can be a thing of beauty, when done smoothly...

surrealKU 3 months, 1 week ago

“Even though we didn’t make shots and didn’t play well offensively, what probably should have been.." - “We didn’t go strong to the hole.." - EJ: nice strong drive, but fell short - could've been a lob-pass for an easy dunk by the tall white boy or BMac - 3pointers: need to practice more - Jumpshots: Tharpe or BMac, that's about it - Fastbreaks: can't really say it's an offense - Ring-a-round-a-rosie passing: leads more TOs

Sorry, I don't think our team did not perform well. It's the opponents that have become 'smarter'; their scouts are spot-on. I will trust HCBS & staff when I see the team is used more effectively. Obviously them boys are strong & skillful individuals, there's no way they play so badly. I'd love to see some good energy, good defense AND offense KU bball. Let's go Jayhawks!

nostradavid 3 months, 1 week ago

Judo could help them turn being pushed around inside to their advantage.

The mantra is: "Float like a butterfly - sting like a bee!"

not "Sting like a butterfly."

don't get pinned by nostradavid

thekuinthe512 3 months, 1 week ago

Seniors need to man up. Like all the past Seniors, it is not like we have all Freshman. Seniors, you want to lose the conference title, go for it. If you don't, then let's go!

Jaylark 3 months, 1 week ago

Clearly, our offense starts with getting the ball to Withey but I can't really fault the guards in the TCU game.

I was in the stands. Withey was not sealing his guy. He was getting badly outworked and outmuscled in the blocks by the TCU big guys.

Several times the guards tried to force it in to him and turned it over.

There was also very little in the way of high-low action with either Ellis or Young.

Toward the end of the game we got some penetration that opened up Withey for some easy dunks.

Withey has to do better at establishing his spot against Oklahoma. If he does that, we'll get back on track.

It was also clear at TCU that if we desperately need someone to break down their man one on one, it will be Tharpe. He brought us back single-handed at the end with his drives but then we got impatient and started jacking threes.

Johnson and McLemore can't get by their man on their own. They need a screen to make it happen and this team does not seem to set screens like some of the past versions.

Yahweh 3 months, 1 week ago

Self keeps talking about how the team hasn't been up to par in the last week or so. Man, we haven't played a solid game since conference began. Everybody who's watched us knows that, why not admit it? This team has been downright pathetic for almost a month. We've just eked out some wins over inferior talent.

Blown 3 months, 1 week ago

I'm with ya--I'm a little disturbed by his lack of honesty with himself. Less than a week a go he was saying they have been playing on borrowed time for the last 5 weeks, now he says it's just a recent issue? I do agree with him 100% that this is a between the ears thing, and not a talent thing....hopefully the adversity will bring them together.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Blown, not to nitpick (and you are right to wonder just exactly what Self would say candidly about this particular team)--> but none of us know what private thoughts Self has in his own head about this team, other than he is mad at their play. "Be honest with himself" sounds pretty presumptive, and very likely is 100% wrong-->Why? Because Bill Self probably has an intuition about this team that he cannot share with the media or even the team if it is not a favorable, as part of his job is to keep the team believing and motivated.

Hawksboy88 3 months, 1 week ago

This team has WON. NO team has been blowing out opponents this year. None of them! We just win!

marchphog88 3 months, 1 week ago

I'm sorry, but until the OSU and TCU games, our defensive play was actually quite good.

Yes, we were winning ugly, because this team doesn't have the same intuitive passing ability that say, the 2008 team displayed, and they don't have anyone who can score at will (let alone 2 people) like say, last year's team, so they have to get offense from transition and hitting open looks.

But we were controlling even those ugly games. We clipped Baylor's wings, we held KSU at arm's length for an entire game, and in both of those games, our offense was still pretty ugly. But we defended the crap out of our opponent, and that is what got us to the win.

The primary difference between the last two games and the others has been our defensive intensity, which gives me hope that we can rectify it.

The only thing that worries me is that even a really good defensive team is going to be vulnerable with an offense that requires good jump-shooting and transition points from turnovers to score successfully. And that is Kansas' seeming MO this year.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

marchphog, Nail on the head! How does the #1 FG%defense team in America lose? Even after the 13-22 halftime wake-up score, we let TCU score 40 (!!!!) points in a half. That extrapolates to an 80pt output by TCU (!!!) against the #1 defense. There-in lies the reason for the loss. Maybe another lesson for the guys is just like EJ said: "we think we can just turn it on and come from behind and win, but it caught up with us as I knew it would". SelfBall Principle 1.0001: Make the opponent's offense u-g-l-y. Our recent play is failing the System. What is Self to do? Put a more-challenged, incomplete player like AW3 or Rio in the game for extended stretch? (answer: no, no, and no. I will list the reasons for those that do not know: worse defense, unproven shooting, and biggest is they do not know the plays well enough to function in the offense).

ajhk 3 months, 1 week ago

Cultivate their headspace Bill

They need focus. Focus is not effort, intensity or want to. Focus is not playing tight, playing with nerves. It is not about how sweaty your jersey is or how hard you can cry after a loss.

Focus is a calm preparedness for all scenarios. It is a clearing of the slate, a lax of expectations, a clear view of your role, your own limitations and a ready and willingness to adapt on the spot.

Focus is clearing the mind of all excitement, regrets, hesitations, or questions from the last battle by the morning after. It's disengagement before reengagement.

If you are surprised, confused, and agitated by the improbability of what is going wrong, and find yourself sweating blood to make up for them, you have not been focused.

The boys fought hard against Bradley, Bucknell, UNI, VCU, TCU. All different teams for KU. All had proven winners, competitors, skilled players, good chemistry, the X's and O's down pat, each fought to the end and were shocked to the core.

Each game the shots just didn't fall and it seemed like theirs did every time. Lucky threes. Come on call a foul refs. How can the ball pop out of the rim like that? Thoughts like those above are an early sign of defeat. A defeat that happened days before the game began.

Occasionally things just don't work out. Sometimes shots don't fall. But has a bigger picture pattern emerged?

Shots not falling is ok, but if your best shooters aren't the ones getting shots off then it isn't. If your point guards are trying as hard as they can at doing the wrong thing isn't that a misappropriation of energy.? Hard to see these things clearly in the midst of battle. If you have already seen this scenario in your mind and prepared for it with a calm head then you will not lose focus, you will know what course to take.

