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Friday, July 17, 2009

Collins better get in shape

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While Sherron Collins keeps one eye on the fast food-fatness chart to get his weight where it has to be, he might train the other ocular orbit on a Kansas basketball teammate with the wherewithal to take over Collins’ job if Sherron gets too fat and sassy.

Sophomore Tyshawn Taylor has proved he can handle the ball, score, make assists and steals and do everything, well, that a big-league point guard must. The 6-foot-3 Taylor had 18 points, six assists and five steals in sparking the American U-19 team to the world championship recently in New Zealand. In the 9-0 run by the United States, Tyshawn averaged 10.8 points, led the team with 35 assists and tied for a team high 14 steals. He missed one game due to flu trouble.

After a period of self-indulgence, Collins recently was 18 to 20 pounds too heavy for maximum efficiency. At 5-11, he performs best at 205-10. He needs to trim down for the kind of senior season that will make him the first-round NBA choice he hopes to be. Coach Bill Self shouldn’t pamper him any more. Last year, Bill anointed Sherron as the team leader and he tried to over-achieve. Hope he learned something.

If Sherron lags too far in his weight-watcher regimen, he could lose valuable scout-exposure sitting on the bench. Yet KU needs both guys to measure up to the soaring expectations for 2009-10.

With Collins and the departed Mario Chalmers last season, KU would have had probably the best pair of guards in the college ranks. Taylor was forced into Chalmers’ shoes as a freshman and though he displayed tremendous talent, he had too many yearling fits and starts.

The 2009-10 season, judging from Taylor’s performance in the U-19 battles, could see KU restored to the No. 1 guard tandem level. With Collins in peak shape and Taylor continuing his international achievement pace, about all Self will have to do to assure a run to the Final Four will be to find a solid No. 3 starter, be it the well-hyped Xavier Henry, a healed-up Mario Little or maybe a sleeper like Travis Releford.

Collins and Taylor will have backups like Tyrel Reed, newcomer Elijah Johnson and perhaps even Brady Morningstar. Up front, anchorman Cole Aldrich will hold sway with, hopefully, Marcus and Markieff Morris better-prepared, physically and mentally, to deliver consistently. There will be added muscle in 6-8, 230-pound rookie Thomas Robinson; 6-10 Jeff Withey debuts at mid-year.

As for the No. 3 spot, two of the best media developments of late is that the Michael Jackson overkill is fading and someone told ex-Jayhawk Carl Henry to stop yapping so much about sons Xavier and C.J. If they’re good enough, they’ll play and excel. Coach Self is a master at extricating the best for a TEAM effort. It will be a mistake if the Henrys come in thinking they are the saviors of the program. They’ve never been through a Bill Self boot camp, and he’s likely to give them some special dues to pay just to prove they are as good as daddy says. Competition will be lava-hot.

I can almost hear the holdover Jayhawks, who’ve been “boot-camped” and survived, snickering at the blast of reality Xavier and C.J. are going to get this fall. Truth is, Self and Co. can field a 10-man crew good enough to make the Final Four without either Henry.

Not that these two can’t add a lot, but they’re going to have to earn the playing time they get. Daddy can’t talk them into that.

Comments

sdoyel 11 years ago

When and where has it been reported that Sherron is CURRENTLY overweight?

Eurekahwk 11 years ago

Did you know that your weight can fluxuate 5-10 pounds or more in a single day? Especially on a hot day. I wouldn't worry about Collin's weight. The Boot Camp will be more than enough to knock the extras off of everyone. And that is why we have Boot Camp and not the annual track run that Roy liked so much.

kingpin 11 years ago

Mayer: you could cut Sherron some slack. He's done everything right. He put his family before himself and no one could ask for anything more from the young man. "If Sherron gets too fat & sassy," maybe you should be writing for the Columbia Tribune. If you've ever watched Sherron play ball, you'd know he plays with more fire than anyone else on the court.

emillasap 11 years ago

This article borders on non sequitur. At the very least it is lazy and dated. I am not usually one to complain but, please.

imnotpaulpierce 11 years ago

You can't blame the guy for packing on a few pounds when (1) he just finished a grueling season and (2) he had some pretty serious family issues that were probably 'weighing' on him.

He has been overweight before and cut the weight. I don't see why he won't do it again.

tstanlick1909 11 years ago

no joke, if you have nothing good to write about, dont write anything at all.

serisouly, Bill Self is not cutting him any slack, it is July, Sherron does not need to be in peak physical condition right now. He has shown that he will do whatever it takes to trim down, and he will, duh. Lets not forget that he just got done skipping the draft to stay and win a Championship, lets not accuse him of being a slacker Bill.

I cant believe you are saying hes going to be on the bench, he is not one of the players on roster that is worrying about his playing time

Dirk Medema 11 years ago

Sherron's weight was a slight concern a month ago, and even then Coach Self confessed to being part of the problem. He said that he told Sherron to shut it down completely and recover from the season. This is also such old news, because it has already been reported a couple weeks ago that Sherron has lost about half the excess. Not terribly different than August/September '08.

It was also Coach Self that told Sherron last year that he was suppose to take a lot of shots (?#?) and he expected his FG% to drop because he would be needed to take the shot no one else wants to take for the good of the team. That's quite a bit different than "Bill anointed Sherron as the team leader and he tried to over-achieve." Does "Hope he learned something." refer to Bill or Sherron?

In the hope he learns something category, I'm hoping that whomever is directing Mr Mayer away from the historical pieces will reconsider the folly of his ways, and have him do what he does and knows best, cause the last couple articles attempting to be current have really been lacking.

Twan2000 11 years ago

This piece sure seems fueled by alcohol. How did an article about Sherron's weight end up taking shots at the Henry's? Maybe you had too many shots tonight Mr Mayer!!!

trueblue9 11 years ago

worst. article. ever. i learn more from reading the comments sections.

kansaswingnut 11 years ago

Taking shots at the heart and soul of KU basketball ( Collins )? Not a good idea! More Jesse Newell.........Fire Mayer!

jayhawkinATL 11 years ago

Sherron will be in shape when it matters most...he's done this before.

