A kick in the teeth: Late FG lifts Owls past KU

A field goal from Rice kicker Chris Boswell sails over a pack of lunging Jayhawks to win the game for the Owls 25-24 on Saturday, Sept. 8, 2012 at Memorial Stadium.

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KU coach Charlie Weis postgame: Rice

KU coach Charlie Weis' postgame comments following his team's 25-24 loss to Rice on Sept. 8, 2012.

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KU coach Charlie Weis talks after loss to Rice

KU coach Charlie Weis talks after his team's 25-24 loss to Rice on Sept. 8, 2012.

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About 30 minutes after the final horn sounded on Kansas University’s 25-24, fall-from-in-front collapse against Rice on Saturday at Memorial Stadium, KU senior Daymond Patterson sat with a bag of ice on his hand, a slight shrug in his shoulders and a stunned look on his face.

One by one the questions came, and Patterson did his best to answer them.

“What went wrong?” “Why did the offense struggle so much in the second half?” “Where do the Jayhawks go from here?”

In the middle of one inquiry, the roar of motorcycle engines came from Patterson’s phone in his pocket. That was his ring tone, and on the other end was former KU teammate AJ Steward, now a graduate assistant at Rice.

“Look who’s calling,” said Patterson, unable to hide his laughter even though all he wanted to do was scream.

The phone call was no surprise. The loss was. And with that came the beginning of what figures to be an interesting ride.

“This is a new challenge,” KU coach Charlie Weis said. “Because now it’s, ‘Let’s see what they’re gonna do after they lose a game like this.’ Am I gonna have people throwing in the towel, or am I gonna have more people stepping up to try to make it right?”

KU (1-1) had plenty of opportunities to make Saturday’s outcome right but failed to capitalize each time. The offense was shut out in the fourth quarter, the defense missed a few crucial tackles in situations that would’ve changed — if not iced — the game, and the field-goal team connected on just one of three attempts, missing from 53 and 40 yards. In a one-point loss, when failure in any area is magnified, hiccups in all of them proved catastrophic.

“All three elements of our team had an opportunity to win the game, and we didn’t, and therefore all three failed,” Weis said.

After overcoming a slow start, the Jayhawks took the upper hand with a 29-yard field goal from Ron Doherty and a touchdown pass from quarterback Dayne Crist to tight end Jimmay Mundine late in the first quarter.

KU’s 10 unanswered points turned a 3-0 deficit into a 10-3 lead. After a one-yard TD plunge from freshman linebacker Schyler Miles late in the first half, KU maintained its lead at 17-10 and, later, expanded it to 24-13 on an eight-yard run from junior running back Taylor Cox. Cox’s TD run came on the first drive of the third quarter and capped a swift 75-yard march.

A crowd of 44,683 saw the Jayhawks, who finished with 195 yards rushing and 339 yards of total offense, manage just 100 yards the rest of the way, including just seven combined yards on their final two drives.

“We had some untimely penalties, we had some bad plays where we had losses and didn’t move the chains, and that really hurt us,” said Patterson, who led KU with 55 yards on seven receptions. “Football’s a game of momentum, and you just have to have that swagger, just knowing that you’re better than that other guy. Somebody has to make a big play to get the team going again, and we didn’t have that, especially on the offensive side in the fourth quarter.”

While the Jayhawks struggled to make plays, Rice started cooking. First came a 93-yard drive that tailback Charles Ross capped off with a two-yard TD run. A couple of drives later, Rice cornerback Bryce Callahan intercepted Crist for the second time to set up the Owls with a first-and-10 at their own 47, down two, with 3:47 to play.

The fact that KU still had the lead was the result of a solid play from senior linebacker Tunde Bakare, who tied for the team lead with nine tackles. Bakare’s hit in the back of the end zone on the two-point attempt that followed Ross’ TD run forced tight end Luke Wilson out of bounds and kept the Jayhawks in front.

But Callahan’s second interception quickly followed, and the KU defense then misfired on a couple of must-make plays. The first came on a fourth-and-four near midfield. After Rice quarterback Taylor McHargue fired a swing pass to tight end Vance McDonald, two Jayhawks had a shot at a tackle before the first-down marker, but both Dexter Linton and Greg Brown overran the play, and McDonald plowed ahead for seven yards and a first down.

“We had an opportunity to end the game,” senior defensive end Toben Opurum said. “The game’s over if we make that play.”

Three plays later, on a third-and-seven from the KU 37, McHargue escaped what seemed destined to be a massive hit by defensive end Josh Williams for no gain and instead scurried for 12 yards and a first down.

That made Chris Boswell’s 45-yard game-winning field goal try seem a lot more manageable, and after KU called timeout to ice him, Boswell nailed the kick.

“I give it to Rice,” senior cornerback Brown said. “They competed ’til the end.”

That, more than the loss even, was the most disappointing part of Saturday’s setback for Weis. He knew what he was stepping into when he took this job last December, and he did not believe for a second that he would be able to walk in, wave a magic wand and send the KU faithful home smiling night after night. He did, however, expect to put a product on the field that would compete from start to finish.

“The No. 1 thing they have to understand,” Weis said. “is it’s not OK to lose. It’s not OK to lose a close one. It’s not OK. We’re supposed to win games, not play close games.”

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jayhawk_sean 8 months, 2 weeks ago

By now, defensive players should know how to tackle. Today, they did not. Pathetic display of defense from a "defense that is supposed to be improved". Gonna be a long year!

cshjhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Not only that, defenders need to catch balls when the opponents QB throws the ball directly into their hands and our QB's need to be accurate on throws. Looks like everyone including the coaches, gave up during the 4th quarter. Poor performance but move on.

marchphog88 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Oh, give me a break. Mangino got a raw deal from Perkins with the whole way everything went down, but Mangino was NOT the long-term solution at head coach. Take away the serendipitous Orange Bowl year and his resume was not impressive. And his in-game decision-making was highly suspect.

