Monday, April 6, 2009

Gary Bedore’s KU basketball notebook


Reader poll

Who are you cheering for in the national championship game?

  • Michigan State 74% 315 votes
  • North Carolina 16% 71 votes
  • Undecided 8% 37 votes

423 total votes.

Chalmers looks back

Former Kansas University guard Mario Chalmers of the Miami Heat was asked by the Associated Press on Sunday to reflect on his game-tying three-pointer with 2.1 seconds left that sent the 2008 NCAA title game between KU and Memphis into overtime.

“It seems like a lot longer ago than a year already,” said Chalmers, who has started at point guard every game his rookie season. “The NBA season is so long, you don’t always have time to think about the past. But it’s still a great feeling, knowing you’ll be remembered for that, something I did, something that’ll go down in history for my school and my family.”

Chalmers said there was no doubt when he went up for the biggest shot in KU history.

“I knew,” he told the AP. “I made a name for myself doing something I’m proud of.”

Cheering for Roy

Former KU guard Ryan Robertson, who played for Roy Williams-coached KU teams from 1995 to ’99, said he’ll be rooting for the Tar Heels against Michigan State tonight.

Robertson was in San Antonio last year cheering wildly for his Jayhawks during the NCAA semifinal victory over Carolina and title victory over Memphis.

“I was just thinking about last year and how everybody in the media was asking us (Jayhawks who played for Williams), ‘Who are you rooting for, your alma mater or coach Williams?’ Clearly I was rooting for my alma mater,” Robertson said.

“Now this year, since we are not there, I’m cheering for North Carolina. I think it’s a good illustration of what we tried to tell everybody last year: We want them (Heels) to win every single game unless it’s against Kansas. We want them to win every recruiting battle, unless it’s against Kansas for a player we want.

“I want Kansas to be better than North Carolina,” Robertson added. “But tomorrow, I’m rooting for my ex-coaches and friends (like Jerod Haase and C.B. McGrath) who are there, now.”

Robertson said he didn’t know of any of his former KU teammates who’ll be at the game Monday night.

“That doesn’t have anything to do with coach Williams. It’s more about Detroit,” Robertson said of the Final Four site, which is forecast to be hit by a snowstorm today.

“I called coach Williams before the tournament and said I’d be watching and wished him luck. I remember when I was a player, right before the NCAA Tournament, coach Williams would say (to media), ‘I got calls today from 15 of my former players,’ and he’d name them all. I said, ‘OK, I guess that’s what you do when you are an alum.’

“So I usually call him before the season starts, right before the tournament and the Final Four.”

Robertson is the guy who took the heat from North Carolina fans for pinning a KU sticker on Williams 10 minutes before the national title game. Williams sat in the KU section and rooted for the Jayhawks.

One problem with the story: Robertson didn’t pin the sticker on Williams.

“My friend from Wichita (a financial advisor for Merrill Lynch) said, ‘Here coach, put this on,’’’ Robertson recalled. “There was so much hustle and bustle with the crowd, I waved at coach Williams and left. Next thing I know, I look at the big board, and there he is with the sticker on. I didn’t know if my friend slapped it on him or coach Williams put it on.

“Then coach mentioned he got the sticker from me. All the Web sites and blogs in North Carolina were blaming me. They were all up in arms that I did it. I didn’t do it,” Robertson added with a laugh.

Mrs. Mizzou

Robertson, who is regional director for marketing for The Hartford in St. Charles, Mo., had some interesting family news to report Sunday night.

His wife, Andrea, recently won the title, “Mrs. Missouri America 2009” held in Branson, Mo., and has qualified for the upcoming Mrs. America pageant.

“I tell all my friends I’m ‘Mr. Missouri’ now,” Robertson said.

Last year revisited

Williams, who tonight tries for his second national title, was asked by media about last year’s 84-66 semifinal loss to Kansas.

“Well, I was there 15 years. That game is going to be with me forever, how we just didn't play as well as I wanted to play,” Williams said. “I still felt like at halftime we were going to win the game. I honest to goodness felt we were going to win the game. But we didn’t.

“And then the criticism that I received two days later for one of my former players handing me a sticker and putting (it) on. It was not the best weekend. It’s not going on vacation, (National) Lampoon or anything. That was a tough time. But I’m a big boy. You’ve got to be able to handle that stuff. It didn’t make me work any harder over the summer. It hurt a great deal. I still hurt a great deal. But at the same time, I have a wonderful group of kids that helped me turn the page.

“I have not looked at that tape, not one time. Until I die, at the Pearly Gates, if I happen to be lucky enough to go there, I’ll ask St. Peter to give me the tape and I’ll watch it at that time.”


Kevin Sontag 10 years, 9 months ago

Yeah, Roy hasn't watched the tape, but I bet he's seen the game about twenty times in his nightmares :)

Seth Peattie 10 years, 9 months ago

roy is a KU BRO!!! good luck tonight, KU BRO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mike Crosbie 10 years, 9 months ago

I picked MSU in my brackets so go MSU....BUT, UNC and KU are basketball cousins, and KU made Roy into the coach he is today, so the best to Roy, Good luck !!

Rock Chalk !!

KU 10 years, 9 months ago

I don't understand these people who want UNC to win every game except when they play KU. What kind of sense does that make? Don't we want KU to become the #1 program in terms of all-time wins? How are we going to do that if we wish UNC or Kentucky all the luck in the world?

I want to bury those programs and I don't wish them any luck.

Rock Chalk.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 9 months ago

Any team with Jayhawk ties, I wish no ill will...but I only CHEER for one team..THE KANSAS JAYHAWKS!!!

KEITHMILES05 10 years, 9 months ago

Roy......being the martyr and drama queen he is. He still hurts. He can't let it go. He can't watch the tape. He was sick. He threw up in a towel. Blah. Blah. Blah.