That being said, IMHO, this is the one issue that I believe will scare some NBA teams off come draft time and could cost Sherron a spot in the first round.

mythicalbirdfan 11 years ago

This is a tired, old story that gets written every year. It's also interesting that the same website has one article saying Collins better get his act together and another one saying he might be the greatest PG in KU history.

Robert Brock 11 years ago

I wonder how many times Mayer has seen Xavier Henry play in person. I am guessing it is a REALLY low number.

Ryan2845 11 years ago

Apparently Mayer didn't read Bedore's article from the 10th http://www2.kusports.com/news/2009/jul/10/family-comes-first/?mens_basketball Sherron has already dropped 10 pounds. He admits he let him self go b/c he was worried about his mother.

jaybate 11 years ago

Bill plays the "what if something contrary to common sense happens, then a surprising outcome will occur" game of commentary.

"If Sherron lags too far in his weight-watcher regimen, he could lose valuable scout-exposure sitting on the bench."

Fine. Let's play Bill's game, too.

If Sherron gets both hands cut off in a lawn mower accident and can't dribble, or pass, he could lose valuable scout-exposure sitting on the bench.

If Sherron goes blind from too much auto stimulation and can't dribble or pass, he could lose valuable scout-exposure sitting on the bench.

If Sherron develops catatonic schizophrenia and is institutionalized in Ossawatomie, he could lose valuable scout-exposure sitting on the bench.

If Sherron turns out to be an alien called back to his home planet, he could lose valuable scout-exposure sitting on the bench.

Or may this...

If Bill doesn't contrive improbable premises for stories, his reader clicks may decline.

Adam Collins 11 years ago

I always read Mayer's articles as opinion pieces. Whether he means them that way or not, I don't know. But it makes it easier not to get annoyed with the lack of information in them.

jaybate 11 years ago

"Competition will be lava-hot."--BM

The trouble with competition that is as hot as lava is that it burns up the competitors.

DocBean 11 years ago

I've never complained about an article, NEVER. but this one is pretty bad. Bashing the Henrys seems out of place in an article about how Sherron should get in shape so he doesn't lose his starting spot.

Let's face it, the Henry's are professional level athletes. CJ was a pro, and I'd assume Memphis had some sort of boot camp too, he'll be fine. Xavier will handle the boot camp as well as any freshman, probably better then most. They're dad maybe talks too much, but he's also been the one waking them up at 6AM every day getting them to work out early and often. There's a reason they're as good as they are.

There is no reason to think Xavier, Taylor and Sherron won't all start, and no reason to think CJ and the other guards won't push them hard for their spots. I wouldn't be shocked if we see Brady Morningstar start a game or three. Remember with Self, it's not who starts the game, it's who finishes the game.

Chiliskate 11 years ago

I am sure we would be interested to know if Clyde Lovellette, Jo Jo White, or Wilt were ever overweight.... uh ..nevermind..

Joe Baker 11 years ago

jayhawkinatl (anonymous) says... Sherron will be in shape when it matters most...he's done this before.

Enough said!

Uh oh...According to Mr Mayer, BM is a "backup"?

JayhawkPurist 11 years ago

I too rarely, if ever, complain about the substance of articles, but this one is just plain terrible. The little information upon which it is based is stale, and given Collins' admitted reasons for his most recent weight gain (his mother's recent cancer scare), it's borderline mean-spirited to suggest that Collins is risking becoming "too fat and sassy." Such commentary is in bad taste, and more to the point, disrespectful of a young man who has given much of himself to the university and Kansas basketball.

Don Everett 11 years ago

As usual, another Mayer piece to wipe my butt with. When will this clown retire and quit wasting newspaper space?

DrPepper 11 years ago

Who honesty thinks the Henry's are going to think boot camp is a super killer? I doubt it. Physically, I imagine they will come in better prepared than anyone else on the team (just a hunch). Sure, they will have to prove themselves just like everyone else to see the floor, but I'm not questioning their ability to sweat, work extremely hard, or get out of bed on time. It wouldn't surprise me if they break sweats before their future teammates are even out of bed.

jaybate 11 years ago

I reckon most everyone is assuming more or less the following regarding perimeter rotations for the coming season.

Perimeter starters: Collins, Taylor, and X Perimeter backups: CJ, Brady, and Little Perimeter alternates: Tyrell, Elijah

Some particularly high on Elijah might move Elijah to back up and Brady to alternate.

Question: who is going to be the glue guy on the starting rotation of Collins, Taylor and X?

There has to be one. Every great team has to have a glue guy on the perimeter. Gueldner was the man in '88. RR was the man in '08.

Every national champion I can recall had a glue guy on the perimeter of its starting five.

Who among Sherron Collins, Tyshawn Taylor and Xavier Henry is going to be glue?

What do you have to do to be ideal glue?

You have be able to:

a) make few mistakes; b) feed the play makers first; c) feed the post; d) hit the open three; e) guard the opposing players that would foul-up and tire-out your playmakers, if they had to guard him; f) abandon all parts of your game that would impede the kind of offense the coach has schemed to optimize play maker talents; and h) help everyone on defense.

Let's see, Sherron? Hmmm. The greatest impact guard Bill Self says he has ever recruited? Being glue? Seems unlikely.

Tyshawn? The star if his U19 team? The guy with huge match-up advantage against almost everyone because of his speed and ability to get to the rim? A guy who wants to wear a headband? It would be a real stretch.

Xavier? Could he be the first OAD glue guy? It just doesn't seem probable.

Looking at this trio, it has to be Tyshawn. But can Tyshawn really knock down the trey when he's open? Can he really feed the post? Can he do all the things that need doing? And can he stand the anonymity?

If he struggles with the role, there is a guy, Brady Morningstar, from last year's team who has already proven that he can do it.

leonard 11 years ago

docbean...you don't make much sense.

"the Henry's are professional level athletes"...CJ playing baseball in the low minors has nothing at all to do with his chances at KU. Xavier has exactly zero professional level experience.

"I'd assume Memphis had some sort of boot camp"...assume...assume? You based the comment on exactly zero knowledge.