The suffering we're going through now isn't a result of running Mangino off so much as it is a result of hiring a complete amateur to replace him.

jhox 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Mangino was/ is part of the problem with this team. If he hadn't quit recruiting quality players, we would have higher quality players in the Junior and Senior class right now. Instead, this thing is a mess, and Weis can't be expeted to turn it around over night. Until we get a defensive line that can pressure the QB it is going to be an up hill battle.

Another thing that must change is the attitude of the fans. Had more of them returned to the stadium after their half time beers in the parking lot, and been loud and supported our players, we may have pulled the game out. It is truly embarassing how many of our fans leave at halftime, even when we're playing pretty well and winning. That kind of thing isn't going to make recruiting any easier on our coaching staff. Weis has to be wondering what he's gotten himself into. We want a better football program, but too many of our fans are not willing to do what it takes to help build one. It wasn't just the student section that cleared out at halftime yesterday. When the players quit giving effort (as they have the last couple of times we played K State) I have no problem with fans getting disgusted and leaving. But when the players are playing hard, they deserve our support. Period.

Imagine how great it would be to have a football program we could be proud of, and how much fun it would be to watch games on a beautiful fall Saturday in Memorial Stadium. We, as fans, can help make that happen, but it won't happen without our support.

ahpersecoachingexperience 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Bag of rice > Rice

Bangkok_Jayhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

This one hurt... We needed to sweep our non conference schedule for some wins to build towards respectability. Still positive about the future and the direction of the program but this loss was a big set back for our boys this year.

swjhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

It's the same old song, almost year after year. Oh well, only 51 days until basketball season. Is this new, expensive coach paid for wins or does he get paid for this type of football. The 53 yard field goal attempt in the third quarter made me turn off the tv and find something worthwhile to do.

ralster 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Stick to basketball, buddy. Come back as the fair-weather fan you revealed yourself to be in about 2 yrs, when Weis has built up the train of coaching, recruiting, etc...into a more reliable "machine". Keep your 1-game predictions for those that care to believe them.

BleedCandB 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Its gonna be hard to recruit when your team loses to Rice at home.

Come back in 2 years when Weis is still struggling to get us bowl elegible.

KUHawkhead 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Wrong. Gill and Lew are the ones to blame, not Weis. This cupboard is BARE. The only players contributing worth a damn are Mangino leftovers and Weis hired guns. Yesterday hurt, but when you look at how bare this cupboard is, it is not unexpected.

We WILL improve a lot between now and December.

Kirk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Yep. Did anyone even ask Weis about that 53 yard field goal decision? We are too polite about football around here. A basketball coach would have been skewered relentlessly for an analogous head scratcher. He probably would have addressed himself: I made a really stupid decision.

hawkinator 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Same ol' KU.

waywardJay 8 months, 2 weeks ago

All that blaming Turner Gill sure looks idiotic now. Certainly it's his fault we lost today.

KansasRedLegger 8 months, 2 weeks ago

What are you talking about? Who blamed Gill for today's loss? We probably would have lost by thirty with Gill still coaching.

ralster 8 months, 2 weeks ago

wayward, I swear to high heaven, did you really type that??? Did you realize Gill's defense was dead-last out of over 300 Div1 teams last year? I am certain you are aware Weis did a major house-cleaning when he arrived, and we have 41 new faces on the roster. New schemes to learn, new coaches, new mindset. So you honestly think that would all be installed by now, Game 2???? Turner Gill is 1 of the biggest football idiots I have ever seen, and I would tell that to his face. He was the first one out of the film room back when he was the handoff QB for Nebr., and his teams at ku degenerated to his lack of accountability. Look, Gill's daughter worked in KU Athletic Dept. because he was a longtime friend of Perkins. That is how he got his $10mil contract with NO out-clause (because he was Lew's friend). Lew is gone, and the 1st class mess he created by giving a personal friend a sweet deal, is simply a system-level rebuilding job that will take more than 1 season to change. Most realists on this site are giving us a likely 3-4 win season this year...so sit back and gather more data. I will blame Turner Gill (&Lew) as much as I want, because it is 100% justified--not "idiotic". (Your ridiculously premature comment stands corrected). Dont take this personal, but some of us alums are behind the football team for the long haul...(& womens basketball, and tennis, and other KU sports). No fair weather fan here! RCJH. Any short-term fair-weather types, please get your KU fix from men's basketball. We will inform you when it is "safe and reliable" to come root for our football team...(sorry, couldnt resist)

jayhawk_sean 8 months, 2 weeks ago

a bazillion!

Rockn_Chalkn_KU 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Thank you ralster. I rarely post, but I'm very appreciative of your comments. I'm an alum who hates to see us lose, but still attends all the games (well, I missed 2 home football games in the last 8 years due to out of town family commitments). It sucks to see us lose, but I'm in it for the long haul.

waywardJay 8 months, 2 weeks ago

nor am I a fair weather fan, Ralster.

I just disagree. One thing we certainly can agree on, is Rice should not have beaten Kansas.

marchphog88 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Just so we're clear, a lot of the team that took the field today was Gill's players, not to mention the fact that this is the second game of the Weis Era. Gill had two full seasons to show all of us that he couldn't coach his way out of a wet paper bag.