What a head case.

Joe Joseph 10 years, 9 months ago

Quotes like that make me happy that Bill Self is the coach of Kansas.

Greg Lux 10 years, 9 months ago

Why do some people have to be so narrow minded. Roy was the coach at KU for 15 yrs. He had just got beaten badly by his former school. Why do they make a big deal out of a Jayhawk sticker on his sweater at the title game? Roy has been very honest ( in my opinion ) about his love for both schools and I respect that of him. I am thrilled he has his livelong dream job and I am thrilled we have HCBS at KU. I have always respected Roy for the 15 years he gave KU and I thank him for his loyalty to KU after his current team got there butts beat. That takes real guts to wear that sticker and I respect him for it.

Rock Chalk

niemoth 10 years, 9 months ago

Anybody heard the latest on Sherron and Cole's decisions. Or what hoops does Henry and his brother have to jump through before they can come here? Will Lance Stephenson still come here (as was predicted) if Henry comes here? Anybody with some inside info please? Thanks.

swjhawk 10 years, 9 months ago

Time, Bill Self, and that championship trophy heals all wounds. Dumping out on KU after saying he would stay (so he could coach Heinrich & Collison), then fleeing the second time and in the manner he fled is in history and can't be erased. We thought he was a class guy but it turned out otherwise. All's well that ends well.

Appoggiatura 10 years, 9 months ago

I have no hard feeling towards Roy Williams. He's a good man and if he should win tonight, I'd be happy for him. That being said, I absolutely hate ESPN's North Carolina Tar Heels and their fans.


Tribehawk 10 years, 9 months ago

Yeah, it always hurts when your ex-girlfriend dumps you for your own brother, but in the end, if everyone is better for it, why be bitter?

Because of our history, Kansas has links to every major basketball program, but the roots run especially deep and intermingled with UNC. I don't see why we can't simply accept them as our sister program and root for them when not playing against them. In many ways, their success is our success and vice versa.

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago

Here's the problem with Roy.

He wants UNC to be better than KU.

Let me repeat for the sentimental.

Roy wants UNC to be better than KU.

He wants to beat us out for the best players. He wants UNC to be ranked higher in the polls. He wants UNC to be recognized as the best D1 college basketball program, not KU's equal. He wants the UNC legacy to eclipse The KU Legacy. He is unconditional in this. He makes no apologies for this. He is Robert E. Lee and this is a basketball Civil War and it is damned well time KU people who like Roy, and I have been among them, wake up to the fact that in the final analysis it matters who side you are on and you can't be on both sides, when both sides compete for the same thing--unless you are a central banker, or an oil company, or TV network, controlled by that central banker.

There can be no equivocating on the above.

Roy wants UNC to be better than KU now, later and always.

Again, this is the basketball equivalent of civil war between KU and UNC, whether we want it to be, or not. UNC is a program cleaved from our family tree. Roy does not just want UNC to beat KU during the occassional game they play. Roy wants UNC to become the dominant force of college basketball year in and year out.

Roy only wants detente, when it suits his purpose of preparing for the next war.

Screw detente, Roy.

I know the acts of an enemy when I see one, no matter what words come from his mouth.

Reading between the lines in these quotes, Roy hated losing that game to KU more than anything, certainly more than I would have hated KU losing to Roy. I used to be able to buy into the idea that keeping it in the family made such competitions and losses okay. But that was when someone in the family was not trying to undermine and overthrow the order at every turn and permanently.

Frankly, I was going to root for Roy tonight until I read this story, not that than matters much.

But I know a mortal enemy when I see one.

I am for KU being better than UNC now, later and always.

Roy winning anything, even a pick up game, is not good for KU now, later and always.

We want the same players. We want the same stature. We want the same rings. We want the same media attention.

Two go in. One comes out.

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago

Roy is competing for and beating us at recruiting MickeyDs; that means he is stacking the deck for beating us in the future repeatedly. He is getting better talent in greater numbers every year.

Coach Self has a chance to begin to reverse this process with the next couple classes, but such a hangs entirely in the balance.

What is best for KU basketball is for Roy to fail miserably tonight--to be outcoached--to be exposed once again for not being a strong bench coach--to be revealed once again for needing wildly superior talent to beat his competition and often failing when he has it--to betray the fact that inside good ol' Roy is a man who cries and flees when he can't have things his way--to be asked point blank in the tear soaked losers interview if losing to MSU hurts as much as losing to KU last year.

What is best for KU is for Michigan State, which I despise, to win, because that implies that KU probably could have won it all had KU had a decent trey shooting night against the eventual national champions.

KU is in an intense and ongoing competition with UNC for the best talent to be the best program in college basketball. In sports competition, second place is something to be respected as an accomplishment, but not the object of the game.

KU needs new athletic housing NOW! This is an absolute must, whether KU incidentally ends up with Henry and Stephenson this year, or not. Bill Self is a great coach and a fine recruiter, but he has to have this housing now.

KU may need a new arena now, too! There is a war on. War requires change that was once thought unthinkable. And here is the solution to those who will scream not to tear down Allen Field House (and I will be screaming among them). Build the new Allen Field House beside the old Allen Field House. Use both the same way KU uses both the blue and the red uniforms. Hire OakvilleJHawk to design the new Allen Field House to look like the old Allen Field House in the way the new Yankee Stadium looks like the old Yankee Stadium. Another possible solution is to literally enclose the old Allen Field House inside a newer larger Allen Field House, one that looks almost identical to the one that is enclosed within it. Double deck the entire arena seating. The possibilities are endless. If we want to continue the legacy, the architect can continue the architectural legacy. Michaelangelo added the dome to Il Duomo in the cathedral in Florence and the building is much the better for it. Allen Field House does not have to be destroyed. It can be made much the better, not just by up dating the interfaces, but by scaling up the entire structure. Allen Field House was made the scale that it was, because that was as grand as the visionaries of the time could envision and the budget and corresponding national guard armory usage could be fitted to. It is not an upper limit.

