Originally published May 24, 2010 at 12:13p.m., updated May 25, 2010 at 12:00a.m.

Pac-10 games highlight KU’s non-conference men’s basketball schedule

Kansas head coach Bill Self grabs the attention of his players during the second half against UCLA, Sunday, Dec. 6, 2009 at Pauley Pavilion. Self is about to embark on the recruitment trail for most of the month of July.

Kansas head coach Bill Self grabs the attention of his players during the second half against UCLA, Sunday, Dec. 6, 2009 at Pauley Pavilion. Self is about to embark on the recruitment trail for most of the month of July.


Reader poll

Which KU non-conference game are you most looking forward to?

  • vs. Arizona (Las Vegas) 14% 254 votes
  • vs. UCLA 19% 354 votes
  • vs. Memphis (New York City) 44% 802 votes
  • vs. USC 1% 34 votes
  • at Cal 4% 89 votes
  • at Michigan 11% 210 votes
  • Other 2% 40 votes

1783 total votes.

Home games against Pac-10 teams USC and UCLA, road battles versus Michigan and California, as well as appearances in the Jimmy V Classic and Las Vegas Invitational highlight the Kansas University men's basketball team's 2010-11 non-conference schedule, which was released Monday.

“Once again, this schedule will be as competitive as any in the country,” KU coach Bill Self said. “We have some great trips for our team and fans.”

The first trip is to Vegas, where the Jayhawks will meet Ohio University on Nov. 26 and Arizona on Nov. 27 in Orleans Arena. KU has two home games in the event — Nov. 15 against Valparaiso and Nov. 23 versus Texas A&M-Corpus; Christi.

KU will travel to New York on Dec. 7 to face Memphis in the one-day Jimmy V Classic twinbill at Madison Square Garden. Syracuse will meet Michigan State in the other contest.

The Jayhawks will play UCLA on Dec. 2 and USC on Dec. 18 in Allen Fieldhouse. KU heads to Cal on Dec. 22 and Michigan on Jan. 9. This year’s games against UCLA, Michigan and Cal conclude home and home series. KU will travel to USC in 2011-12 to complete that deal.

One-year, guarantee games will be played at Allen against Longwood (Nov. 12), North Texas (Nov. 19), UT-Arlington (Dec. 29), Miami of Ohio (Jan. 2) and UMKC on Jan. 5. KU will meet Lawrence High grad Dorian Green’s Colorado State team on Dec. 11 in Sprint Center in Kansas City, Mo.

“I think it’ll be a good schedule. If you look at RPI, UCLA and Michigan are typically top 30. Last year they were in the 130s,” KU’s senior associate athletic director Larry Keating said of rare down years by the two programs. “I suspect they’ll both be back in the top 50. Arizona will be good as usual. Cal will be picked 1 or 2 in the Pac-10. Memphis will be ranked top 10, 15 nationally. USC will likely be top four in that league. Colorado State is a good game, Miami and Ohio have traditionally had good records in the MAC,” Keating added.

There was no master plan to schedule home guarantee games against the three Texas schools, Keating said.

“Corpus Christi is part of the Vegas tournament. They brought them to us,” Keating said of Vegas Invitational officials. “Arlington was a game we scheduled early. North Texas was added last week. We weren’t trying to specifically look to schedule more Texas schools (in addition to Big 12 partners).”

Keating said he’d be looking for two home games against high major teams and possibly one away game for the 2011-12 season to go with the USC contest.

“We go to Maui (Invitational), so I’m not sure if we’ll play another away game,” he said. “I believe Duke, Georgetown, UCLA and Michigan are in it (and possibly Tennessee). It should be one of the strongest fields ever.”

Notes: KU, which has won 59 straight home games, is three shy of the school-record homecourt win streak of 62 set from 1993-98. KU could tie the record by beating Longwood, Valparaiso and North Texas. The record-setting victory could come against Texas A&M-Corpus; Christi as early as Nov. 19. ... KU’s game against UCLA is part of the Big12/Pac-10 Hardwood Series. KU beat the Bruins, 73-61, last year at Pauley Pavilion. ... KU and Arizona split games during the 2007-08 and 2008-09 seasons. ... KU will be traveling to Ann Arbor, Mich., for the first time since 1985. KU beat the Wolverines for the first time in six meetings, 75-64, last season. ... KU has won five straight against USC, including a 2-0 mark in the Bill Self era. ... KU topped Memphis last season, 59-57, in St. Louis. ... Cal won the Pac-10 title last season. KU beat the Bears, 84-69, in Allen Fieldhouse. ... Ohio U won the MAC tourney title and North Texas the Sun Belt regular season and postseason tourney titles before falling to Kansas State in the NCAAs. ... Longwood is an independent located in Farmville, Va. ... KU is 2-0 versus Valpo with the last meeting in 2002. ... KU has never met Corpus Christi or Arlington. ... KU will play exhibitions versus Washburn (Nov. 2) and Emporia State (Nov. 9). Late Night is Oct. 15.


Larry Smith 10 years, 5 months ago

That is a very challenging schedule. SOS should not be an issue this year.

jayhawkinnc 10 years, 5 months ago

We have a 59 game home court winning streak at AFH. Our school record is 62. Looks like we should easily win our first 4 games at home and break the record on Nov. 23.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Well, name-wise it's a good non-conference schedule. But what do we have...two teams that made the tournament last year on the schedule? Cal & Ohio are the only ones I see. Memphis should be a good game. It's just disappointing that we have 4 games against the Pac-10 and that conference is pretty much garbage right now.

Steve Corder 10 years, 5 months ago

The Pac-10 games might be the result of a behind-the-scene partnership to create a new TV broadcast deal between the conferences which will compete revenue wise with the Big-10.

When announced, you might want to notice the geographical direction of the other Big-12 basketball schedules.....just a thought.

Michael Auchard 10 years, 5 months ago

We played Memphis and Michigan last year, too. Surprised you don't remember the Memphis game.

speegku 10 years, 5 months ago

I believe North Texas also made the NCAA Tournament last year.