I'm honestly stunned that anyone still wastes their energy defending him.

texashawk10 8 months, 2 weeks ago

How many of the normal players were Gill's? I see 4 that played significant snaps during the game. 14 of KU's 22 starters on offense and defense are Mangino recruits. Gill may have had to convince a handful of those guys to stay, but those players still committed to KU while Mangino was the coach. 5 more of the starters are Charlie Weis recruits which means that only 3 of the 22 starters yesterday were Turner Gill recruits. Explain to me how most of the players that played were Turner Gill players when only 3 of his recruits were in the starting lineup and only a 3-4 more are on the 2 deep and playing regularly? Seriously, 19 of the 22 starters yesterday were recruited to KU by either Mark Mangino or Charlie Weis and you're still blaming Gill's players for yesterday? Please explain that logic to me because the facts say you are full of crap on that one.

waywardJay 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Someone using logic to defend an argument. Well Done!

bladejhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Where is Mangino???

Mangino_Maniac 8 months, 2 weeks ago

He's waiting patiently to take over at K-State whenever Snyder retires... ;-)

danmoore 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Can't rule it out. It would be sweet revenge for Mark.

Table_Rock_Jayhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Perkins is the root of our football program woes. His decisions made back in the fall of 2009 set us back an unknown amount of years. It will never happen...but I would love to bring back Mangino.

dagger108 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Mangino is home thinking about how his first team in 2002 had a record (2–10, 0–8) than his pathetic predecessor. Ominous but true.

Table_Rock_Jayhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Several folks that regularly get on these message boards said I was being a "Debby Downer" when I predicted two things.

1: That we would only win 3 games this season. 2: That our D-line won't be much improved from last year.

We need a SERIOUS upgrade in talent level with our future recruiting classes.

Bill Snider is the only coach I know that can take Kansas farm boys...and compete for conference championships. Otherwise...it's not realistic to expect us to go to a bowl game this season...like several posters thought.

My opinion on the Charlie Weis hire is still up in the air...but I'm concerned that his savvy pull...hasn't landed any 4 or 5 star talent in this next upcoming recruiting class. My predictions...if he doesn't get the talent level needed in this next class...and we only win 2 or 3 games this season...his days of being a Jayhawk will be short-lived. And I'm not saying he will be fired...I'm saying that he will make the decision on his own...to take an Offensive Coordinator position back in the NFL.

ralster 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Forget Mangino, buddy. Looks pretty stupid to say "would love to bring back Mangino" after 2 games into a whole new system, and 41 new roster faces. Pretty stupid because you fail to acknowledge this is a major, major rebuilding job, isnt it. But if you acknowledged that, you never would have posted "bring Mangino back" after 2 games, would you. I wont call you a Debbie Downer. No, I personally am a bit "down" because of missed tackles and offensive sputterring late, but I will absolutely call out a just-plain-stupid comment. These kids are fighting, or even beginning to learn how to fight for a full game...and you want to cut & run to another system already. Worse than those students that leave early, you actually said/wrote something stupid for the players/team/fans to digest...well, I'll throw it up back on you. Did I say "stupid"? Get your brain back from the bottom of Table_Rock_Lake. Methinks it drowned?

BleedCandB 8 months, 2 weeks ago

It doesn't matter if it's a major rebuilding job, KU should not lose a game to Rice at home. We showed a lot of the same mistakes that we showed when Gill was the coach (poor tackling, looking uninterested in the game in the 4th qtr., unable to make a critical stop on D, unable to make a critical play on O, and on and on). This is why people are pissed after this game. I'm pissed. I just hope the players and coaches are pissed (which would be a change from the last 2 seasons). If we play the way we did yesterday, we likely won't win another game this season.

GoHawkYourself 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Man, it would be really bad if we lost to UNLV by 14 or to Bowling Green by 23, then go on to lose to K-State 0-64 . . . That was Mangino's first season, we went 2-10. Rebuilding a program in football is a lot harder than rebuilding a basketball program, you have way too many people on the field and on the staff to reevaluate. We're 2 games in to his first season, give it some time.

Table_Rock_Jayhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Ralster - maybe you should think before you type. The "major major rebuilding job" that you refer too...is my whole premises as to why we win maybe 3 games this season. Been saying that through the entire off-season. Wait...you're probably one of the many...who said we would win 7 games this year and go to a bowl game...and that our D-line will be able to compete in the Big 12. Just keeping it realistic and tempering the expectations.

By the way...methinks you're one of those introverted geeks that likes to throw down and hide behind your computer screen.

Kirk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

You predicted 3 wins? You ARE an optimist. I had us at 2. (I think I'm an optimist also.)

texashawk10 8 months, 2 weeks ago

For those of you who still like to complain about the defense, let me ask you something. What do you realistically expect from a unit that is on the its 5th different coordinator in the past 6 years (2007: Bill Young, 2008-09: Clint Bowen, 2010: Carl Torbush, 2011: Vic Shealy, and 2012: Dave Campo) and has changed its base defense each of the past 5 seasons (2008: 4-3, 2009: 4-2-5, 2010: 4-3, 2011: 3-4, 2012: 4-3)? Is it realistic to expect any consistency or significant improvement from a defense that has a different person with a different philosophy telling them what to do every year? If you want to see noticeable, significant improvement in KU's defense, there has to be consistency in the coaching staff so the players are hearing the same message from the same voices long enough to actually figure out what is expected of them. If KU has pretty much the same defensive staff 3 years from now, I can almost guarantee this defense will be significantly improved over where they're at today. Continuity in the coaching staff is one of the trademarks of just about every major program out there. Does anybody honestly believe Bill Self would be as successful as he is if he was having to hire new assistants every offseason? Sorry for the rant, but it just amazes me that people are so blind to see that one of the biggest problems in KU football is the complete lack of stability among the coaching staff over the past few years.

ralster 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Well said. To me, the defense already looks better than last year, as they seem to be disciplined enough to be in better position--and we are getting some pressure on the QB--although we still need a big influx of talent & speed with a real recruiting season for Weis. But for now, a needed reminder lesson in sure handed tackling for 60min...not just 56min. I am saying nothing more than what the defensive players are quoted above saying. 2 different chances to make a tackle that ends. the. game. Keep our heads up, keep fighting.

texashawk10 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if that is a factor because I would guess a lot of college level DC's expect that their players already know proper tackling techniques coming out of high school when they very well may not know how to watch a ball carrier's belly button because they can't juke that body part or to get their head in front of a ball carrier when he's tackling him from the side because there's less chance of the tackle being broken. Just stuff like that that a player may not know how to do and a coach doesn't emphasize those things because he assumes his players already know stuff like that.