An HCBS team will always be focused for the "big" opponent. As for the little guys, lets take a minute, and remember we'll have to come just as well prepared for any scenario. Panic is not an option.

njjayhawk 3 months, 1 week ago

Perhaps Bill should invite Bonnie to "come over" and diagram a few plays, and give the players a pep talk on the agony of losing. She would something about the later, for sure. Any chance Bill will have KU wear Topeka YMCA retro jerseys when KU plays Manure U. next week? I honestly think KU's "soft" problems started when they wore those hideous retro jerseys at UWVA last week: that was almost akin to mothers in the early 1900s making their young sons wear frilly dresses in family photographs.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Um, I know you were joking, but maybe our shoddy play is because we are scouted, have less power in our post game compared to last year, and one of our key players is in a shooting slump, while another refuses to shoot? And maybe since we are missing the best penetrator we've had since Keith Langford...

nuleafjhawk 3 months, 1 week ago

“We would take 19-3 before the season. Everybody would with the schedule we play. We’d take 19-3 right now. The problem is, we’ve played really poorly the last five days. “We’ll get it back. We’ve got good players. We haven’t played as well as we should. "

See? That's the problem with Self. If he would listen to us (yes, myself included) posters, he would throw his arms in the air and say " Forget it, I'm done. Find some other moron to coach these losers, I'm gonna go find me a nice 9-5 blue collar job for 12 bucks an hour."

He's just too rational.

kellerman411 3 months, 1 week ago

KU on Parden The Interruption. by kellerman411

These two were laughing their heads off listening to Bill slam the team after the game. I enjoyed it as well.

zimsjim 3 months, 1 week ago

"Pardon" your misspelling....

kellerman411 3 months, 1 week ago

Pardon me while I burst into flames?

JakeBarnes 3 months, 1 week ago

If anyone is going to have his team prepared for the usual sets run by KU it is the Oklahoma coach.

chriz 3 months, 1 week ago

Why are we letting opponents dictate the game, anyway? Shouldn't we be showing them who their daddy is?!

HighEliteMajor 3 months, 1 week ago

“I don’t know what else you do. This team has won. It is 19-3,” Self said. “We would take 19-3 before the season. Everybody would with the schedule we play. We’d take 19-3 right now.

A few items for consideration:

1] Do whatever you can to get Releford to assert himself on offense.Hawk90 mentions it above. To me, this is the panacea on offense. This is the key. This will fix it. It's the best option that is under the coach's and the player's (Releford) control. The guy can score. We need scoring. I went back and watched the game again from Wednesday. Seriously, it makes my stomach turn. Not the loss, but how Releford so calmly passes on opportunity after opportunity to even attempt to score. This "slasher" tried to drive twice the entire game. And guess what? It resulted in a dish for a basket, and then a foul (which should have been a shooting foul). Releford took 1 shot in 36 minutes. We were playing with 4 offensive players on the floor Wednesday. Harshly, Releford needs to act like a 5th year senior and step it up. There's one answer.

2] Sprinkle in the press. Good point made from the TCU game by some posters .. how do you press when you don't make baskets? Right. It's hard. You can only do it when there inbounds, full court. Simply to change pace and change the dynamic, try a full court trapping press every 3rd (or so) full court inbounds situation. It changes the dynamic. It's aggressive. Further, we ran a 2-2-1 3/4 court press a few years ago for a stretch in December .. sprinkle that in. And for those that were responding yesterday saying we did "press" early, don't confuse a real "press" like we initiate at the 7 minute mark of second have with "pressure", where we put KY on the ball in. Two different animals. I understand that pressing real good teams can lead to easy buckets. But it is the surprise element that leads to turnovers -- first time we popped it on TCU, they turned it over.

3] Incorporate a shooter. Give AW3 10 minutes per game. Look, Wednesday, he could have gotten 5 of Releford's minutes and 5 of EJ's (with Tharpe in the game). Evidence is mounting that this is the right thing to do. Self even said after OSU he should be playing him more. AW3 looks like maybe a streaky guy .. either on or off .. but we don't know yet. Either way, it's worth a minimum of 10 minutes for an offensively challenged team.

4] Ball screens for McLemore. Some isolations with a direct ball screen for McLemore, and let him go. This is easy. Make sure to remind McLemore he doesn't have to shoot .. he can dish on the drive. He's our biggest offensive threat. Isolate him. Let him go to work.

5] Build the team up. Instead of saying how bad they are, focus on how good they are. No, how great they are. Even if it's not exactly true. JayDocMD made the point yesterday that all of the negatively may have backfired. Maybe it did. No reason not to try the opposite approach.

(continued)

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Agree, HEM. I also rewatched the TCU game from an analytical perspective. Releford was a total Brady-like M.I.A. Not to muddy the waters with Bradebate, but that was the exact knock on Brady: limited offensive repertoire, and disappeared from games, and his main role was facilitator. Releford needs to realize EJ trying to play-through and facilitate better maybe-just-maybe needs one of the pass-recipients (Travis) to 'do something' with the g-dmn ball. EJ slumping, but still trying to take offensive-rhythm 3s (always OK with Self, just like Tyrel Reed, who sufferred a similar brick-city vs VCU), Releford not even shooting or driving, and BMac taking his shots just like he's supposed to, and just an off-night. So, what happens? Pound it in the post? To no-show Ellis? Didnt work. What I saw analytically is a team early in the game trying to run our stuff, but slightly off on passes and shots (played tight). EJ is not taking bad shots. But pass-pass-pass around the perimeter for ball-reversal is only about getting open looks, or a post pass angle opening up...we just missed about every open look. Not a system fail, but rather an execution-fail (hit the damn shot). Not our night. Self no doubt sees his guys running the plays (uh, turnover-plays excepted of course), but having a terrible shooting night, ala UNI and VCU. At least this outing wasnt a season-ender. And if it turns out to be, then so what? What defies analytical reason, but is 100% truly an intuitive fact is: this has happened before with totally different KU players, and it happened vs. TCU however unlikely...and it will happen again. Such is the game. Self recognizing the aberration, isnt going to scrap this battleship, even though we are at cruiser-firepower currently due to no Man-presence at the 4. But Self clearly knew we needed another dimension (penetration), and has only been harping on that since December. I would love some of the posters here (myself included) be given a shot at a private, mock press conference with a candid Bill Self. We would learn quickly he much stuff he has analyzed and considered. Sometimes kids just cannot execute to the degree needed for a W. Sure no one wants to eat a L from a TCU-stat squad, but the answers are simply on the gamefilm. Do need a return of more physicality. Maybe Self needs to have Traylor play a little "too aggressive" with PerryEllisLimitedPortfolio during practice sessions. There's gotta be a Man somewhere inside that 6'8, 235lb Div1-ready body, eh?

marchphog88 3 months, 1 week ago

Especially agree on 1 and 4, but all very good points.

I still think Self may be holding some of his cards on the issue of pressing, so that if we get into a situation like UNI in the NCAA tournament, he can spring it on a mostly-unprepared opponent for a big advantage. But there is no harm in working in small stretches of it now, if for no other reason than to make sure the guys aren't playing the hard press for the first time in a real game, which increases the potential to mess it up.

HighEliteMajor 3 months, 1 week ago

Self said above -- “if we were going to have changes, we would have done that over Christmas break. You can’t change when you have one day of practice or two days of practice. You can tweak something or put something in that can help you a bit. The meat and potatoes ... that’s done."