"Xavier will handle the boot camp as well as any freshman, probably better then most."...Another grand assumption based on nothing. He's about to enter a new world where the competition level his higher than he's ever experienced. We'll see how this pampered 5 star recruit handles the work load and discipline required...and "pampered" is not a direct slam at Xavier...they're all pampered.

"There is no reason to think Xavier, Taylor and Sherron won't all start"...There are plenty of reasons why Xavier won't start. The first one is he has to demonstrate he can play D-1 level defense, which will be a completely new experience. Despite his offensive talents he will have to prove he can handle balancing classroom workloads with the intense level of effort on the practice court.

Sure I'm glad the Henry boys are here...CJ has a lot of competitive rust to knock off and I'm not ready to "assume" that Xavier's offensive skills alone will make him an automatic bet to start.

Ben Kane 11 years ago

Mayer,

your useless articles continue to amaze me. He's always overweight this time of year but seems to not be as bad this time around...I definitely see a bunch of bench time in his future. Sorrry but i only read a few sentences of this article as it was just too painful to continue.

Tony Bandle 11 years ago

LJW will need to issue a " grumpy old man" alert every time a Mayer article dealing with any subject after the millenium is about to be posted.

Jaybate and I can remember when Bill used to be a great writer......however, like most columnists of any subject, unlike fine wine, few actually age well. I am sad to see this kind of story come from someone who was so entertaining and insightful in his day.

There is a reason his "historical columns" are enjoyable as opposed to current subject matter....he was at his peak during those days and the residual quality still filters through.

It's easy to throw criticism and scorn toward someone who may be considered professionally "beyond their years", but sooner or later we'll all be there ourselves. Show a little kindness.

Topside 11 years ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

Joel Hood 11 years ago

I’m not sure why so many of you are reacting with such anger & surprise at Mayer’s column. Bill has been the LJW’s old sports curmudgeon for the better part of the past 25 years. His articles are typically designed to elicit responses – it doesn’t matter if people agree or disagree with him, just don’t ignore him. That’s OK, we need living historians like Bill (and Max) around to make sure we don’t forget the richness of our KU sports legacy.

Bill often writes in a manner that challenges players and this piece is no different. I agree with OakvillJHawk – show a little kindness. We don’t need to love Mayer, but someday I will miss the spice he brings to the table.

KANSTUCKY 11 years ago

"Article" is a bit of an overstatement. Drivel would be more appropriate. Could we get some positive journalism for the pre-season number one?

bobbyfinstock 11 years ago

Second day in a row the LJW takes a not so thinly veiled swipe at the Henrys. They obviously learned a lot from the articles they wrote about BRush before he started playing. Remember? BRush was going to being "selfish" and only concerned with getting himself to the NBA and not a "TEAM" player... Sound familiar?

If the LJW is so insistent on keeping Mayer around, why not relegate him to articles that he can enlighten the readers on? How about he does a weekly article on a team or story from KUHoops distant past? Maybe a "where are they now?" piece... But please, stop putting out these garbage articles that just proves the game has passed him by... on one hand its terribly frustrating to read and on the other hand its just sad to read because I used to enjoy his articles.

And for you Mayer defenders (there have to be a few of you remaining... though I'm shocked you know how to get online) save your argument of "Well if you don't like him, don't read him." That holds no water. This is supposed to be a top flight publication and I want to read everything I can in my spare time about my beloved Jayhawks... is it too much to ask that articles/commentaries put forth by what should be the most connected publication for KUSports has better writing? Find a niche for Mayer, or find a way to let him go out to pasture with his remaining dignity.

Andrew Moore 11 years ago

Starting lineup -

Collins Taylor Xavier Henry Marcus Morris Aldrich

I am not so sold on Taylor starting over Brady. I think it will be tougher than many realize to beat out Brady in the starting lineup.

Think two years ago, when Collins came off the bench. Brady is the new RussRob.

Xavier Henry will be the most talented player on the team. Will that mean the best on the team? absolutely not. But its hard to deny the potential for greatness. I don't understand how so many newswriters and fans hate the Henrys. Its just unbelievable. I for one, am grateful that they have decided to play for KU, regardless of how long. X will earn his starting spot, and I would guess that it wont even be too difficult for him. He is a great basketball player.

McMorris has improved over the summer. He may sub for X at the 3, and start at the 4. Or perhaps he subs the 3 and Mk or T. Robinson starts at the 4. Maybe even Withey. Basically, the 4 will be a revolving door of guys that will play beside Cole. Mc, Mk, TRob, and Withey will all get shots at the 4, and overall it will be a much better configuration than last year.

final word: Collins, X, and Aldrich will be the stars of this team. There is no question that X will start. There is no question that Collins and Aldrich make us good. But Xavier make us great. He is the missing piece from last season. And with him we could go all the way.

ChicagoJHawk 11 years ago

Bill Mayer is an idiot and needs to be fired. How do you start talking about Sherron being overweight, and possibly losing his starting spot, and end up talking about the Henry brothers?? Sherron will be fine and will NOT lose his starting spot!

Every article he writes is either something negative about KU or it's just pointless and meangingless.

BabyJayBate 11 years ago

It might be time to hang it up Mayer. You bring absolutely nothing to the table. Losing touch with reality should be a sign that it is time to hang up the ol' sneaks and call it a day. We will see ya....

kansasYEA 11 years ago

This is a TERRIBLE article. Sherron will be fine, what's a boot camp for anyways? Also, stop talking negatively about the Henrys.... LET IT GO. why dont you just let them get to school and start competing instead of stirring up more bad feelings- totally uncalled for.

UncleMiltyN 11 years ago

The last person I'm worried about on this team is Sherron Collins.

I've got news for you...he's starting even if he puts 20 additional pounds on and we have to start calling some cute nick name. My vote would be for "Butter Collins" or "The Fullback". You would be sure to get out of his way when he drove to the hoop.

This article is a little more inane than usual....even for a Mayer basketball piece in July.

How are the Henry boys going to possibly live up to the hype? I actually feel sorry for them a little bit even if they did bring some of it on themselves.