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago

But another possibility that would work for me even better than physically expanding Allen Field House, and which I believe would be more cost effective and given the technological trends of the future, would be to create a virtual Allen Field House that persons who cannot be there could experience. As OakvilleJHawk can no doubt attest, architects already build virtual models of many of the structures they create for clients. These virtual structures are used to let the client "tour" what will be build inside and out. These virtual structures are often visually simplified to control costs. But the fact is, there is no reason whatsoever that KU could not go to Pixar/Disney, or Industrial Light and Magic, and create an absolutely realistic virtual Allen Field House down to the last nut and bolt, down to the last harmonic vibration of the metal structure, down to the last decibel level, down to the last person sitting in the stands, one with every loge, seating section, one with everything, that every Jayhawk fan could experience virtually.

We have the technology at hand, via broadband internet, to put everyone in the virtual field house. KU could go to Wii/Nintendo and turn virtual Allen Field House into an affordable virtual experience. Every Jayhawk fan could sit in the best seat in the house, mid court, five rows up, and have multiple windows open with multiple camera angles. Every Jayhawk fan could get up and walk around the field house, walk down to the bench and stand or sit behind Coach Self and the players, or walk out on the court virtually during actual play and run with the team. Every Jayhawk fan could go up and meet with friends, or sit with friends, in a virtual corporate box. This is all technologically feasible right now and it would be drastically cheaper to set up than building a new arena and risking changing the beloved dynamics of the old one.

This is the future of college basketball viewing, probably of all sports viewing.

KU has always lead college basketball into the future.

KU had hired the founder of the game to start college basketball.

KU had the first great coach of the college game.

KU developed all of the basic ways of playing the game.

KU had one of the first good arenas to play the college game in in old Hoch Auditorium.

KU was the first great winning program both in percentage and in championships.

KU lead the country in creating the NCAA national basketball championship.

KU was the first of the great basketball programs to integrate, and among the first of all basketball programs to integrate.

KU had the first and still the best gigantic basketball arena on campus.

KU had the first truly great athletic 7' center who changed the game for ever.

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago

KU revitalized itself when it was sagging and reascended to the pinnacle of basketball excellence and proved to all the other programs that the old could be made new again.

KU lead the country in rediscovering and reconnecting with the legacy and history of college basketball.

KU lead the country in naming basketball courts after truly legendary figures.

KU was among the leaders of embracing the time zone centered conference for television.

KU now has to reassert itself as the visionary in the experience of college basketball. It has to either build a new arena, or create the virtual arena I am envisioning, or both.

And it has to do this in part to meet the immediate challenge of Roy Williams and UNC, and the soon to emerge challenge of John Calipari and UK.

It has to.

In basketball, the object of the game is to win by the rules. Part of winning, is recognizing when it is time to put one's boot on the back of the neck of an opponent and stop feeling them out for weaknesses and advantage. We know what Roy's strength's and weaknesses are. His strength is Dean Smith and the location of UNC on the eastern sea board. His weakness is Roy Williams and the fact that the Eastern time zone is not as easy to view across the USA as the central time zone is.

Every once in awhile, because of my fondness for Roy's 15 years of hard work at KU and because of his style of ball that he plays, I forget that Roy at UNC is KU's mortal enemy until he retires. He will never acknowledge the way he damaged KU by leaving the program in a national title run and for 15 years recruiting only half the country in order to protect the UNC program that he eventually wanted to run. Fine.

Now here this:

I am for Roy failing miserably tonight. And for Roy losing every game, until KU is getting the better talent, and winning all the rings, and Roy and UNC are so lousy that we can afford to mend fences with him. Or until he retires. Which ever comes first.

Thanks, Gary Bedore, for reminding me with Roy's own words of the realities of the competition between KU and UNC, and of the nature of Roy's relationship with KU.

After he quits coaching against us, competing against us for talent, trying to beat us on the floor, and trying to make UNC the superior program year in and year out; that is, after he retires, then will be the time to mend fences and give him his proper due for his contributions to KU. Until then...

Go Spartans.

gthejayhawk 10 years, 9 months ago

Jaybate, you struck a chord... GO SPARTANS!!!!

Tribehawk 10 years, 9 months ago


All of KU's accolades and accomplishments you list are true, but why catalogue them like this when discussing UNC? It seems a bit like a knee-jerk reaction caused by a latent inferiority complex. Obviously, KU is not inferior to UNC--or any program for that matter. KU doesn't need a stroke job. I get the feeling you're being driven to write all this by certain feelings of insecurity. That would also explain the irrational hatred of Roy Williams.

I'm not suggesting that we all bow down and worship at Roy's feet. I'm definitely a Self fan, and Self is the better coach in my opinion. But we shouldn't forget all that Roy did for us for 15 years. We don't even sniff a chance at hiring Bill Self if not for the foundation that Roy laid after Larry Brown. And its ridiculous to believe that Roy has it in for us. Unless you're going to argue that the wearing of the infamous Jayhawk sticker had some hidden, nefarious plot behind it, it seems obvious that Roy genuinely wants to see us succeed. There's no reason we can't feel the same for him and his program--so long as they are not head to head.

Every great person/program needs a good foil. Otherwise, you can't see how great they truly are. UNC is our sister program. We push each other to be better than either of us could be by ourselves. There's no shame in saying that our programs are connected. Great rivalries CAN and SHOULD BE based on mutual admiration--not mutual hatred. We already have a foe we can hate--MU. That should be enough. There's no reason to paint Roy a villain just so that we can create a new hated rival.