100 10 years, 5 months ago

Excellent schedule. Looks like it could be another expected KU-UK final. Both teams should be stacked again although UK very young again. Speaking of the moderately wild kittens, their fans are freaking out. Search "Lexington Herald" and click on their K'tucky sports section. Some of their fans are already discussuing who should be their new coach. Others are really upset at their local beat writers who keep focusing on the Will Calipari Leave stories. One article listed how Calipari made Memphis the fool every summer, similar to what he's doing this summer to UK, using headlines to make his job prospects bigger down the road, or perhaps depart to coach the NBA, all while saying "I'm not leaving". Calipari One And Done? Does he have enough professional pull to affect where Lebron James ends up? A lot of the neurotic K'lucky fans seem to think if an owner can afford fried squid, he will make Lebron play basketball again in the greatest offense ever designed. The dribble drive!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

I haven't read anything from the Lexington Herald, but I'm sure much of this has been fueled by the Cavs firing Mike Brown

DevilHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Actually, the Cavs fired Mike Brown today. According to The Plain Dealer (and subsequently mentioned on TSN), Calipari is among the Top 5 replacements on their list.

100 10 years, 5 months ago

Interesting link. I see a couple unrealistic dream coaches at the top of the list, Phil Jackson and Coach K. The first "realistic big name" as they call it is....


John "The human squid" Calipari.

If this list truly reflects what Cleveland is looking at... Wow, Johnny Squid Calipari is about to be fought over by a bunch of NBA owners trying to stop Cleveland from getting James and get James for themselves.

Amazing what a poor ocean creature can do without ocean water for a couple decades... They get rich!

Jonathan Allison 10 years, 5 months ago

what amazes me about Coach Cal, is that with all of these rumors circulating, his only response is something along the lines of, "people are going to say what they're going to say, and I can't do anything about that."

I haven't heard any Bill Self to the NBA rumors. I'm just glad that we've got an honest coach who does his business above the table rather than under the table.

KGphoto 10 years, 5 months ago

Terrance Jones bolts Washington: Lands in Kentucky

What a piece of crap! He made a circus out of his choice and then stabbed them in the back in order to play for the squid.

Poor Washington. Losing two players to that douche.

KGphoto 10 years, 5 months ago

On a more pertinent note.

Vegas over Thanksgiving and Berkley over Xmas should be nice trips.

DevilHawk 10 years, 5 months ago

This is an interesting schedule. I'm really surprised that we're playing as many Pac-10 teams as we are without including Washington.

I think that KU has a long-term contract to play UCLA and Arizona. However, both of those teams should be much better this year.

I don't know much about the situation at Cal and USC except that Cal lost its primary scorers.

Memphis and Michigan should be decent games, but I'm sure that I'm not the only one who doesn't enjoy watching us play Memphis.

The rest of the schedule looks about par, but we are very dependent on how the Pac-10 does during the non-conference.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

With Cal gone I have no problem playing Memphis. They gave us a good fight last year, and they should be really talented again this year.

CP 10 years, 5 months ago

Sounds like you're scared of Cal ... I say bring him on.

crestdr 10 years, 5 months ago

Does anyone know when the conference schedule will be released?

Marcia Parsons 10 years, 5 months ago

According to the article above, "later this summer."

Phoggin_Loud 10 years, 5 months ago

Looks like there are 2 "true" road games. That has been the knock in the past.

Nice schedule. I can't wait for the throttling of UCLA in Lawrence.

Kyle Helmer 10 years, 5 months ago

Could all of these Pac-10 games be a pre-cursor for the future? Who knows, in a couple of years we may all be in the same conference.

KULA 10 years, 5 months ago

We open with LongWood?!!! OMG, I've been outted! That's my nom de porn!

tstanlick1909 10 years, 5 months ago

That schedule is extremely weak, I want to play some blue blood east coast teams. I want to play Kentucky or Duke or the Heels.

Is this not identical to last years non con?

Oh well, weak defenses will allow everyone to see how high Selby and EJ can jump

David Hodges 10 years, 5 months ago

We'll never play the heels in the regular season. Roy won't allow it.

hammr25 10 years, 5 months ago

I'm just glad we get 4 teams from that mid-major conference the PAC-10 this year.

hailtoku 10 years, 5 months ago

Alright KUSports... this is pretty basic... but.

Two schools use "USC".

Which do we play; Southern California or South Carolina?

Jim Pendleton 10 years, 5 months ago

A few responses here -

Devilhawk, KU does not have a long term contract with UCLA. This is our designated opponent for the Big 12 - Pac 10 Hardwood Series. This series goes in two year cycles, and since we played them there last year, the game is here this season.

Arizona is part of the Las Vegas Invitational. Don't believe there is any return games for these teams at either campus.

Can't speak for the USC and Cal games, although we played Cal here last year, so that must be a return game. Played home and home with USC a few years ago, so don't know if this game is part of that, or a new series.

tstanlick, while it would be nice to play some of the bigger name eastern schools, you will never see KU play UNC in the regular season as long as Ol Roy is the coach. He never wanted to play Dean in the regular season either, and he hates playing former players or assistants as well.

Some of these other games have some interesting tilts. I agree with the comment earlier about playing the Pac 10 schools could be a pre-cursor of the future. The same could be said for Colo State.

crestdr, expect the conference schedule to be released some time in July. That has been the norm for awhile now.

I always hate getting ahead of myself, but based on these teams performance last year, I expect us to be 7-0 going to the Jimmy V against Memphis. Don't really see many chances for losses here. Ohio will be a challenging game, but expect a win. Cal on the road will be tough, so we'll see on that one. Same with Michigan, but some of their players left early, so who knows what they will be.

Should be another great year. Rock Chalk!!

Tuskin 10 years, 5 months ago

Here are my computer's rankings of our upcoming opponents as of March, 2010. For what it's worth, North Texas did make this year's tourney.