Right. The above items are four tweaks (items 2, 3, 4, and 5) and one kick in the butt (Releford). One tweak he has made is that he is playing small in stretches. He did that at the 11:00 minute mark of the second half. But as ict pointed out yesterday, if Releford won't shoot, he's useless at the 4. But it's something.

There is no reason to panic .. at all.

raprichard 3 months, 1 week ago

HEM, great points! I couldn't agree with you more on Releford. Every time he beat his man and headed toward the basket, he kicked the ball out to another guard. I was screaming at the TV for him to finish plays. The other guards make the same decisions. I have no idea why, when one of our guards gets a step on their man, that they don't go to the basket or pull up and shoot. Its like they are programmed to kick the ball out. We hear Self telling them publicly that he wants them to be more agressive and shoot the ball, but I can't help but wonder what practices are like if we are so predisposed to kick the ball out. If we would take some of these shots, I think it would keep the defenses honest and open up our outside shooters for the dish when the drive and shot is not there.

I also agree with you on McLemore. Ben has started to be more agressive, but he does need help to get the ball in better position to score. If we can get him the ball when he has a step on his man, he will likely score more often than not. We can do this by setting off-ball screens as well as ball screens.

One player you didn't mention is Ellis. I know he has been less than impressive lately, but you can still see the talent just below the surface. Jaybate has publicly wondered if he has the ability to be an above the rim player, and I have occasionally wondered that, too. However, a few games ago, I watched him go up for a rebound and he was well above everyone else. He has the ability, he is just lacking the confidence and mental toughness right now. In my mind, he needs to get serious minutes each game because we are going to need that inside scoring option come March. There is no way he can get that confidence and comfort level in a game unless he plays. He also needs to concentrate on defense when he is off the ball. He gets out of position off the ball and then his man beats him to the basket on the rotation or loose ball.

Last but not least, you are right on the money with your last statement. There is no reason to panic.

Rock Chalk!

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Personally, knowing what Self likes his teams to display, I am ready for a return of some Nasty in our team. We need stank-face Withey. We need TechnicalFoulDunk-on-their-Bigman-Elijah. Add in the back-door slasher RipperReleford. Come on, Travis, show us your knife! Next year we see Wayndunk Seldendunk, Brannen Greene, HudyLucasHighlightFilmProduction, and an up-to-speed JamariFastFreight. And maybe, if we are lucky, and explosive PerryEllisPortfolio? Maybe Frankamp will be a Keiton-Page-good type of shooter out of the box. Problem with this team, is it isnt playing like the Big10 bruiser type of team Selfball is designed to compete with conceptually. If you cannot slug it out on a bad shooting night, you cannot win with mental passivity. Keegan took my point from 3 days ago, and made a nice article about it yesterday about our current 4 seniors (and Benny) being 5 "nice guys".

globaljaybird 3 months, 1 week ago

As usual HEM, a friggin slam dunk! I should have known you'd step up.

globaljaybird 3 months, 1 week ago

Plus if I may add, we are TREMENDOUSLY missing Danny Manning & his tutiledge of the kids' play in the paint, as I posted on the other thread. I think this is by far the most obvious difference I have seen in this squad & all the others since 05-06. His ability to teach footwork was impeccable. With Danny, Ellis is probably well on his way to becoming the beast we have been expecting. Without, is possible he may never reach his full potential. Also without Danny, Jeff is clearing regressing into a stationary footer that is not creating good passing angles & is often trying to dribble for advantageous position which never, ever works when doubled, resulting in poor shots, TO's, & bringing a footer down to the height level of a 5'9" guard. That is BB 101, something a big should never try unless he has great agility, something Perry has & Jeff does not, IMO. I sure hope I'm missing the mark on this, but when it continually quacks & quacks it's usually a duck. Personally I prefer mallards. Teal aren't very tasty to me! JMO & time for lunch!

KU 3 months, 1 week ago

Expect a bounceback game from Releford at OU. It was just last year that he put TRob and Tyshawn and company on his shoulders in Norman and said "I got this." What did he score that day? 24? 28? If he didn't come through that day, KU would have lost.

Not only does he have motivation to make up for his TCU no-show, but he also has the positive memory of playing well in Lloyd Noble Arena.

Reuben_J_Cogburn 3 months, 1 week ago

Don't jump ship yet.

I had a feeling watching these guys in December, and two losses hasn't changed that.

Stay the course. Keep the faith. Rock Chalk.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Reuben, what have you done with our usual Cogburn??? I am literally stunned by your optimism... :) (Dare I ask your opinion on, uh...football recruiting?)

Reuben_J_Cogburn 3 months, 1 week ago

Weird, huh?

I've watched both KU Basketball and Football since I was a lad. I call it like I see it. Our basketball program has hit bumps before, but we perservere...and usually in exciting fashion.

As for football, you could probably guess my opinion of our recruiting class.......

I'll believe it when I see it.

jpstrayer 3 months, 1 week ago

No disrespect for Coach Self intended, but I have to disagree with him. This team has been playing poorly for a lot longer than 5 days. Starting with the Temple game the offense has been very painful to watch. Scoring in the 80s hasn't been seen since before conference play. For goodness sakes...it took a banked in 3 point shot to send the Iowa State game to overtime.

Maybe the offense has been poor all season and covered up by fast breaks started on the defensive end...which also has evaporated with the start of conference play.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

We've been scouted. No strength in the post game. Withey gets his stats largely due to being 7ft tall. Puts scoring pressure on the perimeter players. Thus this year when EJ drives, its not a 3 option Tyshawn attack (TRob, vs keeper finish, vs kick-out for 3), but more of a 2 option (keeper vs. kick-out). Seen alot of those kick-outs get intercepted? Scouted! So Self has been harping for about 8-9weeks for us to drive it more to add another dimension to the current predictability. And he has been hoping Ellis finds his inner Man. A 6'8 McDAA who cannot handle the 278th ranked team's 6'7 or 6'8 post players? Man! (needed...).

JayDocMD 3 months, 1 week ago

I'm with Yahweh up above (rimshot.)

This Self quote is bothersome: "The problem is, we’ve played really poorly the last five days." Surely he doesn't believe that does he?

The first whiffs of a funk began Jan 6th vs Temple, and we have been progressively more funky with each game: Iowa St and then Tech. We could have easliy lost as well to TX, KSU, OU and WV. All of those game were in question deep into the 4th quarter.