InfiniteJ 10 years, 9 months ago

Of course Coach Williams wants North Carolina to be better than Kansas.....he's their freakin' coach, just like Coach Self wants his team to be better than Illinois, Tulsa, Oral Roberts, and every other team in college basketball.

I grew up being a KU and a UNC fan, so of course I'm going to root for the Tar Heels tonight, but even if I wasn't a UNC fan, I'd still root for them because Coach Williams is a good coach and a good person, he gave everyting he had when he coached KU and I will always be a fan of him for that.

Anyone who still has hard feelings about Coach Williams leaving for UNC is a total douche bag.

As far as recruiting goes, there is plenty of talent to go around, besides, it's not all about being a McDonald's All-American or a Parade All-American, it's about how a player fits into a coach's system/program. Yes, it's awesome to recruit and sign 5-star players, but having 5 or 6 McDonald's All-Americans on a team doesn't always equal a National Championship. Despite programs like Duke, UNC, UConn, and UCLA, Coach Self and the Univerisity of Kansas still gets it's share of elite talent.

Bill Self and his assistant coaches are the best in the country and it's been six years since Roy Williams left for's time to get over it.

Marcia Parsons 10 years, 9 months ago

You would expect Roy Williams to hope that UNC would be worse that KU? Wow. I'd sure hate to think that Bill Self was going around secretely wishing someone else would be better than KU.

hawk_of_ages 10 years, 9 months ago

Well put, Tribehawk, though I don't know if I'd go so far as to call UNC a "sister program."

Root against UNC if you like, but the good Roy did for Kansas far, far, outweighs any negativity surrounding his departure. Before Larry Brown arrived, the program was good but hadn't been a perennial title contender since Wilt. Larry restored that, but then he bolted as Larry Brown always does, leaving recruiting penalties in his wake. It took Roy to repair the program and maintain the winning standard over the long haul.

Criticize Roy's recruiting all you like, but the fact is that we're much more competitive recruiting against the UNCs and Dukes of the world as a result of his high-profile success over 15 years.

He didn't win the title at KU, but to blame that on inferior coaching is absurd given how close he came so many times (not to mention the lucky breaks that Larry and Self got in winning their titles).

And the notion that Roy "needs wildly superior talent to beat his competition" is utterly ridiculous to anyone who remembers his 1989-93 teams, before the Mickey D's recruits started coming to Lawrence.

I am as proud to be a Jayhawk fan as ever; I was as thrilled as could be when we crushed Roy's Tar Heels last year; and I am absolutely thrilled to have Bill Self as our coach now. But I will nonetheless be rooting for Roy tonight.

keith horinek 10 years, 9 months ago

Jaybate, actually i think every head coach in a DI program should want to be better than KU or any other DI program. Isn't that the nature of the business? To be better than everybody else? Roy gave 15 years to KU and put them back in the spotlight after Larry Brown left. People need to get over Roy and let it all go. I'll be cheering for UNC tonite, not for any of the players on the UNC team but for Roy Williams, Joe Holladay, Steve Robinson, C.B. McGrath and Jerod Haase. They work just as hard as any other DI team throughout the year and BB season. I would not want them to cheer against KU if KU was in the same position tonite. Think about it.

King_Kaun 10 years, 9 months ago

I am rooting for Michigan State tonight. Mainly because of my bracket, but hey...they knocked KU off this year, so it's always best if the team you lost to in the tourney ended up winning it all, right?? I mean...they couldn't beat them that year...but guess what... NOBODY could!

Go Spartans!

InfiniteJ 10 years, 9 months ago

Hey, drgnslayr, aren't you going to jump into this and praise jaybate for his intellect or blast a clever post like "Hey everyone, wake me up when something happens."?

kufankam 10 years, 9 months ago

I love coach Williams and will be thrilled to see him succeed. KU will be just fine even if UNC wins another title. I am thankful for all the teams Roy assembled and was thrilled to watch em all!!

As far as the recruiting? Gimme a break! Self does more with lesser named recruits than any coach in the country. Of last year's 8 newcomers, 0 were McD's participants. UNC could get McD's recruits every year and we will be there stride for stride. Self is not second to anyone when it comes to putting together a recruiting class (McD's players or not).

eastTXjayhawk 10 years, 9 months ago

i'd be happy to revisit the "vince the shamwow guy" story if necessary

Lance Hobson 10 years, 9 months ago

I just can't cheer for UNC, but it doesn't matter. MSU has no chance tonight.

af13 10 years, 9 months ago

Jaybate, that was one of the furthest tangents I've ever seen. The only reason I'm responding is because I'm in the 3d and the architecture business. As an alum, your virtual Allen Fieldhouse idea sounds intriguing, especially since I never go to games anymore. But, in my professional opinion, nothing will replace the real life gameday atmosphere at AFH, no matter how good technolgy gets. Personally, I hope they never tear down that building. There are too many memories.

imzcount 10 years, 9 months ago

It's time to stop being all sappy and sentimental about coach Williams. There's nothing wrong in appreciating his time at KU, however he is GONE. It's fine if you want to root for coach Williams but now he is coaching at North Carolina. Why do true KU fans forget that this is about KU and total wins and every time North Carolina wins a game it takes that much longer to get ahead of them in the total win column. It's as simple as that.

Tribehawk 10 years, 9 months ago

Why does everyone have stat-envy? Whether we have won a few more games or a few less games than UNC over the past century doesn't mean that we are a better or a worse program. It's not a zero-sum game. You can't measure things like tradition, heritage, and legacy with numbers. Besides, if you're going to rely on stats to prove who has the better program, then you need to forget about overall wins and run some sort of 150-year, uber-RPI analysis on all the teams. That's the only way to tell if our 2000 wins are of a better quality than UNC's 2000 wins. Frankly, I have better things to do with my time.

hawk_of_ages 10 years, 9 months ago

Yeah, I don't really know why we would want to focus on total lifetime program wins as a reason to root one way or the other in a specific game. But if you do care about that stat, keep in mind that Self will be coaching for a lot more years than Roy will. There's plenty of time to catch up.