300 Nov. 12 (Friday) – LONGWOOD, Lawrence

179 Nov. 15 (Monday) – VALPARAISO (Las Vegas Invitational), Lawrence

174 Nov. 19 (Friday) – NORTH TEXAS, Lawrence

182 Nov. 23 (Tuesday) – TEXAS A&M-CORPUS CHRISTI (Las Vegas Invitational), Lawrence

105 Nov. 26 (Friday) – Ohio University (Las Vegas Invitational), Las Vegas, Nev.

79 Nov. 27 (Saturday) – Arizona (Las Vegas Invitational), Las Vegas, Nev.

98 Dec. 2 (Thursday) - UCLA, Lawrence

55 Dec. 7 (Tuesday) – Memphis (Jimmy V Classic), New York, N.Y.

130 Dec. 11 (Saturday) – COLORADO STATE (M&I Bank Kansas City Shootout, Sprint Center), Kansas City, Mo.

73 Dec. 18 (Saturday) – USC, Lawrence

15 Dec. 22 (Wednesday) – at California, Berkeley, Calif.

235 Dec. 29 (Wednesday) – UT-ARLINGTON, Lawrence

145 Jan. 2 (Sunday) – MIAMI (OHIO), Lawrence

295 Jan. 5 (Wednesday) – UMKC, Lawrence

62 Jan. 9 (Sunday) – at Michigan, Ann Arbor, Mich.

justinryman 10 years, 5 months ago

That's an average team ranking of 141.8

Tuskin 10 years, 5 months ago

That's a bit tougher schedule than we've had the past year or two, which I think is a good thing.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Right now, on paper, there's no way this schedule is tougher than last year's. I don't know what those numbers are, preseason RPI? Regardless last year we played Temple (at Temple) and Cal, both were top 20 RPI teams. Cornell #48, Oakland #52, Memphis #53. I don't care what it averages out to be versus what other year's schedules have averaged out to be, if Cal at #15 is the only team as good or better than than the games against the 5 teams I listed, then this schedule is pretty weak.

I agree with tstanlick, we need to be playing some decent Big East/ACC opponents. Just one from each conference would be sufficient, as opposed to the lame Pac-10 and one of the crappier teams from the Big Ten (Michigan).

Tuskin 10 years, 5 months ago

Last year we played Alcorn State, the lowest ranked team in Division 1. We also played #304 Central Arkansas, and various teams ranked in the 200's. I felt that since we had so many games that were supposed to be blowouts (and proved to be) that our team thought they might not have to show up on a given night. Who knows if that's right or not, but it didn't seem we played with a lot of consistency - except in the wins column. But several of those wins felt closer than they should have been.

So, if the above rankings are even close to accurate, our blowouts won't be expected to be as lopsided this coming year, which would be good for our team. Those rankings, though, are year-end rankings for this past season, not preseason rankings for next season. (Past performance is not necessarily a good indicator for future results.)

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

There's always going to be cupcakes. I guess it's just a difference of opinion, would you rather play a few really bad teams and a few really good teams, or would you rather just play all mediocre teams? That's the difference between the schedules. Next year's schedule - not one really good team on it other than Cal. Again, this is all on paper, and according to the rankings you provided. I'm assuming when you say "rankings" you mean RPI, as I don't know any service that ranks teams all the way down to the very last team. You're right, I don't think past performance necessarily translates into future success. If I had to guess, Memphis will be better than Cal, probably a top 25 team, and Cal will be worse than a year ago. Regardless, next year's schedule is thoroughly unimpressive.

As for your rationale...your logic is completely circular. You're upset because we blew a bunch of teams out but also upset that a lot of games were too close and should have probably been blowouts?

Tony Bandle 10 years, 5 months ago

Gee, no Southeast Conference teams....are we afraid someone is going to give scouting tips to Kentucky!!??

No ACC teams, no Big East teams.....what's the deal??

Matt Bowers 10 years, 5 months ago

I am disappointed that KU is not playing any SEC, ACC, or Big East teams. I know were probably not going to play UNC, Duke, or Kentucky, but why not schedule a Wake Forest, Villanova, or Ohio State University? This is not the schedule I expected and there are too many games at home. Don't see how that prepares KU for the tournament, but it could be that nobody wants to play KU. I'm sure that this is the best schedule that HCBS could get.

Rock Chalk

Scott Smetana 10 years, 5 months ago

Nice Work Tuscin.... I agree with the schedule.... YAWN. This was true last season as well.
Can we get rid of the Pac-10 Hardwood Uneven Challenge and get a real basketball conference please??!?

BCRavenJHawkfan 10 years, 5 months ago

Uh, I notice that there are no MVC schools.

HawkNationNWichita 10 years, 5 months ago

I don't know if your being sarcastic about this, but I really wish we had the Mo Valley champs every year. I know last 2 times we've played the Valley teams in the tourney, it hasn't work out good for us. But I really think those were flukes and we were the better team both times. And no I'm not taking anything away from Bradley or UNI. Both games, the team that wanted it more won. But living in Wichita, I'm sick of listening to Wichita State fans. That's why I wanna play Valley teams, to shut them up. But then again they'll probably be like KState fans, in the fact we beat em 3 times, but they still think KState was the better then us.

HawkNationNWichita 10 years, 5 months ago

Oh trust me I know all about it. And I'm proud to wear my shirt in Wichita that says Wichita, Kansas: home of We Suck University. Shocker fans love that. I had nothing against em until the made that 16 run and ran their mouths about KU. I honestly hate WSU almost as much as I do Mizzou and OU. And only reason is their fans. But as a KU fan, you can't hate anyone more then Mizzou. Its just fun :)

Chris1955 10 years, 5 months ago

Will people look back in 2018 and say that this was really the first year of the WAA (Western America Alliance)? The proposed WAA would be the Pac 10, plus BYU and Utah, and the Big 12. Someone else coined the idea for the Pacific and Plains divisions, which I readily endorse.

Omari Miller 10 years, 5 months ago

Happy to see the 'Hawks come out here to the Bay Area to play Cal. I also want to see beatdowns of the other Pac 10 teams we play. KU gets very little to no respect out this way. Time to be the bully on the West Coast block for a bit.

trueblue9 10 years, 5 months ago

Do we really play Ohio twice? Or is the LJW just incompetent?