Fred Davis 11 years ago

Couple things - not to continue to bag on Mayer - but seriously, griping a month after the fact that Sherron needs to lose weight? Give it a rest... Why don't you substitute Mangino for Sherron - but if Mark lost weight, then other schools would grab him, and he wouldn't be so cuddly, so Coach, keep that pleasant plumpness and go grab a rice cake - I hear they're low fat - and a Big 12 North Title - I hear those boost recruiting... Also, to respond to Brady getting the starting nod over Tyshawn Taylor, I want whatever you've been smoking.. Brady will probably be one of the first guards off the bench, but there's no way he starts over Tyshawn, who in my eyes, will have a better season this year that Xavier, not to say that X won't play well, but Tyshawn to me might be the most improved player coming back next season. But, before all that, KU has a Big 12 North Football Title to win. Rock Chalk.

kennethst 11 years ago

Leave Collins alone....give him break, I say. It's summer and he has plenty of time to get in shape. Why create an unecessary controversy???

stravinsky 11 years ago

Jaybate, maybe it's a cool sort of lava? Like the lava that volcanoed out maybe a few hours ago or something so it wont, you know, disintegrate you but is a little uncomfortably toasty?

I don't think it'll be that hard for Tyshawn to beat out Brady. I didn't think Brady looked that good through conference season last year. He played alright defense, but made a decent amount of silly mistakes on offense... Course, both of them will be better. But Tyshawn has by far the higher ceiling.

Jeremy LeMaster 11 years ago

I have never gotten on the website and bashed another poster nor the author of the article. My history on this website is goes back many many years (longer than 10 years or so) along with many of the people on here. I will still not do the former, but I am going to take a shot at the latter.

Mayer, stop taking shots at Jayhawks that have not shown or proven anything because they have not played one tip of the basketball in a KU uniform (referencing the Henry brothers). Perhaps you should take articles from an objective point of view and give us the facts rather than putting your subjective notions that have no basis in reality onto this site. Frankly, I am embarrassed as a Jayhawk that we have a devoted site that is bashing it's incoming players without being grounded. These kids have not gone off and broken laws and been public enemy's before arriving on campus; they are simply self-confident. They have not shown that they cannot be or will not be team players; they have simply shown an interest in making their dreams come true and doing what they feel is best. Lets stand behind them until they show us that we should not do so (if your fictional beliefs come to fruition).

Leave the conjectures to the readers. The Henry's have been put into a bad light with respect to KU because of poor journalism. Congratulations if that is what you were looking to achieve!

How do you suggest the removal of an article for poor taste?

Joe Baker 11 years ago

afmoore06 (anonymous) says... Brady is the new RussRob... I think it will be tougher than many realize to beat out Brady in the starting lineup.

FreddyD (anonymous) says... to respond to Brady getting the starting nod over Tyshawn Taylor, I want whatever you've been smoking...but there's no way he starts over Tyshawn

I hear you Freddy. I don't know why so many want to defend Brady. He has nothing to prove and if his shot isn't much more consistent, TT starts. He better step up his O and compliment that tenacious D!! He is a Junior this year and better play up to his Junior "ability". I have and remain having huge expectations of Brady Morningstar. He better deliver.

If he's such a stellar player, why isn't the trio: Collins, Aldrich and Morningstar? He's not a lock!! Again, either TT or BM will be a win win for KU!!

okiejayhawk5 11 years ago

This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.

Dillon Davis 11 years ago

Yeah he did definitely stray from the point there at the end. But back to Sherron's weight, which is suppposed to be the subject of this article, hasn't this been a problem for him the last 2 years? Yet he always seems ready by the time the season starts. And like some of you guys said, if he's not completely back in shape by the time boot camp starts he sure as hell will be after it. I really don't think this is something we need to worry about.

ObiWan 11 years ago

The idea of Sherron losing minutes in the rotation is laughable to me. All week long we've been debating whether or not he's the best guard KU's ever had, and now Mayer thinks his summer love handles are gonna cost him his place in the lineup? I don't typically take shots at the KUSports writers, but this article is pure trash. As I've said on this forum before: Sherron Collins is the absolute least of our concerns!

David Wanamaker 11 years ago

Talk about being behind the curve. Weren't these "stories" stories like 3 weeks ago? As a friend of mine speculated, Mayer must have just gotten his stone tablet version of the news yesterday before he wrote the column.

Maybe the GEICO commercials should say, "So easy, Bill Mayer could do it."

addlime 11 years ago

The only reason to read terrible articles like this is so I can enjoy the humorous comments more.

Tony Bandle 11 years ago

Isn't this the time of year that a newspaper should be focusing on the "hidden" stories;

  • How are are the injured players recovering?
  • Has Markieff stepped up his game for the coming season?
  • What's going on with the new guys, Johnson and Robinson?
  • How about a weekly Sherronatron weigh-in?
  • Where did HCBS get that fantastic toupee?
  • What are CJ and X doing? [Oh wait, you may have to contact Carl on that one...er, wait-scratch that one!!]

Anyway, you get the idea..look for new stories, insights, progress reports.

I think it's called JOURNALISM!!!

rawkhawk 11 years ago

I think this is first time I've complained about an article, but I echo previous posters, especially the negative tone and the unnecessary attempt at resurrecting the Henry "crisis". Sherron will do what he needs to do in the off-season as will the Henry brothers, and the team is in an excellent position to come together during boot camp and win a national title.

I understand the need for journalists to be objective and to contradict fans when the facts say otherwise, but this sloppily written opinion piece seems more fitting for a Mizzou publication. Let's focus on the positive!

waywardJay 11 years ago

If you really, for one second, suppose that Bill Self is going to start tyshawn taylor OVER Sherron Collins.... there would have to be something serious to suggest that. I'm not going to get into who is the better player right now, nor would it be wise to do so. I'm just going to say, I hope this was an article bent on firing up Kansas Fans, because that is the most insane tagline i ever read.

Self would get fired for pulling a moron move like that.

DId it really take almost a week after Tyshawn Pulled off such a wonderful feat 9-0 record team leading in points yadda yadda yadda.... to spew out an Article about Sherron's weight?