Matt Gonzo 10 years, 9 months ago

Saturday, instead of watching the NC-Nova game, I threw in the dvd player the NC- KU Final 4 game from last year. What a great game. Maybe tonight I'll watch KU-Memphis instead of MSU-NC. Rock Chalk!!

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago


Wake up.

We can't be the best, if Roy's got the best talent.

We can't be the best, if UNC is the best.

We can love Roy and give him his dues after he retires. We don't have to love him now, do we? Can't he stand to do without our love until he retires? I am hobbling along ever freakin' day without Roy's love--with Roy loving UNC and trying to make it better than KU. I don't have to help him, do I?

Geez, whose side are you on? Be a man and take a stand. Are you for Roy's success, when it makes it more difficult for us to recruit the players we need, or not? What? Do you want Self to quit recruiting the eastern half of the country to help Roy, because Roy did the same thing to help UNC?

And cut the vulgar ad homs, puhleeeeeze. It makes you seem like, well, like "a douche bag." ;-)

Seth Nesmith 10 years, 9 months ago

Good luck Michigan St., I hope you demolish North Carolina! I hope Roy loses by 20+!

d_prowess 10 years, 9 months ago

mgonzo182, have fun watching the Memphis-KU game tonight. I know Calapari says that his team can hit free throws when they need to, but I have to think the percentages could catch up with them on some night. Here is hoping tonight is that night! It will also be interesting to see how our guards, especially Collins, do against Rose. Hopefully he will take the Chicago rivalry to heart and really D up on him!

hawk_of_ages 10 years, 9 months ago

By your logic, Jaybate -- which seems to be that tonight's game has potential recruiting consequences -- Kansas fans should definitely be rooting for UNC. Izzo and the Spartans are a much bigger threat to our Midwest recruiting base than Roy is at this point.

Right now, as Memphis is likely to decline as a recruiting threat, Kansas is THE big dog in the Midwest -- thinking of Chicago recruiting in particular -- but that could change if MSU is ascendant once again. On the other hand, even if UNC were to go into steep decline, Kansas at best would be able to steal a few East Coast guys every few years -- most of them just don't want to go so far from home.

jayhawkinnc 10 years, 9 months ago

Hi folks. I'm a longtime viewer but a first time poster. I gotta talk about Roy. I'm a KU grad (Dec. '97) and grew up a huge KU fan with a major man crush on Roy while I was growing up in high school and while I attended KU. However, I began to see Roy's true colors my senior year of college and his final years at KU while I was working in the media. Granted, he's a hell of a basketball coach and I'm grateful for what he did for KU for 15 years, but the man is a phony and a fake. I got to see a side of him that most people never saw until his final years at KU when his ego got WAAAYYY too big and didn't leave KU the best way (especially after he lied and said he would stay at KU the rest of his career). He's was a control freak not only with his team (which is ok), but tried controlling the entire KU Athletic Department, then the whole town of Lawrence and other people, etc. He was only nice to people who could help him and tried to be a bully to those who couldn't help him if you stuck the smallest of nerves with him. There were some times he was unnecessarily rude and mean to me while I worked in the media. In fact, Joe Holladay once had to call me and half-way apologize for Roy on his behalf. He comes across on TV as oh golly jee, dad gum, dog gone, ah shucks, play like the dickens good ol' choir boy Roy, but he's not. My cousin played for Roy as a walk-on in Roy's early years at KU. He said behind closed doors, Roy was the Bobby Knight of KU and dropped more F-bombs than you would imagine.

I was glad to see Roy leave in 2003. Heck, I wanted to see him leave in 2000. I'm glad he's gone. I also just got so sick of the same ol' drama routine by Roy every time his team lost in the tournament saying all the stuff he says every year. I love Bill Self. I think he's a better coach, a better recruiter and a better guy in the 1 time I've gotten to talk to him. He handles himself better in the media and is a better fit for KU. I wouldn't want any other coach in the country to coach my alma mater. But, there are still some fans who wish Roy was still at KU. Why? He didn't want to coach there anymore! Bill Self wants to coach at KU and for a long time. Bill Self brought us a National Title! Roy didn't. Let's support our current coach!

hawk_of_ages 10 years, 9 months ago

Jayhawkinnc, I don't see anyone saying they "wish Roy was still at KU." Who is saying that?

And it's ridiculous to say Roy "lied" about never leaving in 2000. What's your theory, that his choice to stay in 2000 was part of some nefarious long-term plot? Of course he thought he was going to retire at KU, but the circumstances changed between 2000 and 2003 -- in the meantime Bob Frederick was pushed out as AD, the guy who replaced him fired Roy's friend Terry Allen in the middle of the season, and Roy's alma mater UNC was suddenly in danger of becoming a mediocre program as a result of his initial refusal. I mean, I was very upset that he left, but it was a perfectly legit career choice -- there were family reasons, too.

I can't speak to the other vague accusations about him being a "phony" -- most people have a darker side than their public persona would suggest. From where I was sitting as a fan -- and I met him once -- he was a good man and a good coach.

Jonathan Allison 10 years, 9 months ago

I picked UNC to win it all, but I've already clinched my office pool whether they do or not.

So, go Spartans!

JayhawkPhil64 10 years, 9 months ago

Roy Williams had his faults but being phony was not one of them. In fact, he was honest to a fault. He needed to leave in 2003 because he had a chance to go home. I did not resent him for doing so. He left the place better than he found it. Bill Self is the perfect coach for KU but Roy was very good and gave more than he took. I wish him well tonight.

jahawkdave 10 years, 9 months ago

Roy's a class act but, I always pull for the underdog. Go State. The scroll wheel on my mouse is wearing out, thanks Jaybate.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 9 months ago

Jaybate. Thanks for the vote of confidence, my friend, but I must respectfully decline.