Meet at the Bear's Lair on Dec. 22.

jaybate 10 years, 5 months ago

"Some Off-the-Record Reasons Given by Schools for Refusing to Schedule KU Next Season:"

~MSU: MSU AD speaking off the record--"Tom knows Bill is having Andrea Hudy build the KU players up to be bigger than Tom's players, and Tom doesn't have a clue how to beat a team that he can't out-thug."

~WVU: Satan speaking through William Peter Blatty--"I have more work to do with my dark angel named Bob Huggins before I give him a shot at corrupting the Father of All Basketball Programs."

~UNC: Roy Williams speaking off-the-record--"My team sucks. My only decent bigs took a powder. What I have coming in is just as over-rated as last year's crop. I'm a phony. Dean keeps making me wear that Carolina Blue bustier to clean his office. Ol'Roy sure as heck ain't gonna go up and get the spit slapped outta me by Bill's kids this coming season."

~CUSE: Jim Boeheim speaking off-the-record--"I want sleep on the bench more this season. I'm getting older. If I schedule Self and KU, I have to stay awake for the entire game."

~FLUKE: Mike K's wife speaking-off-the-record--"Mike knows Bill is taking the gloves off next season and Mike's afraid the one of the KU players will walk up to him during a time-out and say, "I'll slap you and you'll like it!"

~UCONN: Jim Calhoun's cardiologist speaking off-the-record--"Lew called and asked me if Jim was circling the drain, and I told Lew straight, 'How do spell myocardial infarction? He'll croak the first half watching KU beat the snot out of his overrated team.'"

~UKON: Ashley Judd speaking off-the-record--"No point in us scheduling anyone any as good, as KU, since Cal just got a P.O. box in Cleveland."

~G-TOWN: John Thompson Version 1.0 speaking off-the-record--"I told my son not to schedule KU, because, frankly, my son is not that good of a coach yet."

~G-TECH: Paul Hewitt's tailor speaking off-the-record--"Underneath, Paul's pretty insecure about his looks and he hates it when he has to be around anyone that wears a suit better than he does. Bill Self's shoulders are much broader,so a suit hangs much better on Coach Self than it does on Paul. Throw in Kurtis Townsend stylin' on the bench, and, well, no way Paul schedules KU."

(Note: all fiction and sans malice.)

Jayhawk444 10 years, 5 months ago

"The record-setting victory could come against Texas A&M-Corpus Christi as early as Nov. 19."

"as early as...."? kinda if the record-setting victory could come a little later. It's technically a correct statement, but if we lose any of those first four games, there will be no record setting victory any time soon.

Steve Brown 10 years, 5 months ago

funny, the record could come as early as 11.19.2010 or as late as 11.27. 2018 or beyond.

jaybate 10 years, 5 months ago

They should hire you as an editor immediately!

jayhawkinnc 10 years, 5 months ago

it should state that the record setting victory could come on Nov. 23 not Nov. 19

Mike Kendall 10 years, 5 months ago

Looks like a good schedule to me. I am excited to see Selby play. Go Hawks!

Steve Gantz 10 years, 5 months ago

This schedule is full of teams that historically are tough, but recently have been playing more like mid majors. Now maybe UCLA will rebound into a tough team, Memphis is so well coached that they'll be tough, Michigan hasn't had a decent team in a decade, Arizona hasn't been the same since Lute left. USC, they're coming for a paycheck. Their schedule last season contributed to their demise I believe and this one doesn't prepare them for March very well either.

Making all of you who shell out big bucks to get seats to have to endure those first four games to the record are being ripped off. The record ought to have an asterisk by it

Marcia Parsons 10 years, 5 months ago

I don't understand why you think the first four games next year are any less worthy than the first four games of any past year. Should none of those be counted as real games either? It doesn't make the first four games any more or less significant next year just because they lead up to the record.

Steve Gantz 10 years, 5 months ago

All I'm saying is the early schedule is boring. When I was a KU student the first month games were dull. I suppose those games have some value, although I'm not sure what is gained by playing your first four home games against those teams. And it seems to happen every year.

KGphoto 10 years, 5 months ago

Toughest games:

UCLA, Lawrence Don't sleep on UCLA. They're still UCLA. And they will be better. They got Josh Smith, the #2 Center in the country. He's a monster at 320 lbs. They also signed a couple of nice shooting guards including Tyler Lamb.

Arizona, Vegas Don't sleep on Arizona. They're still Arizona. And should easily be improved in the second full season under Sean Miller. They've only faltered during a few years of uncertain leadership. Miller is solid. He had a string of 20 win/Tournament seasons going at Xavier. PG Kyle Fogg (42% 3pt.) will step in for Nick Wise, and they lured a Top100 shooting guard Daniel Bejarano from Texas. Breakout freshman (Pac10 FOTY) Derrick Williams, 6'8" 235, is capable of going off. And at 6'7", Jamelle Horne has steadily improved his 3pt shot. He hit 50 last year at nearly 45%. He'll be a senior.

Memphis, The Garden Memphis went 24-10, lost almost nobody, and landed four Top100, including Will Barton. For Christ's sake! They are stacked in 2010.

Overrated: Cal, Berkeley California They lost the house. Their top 4 scorers were seniors. (and we spanked them last year) They have a couple nice recruits but this will be a whole new team. A very young and inexperienced team. Interesting to see if 7"3" Max Zhang gets more than the 4 minutes he saw against us last year.

Longshot: Colorado State, Sprint Center Colorado State has teeth. And a lot of seniors. They went 7-9 in a real good MWC, then stole Chad Calcaterra (#28 C), away from Minnesota and UNI.

Don't miss: USC, Dec. 18th, AFH Maurice Jones. A 5'7" shot-blocking dynamo.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

What does "they're still UCLA" and "they're still Arizona" mean? This is the kind of rationale, the name on the front of the jersey credibility, that led to UNC being ranked for maybe a month longer than they deserved to be.

I'd agree with most of the rest of your points, although I think the jury's still out on Josh Smith. If he can't drop some weight (which has been problematic for him for awhile) I expect him to be about as effective as Dexter Pittman was against us this past year.