The funk was not to be ignored vs OkSt. And then Wednesday happened. The funk came to a purulent head in Ft Worth. Fitting that it would take a Horned Frog to expose our warts - but I would argue they've been there all along.

marchphog88 3 months, 1 week ago

You earned a thumbs up just for that opening line. It took me a sec, but then I chuckled to myself out loud once I got it.

icthawkfan316 3 months, 1 week ago

Posted this late in the day yesterday. Re-posting, just because I'm interested in fan reaction. The one person that responded tried explaining Releford's passiveness by telling me that he'd be his retirement that Travis was ill with the flu during the TCU game, and that the next time I had the flu to go play 36 minutes at my local YMCA and report how that worked out. The response was so laughable. Anyway, here's what was posted:

Please stop trying to justify this as "just one loss" or throwing out our record, or the record of teams from seasons' past. Because you know what? When we were playing horribly and skating by all January and some of the astute posters were leery of the direction the team was heading, you all were shouting us down then by saying "we've lost one game and are #2 (or whatever we were at the time) in the country!" How long can you keep burying your head in the sand and pretending that there aren't major issues with this team?

Is the team horrible? No. Is it broken beyond repair? No. Look, this morning the sun came up and I dressed my son in his Jayhawk hoodie before sending him off to start his day. I took the lumps at work, and was still thankful I was a Jayhawk fan and those poking fun at me weren't.

I still think we should win the Big 12, but some things need to be remedied:

1) - Releford. His passiveness on offense is inexcusable. Myself & others have been critical of this long before the losses started piling up. It's not new. It's his M.O. The Houdini act he pulls is the biggest problem with this team. Young isn't a scorer. Withey is not a natural scorer. EJ is struggling mightily. So where's the offense going to come from? BMac isn't going to have too many games like last night, but at least he was trying! Travis would get the ball on the perimeter and wouldn't even look towards the hoop. He couldn't get the ball out of his hands fast enough. After the OSU loss Jaybate suggested (perhaps jokingly, but probably with at least a dash of truth to it) that Self should tell the rest of the team to clear out for EJ and let him get 6 baskets. No one takes a shot until EJ gets us 6 baskets. Well, in all seriousness maybe that should be the case for Travis. He has to get more aggressive on the offensive end. If that had happened, at least one of these losses could have been avoided, and my guess is both of them. Might have still had to win ugly, but getting him on track is the biggest step this team needs to take to get their swagger back. If he's going to continue to be this much of a non-factor then Self is better off starting and playing AW3. A couple of weeks ago, I would say that is unthinkable because of the net gain Travis provides with his stellar defense and usually solid fundamentals. However, he’s been getting beat a lot on the defensive end lately too. And last night he was the one who failed to box out and allowed TCU that monstrous tip dunk that re-energized them.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Agree about Releford's passivity inexcusable. His 10-12ppg coulda/shoulda/woulda made the difference, plus give the opponent something else to worry about, thus opening something else up...(changes the whole dynamic). Agree Wichita-area non-ku fans can be an insufferable collection of mediocrity Kudos to your son for proving you are not fair-weather fans--Im sure he wears that hoodie well, as does my 14yr old. Im especially proud of my daughter who wore her MuckFizzou shirt often during her 4yr WSU time, now finally in Lawrence at KU professional school...

icthawkfan316 3 months, 1 week ago

2) - EJ. Let's get this out of the way - EJ is in all likelihood not going to regain the form we saw during the last 9 games of last season. And as someone pointed out after the OSU game, that 9 game sample is the biggest reason we had any evidence to have our hopes so high for him. However, he is a better player than this. He is capable of being a good PG for this team. The problem is between his ears, and it's on Self to snap him out of it. I think when he's right he's the better option at the point, but until he's right Bill should be seriously cutting into his minutes and replacing him with Tharpe. Now that might seem counter-intuitive, that it will destroy his confidence and he'll never get it back, but it has to be done for two reasons. First, the constant poor performances aren't helping his confidence either, so maybe he needs to be unburdened as the leader of this team. If he isn't carrying that weight maybe he can relax and just play. The second reason is that with him burdening himself as the leader of this team, the crisis of confidence going on with him is spreading to the rest of the players. It’s like a cancer at this point. Instead of coming out ticked off and ready to lay a beat-down on TCU, they came out and got punked, and just took it.

3) - System. I believe in Self's system, but he doesn't have the pieces that fit that system perfectly this year. He has to adapt. You can't run a high-low offense with no post-scoring threat. Credit to Jeff, he's come a long way, but he is not suited for us to run offense through. Perry was our best hope for developing a true post scoring threat, but that doesn’t appear likely to happen soon. So in the absence of a running the offense as Self has traditionally ran it, what do we do? I don’t know honestly, but as sacrilege as this may seem…look at K-State. Borrow some of that motion offense, because really their personnel is not that different than ours right now. They have one bona fide scorer – McGruder. We have one bona fide scorer – BMac. Nearly everything else has to come from the system, so maybe it’s time to change it up. Probably won’t happen, but I’d like to see us at least adding some new wrinkles into the offense. Right now I have no idea what we’re running, other than the weave.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

I personally believe EJ has got to play thru it. Maybe be very picky with his shot selection or run set plays for him to boost confidence. I dont buy this SG vs. PG debate regarding EJ. I guess people's minds naturally try to find some sort of comfortable explanation for adversity--thats human nature. Elijah Johnson was the #4 rated PG (not SG) after John Wall. Specifically watch EJ on offense and on defense most of that TCU game. He was very active, but had a horrendous shooting night. No reason he should be tight, as he faced big pressure games last year...but maybe the pressure of being the Man is partly a stressor. Also, we know there are less than 55days left on EJ's clock as he goes from player to legacy...that stress even affected Sherron on Senior Night, as he had a very forgettable performance. RussRob mentioned it as well, but was able to play very focused down the stretch. *Totally agree about the hi-lo system being bothered by imperfect personnel. We all know KYo was an emergency fill-in, and he has proven indispensable--proved again in microcosm when Ellis started. I can guarantee if Ellis started we would have ended the 1st half with 20+ pts (not just from him...its more about his dynamic). Some poster sarcastically asked "why does KU have a 190lb 4-man starting?". That can be answered on so many levels, but I will just let that guy sweat it out for himself. Yes, I am looking forward to the power-4 position upgrade next year: Steadily-improving Traylor (I'm seeing flashes...) + found-his-inner-Man-Ellis, and just plain curiosity about 6'10, 240lb Lucas with a year of SelfBall, knowing the plays, and alot of reps and alot of Hudy...and if Justin Wesley can be a 6'9 220lb imitator of KYo's role, thats all I ask of him. The system needs pieces. We get alot next season, although we do lose 4 nice-guy personality seniors...

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Geez, correction: I meant "I can guarantee if KYo started in place of Ellis, we would have...". (Also, I think "picking" TCU to start Ellis signalled some disrespect to TCU, and signalled to KU players that Self considered TCU easy-enough-meat to give Ellis a shot--so I think that roster move energized TCU).

icthawkfan316 3 months, 1 week ago

I don't by the SG vs. PG debate either.

Let me ask you this though: what shots are we very picky about EJ taking? Can he not take 3s anymore? Because the majority of his looks from beyond the arc have been open. Is that still a good shot?