Doesn't sherron do this every year ? Or Did he miss Newell article that sugggests Sherron may be one of the greatest guards in Kansas History ? Or did He sleep through the Steal and subsequent Step back three against Memphis ? Or did he sleep through the Pass that delivered the shot, with two tigers hounding him ? DID he sleep through COllins doing this on a partially torn Knee ligament ?

I wonder, is it possible that he still thinks Sherron is a freshman first time coming to Kansas ?

Hell I don't know but something sure as hell Don't make any sense with this "article"...... maybe it's the writer.

ginger2015 11 years ago

I don't understand. If you don't like the guys writings, why do you read them?

KanKu 11 years ago

Fantastic article...thank you very little....

jayhawkboogeyman 11 years ago

Sherron is in fine shape. He is already slimming down, and it's not like he didn't have more serious matters to worry about than carrying a few extra pounds. This article is stupid. Sherron is the leader of the team, a future NBA point guard, and no one is taking his playing time in the year he came to win it all.

Scott Smetana 11 years ago

This is the worst article I've read on this website over the past 4 years. Get your act together Mayer and don't type worthless negative drivel.

Tuskin 11 years ago

I think Mayer's paycheck depends on the number of responses he gets on this board. Here's another quarter for you, Bill!

How about using it for a phone call to the players? Interview them about how Coach Manning works with them. That would be a nice read.

Tony Bandle 11 years ago

ginger2015

I was waiting for someone to come up with the "which came first, the chicken or the egg" question.

I feel that Bill is taking up space that could be better utilized. For example, I think Jesse Newell ought to be given a full free hand to input to this site rather than the somewhat restricted contributions that we see now. In fact, switching Bill and Jesse's roles may do the trick.

I guess my answer to your question is that we are all such rabid Hawk fans that any tidbits, especially this time of year, are impossible to ignore. However, that is no excuse for poor journalism.

Robin Smith 11 years ago

I'm baffled that a professional writer would end a piece by going completely off topic. It makes no sense to end with some jibes at the Henrys and the line, "Daddy can’t talk them into that", when the article is about Collin's weight and the potential ramifications (which are strained regardless).

Ironically, all KU students know that when you write anything, and you're hoping to have some kind of coherent point, you must have a premise (thesis), reasoning, and a conclusion that is related to that premise and reasoning.

Is it too much to ask of a professional what we ask of students?

Arthur Hess 11 years ago

Mayer's columns are getting more lame each time. LJW already reported that Collins weight is down and about his mom's health scare. Also, now that the Henry saga has died down, he goes and shamelessly tries to flame it up again.

Bill, it's time you are put out to pasture.

Tom Gillaspie 11 years ago

Bill Mayer = hack. Need anyone say more?

Keith Kienzle 11 years ago

Let's look at the main premise of Bill's 4 most recent articles, starting with the most recent:

http://www2.kusports.com/staff/bill_mayer/

  1. Sherron is fat and sassy.

  2. Old KU people that died recently will be missed.

  3. Kentucky's basketball program has always been dirty.

  4. Kansas athletics has their glory years behind them under Bob Frederick, and now we "pursue dollars and victories, at serious cost to reputation"

Look, Bill, we get that you've been watching KU sports for a long time, but if you want to give fans of CURRENT Jayhawks sports something they enjoy reading, you have to enjoy it yourself. These articles don't sound like you enjoy current KU sports at all. The best sportswriter is the super-fan, the guy who lives, breathes, dreams the sport, and wants to share his insights because it's who he is. Can you get back to that mental place about our CURRENT team?

phogdat 11 years ago

Such a negative perspective on our coach and players plus pathetic journalistic content!!! First you insult the pivotal player of our team, Mr. Sherron Collins....next, you call into question the approach Mr Bill money-coach of North America Self made as he guided this overachieving team to the sweet sixteen and then somehow you still had enough garbage in your brain cell to tweak the sensibilities of the Henry family!!! Amazing...ALL of these folks have and will make us proud of the University of Rock Chalk because they are devoted to being positive impact people. Work on it, Mr. Mayer as you do not appaer to be a KU fan nor a journalist worthy of an article in the Lawrence Journal World.

suttonku 11 years ago

This article should have been written a while ago...we all know that Sherron is losing weight and he will be ready for his senior season...and as for saying that Releford could be a dark horse, I think he should be a redshirt...lets see if we can get away with sitting him a year and helping him develop an outside shot...hey if we need him we can just pull the redshirt off of him...to me its the right decision...I mean we have X, Little, and apparently Marcus Morris that can play that position and if we absolutely needed it we could put CJ at the SG/SF position because he is in fact 6'4...what do the rest of you guys think? Redshirt Releford?

Jaminrawk 11 years ago

Come on! Collins has been here before and now we know that part of the weight gain was because Collins was worried about his mom's chest tumor. Cut him some slack. When the season starts does anyone actually think he won't be ready to roll? Collins losing his starting spot to Taylor (who will start at shooting guard) is laughable. Self has gone on record as saying Collins is exactly his type of point guard.

Part 2, what is with the Henry Bros digs? Does Mayer honestly think these guys won't be ready for boot camp? All the Henry brothers do is workout and play basketball. CJ has already been a professional athlete. Xavier is probably going to walk on campus as the most physically impressive player outside of Aldrich. Plus, Mayer just needs to let the grudge against Carl and the boys die. Move on.

Keith Kienzle 11 years ago

Here's why I disagree with redshirting Releford, though he and maybe (though I know next to nothing about him) Thomas Robinson, would be the logical candidates: a) I'm not sure it will get any better for him next year. Next year, at the very least, we should have CJ, Elijah, Brady, and Tyrel back, and probably a 4 star+ recruit in the backcourt. I guess if Travis at 6'5 plays the 3, he could get some solid PT, not if we get Harrison Barnes (if he goes to Duke, forget I ever had any interest in him). b) he has 3 years of eligibility left, right? So if he has a chance of playing for a national title, why not? If he redshirts, will he earn himself any more eligiblity the following year? Conversely, if he turns it on his last 2 years, will not having an additional year hurt his NBA stock any? I wouldn't think so.