KGphoto 10 years, 5 months ago

All I mean is that the players shouldn't underrate them because they've been a little down. Those programs, especially UCLA obviously, don't just fade away. A down year for them is extremely odd, and a player should expect a formidable opponent.

Don't you think that when Kansas entered the season unranked for the first time in aeons, other teams saw the unranked Hawks and circled them on the schedule anyway? All the while in their minds (smartly) saying "It's still Kansas"?

Chris Shaw 10 years, 5 months ago

It's a shame that Percy Miller Jr. (Master P Jr.) transferred. Master P would officially be, "In Da House"!

Jim Pendleton 10 years, 5 months ago

trueblue9, don't know what you are looking at, but we don't play Ohio twice. The Ohio game in November is part of the Las Vegas Invitational. There is a later game in early January against Miami of Ohio, but that is not the same team as Ohio Univ.

Some of these schools on the schedule have been good in the past, but for a lot of reasons are down right now. Perhaps some of these teams will be better than they were a year ago. You don't know until everything plays out. Remember we played Alcorn last year when they were 0-for. They wound up winning their league tourney and was in the play-in game. Obviously you don't expect to lose to a team like that, but it looks a little better when some of these lesser teams wind up winning their league, or league tourney and getting to the big dance. Rock Chalk!!

Matt Gauntt 10 years, 5 months ago

COME TO CHICAGO, HAWKS!!!!!!! Schedule with DePaul, Northwestern, UIC or Northern Illinois.


Chris Shaw 10 years, 5 months ago

or maybe it's Kincade's. Can't remember

apeoples410 10 years, 5 months ago

Any chance we can get more info on Selby and Woolridge? It's great to hear about Peters, but how about the guys coming this year? When are they moving to Lawrence? How are they doing on the AAU circuit?

Steve Gantz 10 years, 5 months ago

When was the last time KU played a great non conference team? To my memory playing National champ Florida was the last time. I could be wrong. Anyone?

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Great? Well two seasons ago we played at Michigan State in the regular season and again in the sweet 16. They went all the way to the title game, although most think they overachieved, so I guess whether that was a great non-conference foe is open to interpretation. That year's schedule was tough though, with games against the Spartans, Syracuse, Washington, Tennessee, Arizona, Temple, & Sienna.

Steve Gantz 10 years, 5 months ago

Forgot about that MSU game, although I recall that was a forgettable game! Arizona took it to us that year also didn't they!

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Yes we lost pretty bad to Arizona that year, and Michigan St. The tourney game was much closer. Zona made it to the Sweet 16 that year same as us. Mich St. was a 2 seed that year, so maybe making it to the championship game wasn't overachieving as much as I thought. Anyway, just trying to answer your question about great teams faced in the non-conference schedule. That Spartans team was probably the best we've faced since the Florida team we faced in Vegas

100 10 years, 5 months ago

Ralster: I know I've said this before but it cannot be emphasized enough. I think last year's two stars, although great legends in the ku program, were out of shape at times during key stretches, which messed with our subbing & substance.

To anyone who can, take a look back at that KU-UK game played in Allen Fieldhouse in 2007 (maybe 2006). That was Selfball to perfection. Lots of lateral movement from the guards, pass, pass, pass, melt the defense, pass, dribble, pass, shoot the five foot floater, swish.

A perfect example of Bill Self at his best. He let last year's team get away with murder, stylistcally speaking, although we were still a great team, easilly capable of winning it all...

This year, it's time to get in shape and have a blast again!

jaybate 10 years, 5 months ago

"Tuesday Morning "

} "Schedule Assessment:"

Board rats critting the schedule perhaps forget that KU is not coming in with Sherron Collins and Cole Aldrich and Xavier Henry this season. The incoming team does not yet appear to have anchor players that include 2 probable Top 17 NBA draft choices and a third player forecasted to go first, or second, round. Facts are facts.

This schedule looks plenty tough for what we have coming back and coming in.

KU is reloading (if lucky), or just rebuilding (if unlucky), depending on how far along Selby, Little and Releford actually are, on how much of the load Marcus can actually carry, and on how much Jeff Withey and TRob have developed.

The best part of the schedule is that it gets KU media exposure many places it needs exposure, though not significantly in the Pacific Northwest--a place where KU's recruiting successes seem to have dried up of late.

New York, Michigan, Indiana, Ohio, Texas, Tennessee, NorCal, Socal--these are all places KU needs to be seen and this schedule ensures significant exposure in those regions.

I agree with KGPhoto's assessment of the six majors. Memphis should be a power. UCLA should be much, much better, probably a tourney team. Zona should be like Memphis last season--a good team lacking a big man inside. Cal and USC will be struggling.

KU's mid majors often turn out by end of the season to be better than anyone thought going in, but I just don't know much about this group. Ohio should be a good game.

} I'm also glad to see UMKC resuming on the schedule. It offers KU a game against a Princeton team, and KU needs that with Buzz Bzdelik buzzing off to Wake Forrest.

} I would still like to see KU get lucky and pick-up a a 3-4 swing man, so we don't have to go into year after next with impact freshman trying to start or first back-up at one, or positions, without other experience there.

Anyone out there?

I still haven't read anything from Self stating definitively that he's done. Or did I miss it?

tstanlick1909 10 years, 5 months ago

Havent heard anything in regard to whether he is finished or not. The only remaining recruits out there would not see the floor for us for at least two years

Tallhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

Nice Assessment Jaybate, I would say spot on. Everyone also need to realize that the Big 12 will again be pretty strong across the board, KSucks will be a big challenge both on the road and home and the south will have a few teams that will have a strong showing. Relax and enjoy another Big 12 title my friends.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 5 months ago

PG - Taylor?, Johnson?, CJ? [Buford] SG - Selby?, Reed, Woolridge?, [Juenneman] PF - Marcus, TRob? Ctr - Markieff, Withey?

3 - Mario?, Releford?, Morningstar?, [Teahan,]

This is a reasonable roster rotation based on no redshirts or injuries. I am almost pathelogically optimistic [major aximoron] about life HOWEVER, if you notice the "?"s, I think each individual designated such has something to prove, improve or overcome.