I don't buy the argument that if Young had started we'd have been up by 20+ points at the half. Our offense has had plenty of struggles lately, and that's with KY starting. If the offense had been humming along and Self shook things up we could blame it on that. But it was sputtering long before.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

ict, great question. EJ's minor shot selection tweak would be to simply not "settle" for so many 3s. Not that I want EJ to become Tyshawn, but since that is a straightforward apples2apples comparo (since we are judging the lead-combo-PG position, and they are both similarly physically gifted), we see Tyshawn was almost never jacking up that many 3s. Seems he shot 3-4 3atts per game. He spent alot of time personally putting fouls on enemy bigs, and thus spent alot of time on the FT line. EJ's trips to the line are not even close to Tyshawn's. Thats the adjustment Self kept talking about back in December. Driving the ball puts alot of pressure on the D. I almost think Calipari imprinted on WildBill a little bit, but I loved seeing Tyshawn go right at foes. I think the adjustment for EJs game is "get tougher" with your play. And when EJ does finish at the rim, usually it is ultraslick. Side benefit is that attack mode makes him look good to scouts. Good for him, good for ku down the stretch. SO, unfortunately, I realize 2 things: I concede EJ doesnt have Tyshawn's attack mindset to the same degree, and I am nonetheless asking EJ to "be" Tyshawn as thats what the team needs (& what Self has asked of him too.) Tharpe's issue with shooting is to not do it so soon in the shot clock. It would be a grinning discussion if he hit 60-70% of his quick shots, but that didnt happen. LOVE Tharpe's attack mentality, and I just know Self does too--just not Tharpe's judgement on when to shoot...

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Regarding KY: I might have mistyped...was trying to say we might have hit 20pts for the half instead of 13, not because Kevin would have hit 7pts, but because he might have hit 2pts AND also collected another couple of possessions as offensive rbnds, and we get another couple of shots from whoever (not just KYo). So my point about Kevin is he could have made his usual stamp on our 1st half possessions and thus given us a better shot at scoring a few more pts.

icthawkfan316 3 months, 1 week ago

4) - Self’s game management. It’s not all on the players. A lot of it is. Self isn’t out there shooting these woeful percentages. A lot of it is as simple as making open looks. We make open looks, we’re having different discussions. However, he has to shoulder a lot of the blame as well. Watching the game last night, some of the stuff he was doing was a joke. As HEM has pointed out, putting AW3 in the game cold (again) with a minute left. Does he know he’s eligible to play the whole game, not just that desperation last minute of play? I was actually a fan of what he was doing with pulling the starters (as Roy used to do), but you have to leave them out there for more than a minute of play. Players were in and out too quickly. Let Rio get into a flow. Traylor scored our first points and then disappeared. Perry starts both halves but didn’t see the court after subbing out both times. What was he doing (or not doing) that was so much worse than the rest of the team? And just circling back - more AW3 please.

5) - Tharpe. This could be as simple as reeling him in. He is still young, but he got a little confidence and it worked against him last night. He got us back in the game, then took us right back out. And while he does some things well, I still don’t see him as the answer at PG. Long-term I have a hard time envisioning him as our starter the next two years. Short-term, he might be the answer for cutting EJ’s minutes, but that can’t be the case come March. I still think it was a mistake to not be developing Adams, but Self was probably more comfortable with Tharpe’s knowledge of the system so Adams had to take a back seat.

Anyway, I think if KU can just start fixing a handful of things the confidence, swagger, & toughness will come back. And really, that is what made this team so good. We’re not blowing anyone away from a pure talent standpoint. But we have the best coach in the country (yes, I still believe that), and when things are right those intangibles are what carry this team to victories over the likes of Ohio State. I can’t wait to see how they come out Saturday. Rock Chalk!

OakvilleJHawk 3 months, 1 week ago

WOW....icthawkfan316 with a Jaybatethian-like posting.... .adding a touch of logic, a pinch of optimism and a dash of perspective. Just the recipe for a Hawk resurgence!!

icthawkfan316 3 months, 1 week ago

Thanks Oak.

In years past I've tended to put up longer posts, but this season have found myself too busy. Still get on everyday and at least read.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Self may be simply from the school of thought "you earn your time, then you play". That maxim plays out differently for each player. Sherron came in as a frosh and was "pure" from Day 1. But he didnt start his soph season, but sorta was a 6th starter on the bench, along with Kaun. Self played Marcus and Tyshawn as frosh because he had to. He tries to play Ellis, but he is not as far along as frosh Marcus was, painful to say, but true. He tried to play Selby. He was forced to play Xavier to the detriment of team chemistry. You got to be VERY crafty when you put in some youngster 'over' some upperclassman. Notice the delicate balance between Sherron and Mario's and Russell's mpg--they all 3 felt equal, and played well. Self may play a green kid, who then gets a quick hook after a bonehead play. That is another one of Self's criteria. So to all the ones who lament mpg for promising frosh (like we did for EJ), they are under very careful scrutiny as he wants the best 5 out there. NO WAY AW3 has the defense of Releford, or the ball-handling of a combo like EJ or Tharpe, or the shooting % of BMac. Thus he sits because of that 3-headed reason.

icthawkfan316 3 months, 1 week ago

I'm all for players earning their time, but maybe it's in how you define "earn". Certainly practice performance factors in, but come game day - who gives you the best chance to win? Like you say, he wants the best 5 out there, but sometimes I think he confuses the 5 he's most comfortable with and the best 5. They're not always the same.

Regardless, you say "NO WAY AW3 has the defense of Releford". Of course not, but in recent games the shine has come off of Releford's defense. He let Markel Brown go off. He was also on the TCU player who had a pretty good game. But even conceding that AW3 is no Releford on the defensive end, it's not just about that. If Travis is going to be non-existent on offense and we're basically playing 4-on-5 at that end, then if AW3 can provide you some punch there, it might be a net positive despite the drop off in defense. Right now Releford's man doesn't even have to respect him. His man just has to show a little out on the perimeter, and because Releford isn't even looking to score in the half-court, his man can cheat towards helping others, sagging into the middle for post help and better rebounding position, etc.

And no AW3 doesn't have the ball handling of EJ or Tharpe, but you could cut into their minutes by taking the time you have both of them on the court to having only one of them on the court.