With all the position changes that happen in high school and college, players may very well not ever learn those proper techniques in high school because they are getting by on pure athleticism. Since I'm not at KU's practices, I couldn't tell for sure if Campo has the defense working on how to properly tackle someone although I suspect he doesn't given how long he had been in the NFL prior to this year. That's a question that I'm curious if Tait would know the answer to or not and I'll try to remember to ask him that this week when he does his Q&A with us on the off chance that he knows the answer.

ralster 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Wow. Just look at the fools commenting--already making summary judgements after game number TWO with 41 new roster faces, totally new coaches and schemes, etc...(thus easily earning their "fool" moniker). To see those 2 "missed arm tackles" or whiffed tackles by the defense is frustrating on Rice's final drive. Did you notice one of our defensive starters out that whole last sequence? One of the names mentioned above in the article that did the "whiff" wasnt one of the main players all game long. Also frustrating is to see Crist throw that 2nd interception. Hey, this is football, and the little things add up. 2 missed FGs. 2 missed tackles to ice the game. Clearly the KU passing game (which is very dependent on timing/finesse) is a couple of steps behind the running game. Which makes us a bit 1-dimensional for now. People will dare Crist to beat us with the pass. And Crist's last start was 1 calendar year ago. His confidence and sync-ing with the receivers will come, but the games do not get any easier. Will we win every close game we get in? Maybe not yet...(that's my analysis, as we are clearly, clearly, clearly a work in progress). Someone mentioned recruiting...Yes, I would like to see what Weis can do if given an actual full year to recruit (which he did not get this off season). Credit Rice for actually making some plays, but our run game looked better--which makes me wonder about some of Weis' offense not installed yet. That interception by Crist late was absolutely critical error. Where was the short yardage pass or run. We dont even know yet what our own highest % 7yd play is (as fans). We just havent seen enough of this team's plays and execution to know. But apparently some here feel they do already know? How about giving me some more foolish tips for my next Vega$ trip? Not giving a new program and the players time to correct their mistakes week to week is the epitome of clueless football fans. Pains me to say that some of the KStutter football fans have better football sense than some of the "ku" fans here. If you dont understand just how bad Gill let KU get, and that a ground-up overhaul takes more-than-2-games to master (try 1-2yrs, at least judge 5-7games played, eh???), then you "ku" people ought to stick to rooting for Self's basketball team. But recall it took Self into year 3 to get all his players, and coach em up to his standard. And alot of "ku" people still wanted Roy back up until a few yrs ago. Think big pix. please?

bad_dog 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Nice use of the Rice logo for your avatar. What's the matter, Tulane reject your application?

Oseashawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

We need more alums like ralster.

This is college sports, win or lose ..just enjoy the game.

After all, 1-1 is better than 0-2.

jjinks 8 months, 2 weeks ago

It's too bad he doesn't have the talent to run the kind of offense he wants to run. I'm kind of like Ralster in figuring the talent level wasn't going to be there, and it isn't, but they do have room for improvement but 0 wins in the conference is highly likely. Turner Gil would have looked a lot worse.

99yard_run 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Turner Gill won his second game!! Keep dreaming fools, keep your heads buried in the sand! This is exactly what happened to HCCW at ND, his teams were pathetic! Same thing here!

ralster 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Sticking to pure football commentary: I think with the house-cleaning Weis did, and the new mindset being expected, and the new strength & conditioning...you almost could say now the coaches just need to see week to week how these kids perform and THEN it is clear what coaching corrections they may need to give. Yes, that is a captain-obvious comment, but maybe some need that reminding? The defense played fair through most of the game. Campo told the announcers prior to the game that a dual threat QB was the "toughest opponent to defense for a full game". Takes a lot of discipline. I thought this was a stay-at-home, albeit "vanilla" defense, that will get more and more skilled with experience and coaching. BIGGEST LESSON for the defense is gotta make plays til the final whistle. Call losing a close, very winnable game a BIG teaching-point game...not just for the defense, but for the offense also (Crist and receivers). I thought the O-line and running game is serviceable already. But the versatility of packages to convert a critical 3rd & 7 is just not developed yet...that 2nd interception was, to me, the worst play of the game. Armchair QBs would suggest a run play or draw or dumpoff to Pierson in space...but those reps and faith in such plays may not exist (yet). The screen attempts have been downright ugly (so far). Work in progress.

dagger108 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Like CW booting players from the team, you could provide increase by subtraction if you left.

ralster 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I saw Tulane got their butts handed to them--what do you say about that, eh? Thanks for posting here, but a rebuilding job takes more than 1 offseason, doesnt it? Wish some "ku" fans acted/posted like they knew something about football. Any football. Gosh, can we talk NFL even to get people thinking about football? Brees, Rogers, KC, Pats, etc...

bad_dog 8 months, 2 weeks ago

The Rice puppet sock was already banned under the former user name KSA 21-3503. As you all know, this is the Kansas statutory reference to indecent liberties with a child.

What do you expect from someone that would choose that as their user name?

ralster 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Ahh, so manginorhoolz = the same guy banned with the screenname KSA 21-3503 (indecent liberties with a child). How about you get the heck off this site?

99yard_run 8 months, 2 weeks ago

5-7......... at least you own to it.....

springtxhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I've got some English for you.

Please go away. You are a negative person.

You are also a complete tool.