With today's technology and varied building processes and materials, anything is possible...all it takes is money. A replica Allen Fieldhouse which seats 20,000 or more, a virtual 3D model with same time movement thru-out, even an enclosed " Super Fieldhouse"..anything is possible.

However, as we keep "improving" our environment, our places for life, our world, I fear that the cost is our legacy. Allen Fieldhouse is one of the most antiquaited, uncomfortable and design-flawed basketball venues in America....and I wouldn't trade it for a billion dollars.

What it provides is that most precious of gifts.....the shared experience of over half a century of KU basketball. Allen Fieldhouse is the beating heart of KU Nation. If a newer venue was built, sure KU tradition would go just wouldn't be the same.

The day will come when it to will be eventually replaced...I just hope I don't have to see it.

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago


Fine. Let's just lead college basketball into the Digital Age with a visionary virtual experience of the old Allen Field House. But let's not sit on our hands and let Dean and Roy do it first.

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago


Geez, I'm glad you're not our coach or AD. I've never seen someone from KU shrink from competition with UNC. An inferiority complex? Hardly! This is war and you want to bring a knife to a gunfight? Roy is getting every guy he wants, and Coach Self is working his butt off and getting stiffed at every turn after a national championship. He kept his end of the bargain. He took KU to the promised land. And he had a great season in a reloading year, making the best of two MickeyD types in Collins and Aldrich and patching with a cast of good, but not great talent he brought in this past season. It is time for KU to keep its end of the bargain to Coach Self, and give him the athletic housing he needs to compete now. And its time for KU people to quit giving aid and comfort to the enemy until he retires. We owe Roy not the sweat off our reproductive organs until he retires. This is ridiculous. You're ridiculous. Roy's going to have something like 9 MickeyDs, and Coach Self will be absolutely lucky if he lands two in Henry and Stephenson, which presently remains a long shot. And you want to roll over and cheer for old Roy? While recruiting season is coming to crunch time. You are crazy! Certifiable bonkers.

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago


Good man. I know those mouse wheels are very tricky to operate, but I knew you could do it. :-)

hawk_of_ages 10 years, 9 months ago

I still don't understand... Why is Roy our "enemy" any more than Tom Izzo?

mjhawk 10 years, 9 months ago

This is not good sign if you are a jayhawk fan. I guess what comes around goes around (Chalmers, Manning). I really wanted us to get X, but I guess we go back to Lance? Didn't we have a position open after Mr. Chalmers left? I'm not a big fan of Colleges being able to hire family of players.

Posted: April 6, 2009 Mike DeCourcy Sporting News

The University of Memphis is taking the most daring leap of any college program in this spring coach-hunting season, hiring former assistant coach Josh Pastner to take over as Tigers head coach.

Pastner, 31, worked under Lute Olson following his graduation from Arizona, where he was a walk-on player for the Wildcats' 1997 championship team.

Pastner was a sort of coaching prodigy who began his own scouting service in his mid-teens and began working out his Arizona teammates while in college. He worked for Olson until the 2008-09 season, when he joined Memphis coach John Calipari as an assistant coach.

According to the source, Pastner would hire former Kansas player Carl Henry as the program's director of operations, which would keep signed recruit Xavier Henry, Carl's son, in the program. Xavier Henry, a 6-6 wing, is a McDonald's All-American and top-five prospect in the class of 2009.

Pastner's presence also might help keep other players on the roster, such as wing Wesley Witherspoon, who expressed concern last week after Calipari left to take the Kentucky job.

Robert Brock 10 years, 9 months ago

You beat me to it, mjhawk. This is not good news for prospects of getting Henry. This has got to go down as one of the most insane recruiting circuses of all time in KU history. Memphis is basically selling their basketball soul for one year with one player. Bring on Stephensen if these shenanigans are going to continue. This is just getting ridiculous.

imzcount 10 years, 9 months ago

Some of you just don't seem to "get it". I wouldn't say Roy is exactly our enemy, but you have to consider who he is coaching for!, North Carolina for crying out loud (see my previous post) A few posters "love " Roy and root for him because he coached for Kansas and won quite a few games while he was here (although no national championships). So by that same or similar reasoning I suppose you would root for another school such as North Carolina or Kentucky or Duke or you name it, if Bill Self went there (God forbid) to coach. You see how much sense that would make! Bill Self has stated that we should root for North Carolina in the championship game but I believe he was just being nice, maybe because Roy wore the Jayhawk sticker last year.

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago


Oh, this one is beautiful. I just had a feeling Carl was going to shake a job out of all this one way or another. X and CJ and Carl all happy as clams at Memphis. Wild! CJ doesn't have to sit. X doesn't need to play anywhere good to be an OAD. He just needs to put up 20-25 ppg. Carl gets in on the ground floor on a new career. I bet Mrs. Henry will get a job in the university administration. This is America. The land of opportunity and family values!

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago


Izzo is the lesser of evils presently. He does not have a corner on the MickeyDs the way Roy does. And Roy with another ring is going to make Roy go from being a MickeyD magnet to being a MickeyD black hole. Izzo has learned how to win with thug ball and prison bodies plus 2-3 talented players. Roy is winning with John Wooden UCLA level talent.

If Self decided MSU prison bodies were the kinds of guys he wanted to recruit, then I would be rooting for Ratso Izzo to lose. My position is strictly strategic. I bear Roy no ill will personally. I think he's a great guy, except for disrupting our title run and not recruiting half the country for 15 years, so he could preserve his dream job at UNC.