My heart tells me all will be well and Kansas will be terrifically athletic, quicker, more aggressive and focused. Still, my head says there is a lot of unknowns out careful.

As far as the discussion of the schedule, frankly, I see that individual teams will be better [K-State, UCLA, Memphis, for example] but taken as a whole, I'm not sure it's challenging enough to take this relatively new team [and don't be fooled, despite the number of lettermen, without Cole and Sherron, this is truly a new team], to task to grow and toughen up in time for when it counts in March.

Comments always welcomed!!

tstanlick1909 10 years, 5 months ago

I really don't see anyone starting at PG other than Selby. If he's not in, it's either Tyshawn or EJ. Self usually runs an eight man roto, but with this next season, he would be making a serious mistake by not using all of his depth (with the exception of buford, juene, even morningstar if he's going to play like crap)

He would be hanging some reaaally good players out to dry by not including them in the rotation.

LAHawk11 10 years, 5 months ago

Our schedule this year is come we never play ACC teams or Big East teams.....who cares about the WACK 10....i wanna go play Duke @ duke or something like that

jaybate 10 years, 5 months ago


Who gets to play 1 and 2 depends heavily on: a) who can protect the ball, and b) who plays the 3 and whether or not that 3 can shoot the trifecta.

With a strong trifectationist at 3, either the 1 or the 2 can endure stretches with a sub 37% trey shooter.

But if the 3 cannot ring the bell in triplicate, then Self has to put two 37% plus, preferrably 40% plus, trinitizers at the 1 and 2.

Self usually gravitates to his best defenders with the best trey shooting percentage and lowest TOs.

I really can't tell who will rise to the challenge.

I know Self cannot afford Taylor and Little in the game for long stretches, unless one of them has become a much, much better trifectationist than either has shown so far.


Unless Self uses Kieff as his second trifectationist, and so clears out the middle for Marcus and Mario Little and whoever is at the 2 to become constant rim attackers; that I would pay to see. :-)

My hope is

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Jaybate - consider the schedule from the '08-'09 season. As I have pointed out, the non-conference schedule was loaded. At Mich St., at Zona, versus Washington & Syracuse in the Sprint Center, and home games against Tennessee, Temple, & Siena (a tournament team that year that won an 8-9 game before losing by only 7 points to #1 seed Louisville, lest anyone scoff at their inclusion here).

Now consider the situation that year. Losing all 5 starters plus Sasha from the year before. Cole coming in for his sophomore season having played only sparingly during his freshman campaign. Having only one bona fide, proven talent returning in Sherron who, while great, still came off the bench the year before (we can call him a quasi-starter if you prefer). That team wasn't returning any true anchors, surely no one thought two players worthy of being lottery picks at that time. Nevermind anchors, that team wasn't even returning much in the way of a supporting cast. Tyrel & Brady had seen virtually no action. And a fairly underwhelming recruiting class was brought in. Travis Releford, Quintrell Thomas, Tyrone Appleton, Mario Little, the Morris Twins, & Tyshawn Taylor. Not a McDonald's All-American or even a 5-star recruit among the bunch.

Then look at the results. Being tested early hardened that team to surprise everyone and win the Big 12 and advance to the sweet 16. Look at the difference between the game in East Lansing versus the sweet 16 game against the Spartans. The strides that team took is evident right there. I'm sure the argument can (and probably will be) made that that year it was Sherron, Cole, & everybody else. However, I would disagree. Look at all that season provided. That season showed the Morris Twins what was required of them at this level, and they dedicated themselves in the off-season to return as legitimate forces during their sophomore campaigns. It allowed Brady to put his game on display, one of sound fundamentals and hustle. It provided Tyshawn a stage on which to earn a spot on the u-19 team. And it provided a launch pad for the follow season's accomplishments and expectations.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Now compare the situation this next season to that of the '08-'09 season. It's true we don't have the "anchors", but neither did that team. This year's team will be returning two starters, that team returned none. This year's team will be returning players who contributed 102.4 mpg from its significant contributors, that team returned 32.2 (and I'm being generous including Cole's minutes from his freshman year). This year's team will return (albeit a modest) 32 ppg from it's significant contributors, that year's team returned 12.1 ppg This year's team returns a combined 20.5 years of experience from 8 returning scholarship players in Coach Self's system (Withey get's credit for 1.5 years in the system), that year's team returned 6 years combined experience from its 4 returning scholarship players. This year's recruiting class features the #1 ranked player in HS. All this tells us that next year's team is in a far better position than the '08-'09 team. After all, facts are facts.

So while it is true we lost a lot, we are still returning quite a bit. It is a team that will have some questions, and will need to find it's identity. How better to do that? Depends on how you look at it. Does the team need to learn how to win? Does it need to build up its confidence? Does it need an extended period of time to figure things out & get comfortable? Those type of teams probably benefit from a slightly softer schedule. However, is this a team that needs to develope a toughness? An edge? Does it need things to come easier for them or does it need to be tested early & often? These type of teams benefit greater from a tougher schedule. I would argue next year's team needs only a few games to get comfortable with a couple of new pieces, then they should hit the ground running. A tougher non-conference schedule would have been advantageous.

Also consider that, in my opinion, the Big 12 will not be as good next year as it was this past year. A&M, Baylor, Oklahoma & Iowa St. will almost certainly be worse. I'd guess the same will be true for OSU & Texas. Texas Tech & Nebraska might be better, but not significantly, and they were so bad to start with any improvement by them won't matter too much. Kansas St. might be better, but they might be worse depending on how they adapt to the loss of Clemente. Colorado has the chance to be better, but it will depend on Tad's coaching abilities. Missouri brings in a pretty good recruiting class, they have a chance to be slightly better. Basically, I'm saying next year's team won't have the luxury of seeing the same level of competition in-conference as last year's squad did, which is another reason we could have used a tougher non-conference schedule.

Anyway, that's my two cents.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 5 months ago

ralster, jaybate,icthawkfan316, all of you make great points.