This was a tough loss and we need to improve, but I'll be back next week.

Rice is certainly not as good as TCU. They are probably a + 21 in a head to head.

But, that is irrelevant. We lost. On to next week .

Go, fight, win Jayhawks!!

I will say one critical thing. On 4th and 2 in the fourth quarter, Weiss should have gone for the first down vs kicking the field goal.

That was an opportunity to put the game away.

Unfortunately, we opted to kick a field goal which likely wasnt enough points to win, anyway.

Chris1955 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Regarding the 53 yard field goal attempt on 4th and 2, I think that Charlie's NFL experience got the better of him. In college football it's much easier to pick up the 1st down on 4th and 2, than make a 53 yard field goal. Why he thought this was a good idea, given the weak legs in our kicking game is a mystery to me.

steveyea 8 months, 2 weeks ago

A poor football team shaky win first week, humiliating loss second week, both to weak opponents, and now the Big 12 beatings will begin. Sad.

Brock 8 months, 2 weeks ago

The Hawks drove the ball on the ground and punched across a nice TD to open the second half. After that - nada. They fooled around trying to extablish the passing game. Fizzle!

IlBastardo 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I should have been well-acquainted with the flippancy of many ku football fans after watching them being shepherded into the mother goose camp after Mangino, only to become discipline junkies this summer with the inception of the Weis and Holsopple regime.

Your dilettante status in the art of toughness is painfully evident, however, as many of you obviously misunderstood the lesson of Holsopple's "Toughness 101" as it was advertised on this site a short time ago.

It's useless to talk about toughness before you've faced any adversity. Now we have, so here is the CliffsNotes version of "Toughness 101" for the dedicated among you:

"Do you have enough heart to show up every day and are you mentally tough enough to battle no matter how you feel?"

"It’s gonna be hard. That’s part of the deal. It is hard. Life is hard. But you gotta keep the pedal to the metal and keep on driving. You won’t break through the wall if you slow down."

(Weis after SDSU 99-yard touchdown) "I don’t think for one second that anyone thought, ‘Oh, here we go again.’ The fans may have thought that, but none of the players did."

I'm embarrassed that our head coach would think that of our fans, and crestfallen to discover he has us pegged after one summer. What right do we have to sit in the stands like fat cats expecting a kind of success we've essentially never had and, worse, to give up at the first troubling sign? We will never get the thoroughbred, one-man armies. This whole program from the players to the fans needs to understand we have some serious dues to pay for another shot at relevance, and it will be a multi-year project. If you're going to stand behind the commitment to toughness and grit, you damned-well better do it on the weekends, not just during the week, and after the losses, not just the wins. Above all, expect a little from yourselves, not just the players. They shouldn't have to earn your support. It has to start somewhere. If you love KU football, love it for what it is. Only a very miniscule percentage of fans can reasonably expect a win from their team every time they step on the field. In life, the vast majority of us have to content ourselves with successes others would turn their nose up at. That doesn't mean I took less joy in beating SDSU than an OSU fan did in pounding Savannah State. If you want to be the belle of the ball, there are plenty of better places to do it. If you can't get dirt under your fingernails without bitching, I don't know why you came here to begin with. Shame on everyone who contributes to that stadium being empty next weekend, if that should happen. If you sow the seeds of apathy, don't complain when it starts to sprout up on the field.

tical523 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Awesome, eloquent. Two thumbs up, totally agree.

AtlJaybird 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Awesome Post!!! I know you've gotten irritated with my replies in the past (deservedly so), but I had to commend you on this one. I really hope folks take your eloquent words to heart. Thank You!

ralster 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Excellent post. Weis has likely heard first-hand from Bill Self about the "unrealistic" fans we have here at KU. Those quotation marks are directly Bill Self's words from 2yrs ago. Weis & his staff are legitimate football minds, who also need to learn what the current roster is/isnt capable of executing. That will take several real games to judge, coach, re-judge, etc...That's all. Work in progress is all any analyst can say. The doom prophecies and NDame comparisons are stupidly premature. Sucks to lose, but got a lot of work to do to become a "reliable" (not break-your-heart) team. So come back to ku football when that day happens, so yall dont get your feelings hurt by a loss. (to whomever that applies.). RCJH. I'll stand behind our players trying to get better, and our coaching staff 100%. Doesnt matter if we only win 0,1,2,3 more games or not...

april28 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Weis has made two big mistakes so far: not giving a scholarship to a top-notch kicker, and attempting a 53-yard field goal with an unproven kicker. Change either of those decisions and we are 2-0.

Look at the two most successful coaches in modern KU history: Mason and Mangino. Both had horrible teams their first years. Both brought the program up to respectability, both petered out.

This is a really tough job. We have the caliber of coaching staff who can get the program back to respectability. It will take 3 years to do it.

AirCapJay 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I don't think it was the failure of the kicking game that cost us a win. Everyone including Weis has to be shocked at the poor play by Crist. He was advertised as being the next Joe Montana and so far has not proved he is any better than what we had the last 2 years.

Our running game is where Weis should put emphasis. We have a real chance there to do something. We need a QB that can run too. We need to take a chance and mix the QB job up a little. Make Crist really earn that spot instead of just giving it to him for his last year.

april28 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Agreed - did not mean to blame the loss on the kicking, but successful kicking would have won the game. Doherty was recruited as a punter, I believe, so he is doing the best that he can.

I've got to think that Weis goes one of two ways with Crist: give him the first half against TCU to see if he can get it together, or ride him all season and give redshirts to the two back-ups.

My opinion from the spring game was that Heaps is the real deal - I believe that it is his job to lose next season.