NH_JHawk 11 years ago

Jeez take it easy Mayer. This happens every year with Sherron.

Keith Kienzle 11 years ago

sorry, i meant "will he earn himself any more playing time the following year?"

waywardJay 11 years ago

Im not against pushing the story for a better result, I understand that. Im not against Publishing a negative, to strive for a greater positive.

I'm just not for imagining absurd realities, I mean the kinda of absurd realities that make Picasso look like a Monk. We understand Self's frustration with Sherron's off season schedule.... that's understandable. We can understand HOW SHerron got that way, excuse or not.

However, to suggest that Sherron is in danger of losing his starting position would be like suggesting Michael Jackson Is coming back from the dead to challenge Orrin Hatch's Senate seat in Utah, after coming clean about Child abuse. It's not happening.

Which is why I stopped reading the article after the headline.

waywardJay 11 years ago

Jaybate.

Your Glue Guy is Brady Morningstar starting at the 2.

S'why Tyshawn will be first off the Bench.

Lance Hobson 11 years ago

Bit of an odd article with the transition to Henry bashing after what I thought was a Sherron article. I suppose he'll get in shape eventually, but he needed to be playing this summer. I'm sure he had family issues but the fact that he was so out of shape probably didn't exactly make the decision to bow out very difficult.

He needs to be a senior and show up for boot camp ready to set the example. The Henry brothers will need that.

suttonku 11 years ago

Aprox,

You honestly think that Releford will get valuable playing time next year? from what ive seen and heard this summer he is the #4 at the wing spot...and he has no jump shot!!!!!!!!! give him a year of valuable practice time with the first round draft picks we have and that will make him better...it will be a waste of a year if we dont redshirt him...and there is no way Robinson is going to redshirt...he could be our best rebounder and we dont get Withey until the end of December and since we lost Quintrell we will need Robinson off that bench with Markief and Marcus will prolly have to play post until the big 12 season starts...Releford can be a great player for us but if you cant shoot you cant play at KU on the wing...e has great athleticism and if he gets a shot he will be a first round pick in a couple years but if he is not redshirting then he will sit on the bench and maybe, maybe get 5 minutes a game and if you ask me, that is not enough time to get better.

Dyrk Dugan 11 years ago

this article was written about two weeks ago...and then just released early July 17. it has to be, because it's all old news.

i mean really, who cares what Sherron Collins weighs in June of any year? and why are we bashing the Henrys, after all the hubbub and commentary from the early July stories? it makes it look like they're right...that they don't have support at KU.

This article is stupid and should have been canned as being totally absurd, out of touch and way behind in any news/opinion cycle.

Good grief, can we just get thru the summer, with no commentary about the recruitment of one of the highest rated players ever in KU history? he's in the fold...and he'll help us have a special season.....now let's all just shut up!!!!

Keith Kienzle 11 years ago

Sutton, I just don't see it making much difference to our team or to Releford whether he redshirts or not. Look at what Brandon did at the wing. He was our leading scorer and rebounder his sophomore year, right? And he didn't have very good handles. What strides is Releford going to make in 5 years that he couldn't make in 4? And if he could get to the point where he'd be a huge contributor with one more year of eligibility left b/c of redshirt, wouldn't he go to the draft anyway?

suttonku 11 years ago

Rush was twice the player Releford is and theyre two different types of players...Releford likes to run up and down the court and Rush is more of a half court guy that can run if he has to...next year will be no help to Releford sitting on the bench...if he redshirts he will get to practice and get better and if he develops a shot he will be a tremendous player...but he needs work and from the way I see it he wont be seeing much of the floor this season...like I said #4 on the depth chart...what's it going to hurt to redshirt him? I dont understand your argument he will waste a year on the bench and honestly he will need four years of college ball anyways

Brett Glover 11 years ago

Who let Mayer out of Pioneer Ridge?!

jchief40 11 years ago

C.J. Henry will be starting too.. not sure where Tyshawn will fit? Collins and X Henry are locks. Tyshawn will get plenty of play but I believe most everyone, including myself, will be surprised at how good CJ will turn out to be. Say what you will about their father but I bet he's just telling the truth: CJ is a baller. Xavier has said it before that he's a beast. CJ will be a big piece of the puzzle.

FairgroveJayhawk 11 years ago

Collins is 21, he can drop 20 pounds in a month no problem, no concerns, nothing new. He didn't forgo the NBA draft to jepordize his career with such nonsense as Mayer is suggesting.

I doubt X or CJ will have any more trouble physically than the other players. They have plans for their future and understand the process by now I'm sure.

Abnormal article. I side with removing it.

suttonku 11 years ago

I dont think CJ will start right away not not saying he wont start but hes going to have to earn his spot and him not being there this summer hurts his chances a lot

Trey Hohman 11 years ago

Bill Mayer is the Rush Limbaugh of sports journalism. If BM’s articles were a metaphor for sex, they would be a horde of virgins beating off to deranged rape fantasies.

LAJayhawk 11 years ago

Collins is 22. Everything else you said, though Fairgrove, is 100% accurate.

jaybate,

re: first post,

Great post. Although I could have done without the "...Sherron goes blind from too much auto stimulation..." Not exactly what I was hoping to read this evening.... :-)

jchief40 11 years ago

suttonku - yes true he will have to earn it. I am saying he has the tools to do so and that Mayer seems to be forgetting this...

FairgroveJayhawk 11 years ago

Thanks LAJayhawk, his birthday is March 18, 1987 which means he must have been held back or started late. Do you know the story?

Tony Bandle 11 years ago

suttonku is exactly right...Robinson not only doesn't redshirt but I predict will be the surprise guy off the bench early. He lives to rebound.

As I have stated before and having seen him play, he has Rodman-like instincts without the Rodman-like weirdness. He will be the Beast of the Boards and the paint WILL BE Mr. Robinson's Neighborhood.

Travis is in an awkward position...deep in the rotation with the current roster, yet needing game day experience to improve. Even with the guys leaving next year, if Harrison Barnes shows up, Releford may be in the same pickle.

Although I hope I am totally wrong, Travis may be the next transfer candidate.