As far as lamenting for guys like Rio to get more time, this is perhaps the only thing that I find myself in stong contrast with Self's philosophy. It has to do with player development. Self prefers to develop players almost exclusively in practice, rarely in games. He does this because I don't think he looks at the season as a campaign. He looks at it one game at a time. Or maybe he does look at it like a campaign, but in the heat of the game his instinct takes over to pull the young guys when the going gets rough and put back in the player he's most comfortable with. He won't risk sacrificing even one game to let a guy like Rio struggle through a game. We saw it Wednesday. He wanted to develop Perry. He wants to get him going. But things weren't going well so he buried him on the bench.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

To be brutally honest, ict, I also wish Self played green frosh alot more also. I see what Calipari does, and I only wonder if we miss out on creating potential March contributors. BUT, I also wonder if Self has seen what he needs to see in the closed practices (which makes Ellis an enigma, as his apparently studly practice playing hasnt translated over in live games). We fans want to see the new meat, but Self's already judged them, is my assumption. I think he tries to find a lineup by late Dec that he can go to war with in earnest in January conf play. I wanted to see EJ play as a frosh, cant believe he has less than 50ish days left!. I feel the same about Rio. He has tools, size, speed, and looks to have the right aggressive mentality. But he on a steep learning curve...

dhinkansas 3 months, 1 week ago

I don't know that anyone is in a state of panic. The reality is the team may have peaked too early. I think of the great win in Columbus, but the poor play of late...at West Virginia, at Texas, at Texas Tech was not a thing of beauty and they pulled the Iowa St game out their backsides. It may not be a year to make a deep March run....it's ok. KU Hoops are still the best show in town.

jackoman 3 months, 1 week ago

Hawk 90 is so very right. Releford can't be in the game for just defense. I hear that all the time and so stupid. He has got to start taking shots. He should be scoring at least 10-12 points a game as a 5th year senior. I hate watching somebody in the open and passing it off to someone else to shoot. Lack of Cofindence.

JCAR2510 3 months, 1 week ago

Well it is Friday! I have read espn "conversation" the "KUSPORTS" board rats, listened to countless radio "experts" and I have come to one conclution none of us has flipping clue what is going on with this team! We have to trust the coaching staff and get behind the players because last I checked, there are no free agent PF or PG out there who average 10 and 10 or 10 and 5 so as a lifelong hawk fan I am eagerly awaiting 3pm tomorrow.

By the way I woke up early this morning and found this! I was laughing the whole time and you what we are still "KANSAS!!"

DP AND AJ TAKE ON KU: MENS BBALL by KUAthletics

chuckberry32 3 months, 1 week ago

our problems would be solved if we could get this kid on the court...

http://www.ask.blinkx.com/watch-video/jaw-dropping-toddler-trick-shots/G4gPQpNU3opT_9QL-ZQrlw

KU 3 months, 1 week ago

EJ is a very fragile person, psychologically. Self knows this. It's not a knock on EJ. He's a good kid. He's a very sensitive kid. In a lot of areas in life, those are admirable qualities that will help you succeed, but not when your job is to be an assassin for a blue-blood basketball program.

Self is damned if he does sit him and damned if he doesn't. If he does sit him, EJ's psyche takes a hit because EJ feels inadequate. If he doesn't sit him, EJ's poor decision-making, turnovers and poor shooting give EJ's psyche a hit.

Don't expect his role to change much the rest of the season. The most we can hope for is that EJ will get on a huge roll like the one l documented that lasted from the aTm game through the Big 12 tourney and the NCAAs last year. That's wishful thinking. Our best options are to get Releford and BMac to take 15-18 shots per game, each.

cpjc 3 months, 1 week ago

Maybe it's the pressure of (having been) a #1 ranked team. It becomes a JOB with lots of pressure to keep that ranking. Not a joy to climb their way up.

And as for missed shots and tons of missed bunnies all season - I wonder if there needs to be a focus on mental follow through every time they put up a shot. Sometimes I wonder if they are thinking GET BACK on defense one second too soon...

OakvilleJHawk 3 months, 1 week ago

Based on two days of postings, articles, quotes and general information, the question is NOT WHAT the Jayhawks need to do to recover. The question is HOW AND IF the Jayhawks can actually do it.

Can they suddenly become a team of aggressive personalities to counteract the "bullying" they will now see till the end of the season?

Can they suddenly gain strength to fight off the behemoths that will come crashing into them?

Can they find the defensive focus to put pressure on our opponents and create offensive turnover opportunities?

Can they overcome the fear of shooting/not shooting the basketball when presented with the circumstance?

Can they recapture the swagger, confidence and mystique that so many great Kansas teams have displayed in the past?

Can the coaching staff find a balance between consistency of philosophy and adaptability to circumstance?

I offer no answers....only patience and let's wait and see. My heart will always say YES, however, my head says I DON"T KNOW.

BCRavenJHawkfan 3 months, 1 week ago

“We would take 19-3 before the season. Everybody would with the schedule we play. We’d take 19-3 right now."

Absolutely.

But the issue is not the record. It's the content of the record!

Had the three loses been to Michigan St., Ohio St., and Kansas St., that would be a bit more palatable, or even Michigan St., Ohio St., Kansas St.. But Okie St. at home and TCU as two of your three loses doesn't bolster your case for your 19 wins!

Reuben_J_Cogburn 3 months, 1 week ago

Two reasons why I am not concerned:

1.) Bill Self proved, last year, he can coach. End of story. He took a mediocre group and made them title contenders.

2.) Remember, if you will, back to 2005. Commentators and reports keep mentioning it....but think about that situation. We lose in Allen Fieldhouse to K-State. Two days later we lose in overtime at Missouri; per the great Moody free-throw debacle of 2005.

This, I thought back then, was the beginning of the dark ages of Kansas Basketball. Bill Self wasn't the right coach. We were heading toward oblivion. We had dropped two straight to our hated rivals.

Everyone refers to that stint because that was the last time we lost back-to-back conference games. But no one seems to recall what happened after that.

The following Saturday, we demolished Nebraska by 53, and went on a conference tear that included just one loss at Texas, but redeemed by the rematch in the Big XII Tournement Championship.

......

I don't know about you all, but for me, losing at home to KSUck; followed by a choke job in Columbia, was much worse than losing back-to-back games against Okie State and TCU.....regardless of the statistical significance behind the TCU loss.

Nothing comes easy, and this team just discoverd that. They've been hit, and the rebound is entirely up to them. But I believe, beyond all doubt, that Bill Self and his team will right the wrongs...and Phog Allen will make room for another banner.

The comments I've seen on here are complaining about our sense of entitlement. It is true that these players need to avoid that arrogance and play with heart and humility if they want to succeed from here on out.

But there's nothing wrong with KU fans feeling entitled to what is rightfully ours. Basketball tradition, success, and glory is our birthright. It's not arrogance, entitlement, or ego-centric. It's fact. It's history. It's legacy.

So, boys, keep your chins up, roll your sleeves back, and let's go claim what's ours.

Rock Chalk.

JCAR2510 3 months, 1 week ago

Year before lost 3 straight ! Bucknell loss 1st round! The 05-06 season as you mentioned lost 1st round to Bradley. But I guess after the TCU loss and 1st round stinker may be ok if we still won the league!!

tka 3 months, 1 week ago

Why can't it just be Saturday already? ROCK CHALK!