AtlJaybird 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Good points. And thank you for keeping everyone in check the past 24 hours. I agree with you that this team is getting better, and we all need to be patient. I still think we are going to get the passing game figured out, and that Crist is going to have a big year. If we get the passing issues worked out, with the running game we already have, and our best running back returning after TCU, it could get real exciting. And I like the improvement in our defense. They will only get better as they gain confidence and more experience. I also think Rice has a much better team than anyone realizes.

jayhawkintexas 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Like Barry Switzer says, "it's not the X's and the O's. It's the Jimmy's and the Joe's". While this loss really hurts, I think we are seeing improvements from the last two years in players. It's going to take a while and we may get blown out a few times but I think the attitudes and new culture with the football team is going to pay off in the future. Hang in there, Coach Charlie!!

texashawk10 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Switzer can say that because his OU teams were athletically superior to 99% of the college teams out there and could get away with not being the best X's and O's program. Hell, look at Calipari in basketball, Kentucky didn't win the title last year because of how well they schemed against KU in the title game, they won because they had superior athlete's to KU. When you don't have the "Jimmy's and the Joe's" to compete on a weekly basis, the X's and O's are how you steal games from better teams. KState football is a perfect example of this. On paper, they should not have been a 10 win team last year and shouldn't be a top 25 team this year, but Bill Snyder always comes up with great game plans and KState has won many games they had no business winning because of Snyder's X's and O's being superior to many teams "Jimmy's and Joe's."

tical523 8 months, 2 weeks ago

We are still at the bottom of the Big XII as a team at this point but I am keeping faith that we will improve everyday and be better each week. I also want to say that I think Rice is a good football team, if you look at their roster they have some big boys on both lines and I was very impressed with the quarterback. . . . bad loss but we will learn from this.

P.S. Tackling is so important, IMO biggest factor that cost us the game.

eastcoasthawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Very tough loss to take based on expectations. We knew we had a weak kicking game and it let us down yesterday. Saw plenty of positives. Like not playing every dback 10 yards off the ball in short downs. Dexter Linton hits their receiver and it's game over. Josh Williams wraps up their QB and it's game over. We were one play off of winning this game. Not 30 to 50 points.

My concern is that after the last two years, will these kids have the mental toughness to come back week after week? So, keep learning guys, keep improving and good things will come. I remember a 1 -10 season in which our win was against the @15th ranked team in the nation. We will upset a team or two this year. Rock Chalk!

NOTcrusher 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Rice was not nice to Weis. Thrill that Gill left the Hill. Bring back the baby eater!

wastewatcher 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I would feel a whole lot better if Coach Weiss would accept some responsibility by using words like we and us and me a lot more. It seems to me his comments always place the whole fault on the players and none on he and his coaches

ralster 8 months, 2 weeks ago

He said exactly the opposite of what you are insinuating. Weis said he will not point fingers and play the blame game at specific players/coaches. The buck stops at his feet. I respect him for that. The mantra is keep learning, fighting, executing x 60min. A couple of key missed tackles late and an out-of-sync passing attack are analytical reasons for Rice loss. Kicking game needing work also. Keep fighting.

bville_hawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Time, people. We just need to keep sawing wood as someone once said.

On another slant, though, what's up with our student body? The student section was probably 90% full at the start of the game and about 98% full by the end of the 1st quarter. At halftime there was noticeable thinning, about 75% full halfway thru the 3rd period and 50% full by the end of the 3rd. Halfway thru the 4th period it's 25-30% full. Yesterday was a beautiful day, a closely contested and fairly exciting game that we led until the last couple seconds. Why would you leave at 4:30 in the afternoon???

I was on another site last week and someone from another school was making the usual comments about KU - snobbish alumni, etc. And then they said (and this struck me) "and a d-bag student body." Is this a true statement?

hawkinator 8 months, 2 weeks ago

...just the Greeks; which are certainly a good portion of the student body.

kualum95 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Weis got what he deserved, a loss to a quality kicker with a game winning FG. I think he cleaned to well and shouldn't have pushed out our 5th ranked kicker and 3rd ranked long snapper...which probably would have won him the game instead of the other way around! I follow special teams players and know for a fact Mueller had 3 game winners in his Jr & Sr year in high school, and Gibas had one of the quickest snap in all of FBS!

Warren 8 months, 2 weeks ago

The only KU coach to start his first season 2-0 is Terry Allen. Do we want him back?

akgjenkintown 8 months, 2 weeks ago

KU might have the worst field goal kicking team in the country if not for Penn State.

RockChalkCaliHawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Ralster is right, the majority of you posters on this site are fair-weather fans at best. Now, before you try saying I'm too optimistic or had unrealistic expectations you should understand, I'm not happy about this loss any more that you are. The difference is that I'm not calling for Weis' job. I'm not asking for Mangino to come back, and I'm sure as hell not going to say we should have stuck with Turner "Can't Coach Pop Warner" Gill. We had a coach make a couple erroneous judgement calls, and our should-be stud QB is trying to solve the whole team's problems with his right arm. Both of those problems can be fixed. That's saying a lot more than was possible last season.

Here is an example of why I'm going to continue to drink the Charlie Weis kool-aid for a few more years:

During that crucial 4th down play in the 4th quarter where the TE made two KU defenders miss beore barely squeaking by to get the first down I was actually impressed with the position of the defenders. Think about it, last year that play easily goes for 10-15 yards before ever having contact by a defender. Those types of plays last year were routinely causing us fans headaches because Vic Shealy had no idea how to stop a screen, swing, or any type of play that moved towards the sidelines. This year, our players were in the right spot and just simply missed the tackle because of a great juke move by such a big player. Our players being in the right position speaks wonders for this new defensive coaching staff. As a coach, I would rather have the guys be in the position to make the tackle and fail than to be out of place to begin with.

What I'm saying is that a lot of you need to calm down. Yes, we might not even get to 3 wins this year (although I'm betting we do), but there's no need to jump ship after week 2, no matter how horrible the loss.