LAJayhawk 11 years ago

Fairgrove,

No, I don't know the story. My guess is he started late. I'm from Chicago, and I had friends who had March birthdays. They turned 18 their senior year in high school. Sherron would have turned 19. I am curious if there is a story behind it.

re: Robinson,

I don't want to dog on anyone's post, but I would say -- barring injury and a "medical" redshirt -- there is a 0% chance Robinson redshirts. We need his size and power on the inside and on the glass, especially considering Withey won't be eligible until December. I haven't seen Robinson play first hand, but I've seen some clips, and the kid has some serious game. A lot of people are saying EJ will be the sleeper this year; my pick for that is Robinson. He looks D1 ready already (and I say that based on the clips I've seen of him on defense).

As for Releford, I can understand both sides: redshirting and not. I would not be surprised either way. I don't think he will transfer, Oakville, but you're certainly not out of place for thinking so. Perhaps he takes his cues from D-Jack and gets his turn as an upperclassman. If Barnes does come -- even though he's high on education -- there is still probably a good chance Harrison is gone after a year. Plus, you'd have to think that Travis, by that point, would be number 1 off the bench. Patience, I do think will pay off for him in the long run.

suttonku 11 years ago

yes thats why I said that Releford will be a four year guy...if he gets a good jumpshot, improves his handles a bit, and works on his defense then after his senior year he will be a 1st round draft pick but its going to take time...KU is always going to get great players like Barnes so Releford should have motivation to improve...wouldnt shock me if he left...I see his talent but right now he is not good enough to play for this team more than 5 minutes a game and that is not enough time to get better...besides look at how much Morningstar improved off of a redshirt year.

jayhawksnumber1 11 years ago

The topic is old news, the writing is weak, and the analysis lacking. Mayer has lost it or his editor has. Stick to stories about past teams, you will have more success and have us nodding with you rather than shaking our head.

Sam Burns 11 years ago

Jaybate....How did you resist ending your comment with "Bill Mayer..........Here's your sign"?

I am really tired of people, that have no idea of what is going on with the Henry boys, assuming the worst and bashing them. It's way past time for us to get behind them and welcome them to Kansas. Let's support them and have a little confidence in them.

hawkson 11 years ago

Hey, Sherron's weight --- assuming he gets it back down close to 215 and does not suffer a stress fracture preseason--- won't make enough difference to be noticeable to the Jayhawks next season. He'll be the leader of the band and a clutch performer just like this year.

What he HAS done is hurt his chance to be a top draft pick. IMHO, his only path to the lottery (or maybe even 1st round) was to come back lean and mean and prove to the NBA guys that his self control problems were behind him. I feel bad for him...missed opportunity.

Keith Kienzle 11 years ago

I'm eating up the insights on EJ, CJ, and Robinson. Please keep feeding it! Anyone have some links to recent clips of these guys? More stories to tell? Seen them around, etc? These guys are past and present top 100 recruits. The chances that at least one of them doesn't turn into a stud in 1 to 2 years is slim to none. The highlight reels for EJ are nasty. I like the new long guards (a la Tyshawn, EJ and CJ) that Self is bringing in. While I loved RussRob, Mario and Sherron and their cold-blooded game, I think they are the exception rather than the rule in terms of winning us that championship, and longer guards make our ability to guard in half court much stronger, especially against hot 3-point shooters, something that has sunk our battleship on numerous occasions. I wonder if we'll see Self adapt from full-court pressure to falling back in a set D more often? Where Mario and RussRob gave teams fits at half court, I wonder if we'll continue that relentless pressure, or if our new guys have a different skill set and may not be as quick as our last generation, but more apt to defend in half-court.

Keith Kienzle 11 years ago

LAJayhawk, it isn't like KU is a slouch of a school for academics (in reference to your comment that Barnes is high on education).

Personally, I find an education at a fine state school like KU with a large diverse student body much more fulfilling than the myopic, elitist world view you would come face-to-face with at a private Quaker school like Universitas Dukiana. Especially if you're a one-and-doner. The "college experience" is going to be more educational than the 100 level classes you'll be taking in your first year.

Anyone considering leaving Dook early should take note of how the Silverspooners treated Elton Brand when he left town:

http://www.truthaboutduke.com/encyc.php?encycid=2

LAJayhawk 11 years ago

approx-

Please re-read my comment. I was not in anyway discussing Duke; in fact, I never even mentioned them. I was saying that even though education is important to Barnes, my guess is he still leaves early from school, probably after a year. And I was saying that in regards to him donning the crimson and the blue. Where exactly do you get Duke from that? Please don't project your thoughts or others thoughts on to me. Thank you.

My wife and I both hold degrees from the University of Kansas. So does my brother. And my sister. Actually, they both have two a piece. I am very proud of the education I recieved from KU, and I wouldn't trade it for anything in the world. That is why a KU flag waves outside my house in Southern California.

Keith Kienzle 11 years ago

I see now, sorry LA. I thought you were saying "even though he's high on education" in counterpoint to him coming [to Kansas]. Sorry about that.

You're right, I am scared that Barnes will go to Duke based on a false premise that the education he will receive there will be better.

Speaking of which, I've been trying to find some indication of more restrictive admission policies for Duke for some time, with no success. I live in the heart of ACC country, and Duke fans are always talking about how their failure in sports is due to more stringent requirements placed on their student athletes, but as far as I can tell, that's just a myth. Can anyone find any evidence otherwise?

Here s their athletic policy, presumably, http://www.biology.duke.edu/kksmithlab/Athletic%20Policy%20Manual.pdf

..and while it says that their student athletes must meet the requirements of any student in the university, it makes no indication as to how that is carried out, and then in direct contradiction to that, it states "However, as a part of the plan to resurrect football, the Director of Admissions will consider admitting more applicants who reside at the lower reaches of our pool of admissible prospects"

Jim Williamson 11 years ago

Wow, Bill, this went well.

Yeah. This column was really, really bad.