Rockn_Chalkn_KU 3 months, 1 week ago

I want to stay the course, but I think we are well past that. It is a mistake to let 10 years of success overshadow 5 bad days. It's time to go in a new direction. If we get the chance to pick up Quin Snyder, we dump Self and make the change.

tashe2 3 months, 1 week ago

I'm a die hard KU fan. I have "KU" tattooed on my right forearm.. with that in mind, I don't want to hear any crap about being a fair weather fan. I'm a "realist" fan. This team is the worst team in the Self era forsure, possibly the worst team since 81'. We have no true point guard, we have no rythem in our offense at all. Travis Releford is scared to shoot the ball, EJ has been playing worse than Tyshawn EVER did, and Bmac is turning into more of a volume shooter than anything else. Sure he scored 15 points vs. TCU but he went 6-16. That is unnacceptable.

Bottom line is, I'm ready for this season to be over. We will get bounced in the 2nd round of the tournament and then we can move onto next year.

This team is disgusting to watch.. I feel sorry for all the past players, coaches, alumni, boosters, etc for having to watch this miserable team play.

Thank the good Lord that we have a great recruting class coming in next year.

Reuben_J_Cogburn 3 months, 1 week ago

...fair weather fan

nuleafjhawk 3 months, 1 week ago

Tattooed fair weather fan........

tashe2 3 months, 1 week ago

call me what you want.. but I'm sorry, I've lost all faith in this team.. I still got faith in Bill though.. I just think his hands our tied with this soft team.

nuleafjhawk 3 months, 1 week ago

We're just messin with you man. Believe me, we feel your pain.

Reuben_J_Cogburn 3 months, 1 week ago

Oh I'm sorry....I misread.

You said you're not a fair weather fan.

Got confused. My apologies.

Rockn_Chalkn_KU 3 months, 1 week ago

Dang -- drama much? Yes this team has problems, and did just play a horrible game, but I think you go a bit far.

tashe2 3 months, 1 week ago

I think it would be taking it to far if we had played a good game and lost.. but we scored 13 points in the first half.. our shooting percentage was worse than a high school girls team... and all of this was coming off a loss in ALLEN.. I've never seen a KU team not be PISSED OFF and destroy the next opponent after a loss, little alone a loss in ALLEN.

Rockn_Chalkn_KU 3 months, 1 week ago

But you have. We lost a couple in a row 7 years ago, and 3 in a row 8 or so years ago.

Hawksboy88 3 months, 1 week ago

Fair weather fan. If you are a "true" fan, or a KU "realist", you are a realist that KU never gives up. We always come back swinging with our backs to the wall. Trav scared to shoot? One game, this whole season, he was scared to shoot. When was the last time a player scared to shoot was second on the team in scoring? Never. Unacceptable for Ben to go 6-16? That is out of his control dude. He can't make every shot fall. But man, you arent a true fan. All I see is a poser with a tattoo.

Cause if you are throwing in the towel now, you aren't a true Jayhawk. Cause true Jayhawks fight on. Rock Chalk.

tashe2 3 months, 1 week ago

What are you talking about? Are you out there on the court? NO, dont talk to me about fighting on. It doesn't matter if I "fight" on for this team or never watch another game. Stop getting butt hurt over a comment on a message board that will never relate to anything to the team or HCBS.

marchphog88 3 months, 1 week ago

I think he's talking about the idea of not "throwing in the towel" as a fan because we had a rough stretch. You're already writing this entire season off as a failure that will end with a second-round loss and wanting to get to next season. He's not suggesting that he or any of us is actually on the court. We're fans, not players. But as fans, we have obligations too--and one of those includes suffering with a team that needs your support.

How about this: why don't you just not bother watching next season either. We're going to be young and might have an even rougher season that this year. I'd hate to hurt your delicate eyes by being forced to watch such ugly basketball. Instead, why don't you just save yourself the heartache and root for... I dunno, a cheap way to remove that tattoo that this year's team has apparently made you embarrassed to sport.

marchphog88 3 months, 1 week ago

Fairweather fan with terrible decision-making skills (tattoo).

Anyone who looks at a single game shooting percentage as "unacceptable" for a guy who is shooting 50% on the year is demonstrating the very definition of a fairweather fan.

"I don't like that so it's UNACCEPTABLE!!!!!!"

But please, elaborate on how McLemore is a "volume" shooter. I'll help get you started with a McLemore stat--shots taken to points scored since conference play started.

[shots taken::points scored]

16::15 (TCU)

17::23

7::13

10::18

7::11

10::16

13::17

7::10

12::33 (ISU)

Just so we're all on the same page, that averages out to scoring 17.3 points per game while taking 10 shots per game. Not sure in what world that qualifies as a "volume scorer" or how anyone shooting 50% can be classified as a "volume scorer"

Reuben_J_Cogburn 3 months, 1 week ago

I say the same kind of stuff about KU football.

But this isn't KU football. This is Kansas Basketball, and you should never...NEVER...count them out or write them off.

And even though I curse our football program with a passion at times....I'm still watching and hoping every game.

Soldier up, pal.

Phog4ever 3 months, 1 week ago

How about just have some FUN!! The guys haven't looked like they are enjoying playing the game of basketball for weeks. No smiles on their faces, no energy, etc. Just go out there and have some fun playing the game you love! Rock Chalk!

PikesPeakSmitty 3 months, 1 week ago

If there's ever a year for a true Cinderella team to win the tourney, this is it. Right now I don't think it matters a lot which seed we are. There's very little difference right now between a 2 or 8 seed. For instance... #2 Arizona vs. #8 North Carolina.

eku757 3 months, 1 week ago

Patience. These guys will regroup under Coach Self and have a head of steam and some new confidence going into the tournament season. Almost seems as if all the seniors are bored playing in there 60ish + conference games. They will be hungry again soon and on a roll.

JayhawkRock78 3 months, 1 week ago

I have been frustrated watching us struggle a lot this year, even though we were winning. The last two games were hard to watch too. I'd say the first half of the TCU game was the worst basketball I've ever seen on TV. I'm done watching games live for a while. I'll use the DVR and wait until the outcome is known before I decide to watch it.

tashe2 3 months, 1 week ago

Thank you for noticing and pointing out the struggles with this team. Apparently not everyone on the message board "hawksboy88" didn't tune in the game on Wednesday. Maybe I'm being a little to harsh, but this team is not what you have come to expect from KU basketball or a Bill Self coached team.

What happens if we lose to K-state at home, Iowa State in Ames, and OK state in Stillwater? And that's just the games that might pose a threat, not the other games like TCU at home or Baylor on the road. Those games are give me games usually, but with this team, you never know.

nomansland 3 months, 1 week ago

I totally agree with you too. Just not alot of people posting on here after the TCU debacle.It killed a lot of confidence in the fanbase, including me. This team could drop 4-5 more games after a loss like that! 13 pts in first half? I couldn't believe what I was watching and I felt sorry for all the alums that were at the game in Ft. Worth. The players should give everyone a refund!! Hard to believe this is the same team from December.