But Roy's standing between us and the MickeyDs and so we have to take him out. We did it last year and this year we need to root for Izzo to do it for us. Nothing deeper than that. We want recruits and people to talk about how if one goes to UNC, one gets to play in the Final Four and lose, whereas if one comes to KU one gets to play in Final Fours and win.

Its just recruiting war for which storied program is supreme for the next 5-10 years, that's all. :-)

mjhawk 10 years, 9 months ago

C'mon LJ world! Please run a story on X's Father being hired at Memphis. I'm getting tired from holding the down arrow while I scroll all the way to the bottom to read the latest posts:) I think this is big news! To be honest these last couple of weeks have been so strange, maybe X still decides to come to KU? Ha, who knows. My two cents on tonight's game, GO IZZO! I can't hate Roy, but I can hate UNC.

Come on Lance! Sign on the line!

Tribehawk 10 years, 9 months ago

Maybe the reason Bill Self is telling us to cheer for UNC is the same reason that Roy supported KU in the NC game last year: they both have class--a class that transcends the sort of pettiness that fans of both programs have been wallowing in of late. I just wonder: for those of you who still hate Roy for what he did, do you also hate every Jayhawk player that bolted for the NBA before they graduated? Roy left us to coach his alma mater, in the state he was born and where he was raised and where much of his family resided or wanted to be. He took the UNC job at the behest of his personal mentor, in many ways his father figure, Dean Smith. He did this only after already denying UNC once to stay with Kansas. Yes, he told us all that he wasn't going to go at first, but how many of us make stupid comments in the heat of an emotional moment that we wish we could take back? Roy Williams isn't perfect and I'm glad that we now have a superior coach in Bill Self who has already brought us a Championship. But Roy Williams doesn't deserve to be crucified by KU fans anymore. And I see no reason to wish failure upon him, as if that would somehow help us in the recruiting battle. You know what would have helped us in recruiting? If we had made it to the NC game this year like UNC and MSU did. Bill Self is a big boy. He's a good recruiter. He gets the kids he deserves. If a kid is on the fence between us and UNC, and he decides to pick us because UNC lost in the NC game while we only made it to the Sweet 16, then there's probably something wrong with that kid. We should win recruits by winning ourselves--not depending on our rivals to lose. I will cheer for Roy the same way I cheer for all the 'Hawks in the NBA. I'm NOT going to cheer AGAINST Mario Chalmers because he left us a year early and his success in the league might entice other young Hawks to bolt for the league early and leave us in a hole. That would be petty. Hating on Roy for the same reason is just as petty.

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago


Good to hear from an expert in 3D and architecture. I would prefer standing pat with AFH, if Coach Self and Lewie the Perk say we can stay competitive in recruiting.

Virtual Allen Field House is the way to go IMHO. Every Jayhawk should be able to sit down at his computer and stream the live broadcast of a game from an existing broadcast conduit, like ESPN, or CBSonline, into a Virtual Allen Field House video game in Wii, or Microsoft Live, etc. Basically, every field house in the country ought to have its own virtual field house package you can access. I'm not smart enough to talk fees and who makes what how. I'm just saying it would quickly become one of the biggest broadband video experiences going.

It is going to happen. You heard it hear first. The arenas are too small and too expensive for all the people that want to participate. TV is too 20th Century. Streaming video of the game is simply not a rich enough digital environment for current and coming generations raised on computer games and game boxes.

Do it now, Lew. Beat everyone to the punch. KU has influential alums in Hollywood. Combine Pixar/Disney and Microsoft Live and create the package. Sell access to us, or turn it into ad click heaven for all the sports marketing industry, etc.

Tony Bandle 10 years, 9 months ago

WOW!!!!! From the ashes the Phoenix known as Memphis arises!!!

Certainly not an innovative move [ ref. Mr. Manning and Mr.Chalmers], yet in it's own way brilliant. Something tells me Coach Cal had this all set up and is laughing all the way to the mint julips.

Last chance to advance to dance with Lance...HCBS better smell the Memphis BBQ and pull the trigger. Also, X and CJ are guaranteed big time PT and for a OAD, that's truly the bottom line.

Lance, my man, you come to KU, the #3 spot is yours to lose!!!!!

Tony Bandle 10 years, 9 months ago

PS Jaybate, you do make good points...with 18 year olds, it's not so much where they play, but more importantly, where they stay....KU better get that new housing PRONTO!!!!!

jaybate 10 years, 9 months ago


Ah, yes, I was wondering how soon it was going to be before someone resorted to the empty argument of class.

Class in sports is winning and losing with dignity and good sportsmanship. It is playing by the rules.

Class is not recruiting half the country for 15 years to protect the program you eventually aspire to move to.

Class is not recruiting players based on the promise that you've decided to stay a Jayhawk and then abandoning them.

Class is not having talks about another coaching job in the middle of your team's Final Four run and then letting the story splatter all over the sports media.

Class is not defined as rolling over and letting a former coach cut you out of most of the MickeyDs.

Class is not defined as cheering your former coach to a win that is likely to make it ever more difficult for your current coach to recruit the MickeyDs.

FairgroveJayhawk 10 years, 9 months ago

absurdly amazing. I heard Pastner would be memphis' new coach and wondered how that could possibly affect the recruiting process. Looks like pastner may have learned a thing or two from calipari.

Tribehawk 10 years, 9 months ago


If Roy was recruiting only half the country to protect the progam he "aspire[d] to move to," then he would have taken the UNC job the first time it was offered.

If a coach loses his class by moving to a new program and "abandoning" his players, then Bill Self lost his class years ago and left in Illinois.

I'm not sure how Roy "let the story splatter all over the sports media." He doesn't control the media, and he didn't look for the press or the job offer--it was thrown at him like a hot potato.

If class is correlated to landing blue chip recruits, then Roy has far more class than Bill because he was able to land more blue chippers by recruiting half the country than Bill has recruiting the whole country.