LAJayhawk 11 years ago

approx-

No problem. I don't know what Duke's entry requirements are (I actually know little about them as an institution). If you are actually interested to see if they are a "higher" level of academics, then you might look into their department rankings. That certainly doesn't prove the education is better, but it does rely a lot on how quickly graduates get work. Again, not a measurement, necessarily, on how good the schooling is, but probably a better idea of how it is seen by employers in the working world.

In the end, though, education is a subjective thing and can't really be measured by statistics, in my opinion. Plus it ranges between classes due to professors, TA's and students. You can have a great professor, but I guarantee you learn more with a class of interactive students who are interested in actually learning themselves. It pushes you and makes it more interesting.

My two cents.

mjlindsm 11 years ago

Regarding the "long guards" thing, I disagree on thinking of that as really a good thing. In fact, in college, I think it's usually good to have mostly undersized players and a couple good sized guys. The problem with the guys with good size for their positions is that the NBA sees "potential." They leave early, regardless of whether or not they're actually done anything in college (Jrue Holliday, BJ Mullens, Deandre Jordan off the top of my head). Undersized players like Sherron are great to have because they won't leave early usually and have the chance of becoming college legends if they're good enough. Throw in a couple of NBA-type bodies (Henry and Aldrich) and some good role players (Morningstar, Marcus Morris), and you've got yourself as good of a title contender as you could possibly get.

I left Taylor out of that because I don't know what I feel with him. I mean I like him a lot. But he's part of what I don't like about guys with good size. He's projected by many a first round pick next year because he's athletic and has good size for an NBA point guard. However, he never really showed to ability to play point guard in college. That's the "long guard" problem. He could be gone next year after having half the career undersized Sherron Collins and Russell Robinson had.

mjlindsm 11 years ago

While I'm at it, undersized bigs are even better. Sam Clancy, Craig Smith, Tyler Hansbrough, Ryan Gomes, Luke Harangody, and of course, Big Dub. These type of guys often dominate in college. Some are decent in the pros, some never make it, but they can really help a college team for many years. Sometimes they leave early because they figure their stock won't improve anyway since they're not growing (Ike Diogu, Dajuan Blair), but more often, these guys are more likely to become college stars than previously mentioned bigs like Mullens and Jordan.

Then you have those guys who have great size and skill and can go in the lottery, yet decide to come back to college. It's a rare phenomenon known as Colealdrich.

justanotherfan 11 years ago

mklindsm,

I understand your point, but the problem with that is that most of the guys you list, while very, very good college players, didn't win anything. Gomes, Harangody, etc. They had nice careers, but didn't do much. Meanwhile, for the most part, the national titles have been won by teams laden with NBA players.

You might point to Hansborough, but if he had not been surrounded by two other legit first round talents (Lawson and Ellington), plus another fringe NBA player (Green) and a guy who could become an NBA player (Ed Davis), it's doubtful UNC wins the title this year. If you surround Hansborough with merely "good college players" its unlikely they make it past the Sweet 16.

Check out the past several champs and the players they sent to the NBA (first round draft pick in parentheses)

2009 - UNC - Hansborough (13), Lawson (18), Ellington (28), Green (and maybe Ed Davis soon) 2008 - Kansas - Rush (13), Arthur (27), Chalmers, Jackson (and maybe Kaun, Robinson, Collins and Aldrich soon). 2007 - Florida - Horford (3), Brewer (7), Noah (9), Green, Richard (Marreesse Speights was drafted 16th the next year). 2006 - Florida - Everyone listed above was on this team also. 2005 - UNC - Williams (2), Felton (5), May (13), McCants (14) 2004 - UConn - Okafor (2), Gordon (3), (Villanueva went 7 the next year, Williams (22) and Boone (23) went the year after that) 2003 - Syracuse - Anthony (3) (Hakim Warrick went 19 2 years later) 2002 - Maryland - Wilcox (8), Dixon (17), Baxter, Blake 2001 - Duke - Battier (6), Boozer, (Jason (Jay) Williams (2), and Mike Dunleavy (3) went the next year, Dahntay Jones went two years later (23), Chris Duhon the year after that).

Every team listed except Syracuse had at least four NBA players on it. Regardless of how you feel about it personally, the reality is that it takes the very best players to have a shot at winning it all, and the very best players will likely move on to play in the NBA sooner than that next tier of players.

Looking back now, I am realizing just how stacked some of these teams were.

justanotherfan 11 years ago

Before the 2008 Final Four, I wrote that it was the most star studded FF of all time. I also predicted that possibly as many as 20 players in that FF would go on to play in the NBA, an absurd number

North Carolina - Hansborough, Lawson, Ellington, Green all drafted this year. UCLA - Westbrook, Love, Mbah a Moute all drafted last year, Collison and Shipp taken this year. Memphis - Rose, Douglas-Roberts, Dorsey all drafted last year, Dozier and Taggart both have been playing in the NBA summer league. Kansas - Rush, Arthur, Chalmers, Jackson and Kaun all drafted last year. Robinson getting a long look from Orlando. Collins and Aldrich will probably be on a roster next year.

That's 22 guys from those FF teams. Any doubt why those teams were #1 seeds?

mjlindsm 11 years ago

Excellent points.

I'm not saying I don't like NBA-caliber players. I'm talking strictly size keeping guys around for more than two years so the players can develop as college stars. Of the players you've listed from recent championship teams, most left after their junior or senior years, many not earlier, and I think a reason they didn't leave earlier was because their size didn't guarantee them a first round spot. From your list, only Arthur, Speights, Marvin Williams, Villanueva, Anthony, and Wilcox left before their junior years if I'm not mistaken. Of those, only Anthony was a real star.. I'm not going to delete what I wrote because I took the time to write it. I looked and saw Rose their too. Hmm. OK, I may have lost this one...

Chad Hallack 11 years ago

I agree, a pitiful article... that was 40 secods I will never get back.

"Sherron might lose his starting spot and the Henry's think they're the saviors... and yadi blah blah"

Pretty sure Sherron's will be way better than fine and play quite a bit this year...

Pretty sure the Henry's don't see themselves as saviors, what exactly would they be here to save? If we need saving then somebody better haul ass to the next swim meet and make sure Michael Phelps doesn't drown...

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