Think of it this way, at least we weren't ranked number 8 in the country with tons of high expectations and then lose to a scrub team as Arkansas did. We are Kansas and we lost to Rice.... BIG FRIGGIN DEAL!!!!!!!!

keithii 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I saw the game and was as disappointed as everyone else. But I did see improvement, effort and good play most of the time. There are still lots of lessons yet to learn from a team that has been through a lot the last two or three years. Crazy to jump ship. We have good players, leaders and experience. Nothing is ever accomplished by panicking. Patience is required. One game at a time!

BPSkelly 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Give the Jayhawks credit. This was a "team" loss. Special teams wasnt very special. Defense looks like it's in full "Bend and Break" mode. Offensively it appears that the running game has a chance to be the 'highlight' of the team. Both backs ran real well the last two weeks. But Dayne Christ is killing us. Maybe he wont be by the end of the year. Im willing to give him more rope to hang himself with. What choice do we really have?

It comes back to the fact that for all the excitement and hype, there just isnt a whole lot of talent around here. Is it better than a year ago... ehh... maybe at a few spots. But not a huge sea change. I think consciously as Jayhawk fans we understand this, but naturally after the life-sucking degrees of awfulness from Gill's 'tenure' we simply assumed anything would be better. I DO believe its better. But its obvious that 'better' is marginal, and odds of us winning many (or even any) more games isnt going to be high.

Remember how p@#$@% off we got when we'd hear the same old @#$* out of Gill after games? I'll be curious what happens when were1-5 (halfway through the season) and Weiss pressers afterwards are so predictable that most of us could give them.

The one thing that stands out to me from both the past two games is it seems (at least to me) that Weiss is almost forcing the issue with the QB. In fairness, there IS a logic to that thinking. But both games I felt like we could have scored more (a lot more two weeks ago) if we'd simply stick to ramming it down the other teams throat. Im all for balance. But if 'balance' means watching Crist airmail ball after ball after ball all around to anyone except our guys im not sure how much I want to see it.

I have faith that Crist will be be better (although in fairness, I cant explain why). But even if he is better it likely isnt going to register in the W-L record. He's going to have to be MUCH better for that to happen.

TulsaJayhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I was at KU in the late 70”s, that started with a great team but fell apart when Nolan Cromwell went down. I never left early, and even the games I attend since graduating I stay through the bitter end. I really took loosing this game hard. Almost as hard as losing to Wichita State in the early 80's just before their program was shut down. It was another example of the coaching staff, and the players not mentally finishing.

Coach, I’m about ready for that fist fight.

troutsee 8 months, 2 weeks ago

So far I am not impressed by this team and am totally disappointed in the QB play. Unfortunately, he cannot make plays with his feet and there is not an option play or read play with him in the game, which are important plays in college football as opposed to the pro game. Thus, we need to have a passing game that is quick and decisive like Rice's was. If we could only muster 300+ total yards against SDSU and Rice, we are in for some very bad times the rest of the way. My preseason optimism has faded after viewing our play in the first two games. I'll be surprised if we win another game this year. As you guys know from my previous posts, I am a very optimistic person, but I am also realistic and perceptive. Sorry for being a downer, but from what I have seen in the first two games, we need a change at the QB position. We also need James Sims. I think he reads the line of scrimmage better. I'll be happy that he will be available after the next game.

inteldesign 8 months, 2 weeks ago

The biggest complaint I will make is that late in the game and were still in control of the outcome we should have stayed with the running game. It was time to stop practicing the dismal passing game. We did not do that and gave the game away. This was a strategic error.

texashawk10 8 months, 2 weeks ago

For those of you who still don't think the defense has made any progress from last year, think about this. Rice was 4-4 on FG's yesterday. The past two seasons, that's like 3 TD's and a FG instead of 4 FG's. You gotta learn how to walk before you can run and you gotta learn how to crawl before you can walk. KU's also up to 8 forced TO's this year which is tied for second nationally through 2 games. This defense is learning how to crawl right now, give it a little bit of time and they will be walking.

Something I left out of my above post about changing defensive alignment every year is the very negative impact that has on recruiting, especially along the DLine. Coaches recruit players to fit their system, but when that coach and system is changing every year, it's next to impossible to recruit any HS with any kind of talent because they're wondering if their talent is going to wasted because of changing defenses every year. Give Campo a couple of years of running the same defense and he'll start bringing in players that fit his system and hopefully he's mentoring either Cross or Wyatt on his system for when he retires so that whoever takes over is tweaking the defensive system and not installing a totally new defense that will set the defense back again.

RCJayhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Well said. It's refreshing to see fans who put things in perspective and accept that this will be a process that will improve over time. I hate losing as much as anyone and this loss sucked. However give it more than 2 games before freaking out. We need to be better fans and knock off these bipolar highs and lows in our expectations. Sit back and let them do their jobs. These guys look a lot better than Gill's teams and will only get better if we show up (and staying the whole game) and root them on. The "when does Late Night start" bandwagon fans can piss off. Just saying.......

OakvilleJHawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Losing to an inferior team sucks.
Reading posts from "jumping ship after two games" fans sucks even more.
The point was made earlier, quite correctly, that the Gill team would have lost this game by 14 points.
Even the fact that everyone is pissed off we lost, is a good sign....at least now as Kansas Jayhawk Football fans we care...I'd say that's a pretty good start by Charlie!!

99yard_run 8 months, 2 weeks ago

How dumb are you? People were pissed off under Gill, and that was good how? Gill won his second game!! Gill had some good wins against G. Tech and Colorado. CW won't win another! CW will go out just as he did at ND, a complete failure! Get a clue!!!!!!!!!

RCJayhawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Weis still finished with an overall winning record. He also got ND 2 BCS appearances and the school's 1st bowl victory in 10+ years. "Complete failure" is a little strong. He had 1 very bad year and the rest would be better than most of the ones under Mangino. Get a clue and quit giving up on a team and a coach after 2 games.

99yard_run 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I drank the CW Kool-aid when he was hired at ND. Then watched those games on NBC every Saturday and was completely astonished at his team's inability to block, tackle, the basics. No I drank the CW Kool-aid once, never again.

Kansas1241 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I hope Turner Gill loses every game he ever 'coaches'. That idiot cost me and everyone else 2 years that we'll never get back. Hope nothing but the worst for him.

TRUBLUE 8 months, 2 weeks ago

some of you really look bad and are very immature, the way you talk to, and about each other. everyone has the right to their opinion, whether it may be right, or wrong. I'm thinking that if we all knew anywhere close to as much as we think we do, we would be on the coaching staff, myself included! quit blaming Gill! move on. some of you wanted him to fail, before he even had a chance to succeed, and a lot of people wonder why! things that make you go:Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm! by the way, I watched a lot of games over the weekend, and I may be getting some of the plays confused, with which games they were in, but did anyone see a trick play that failed miserably in the K.U game? another thing that makes you go:Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm! Now, if you want to point to one thing, point to that play. And I don't care if the QB can call the plays, the head coach, and/or the offensive co-ordinator, should have sent the plays in at that point, so K.U. at least got 3! if they get 3 there:game over!

99yard_run 8 months, 2 weeks ago

are you drunk?

HouTexHawk 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Interesting comments from the posters. Certainly a lot of people bought into the Charlie Weis hype and he still may turn the program around. What is apparent is that there are no quick fixes. While not as bad as losing to North Dakota State, losing to Rice is pretty embarrassing. I follow Rice pretty closely. It is a great school, but the program is mid tier Conference USA.

I think in retrospect, Weis would have been better off not bringing in Dane Crist. His arrival raised expectations that were probably close to impossible to achieve. I know that some people were optimistically projecting bowl eligibility. I think the first two games prove that KU has a ways to go. There is only one easy out in the Big 12 and unfortunately KU doesn't get to play that team.

mhart123 8 months, 2 weeks ago

I want to know why there is such silence from those touting our defense. I kept reading posts how we have more defensive talent than most BCS schools... How we would win 6 or 7 and go to a bowl. Where are these posters?

danmoore 8 months, 2 weeks ago

2nd game of the year and fans are already throwing the coach and QB under the bus. What a sad fan base.

mikeville 8 months, 2 weeks ago

First of all, I just want to say, long time reader, first time poster. Season ticket holder for the past three years.

Losing to Rice is VERY embarrassing. And I am Angry, with a capital "A". When Weis said we would be competitive, I thought he meant with Baylor and Texas Tech and etc. Not with Rice and South Dakota State. We should never lose to Rice. Ever. Except in baseball.

Consider: In the last three years, Rice has lost to UAB, Tulane, and Marshall. In those last three years, they have won 2, 4, and 4 games. This is a BAD team. This was their first win over a Big 12 team since the formation of the conference! This is embarrassing, and we should be upset about it.

Most of the mistakes have been talked over already. Missed tackles, the passing game, etc. But I want to talk about coaching decisions and defense. First - Apparently, Weis must have thought he had a better shot at a 40 yard field goal into the wind than converting a fourth and 1... right? That's the only explanation. And if that's so, I'm worried and upset. Second - I thought Campo said in the spring that we would be playing tighter coverage on the corners. All day long, we lined up 8 to 10 yards off the Rice receivers, and they ran quick slants and hitches up and down the field. The failure to make adjustments was maddening.

So we have the right to be upset about it. We shouldn't be content with just going to the game and having fun (while it's still close, that is). We buy tickets. We buy parking. We buy concessions. We donate to the Williams Fund. It's expensive. So I am mad. Not only am I mad about the loss. I'm mad about about feeling like I've wasted my money the last three years.

We are a Big 12 team! Big 12 teams don't lose to Rice!!! We DESERVE a real football team, a real football program, a program that doesn't embarrass itself, its fan base, or its conference!

When the season started, I was hopeful for for 4-5 wins. But now, my friends... I'm sorry, we're staring 1-11 directly in the face. As I detailed above, Rice is terrible. They are the worst D1 team on our schedule. If we can't beat them at HOME, with an 11 point third quarter lead, with a 100 yard rusher, then I'm sorry, who ARE we gonna beat?

I'm just trying to be a realist here. I am one of those very few people who enjoy football more than basketball. Ever since my very first game back in 1993, Nebraska at Kansas, when we missed the two point conversion late in the game and could have won, I have loved this program.

But I am so frustrated with this program. Saturday was such a miserable day, with the way KState played and the way we played, only slightly mitigated by Missouruh getting killed and Nebraskuh losing. You all remember them... the ones who don't care about history, tradition, or rivalry. Anyway, I digress.

I just... I'm getting close to the edge, and I really, really want to jump off. Tell me why I shouldn't...

dannyboy4hawks 8 months, 2 weeks ago

Can we ban posters like 99 yard run who started posting with the douch moniker for nothing more than to be annoying...It's probably a kstate fan or Brock Berglund.

I can't understand the student departing the game so early....what gives? There can't be anything of any great importance going on that is such a huge draw unless they're out in the parking lot breaking into cars.

Disappointing loss because that was a game Kansas should have won but oh well, TCU is another game. I believe in Coach Weis and company and all those that want to jump ship, I say go ahead...don't need fans like you populating amongst the true fans. Rock Chalk

Debbie Downers and Negative Nancys plz apply for membership at the Arkansas, misery, Cornhusker and Okla lite message boards...I'm sure you'll fit right in

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Football

Rice defeats Kansas, 25-24