I guess my bottom line is I've never seen a KU team with such a potential for greatness coupled with such a potential for mediocracy.

The difference could be likened to a Nolan Ryan fastball compared to a Tim Wakefield knuckler!!

In Self we trust.

Jack Wilson 10 years, 5 months ago

Completely random: Here's an in-season tourney idea, the top 6 programs - UCLA, Duke, NC, KU, UK, Indiana each year at a neutral site. One game, and opponents rotate each season so you play each team every five years (except it's modified so Duke doesn't play NC since they get them in conference). How about year one: UCLA vs. Duke; Indiana vs. NC; KU vs. UK in Charlotte, NC; or at the Sprint Center; or the Staples Center.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Awesome idea. Rotate the venues too and it's just so perfect that we're assured it will never happen! Still, I love it!

Jayhawk444 10 years, 5 months ago

I've always thought this would be a good idea. A Tournament of Champions so to speak...except not really a tournament. TV would eat it up.

addlime 10 years, 5 months ago

Schedule = Weak = Greater likelihood of early exit Just like last year.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Well, last year's schedule wasn't weak. I think we finished #6 on SOS. Granted much of that was helped by a tough conference schedule, but the Big 12 wasn't THAT good to put us all the way at #6 if our schedule was indeed weak.

Also, look at the '07-'08 team's non-conference schedule. Cupcake city! At USC & against Zona were the only BCS tournament teams from that year (and both were 1st round losers that year). That didn't equal an early exit. Just saying.

Martin Rosenblum 10 years, 5 months ago

Interesting how we get on a roll with playing non-conf. schools from the same state. Last year there were four teams from TN. This year, there are three teams from TX. This is in addition to our normal B12 matchups. We'll play a total of 7 Texas teams!

Somebody should find that redhead that was behind the bench in Austin last year and have her follow all of the TX teams whenever we play them. I feel like she could be our good luck charm. Even better, she could team up with Samantha Ryan and then we would have some real titilating fans in the stands action!

Dan Harris 10 years, 5 months ago

Who cares about the ACC or Big East! We need to start scheduling TCU and SMU for a home and home so I can see the Hawks in person!(wishful thinking I know!)

Jack Wilson 10 years, 5 months ago

You may get that anyway in the new Big XII ...

Martin Rosenblum 10 years, 5 months ago

turd -

You deserve a Pulitzer Prize in internet research!

FairgroveJayhawk 10 years, 5 months ago

170 days until KU makes short work of Longwood

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Not that it affects our game against the Bruins next season, but the Wear Twins have officially transferred to UCLA

jaybate 10 years, 5 months ago

Part I


You make a great case and I agree that the tougher the competition a team plays over the season, the tougher the team will be at the beginning of XTReme Madness. If maximizing toughness were the only criterion for success in the Madness, each team would schedule most of its pre-conference major games against the most fearsome opponents they could find and play them away.

But watching Self over the years, it appears to me that he has more criteria than just toughness.

If you have a team with an experienced and terrific player like Sherron, as was the case in 08-09, and you have a green center, like Cole Aldrich, that you believe probably will become dominant with experience, then Self schedules the most ferocious pre-conference schedule he can (short of scheduling an away game with a UNC without a return match at AFH), hoping that Sherron can win a lot of games on his own, while Self throws Cole, Tyshawn, Brady and the Twins to the dogs in hopes of getting Cole, especially, toughened up by March. Again, he figures Sherron is so good that he can will a lot of wins with the green wood. The combination of a strong schedule and a lot of wins and early toughening leads to a good shot at a league title. with a little luck a very good RPI, along with that RPI, a league title and very good RPI, an a decent seed in the Madness with the kind of tougheness it take to go deep.

On another hand, if Self has a previously toughened, royal flush coming in,as happened in 09-10, he avoids scheduling the best nonconference opponents possible in order to avoid an early upset, while the team tries to integrate a newbie like Xavier. But Self does try to schedule as many likely mid major (Cornell, Oakland, etc.) and lesser major (e.g., Atlantic Ten's Temple) conference champions as he can figuring his enormous talent can avoid upsets against these feisty teams early, yet get the RPI boost of a conference champion. The object using the best W&L statement, the best rankings, and the probable conference and conference tourney championships to leverage one team to a 1 seed. A 1 seed maximizes and experienced, toughened talent rich teams advantage.

jaybate 10 years, 5 months ago

Part II

And on a third hand, if Self has a a lot of experienced glue, a lot of unproven impact players, and a 4 that seems like he might blossom into the role of 1st option impact player (i.e., Marcus Morris), given some time to get comfortable, Self schedules good but not ominously good majors, plus mid-majors that will be good, but not likely break out teams. The idea here is let Marcus win a lot of games early, even while he is getting comfortable in the driver's seat, and also play pre-conference teams that allow Self to play his green players and get them as much experience as possible, rather than trying to battle harden them by throwing them in over their aheads against great opponents, or super thug ballers. The play here is to bring everyone as far as you can riding Marcus' game; then enter the conference season with with a lot of wins, Marcus comfortable as #1 option, and the green wood season, but not truly hardened. In this approach, Self relies on the Big 12 games to do really battle harden his team. The team arrives in March with a very good record, but some losses in February when the hardening was taking place and a decent RPI. The team gets a 3-5 seed and is hammers its way through lesser teams, before Self lights the candle against a truly tough opponent.

Someone like Larry Brown seems much less nuanced about this stuff than Bill Self, but much more consistent with your placement of toughening-by-scheduling very high in the hierarchy of team building. If memory serves correctly, Brown just found the scariest opponents he could, agreed to play them anywhere they wanted to play, threw his teams--green, or experienced--to the dogs, and figured he could out-coach the opposing coach sufficiently to off-set the toughening adversity he was exposing his players to early. Of course, Brown also believed in being so lacerating to his players (intensely demanding and corrosively critical) that they found the high powered dogs they were thrown to a refreshing change of pace from practice with Larry. I'm not saying Bill Self isn't a toughie in practice. I'm sure he's very tough. But Brown's acid-dipped criticism burned out every group of players he had, sooner, or later. Though players tire of Self, as all players tire of coaches eventually, Self seems to wear out his welcome more slowly. But I digress.