I think class is willing to cheer your own when your interests are not directly in conflict. If UNC wins more recruits because they win the NC this year, then they deserve them and we don't. Just like we deserved whatever recruiting bump we got by winning it last year. Besides, we're just as apt to lose recruits to MSU if they win the NC. The way we win the recruiting battles is by winning on the court. Now that we have lost and are no longer on the court, it is petty to hope that a former Jayhawk loses in the desperate hope that this might somehow help our program.

As for X and Lance, I fear that we have lost them both. I hate to say it. Nevertheless, I still think we will be a dangerous team with or without them.

hawk_of_ages 10 years, 9 months ago

Jaybate, I usually enjoy your comments, but not a single one of your hysterical accusations against Roy has any substance whatsoever.

He deliberately ignored the East Coast for 15 years because he somehow thought that was a way to get the UNC job? Really. Why on earth would he think that? Wouldn't the fact that he, you know, TURNED THE UNC JOB DOWN in 2000 somewhat contradict this argument?

You say Roy was talking to UNC during the 2003 Final Four run? That's one hell of an accusation. Evidence, please.

And you think the 5-star recruits out there are making their decisions based on whether Roy has 1 ring or 2 rings? Ludicrous! Everybody in the game today knows that Roy (and Self) are in the top tier of coaches. UNC's recruiting will not be hurt one iota by a loss tonight. The name Michael Jordan has a lot more sway for a kid out there than the number of titles.

eastTXjayhawk 10 years, 9 months ago

i really should save this for tomorrow, a bright start to a new day, but, i just can't...NC is whipping MSU and I just can't handle it. Now, at first, i thought, what a shame that little picture is so small, you can't get a good feel for how pummeled Vince the shamwow guy looks, but then i thought, well, if it was bigger, i would've had to look at much larger pictures of Ben Affleck earlier this year. But what if someone had told Jesse that he looks like Vince the shamwow guy?

InfiniteJ 10 years, 9 months ago


When I dropped the douche bag bomb I wasn't specifically talking about you, so I hope you didn't take offense. As far as "being a man and taking a stand", I think my stance on the situation is pretty clear, I root for the Jayhawks no matter what, but I've always been partial to the Tar Heels as well. I don't root for UNC to get elite players, I just root for UNC and Roy Williams to win games (except when they play KU). Does it ruin my day when UNC loses a game like it does when KU loses a game? No, but I still dig seeing UNC beat the crap out of Duke and having a good season.....does that make me anti-KU? No, not in the least bit. UNC could shut their basketball program down and Roy Williams could quit coaching all together and that still would not lead to KU getting every Arby's and Burger King All-American they set their eyes on........and even if they did, you still can't win them all. I think you're distaste for Roy Williams is some what warranted, but I just don't feel the same.....I just see no reason to hold on to the past.

KULA 10 years, 9 months ago

Just watched the game--Sherron's a better point than Lawson & "Dorko-T" isn't even the first draft pick on his own team.

100 10 years, 9 months ago

Jaybate, the top two teams year in and year out for the last decade are: KU &...

UNC (except for Matt Doherty yelling years).

UNC won it this year.

KU won it last year.

ESPN radio just named top 10 for next year.

We, by a landslide, according to ESPN radio are...


If all of these players come (or a couple even), along with Sherron & Cole staying,

We have a legitimate shot to...


Currently UNC has the number 1 recruiting class...

If X and CJ come, and the recruits are added up again (including transfers like Withey)...

We then swipe the #1 recruiting class ranking too.

Stay tuned Jaybate -- UNC and Williams are good for us. We're good for them.

Rock Chalk

Martin Rosenblum 10 years, 9 months ago

All of this recruiting speculation regarding who has the edge and who has the better potential talent is in a way completely silly. It is a cliche, but "there is no I in team". The TEAM has to be good together collectively. How many times have we seen a team with a superior player who contibutes some stats and the team still doesn't gel. Misckey-Ds don't insure a conference title nor a national championship. Usually not even a run for more than 2 years. We're being a little paranoid about some other school having more of an upper hand in recruiting. I don't recall that many players mention Carolina as well as KU in their long lists or their short lists in the past 5-6 years. Watch for Kentucky to be on those lists however now. We have an aging building to offer vs. a new glitzy "venue" style facility that many schools are going to. We do't have luxury boxes for boosters to sit in, only wooden back seats. We only have one of the best reputations in the NCAA and the most knowledgable fans who express their appreciation by not allowing our program to be morphed into something that would not separate it from most other D1 programs.

Bottom line, let those one and done players go somewhere else and the true basketball junkies come to KU.

mlubyRN 10 years, 9 months ago

Blah blah blah, wah wah wah, True, Roy was a good coach when he was here. True, Coach Self is even better here at KU than Roy was...Hence the national title 5 years into his tenure. KU is and will always be a top 5 power house program. We will always get great talent, regardless of MIckey D's or not. Who gives a Shiite what Roy does at UNC now, past is past, we beat him last year badly and he knows it, lets just leave it at that Hmmm k?

mjhawk 10 years, 9 months ago

I don't understand why the ljworld/KU sports still has an article posted that has the headline "Henry wants to go to KU, father says." C'mon Gary, I love your stuff, but please update your information. We KU Fans want to see the latest and expect to see the most up to date information when we click on your site. If the report (Carl Henry being hired) is bogus tell us that, if the report is true how can it not be consider news that's worthy of being reported? I posted the article yesterday and then a comment asking why kusports has not reported the Memphis vacancy has been filled. I even called the newsroom and spoke with someone in the sports department at about 12:30 in the morning and asked why an article hasn't been written. I was told "this is the first we've heard of it." Mike DeCourcy is a good writer so I believe the majority of information he puts out there. I also think there has been a lack of reporting this Memphis development on a national stage, so I don't think kusports is the only news outlet lacking current information.

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