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Why would you be afraid to watch the games? You know it cant be any worse than 13pts in the first half. Cant be. Besides, some of us that are alums will NEVER give up on the 'Hawks. Now various players may plateau, get hurt, go into slumps, etc...BUT I'll never give up on Bill Self. TCU just added spice to the conference race: Now what are the Hawks going to do? What is Bill Self going to do? Keep it fun. Heck, I went and played 2hrs of basketball the day after TCU, and even lowly little me outshot the Jayhawks...which by that point the whole thing was laughable. The ball's in the KU players' hands, lets see what they do with it.

raprichard 3 months, 1 week ago

Amen.

AsadZ 3 months, 1 week ago

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/play?id=8929063

Bill Self with Mike & Mike on ESPN Radio today

kik1958 3 months, 1 week ago

We need Josh Selby. LOL!

REHawk 3 months, 1 week ago

I've been mostly quiet since the meltdown, probably happily so in the eyes of posters who have grown tired of my mini-rants most of the season, calling for more minutes for AW3 and Rio. I'm a guy who still fumes over the lack of minutes for freshman Russ Rob, a player who might have helped rest and revive Miles and Lankford when they ran out of gas by March. Maybe Andrew and Rio will never become the contributors whom Russell was, after he decidend not to transfer, then returned as a major piece in the puzzle his last 3 years. They might not possess Russell's tenacity or potential. And I wish to make clear that I am happy, over-all, with Bill Self's successes at the helm of Jayhawk hoops. I truly feel that no other coach in the nation could have matched his wins and league titles for KU. That said, I think he is too hardnosed and hardheaded about his #9 and #10 player. Since Christmas, something has been lacking in this program. Perhaps jaybate has hit part of the nail on the head in his theory that second semester of NCAA Div. 1 basketball mutates away from a finesse game into more of a muscleball scenario. I do not live in Lawrence, have not attended a game this year, have merely watched from my TV screen and read almost everything available about current Jayhawk basketball. And I am certainly no psychologist or current or former basketball coach. However, a thought niggles somewhere in the recesses of my mind that the gradually imploding advancement of this team might have as much to do with coaching stresses as with player shortcomings.

Reuben_J_Cogburn 3 months, 1 week ago

Stop me if I'm wrong, and I don't relish saying this..........

......but I just can't help but think this is all somehow Brady Morningstar's fault.

OakvilleJHawk 3 months, 1 week ago

RJC..sorry pal, not Brady's...Turner Gill's!!

nuleafjhawk 3 months, 1 week ago

Mangino probably had a hand in it as well......

ralster 3 months, 1 week ago

Ya, Oak, someone posted that TCU won because they had god on their side (TxChristianU)...but that didnt help Gill get any wins...I guess he could have bought some Ws for us with the $$,$$$,$$$ he got, but I digress...

marchphog88 3 months, 1 week ago

If anyone is thinking that they don't want to watch anymore because of how bad it was on Wednesday, please take this friendly advice:

Don't. Watch, that is.

There are plenty of KU fans who will live and die WITH their team and who will proudly watch this team fight to the end, even if the season ends up finishing with disappointment. We don't need the types who feel that quality basketball is OWED to them in exchange for their eyes.

This team displayed some serious flaws. There are a few fans who would point to our record and ignore the problems, but I think most of us are aware enough to recognize the flaws. However, the true fans amongst us are going to keep watching in spite of those flaws, in hopes that this team will figure out the problem and improve, the same way countless, differently-composed Jayhawk teams have in the past. You see, we love the Jayhawks and would rather watch them go down in flames than not watch them at all. THAT is the definition of a "realist" fan. Not getting pissy because our team is struggling and taking our ball (eyes) and going home.

Some Jayhawk fans simply need to grow the [expl.] up.

OakvilleJHawk 3 months, 1 week ago

I agree..I even question those fans who tape the games and watch them later even though they have the time to watch them live.

Fan synergy transfer requires same time generation of transmission...but I'm sure you all knew that. :)

Emery 3 months, 1 week ago

I think the root of KU's problems will be found in the answer to this question. Why did Travis Releford take only 1 shot during the TCU game while Johnson/Tharpe took 27 shots?

Reuben_J_Cogburn 3 months, 1 week ago

Wednesday....Opposite Day.

Apparently they decided to do the exact opposite of what makes sense.

Crazy game, man. Crazy game.

ironhead80 3 months, 1 week ago

The players on this team for the most part have been reserves and there learning how to be frontline players for the best div 1 bball programs in the country. I see them make some good plays trying to go to the basket and make plays, the ball was just not going down in the basket. Rele, Tharpe and Elijah especially tried to make moves to the hole and I feel in the remaining games the effort well be made in to made baskets, because these guy's work to hard not to get it to happen. They'll realize and probably already see that there the only ones out their and they have to rely on themselves. The problem that probably won't be fixed until next season is a playmaker at the 4, I just don't see it happening this season.

How do you go from where you are to where you want to be? I think you have to have an enthusiasm for life. You have to have a dream, a goal, and you have to be willing to work for it. Jimmy V

by ironhead80

yates33333 3 months, 1 week ago

The regular comments that the 2007-08 team lost three games caused me to check on the three losses. They were to Big 12 co-champion Texas by 3 points (Texas was 31-7 and loser to Memphis in the elite 8), to K-State by 9 points (K-State was 21-12 and loser in the NCAA second round to Wisconsin), and Oklahoma State by 1 point (OSU was 17-16 and loser in the first round of the NIT). All three games were away games. Compare those records to TCU which has won six games. Other than KU their best wins were over UAB (10-13), Navy (6-18), and Rice (4-17). How they beat KU defies logic and common sense.

lrahardja 3 months, 1 week ago

Time to sharpen the offensive schemes, draw some new plays.

lasthorsethief 3 months, 1 week ago

You know, I'm not a coach or a player or even anybody important. But I love my KU basketball!
I have 2 observations.
First, where the H?!@# is the bench?!!! When Morningstar and Brady and all the other Walk Ons (or non-starters) {I'm talking to Self, Manning, and all the other stars-in-high-school-want-to-be-stars-at-KU} were sitting on the bench, they were the best cheerleaders in the country... where is the bench at? Second, who did we replace Danny with? We need some NBA big man experience. Scott POLLARD is NOW! What about Paul Pierce in a year or two? When we lose a game or two, how do we get it back? Nothing can replace EXPERIENCE. We have to have an NBA existance. Is it just me, or am I bleeding blue alone?!!!!! Huahhh!!!!

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Staying the course: Bill Self, Jayhawks not panicking over skid

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"I don't like that so it's UNACCEPTABLE!!!!!!"

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