My point is: toughening certainly has its place in Bill Self's approach, but he clearly indexes the amount of toughening to other variables.

Rock Chalk!

gardenjay 10 years, 5 months ago

Glad to see the name-brand opponent schools, often makes for tough, interesting games.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 5 months ago

We better not throw any looks like we're heading toward the cliff with a "MAJOR " ticket scandal including Roger Morningstar and the Pump Brothers!!!!!

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Jaybate - Interesting rebuttal, although I think you have misunderstood my point (for which I will share some responsibility for not being more clear). My point was less about what Coach Self might think and how he schedules accordingly, and more about disagreeing with your acceptance of a soft schedule. You tried to dappen down criticism of the schedule because you thought the team lost too much talent and accepted the level of difficulty based on the amount talent we had returning. That was your original point - no Sherron, no Cole, no X, so facing lessor foes is tough enough for this group.

To be honest with you, I don't think your speculated thought process on deciding a schedule is very close to the mark. Truth be told, Coach Self is in all likelihood very limited on his ability to schedule tough opponents. KU's schedules are always designed with a maximum number of home games, for money purposes. Coach Self has admitted this in an interview with a sports reporter from here in my hometown of Wichita, when he was asked about why KU does not schedule Wichita State. He said KU needs these home games in order to help fund their program. KU will only schedule two or three true road games - typically in the form of a two game, home-and-home arrangement, one non-con tourney and a game at the sprint center, & fills the rest with home games. These games are largely comprised of teams that are lesser foes who don't require KU to play a return game on their home court. Given these restrictions, I suspect it is probably pretty difficult to put together a highly competitive non-conference slate. The perceived difficulty of the schedule will hinge largely on the competition of the two or three home-and-home opponents being good. And in defense of the schedule makers, the Michigan & UCLA agreements were surely expected to be more attractive games. No one would have predicted the Bruins precipitious drop-off, and they probably figured Michigan was ready to turn the corner with John Beilein at the helm.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

At any rate, given the fact that these games are scheduled in two year contracts, and with the uncertainty of college team's rosters & talent level due to transfers, early departures into the draft, recruiting, & player development, it is probably more of a crap shoot as to the level of difficulty and less about Coach Self micro-analyzing the needs of that year's teams. Consider next year's schedule and the schedules the previous three seasons. Those KU teams are all very different. You have the uber-talented National Championship team, the talent-depleted over-achieving '08-'09 team, last year's team looking to build on the Sweet 16 success and bringing in X, and next year's team that has lost the previous years stars but returns a lot of talent and is looking to integrate Selby. Despite how different these teams are, there is always overlap in opponents due to the home-and-home games, so it's hard to make the argument that Self has enough foresight to schedule two years in advance in accordance what he feels his team needs.

I would guess that Coach Self and those who help make the schedule probably try and get the best home-and-home games they can, while taking into account (as you have pointed out) exposure in geographical areas for the benefit of recruiting. So for the most part I am simply disappointed at the way the schedule has shaken out and less upset with those who made the schedule. The one area that I am critical of the schedule makers is with our non-conference tournament selections. That is the one place you have the opportunity to strengthen your schedule. Despite some of the many things I disliked about Roy, he was good at getting us into the marquee tournemants. We seemed to rotate between the Great Alaskan Shootout, the Maui Invitational, & the Preseason NIT. For whatever reason, under Self we have gotten away from this. Now we don't play in true tournaments, more in the one or two game, pre-determined opponents type of deals (i.e. the Jimmy V Classic). I was glad to see that next year we will be in the Maui invitational.

For the most part, I am not upset with anyone for the schedule, I was simply pointing out that this schedule is not difficult enough for next year's team. Your points about Self's thinking and trying to make it fit with the various schedules might seem to make sense, but it's pretty far-fetched. Rosters & talent are just too fluid in today's game - both for us and our opponents - to be able to accurately match-up opponents according to need.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 5 months ago

Am I the only one concerned about major penalties for the Kansas Athletic program because of this ticket scalping scandal in the KU AD ?

Will someone on the staff please acknowledge the allegations and give us some background...we're getting killed out there!!!

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

I had mentioned some concern over this before, and a couple of people (Keithmiles05 being one of them) called me an idiot for wondering. It was condescendingly explained to me that whatever wrongdoings aren't associated with the NCAA rules & regulations. So take that for what it's worth I guess.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Well, I'm sure there are things in the works a couple of years in advance, but no I wouldn't say that we already have our full list of opponents for the '12-'13 season (2 years down the road from now). Right there in the article it says, "North Texas was added last week".

Your statement that "Self couldnt really know what he would have 2yrs in the future" is fairly close to what I was saying. That the talent level is too fluid to know what either you or your opponents are going to look like, especially in the second year of a home-and-home series. Like I said, I'm not blaming Self or the schedule makers, but I am disappointed because I don't think our schedule is tough enough for the team we have next year.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

Further evidence of the scheduling not being completely done in advance, KU didn't add the Jimmy V classic for next year until April 29th.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 5 months ago


Whether it involves the rules or not, any black eye to a major college is more ammunition in the no-holds-barred, fight-to-the-death war called college recruiting.

Also, how about them coming up with a way to pi$$ off the biggest contributors to the AD by making sure ticket brokers get the absolute best seats no matter how much an alum donates. Lew is on the hot seat for this one.

What's going to be the absolute worst will be the Kensucky fans trolling in and letting us have it with both barrels.

Man this sucks big green weenies!!!

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

I'm not at all saying its a good thing, whether it's in violation of NCAA rules & regs or not. I don't know that something like this will be used against us in recruiting, but perhaps. If it is, well then it's just a minor pellett or BB in terms of ammunition. And really if the "absolute worst" thing about it is Kensucky fans trolling our boards, then I'd be relieved. They do that anyway.

Kye Clark 10 years, 5 months ago

there's an article up on this right now. Ask and you shall receive.

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